Musing over Home-Protection choices...
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- AJMD429
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Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I don't have a double-barrel shotgun, and those seem kind of nice, but was musing about the ongoing search for the 'perfect' firearm for wife/kid use when they are home alone. My family is fairly used to firearms so about anything will do, but many guys tell me their wives and/or kids barely shoot guns at all, and they are always trying to figure out what is best for them in the sense of being easy-to-learn, and reliable and non-deafening if used indoors. There's also of course the 'a few big blasts' vs. 'lots of repeat shots' debate that figures in.
Anyway, here's a picture I made showing some of the options we've found helpful.
What I think is interesting is that two of the OLDEST designs (the Win 1892 and Colt 1911) are ones of appropriate power, and the exposed hammers make them a bit less scary to leave chambered when around novices.
Anyway, here's a picture I made showing some of the options we've found helpful.
What I think is interesting is that two of the OLDEST designs (the Win 1892 and Colt 1911) are ones of appropriate power, and the exposed hammers make them a bit less scary to leave chambered when around novices.
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Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Claymore mines around the perimeter, Turret mounted quad 50...
Or
Or the more modern resurrection...
(Note... use ONLY Extra Virgin Olive Oil... it's healthier...)
Or
Or the more modern resurrection...
(Note... use ONLY Extra Virgin Olive Oil... it's healthier...)
Last edited by Old Ironsights on Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Your chart is incomplete.
You're showing a pump shotgun with the gangsta wanna-be pistol grip which will beat the %$#@ out of you.
Remington 870, short 18" barrel, youth stock, side saddle for extra rounds. Minimal training (although still needed!), maximum effect.
I've done the cop thing and that's what I've got stuck behind the bedroom door. Well, maybe. (grin)
Mossbergs are good also.
You're showing a pump shotgun with the gangsta wanna-be pistol grip which will beat the %$#@ out of you.
Remington 870, short 18" barrel, youth stock, side saddle for extra rounds. Minimal training (although still needed!), maximum effect.
I've done the cop thing and that's what I've got stuck behind the bedroom door. Well, maybe. (grin)
Mossbergs are good also.
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Agree on the shotgun grip. I don't mind the pistol grip and can shoot fast with it but I sorta' like recoil...
Another choice for a novice might actually be a Redhawk in 45 Colt with 'cowboy' loads using soft wadcutters. Or a short S&W 29 using 44 Specials.
Another choice for a novice might actually be a Redhawk in 45 Colt with 'cowboy' loads using soft wadcutters. Or a short S&W 29 using 44 Specials.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
no musing needed.....use them all!
yeah.... put a stock on that shotgun
or use very light custom load with 00buckshot...
that's got to be a bit hard to control....
but I bet its fun to shoot!
yeah.... put a stock on that shotgun
or use very light custom load with 00buckshot...
that's got to be a bit hard to control....
but I bet its fun to shoot!
LETS GO SHOOT'N BOYS
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I don't care what firearm You choose, We have to be able to get it "in hand" in a hurry. there won't be time to fumble with or load it. Family members have to be well versed and practiced in it's use.
My Sister, several years ago was home alone one summer day. windows and doors open screen doors locked. She heard a car come up the long driveway looked out to see a beat up clunker with two scum bags inside pull around the back of the house.
She was in the kitchen, grabbed her revolver out of one of the drawers. both got out of the car one told the other try the door at the back porch. All hell broke loose then as Her 100lb Rottweiler "Angel" tried to go thru the door. they left in a hurry.
My Sister, several years ago was home alone one summer day. windows and doors open screen doors locked. She heard a car come up the long driveway looked out to see a beat up clunker with two scum bags inside pull around the back of the house.
She was in the kitchen, grabbed her revolver out of one of the drawers. both got out of the car one told the other try the door at the back porch. All hell broke loose then as Her 100lb Rottweiler "Angel" tried to go thru the door. they left in a hurry.
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
1. Big Mean Black Dog: on guard 24/7 even when I'm sleeping, loves every family member.
2. big mean pit bull, see above
2a, Me, big and white, heavily armed
3, other protections known only to family,
2. big mean pit bull, see above
2a, Me, big and white, heavily armed
3, other protections known only to family,
- sore shoulder
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
This is one of the reasons I switched to Glocks for every member of my family. And the chambered round is not the problem people make it out to be. Now I have the confidence that anyone can pick up any pistol in the house and point and shoot. It shouldn't be anymore complicated than that. The pistols that are not Glocks either have DA only action and no safety or are a revolver.
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
octagon wrote:1. Big Mean Black Dog: on guard 24/7 even when I'm sleeping, loves every family member.
2. big mean pit bull, see above
2a, Me, big and white, heavily armed
3, other protections known only to family,
I'm hoping to find a big mean woman to take care of security so I can sleep through anything that happens.
Dog toys out in the yard provide and extra layer of security as obstacles and trip hazzards in the dark.
This is all meticulously thought out.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
'Most anything will do if the person shooting is familiar with the gun.
As for loudness, forget about it. Even a .22 inside a closed room will ring your bell pretty good. But consider two things:
-- Under pressure in the heat of the moment, you probably won't even register the blast; and,
-- You're firing because your life is in danger. Would you prefer to be alive and hearing-damaged, or dead but with ears unaffected?
As for loudness, forget about it. Even a .22 inside a closed room will ring your bell pretty good. But consider two things:
-- Under pressure in the heat of the moment, you probably won't even register the blast; and,
-- You're firing because your life is in danger. Would you prefer to be alive and hearing-damaged, or dead but with ears unaffected?
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
love the 100# Rottie with pistol backup
I would have let the dog out, the lady has far more restraint than I
Grizz
I would have let the dog out, the lady has far more restraint than I
Grizz
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I have a mech-tech 1911 set up to. it would do glock too??????
mine has a wire stock.
mine has a wire stock.
JOHNNY WACKO
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Grizz wrote:...love the 100# Rottie with pistol backup
I would have let the dog out, the lady has far more restraint than I
Grizz
Grizz, She said the whole thing seemed like it took less than 20 seconds...I'm glad She had an Angel that day.
I would have let the dog out, the lady has far more restraint than I
Grizz
Grizz, She said the whole thing seemed like it took less than 20 seconds...I'm glad She had an Angel that day.
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
They make them for Glocks too - check the MechTech website. http://www.mechtechsys.com/glock.phpJOHNNY WACKO wrote:I have a mech-tech 1911 set up to. it would do glock too??????
mine has a wire stock.
But they are specific - so your 1911 'upper' won't accept a Glock or vice versa. They are inexpensive enough to get another if you like the concept.
Good point about the Glocks - "point and shoot"...sore shoulder wrote:This is one of the reasons I switched to Glocks for every member of my family. And the chambered round is not the problem people make it out to be. Now I have the confidence that anyone can pick up any pistol in the house and point and shoot. It shouldn't be anymore complicated than that. The pistols that are not Glocks either have DA only action and no safety or are a revolver.
Mine ain't big, but she would NOT be the one you'd want mad at you if you were a bad-guy...!Malamute wrote:I'm hoping to find a big mean woman to take care of security so I can sleep through anything that happens.
So does dog poop...Malamute wrote:Dog toys out in the yard provide and extra layer of security as obstacles and trip hazzards in the dark.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Panzercat
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I don't see anything inherently hard about chambering an autoloader, honestly. If you can actuate a lever you can pull back a slide or charging handle. Clearing them is probably the difficulty point that needs to be addressed, likewise continued operation after the initial mag is expended.
Firing an AR in your home will make you a sad panda sans ear protection. Not that any caliber will make you happy, but that super sonic .223 is murder in confined spaces.
If overall ease of operation is desired, definitely a pistol caliber lever or pump action shotty. I had a Mossberg 500 cruiser with pistol grip and laser. It was one mean, maneuverable home def package. Point, shoot, pump.
Firing an AR in your home will make you a sad panda sans ear protection. Not that any caliber will make you happy, but that super sonic .223 is murder in confined spaces.
If overall ease of operation is desired, definitely a pistol caliber lever or pump action shotty. I had a Mossberg 500 cruiser with pistol grip and laser. It was one mean, maneuverable home def package. Point, shoot, pump.
...Proud owner of the 11.43×23mm automatic using depleted Thorium rounds.
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Doc, you've got too many moving parts.
If you've got a family member that shoots a lot WITH the chosen instrument, all of your displayed hardware is nice.
But what if, as you say, the home defender barely shoots at all? Introduce the elements of darkness, diminished state of consciousness, adrenaline, and fear. Then give your "barely shoots at all" one of these mechanical nightmares.
They might get the safety off. They might get one shot off. They might be able to reload or chamber a second round and take a second shot. MIGHT.
I think you need to consider something much more basic.
In the words of my generation... "Point and Click".
If you've got a family member that shoots a lot WITH the chosen instrument, all of your displayed hardware is nice.
But what if, as you say, the home defender barely shoots at all? Introduce the elements of darkness, diminished state of consciousness, adrenaline, and fear. Then give your "barely shoots at all" one of these mechanical nightmares.
They might get the safety off. They might get one shot off. They might be able to reload or chamber a second round and take a second shot. MIGHT.
I think you need to consider something much more basic.
In the words of my generation... "Point and Click".
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
- sore shoulder
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Many things that are easy under normal conditions become extremely difficult under stress. When under the influence of fight or flight chemicals, the body reverts to large motor skills and muscle memory. Placing the additional and unnecessary complication of decockers, safetys, chambering a round etc in the way can mean the difference between life and death even with a trained individual, much less one who only trains occasionally, which is the reality for many.Panzercat wrote:I don't see anything inherently hard about chambering an autoloader, honestly.
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
^^^This......I should put the G30S on the nightstand, and the 1911 (cocked and locked in holster) out where I would use it in the daytime......sore shoulder wrote:Many things that are easy under normal conditions become extremely difficult under stress. When under the influence of fight or flight chemicals, the body reverts to large motor skills and muscle memory. Placing the additional and unnecessary complication of decockers, safetys, chambering a round etc in the way can mean the difference between life and death even with a trained individual, much less one who only trains occasionally, which is the reality for many.Panzercat wrote:I don't see anything inherently hard about chambering an autoloader, honestly.
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- vancelw
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I like that grip you have on the shotgun. I DON"T like regular 90 degree pistol grips on shotguns. All the recoil is transferred to your wrist. And novices tend to want to aim the gun and put the receiver an grip right in front of their face. So a less experienced shooter might be better served by a full or youth sized stock. I think pump guns are the easiest manually cycled guns to function and keep on target. You just have to teach them to work it like they mean it, and not wait until it's too late to shoot.
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
We have a French Brittany. She is our alarm system. I don't think she would bite anyone and don't want her to.I have a double shotgun loaded with light skeet loads for the bite part. At home distances they will put tennis ball sized holes through wall board. My wife has proved to me that she can use it. Make sure that calling 911 figures in your plan. It might take police a half hour to get to my place, but I think I would be in a better legal position if I could cal 911 before a violent self defense. Hope you never have to defend your self or family.
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Yep. I'm fairly comfortable using any of them, and most of my family is as well, so we just argue about which is best but many of the people who ask me for advice (yeah, I know why are they asking their family MD for advice on 'guns' - but anyway...) haven't shot much at all. I usually advise them to just use a double-action revolver, provided safe storage can be had for it, but I can see a Glock or similar gun could be as good.FWiedner wrote:I think you need to consider something much more basic.
In the words of my generation... "Point and Click".
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Canuck Bob
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I'm considering the BPS Upland 20 gauge. Something the girls can bust clay with and Daddy can load up with slugs in bear country. 22" barrel and straight stock. Nothing like a shotgun to put the fear into a punk.
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- Panzercat
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Sure, but that's not the point I'm trying to make, unfortunately. All things being equal, one is not harder to operate than the other; be is pump, lever or slide. If your firearm is in condition zero, it's a moot point anyway-- You're sending a bullet down range the moment you finger the trigger since you've eliminated most of the stress hangups involved before hand. About the only thing that will hang you up is not engaging the passive safeties or a hard malfunction, and even the venerable levergun has a mandatory grip safety to actuate.sore shoulder wrote:Many things that are easy under normal conditions become extremely difficult under stress. When under the influence of fight or flight chemicals, the body reverts to large motor skills and muscle memory. Placing the additional and unnecessary complication of decockers, safetys, chambering a round etc in the way can mean the difference between life and death even with a trained individual, much less one who only trains occasionally, which is the reality for many.Panzercat wrote:I don't see anything inherently hard about chambering an autoloader, honestly.
But let's step back to condition to three since it's the most relevant to most of the firearms involved: Rounds in the mag/tube, nothing chambered. There is almost no difference between pumping, levering or racking a round between these three mechanisms. It's a single action, and if stress is going to mess you up on one, you're not likely to do any better with the others. In fact, outside an autoloader or revolver, you get to repeat that action again and again for multiple failure opportunities. I hope you don't short stroke that pump or lever to instigate a failure to feed. The next point of stress/fatigue failure comes at reloading or loading an unloaded firearm; Condition four. Frankly, I'm laughing at anybody who maintains that somehow fumbling with multiple cartridges in the dark to load/reload a lever or shotty is somehow superior to slapping a mag in place and working the action.
Again, the key phrase here is all things being equal. If a safety can be disengaged on my pump, why not my autoloader? I'm not here to pan one firearm over another, but I am going to challenge this bit of 'conventional wisdom'. Sure, once we get into malfunctions, all bets are off. About the only one that gets a free pass here is the revolver unless you seriously screw it up, but in the Age of Glock, you just don't get the play the ZOMG!Malfunction card like you used to with autoloaders.
Nope. Sorry, not buying into the 'ease of operation coolaid' the way its usually presented unless your firearm is unnecessarily complex.
...Proud owner of the 11.43×23mm automatic using depleted Thorium rounds.
- sore shoulder
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I'm a fan of having a round in the chamber. I don't believe in using the sound of a slide etc to scare off an intruder. Know whats really scary? Gunfire and bullets.
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I vote for lever gun, easy to pick up and use(if it doesn't have a push button safety). Have the tube loaded, and just cycle the lever when danger become apparent.
- GonnePhishin
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Get a nice 9mm or even a 380 for the wife/kids. Ya want them to be able to hit what they're aiming at. Just my 2cents.
I'm hoping to find a big mean woman to take care of security so I can sleep through anything that happens.
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- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Ah well. My nightstand gun is an 1858... with a Gladius short sword for the offhand.
In my neighborhood if you can't finish the job with 6+ a smokescreen & blade you've been home-invaded by the PoPo's Ninja Squad...
In my neighborhood if you can't finish the job with 6+ a smokescreen & blade you've been home-invaded by the PoPo's Ninja Squad...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
The little Marlin .45 carbine might be a good choice if it's reliable, I would get rid of that extra stuff on it and put it back in a user friendly wood stock if it was going to be a family gun. Since you said your family doesn't shoot much, maybe get them started with a Ruger 10/22 or Marlin 60, I wouldn't usually recommend a 22 but since thy are not active shooters, it might be less intimidating for them. My girls seem to prefer Rossi 92 carbines and Henry lever 22's.
- Old Time Hunter
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Line of defense:
1. Dogs-better alarm ability than my parameter laser trips, exceptional pack mentality corners all intruders...unfortunately the good with the bad. Had my BIL cornered in the shed for hours until wife came home.
2. Cats-only have two, but one is obsessed with curiosity, pounces on the back of every non member of the family. She hides on a shelf behind the door...then jumps on the intruders shoulder, before jumping to the floor. She makes a sound like she is laughing...hardly audible over the startled screams of the unaware though.
3. Safe zones in critical parts of the house that yield readily available defensive weapons, not just firepower, but also have a bevy of katana's. One in at least one corner of every room. Even though I keep a firearm, usually within an arm's length, in case of exception. A katana is much quieter.
4. Wife...she can be meaner than all the cats and dogs put together
1. Dogs-better alarm ability than my parameter laser trips, exceptional pack mentality corners all intruders...unfortunately the good with the bad. Had my BIL cornered in the shed for hours until wife came home.
2. Cats-only have two, but one is obsessed with curiosity, pounces on the back of every non member of the family. She hides on a shelf behind the door...then jumps on the intruders shoulder, before jumping to the floor. She makes a sound like she is laughing...hardly audible over the startled screams of the unaware though.
3. Safe zones in critical parts of the house that yield readily available defensive weapons, not just firepower, but also have a bevy of katana's. One in at least one corner of every room. Even though I keep a firearm, usually within an arm's length, in case of exception. A katana is much quieter.
4. Wife...she can be meaner than all the cats and dogs put together
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I wonder if the public at large can get one or those big low-land gorilla / pitbull combo cross-breed critters like they use at the White House?
I think it's called 'Michelle'.
I think it's called 'Michelle'.
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Perfect home defense arsenal: 870 14" barrel with the one shot extension. Glock 18 with 33 round magazines. Full auto M4 with several 40 round magazines.
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
. . .that's the good. . . . where's the bad. . .Old Time Hunter wrote:...unfortunately the good with the bad. Had my BIL cornered in the shed for hours until wife came home.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
STOP TALKING ABOUT MY MIL.FWiedner wrote:I wonder if the public at large can get one or those big low-land gorilla / pitbull combo cross-breed critters like they use at the White House?
I think it's called 'Michelle'.
IF WE WERE CLOSER,i would stop over and test all those out and then give a true answer.
It's funny i agree with everybody's answer and there different.
JOHNNY WACKO
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzevezzx/john ... dproducts/
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzevezzx/john ... dproducts/
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
That's what's fun here - we can argue and agree at the same time. . . .JOHNNY WACKO wrote:It's funny i agree with everybody's answer and they're different.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Sixgun
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Doc,
As an intelligent man, you are over analyzing .....just do what Joe Biden told the American people.......get a double barreled shotgun and shoot both barrels out the door and the bad guys will run away.
It's hard to believe that jerk lives about 10 miles from me. I know several contractors who have done work for him in the past and they ALL say it's next to impossible to get paid for their services----6
As an intelligent man, you are over analyzing .....just do what Joe Biden told the American people.......get a double barreled shotgun and shoot both barrels out the door and the bad guys will run away.
It's hard to believe that jerk lives about 10 miles from me. I know several contractors who have done work for him in the past and they ALL say it's next to impossible to get paid for their services----6
- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
(Mount soapbox)
The gun(s) I/We will use for home defense would vary depending on what room I/We in when the problem starts. Located, and well hidden but easily accessible, throughout my house are 3 Glock 17's, 2 S&W .357 revolvers, 2 S&W .45 ACP revolvers, and 3 12ga shotguns. All are loaded to the hilt, with the exception of the shotguns having empty chambers. The shotguns are for me alone...Kelly knows how to operate them but has been told to leave them alone for now, she has lots more to learn about shotguns.
All three people that live here, and only those people, know where all the guns are, the 11y/o daughter just to be able to steer others away from them discreetly, and know how to use them. The daughter's instructions during a panic are to immediately go to the "safe" closet in the hobby room, lock herself in, and use the old cell phone kept charged there to call 911. This will in turn release the three 70-90 lb. dogs that are brought into that room at dark every night to sleep. Two of those three dogs are pitbull crosses, all of them are great kid dogs, but very possessive of their humans.
When my wife and I got married a year and a half ago she had no firearms experience. other than safe handling training that I had taught at the pawn shop we both used to work at. Before we ever went to the range she was drilled, and I mean drilled, in the safe handling, grip, dry firing, and weapons clearing techniques, both with revolvers and autos. At the range she got to load, unload and shoot both types of handguns at 3-5 yds. Then she was taught what I call contact pistol defense, which is to basically put the muzzle of the gun against your attackers body and pull the trigger. If I'm grappling with some attacker that's what she's been trained to do. Not pretty, but very effective.
As a firefighter I was passionate about teaching E.D.I.T.H., Exit Drills In The Home, to any citizen that wanted them, even going to their homes and helping them with there escape plans, I still am. As a home owner, husband, father, and grandfather I'm just as passionate about both firearms safety and home defense. We drill on both here, probably not as often as we should but at least every couple of months.
Proper equipment is important, but so is training and most importantly awareness. Sometimes I think we fixate on the first and neglect the last. I've ran on home invasion calls, both where the occupant prevailed and when they didn't. I plan for me, or at least mine, to still be breathing when it's over.
(Dismount soapbox)
Rob
The gun(s) I/We will use for home defense would vary depending on what room I/We in when the problem starts. Located, and well hidden but easily accessible, throughout my house are 3 Glock 17's, 2 S&W .357 revolvers, 2 S&W .45 ACP revolvers, and 3 12ga shotguns. All are loaded to the hilt, with the exception of the shotguns having empty chambers. The shotguns are for me alone...Kelly knows how to operate them but has been told to leave them alone for now, she has lots more to learn about shotguns.
All three people that live here, and only those people, know where all the guns are, the 11y/o daughter just to be able to steer others away from them discreetly, and know how to use them. The daughter's instructions during a panic are to immediately go to the "safe" closet in the hobby room, lock herself in, and use the old cell phone kept charged there to call 911. This will in turn release the three 70-90 lb. dogs that are brought into that room at dark every night to sleep. Two of those three dogs are pitbull crosses, all of them are great kid dogs, but very possessive of their humans.
When my wife and I got married a year and a half ago she had no firearms experience. other than safe handling training that I had taught at the pawn shop we both used to work at. Before we ever went to the range she was drilled, and I mean drilled, in the safe handling, grip, dry firing, and weapons clearing techniques, both with revolvers and autos. At the range she got to load, unload and shoot both types of handguns at 3-5 yds. Then she was taught what I call contact pistol defense, which is to basically put the muzzle of the gun against your attackers body and pull the trigger. If I'm grappling with some attacker that's what she's been trained to do. Not pretty, but very effective.
As a firefighter I was passionate about teaching E.D.I.T.H., Exit Drills In The Home, to any citizen that wanted them, even going to their homes and helping them with there escape plans, I still am. As a home owner, husband, father, and grandfather I'm just as passionate about both firearms safety and home defense. We drill on both here, probably not as often as we should but at least every couple of months.
Proper equipment is important, but so is training and most importantly awareness. Sometimes I think we fixate on the first and neglect the last. I've ran on home invasion calls, both where the occupant prevailed and when they didn't. I plan for me, or at least mine, to still be breathing when it's over.
(Dismount soapbox)
Rob
Proud to be Christian American and not ashamed of being white.
May your rifle always shoot straight, your mag never run dry, you always have one more round than you have adversaries, and your good mate always be there to watch your back.
Because I can!
Never grow a wishbone where a backbone ought to be.
May your rifle always shoot straight, your mag never run dry, you always have one more round than you have adversaries, and your good mate always be there to watch your back.
Because I can!
Never grow a wishbone where a backbone ought to be.
- Streetstar
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I came into (4) s&w model 64 stainless fixed sight 4" bull barrel .38 spl revolvers . They are bobbed and DAO only from the factory ( ex LEO guns)
I like these for do everything guns for everyone. Being modern k frames, they will readilly accept +P loads
I am not much of a DA shooter, but these are fine at defense distances--- when evaluating a defense handgun, i always see how it does on 25 yard head shots on a b27 target -- the 64 is GTG here as long as i dont pull it --- and center of mass is a no brainer -- at living room distances, it shoots as well as my modern semi auto defense pieces
I like these for do everything guns for everyone. Being modern k frames, they will readilly accept +P loads
I am not much of a DA shooter, but these are fine at defense distances--- when evaluating a defense handgun, i always see how it does on 25 yard head shots on a b27 target -- the 64 is GTG here as long as i dont pull it --- and center of mass is a no brainer -- at living room distances, it shoots as well as my modern semi auto defense pieces
----- Doug
- AJMD429
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
More and more, even though I may prefer the more 'capable' stuff that is out there, the 4" DA revolver is exactly what I recommend for everyone, only if they have hard trigger pulls I have them practice in single-action mode for confidence building. It a 38 Special to the sternum and/or face doesn't stop the bad guy, at least long enough to put a second or third or fourth in the brainstem, I would think the guy must be a robo-alien.Streetstar wrote:I came into (4) s&w model 64 stainless fixed sight 4" bull barrel .38 spl revolvers . They are bobbed and DAO only from the factory ( ex LEO guns)
I like these for do everything guns for everyone. Being modern k frames, they will readilly accept +P loads
I am not much of a DA shooter, but these are fine at defense distances--- when evaluating a defense handgun, i always see how it does on 25 yard head shots on a b27 target -- the 64 is GTG here as long as i dont pull it --- and center of mass is a no brainer -- at living room distances, it shoots as well as my modern semi auto defense pieces
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
never say never? i like revolvers , but as always , know your limitations.AJMD429 wrote: It a 38 Special to the sternum and/or face doesn't stop the bad guy, at least long enough to put a second or third or fourth in the brainstem, I would think the guy must be a robo-alien.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01 ... -cornered/
careful what you wish for, you might just get it.
"BECAUSE I CAN"
"BECAUSE I CAN"
- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
My backup gun is a .690 RB Howda (2x1oz ball/slug juiced by 100gr BP...) ...pokey wrote:never say never? i like revolvers , but as always , know your limitations.AJMD429 wrote: It a 38 Special to the sternum and/or face doesn't stop the bad guy, at least long enough to put a second or third or fourth in the brainstem, I would think the guy must be a robo-alien.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/01 ... -cornered/
The only limit there is whether or not the Goblin on on a Tiger...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
that is another whole bag of scary.Old Ironsights wrote:
The only limit there is whether or not the Goblin on on a Tiger...
[no goblin , just tiger.]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n-3cFIuQBc
careful what you wish for, you might just get it.
"BECAUSE I CAN"
"BECAUSE I CAN"
- Streetstar
- Advanced Levergunner
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- Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:58 am
- Location: from what used to be Moore OK
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
AJMD429 wrote:More and more, even though I may prefer the more 'capable' stuff that is out there, the 4" DA revolver is exactly what I recommend for everyone, only if they have hard trigger pulls I have them practice in single-action mode for confidence building. It a 38 Special to the sternum and/or face doesn't stop the bad guy, at least long enough to put a second or third or fourth in the brainstem, I would think the guy must be a robo-alien.Streetstar wrote:I came into (4) s&w model 64 stainless fixed sight 4" bull barrel .38 spl revolvers . They are bobbed and DAO only from the factory ( ex LEO guns)
I like these for do everything guns for everyone. Being modern k frames, they will readilly accept +P loads
I am not much of a DA shooter, but these are fine at defense distances--- when evaluating a defense handgun, i always see how it does on 25 yard head shots on a b27 target -- the 64 is GTG here as long as i dont pull it --- and center of mass is a no brainer -- at living room distances, it shoots as well as my modern semi auto defense pieces
I came across a small handful of these for the princely sum of $200 each -- the pictures make them look better than they were cosmetically --- just some LEO trade ins -- lots of scratches and worn down grips
I took one of them and with just a minimal amount of cleaning and a touch of mag wheel polish -- it turned out looking great -- a new $20 Hogue grip was the cherry on top (it needs to be cleaned again though , i have ran quite a few rounds through it , plus it resides in my vehicle backpack now mostly full time)
These guns are not marked as such , but are safe for +P loads (Essentially the same gun as the Model 65, except chambered short ) -- my thoughts were, rather than trying to roll my own , i may order up a few rounds of Buffalo Bore's enhanced +P loads for the social situation i hope never happens
I read the link posted about the thug breaking in and taking 6 rounds to the torso --- it just made me wonder what ammo the gun was loaded with -- if it were 6 rounds of white box winchester or Remington FMJ plinking ammo, --- then i get that, but i dont think the results would have been much better with any other caliber if the wrong ammo was used
one of The policeman shot recently in Ferguson was hit in the eye socket and the bullet travelled the circumference of his head i've been told
As humans, we can simultaneously be some of the weakest critters pound for pound walking the planet, or some of the toughest --- you never know what you are gonna get --- so i prefer to keep the defensive oriented guns loaded with the hot stuff whenever possible
----- Doug
- Dirty Bob
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
With choices like that, I think I'd have some picnic / shooting parties with the family to see what everybody liked best! A novice who likes a firearm and enjoys shooting it is more likely to come along on range trips, especially fairly short range trips.
If I had to pick one for everybody, it would be the Camp 45 with the original wood stock. Light, handy, with modest recoil. Effective with just about any full power .45 ammo you can find.
The other choice might be the '92. Didja notice how short it is compared to the pistol gripped shotgun? A "subsonic" .44 or .45 load still involves a big, heavy bullet going 900-1000 fps. That's pretty potent stuff.
Some electronic ear muffs can be kept with the gun. If you have a second, you can put them on and switch them on to magnify sound, yet protect your ears.
All my best,
Dirty Bob
If I had to pick one for everybody, it would be the Camp 45 with the original wood stock. Light, handy, with modest recoil. Effective with just about any full power .45 ammo you can find.
The other choice might be the '92. Didja notice how short it is compared to the pistol gripped shotgun? A "subsonic" .44 or .45 load still involves a big, heavy bullet going 900-1000 fps. That's pretty potent stuff.
Some electronic ear muffs can be kept with the gun. If you have a second, you can put them on and switch them on to magnify sound, yet protect your ears.
All my best,
Dirty Bob
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
I'll start here...then have a brief introduction with this... :)
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- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Got one of those for my hitch receiver.1892 wrote:I'll start here...then have a brief introduction with this......
Keeps the tailgaters back...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
My wife can't rack the slide of my 1911, nor my I.J. 25 Auto. Recoil doesn't bother her too much, but holding a fully loaded shotgun can get old for her real quick. Magazines, charging, pulling slides, etc. can seem "complex" in a stressful situation (and even at the range). So, my choice, and my wife has agreed, for her is a Taurus M 85. I have "house loads" of DEWC over a stiff load of W231 which she has fired. The smallish revolver ain't too heavy, easy to operate, no "pre shot" safeties. Only down side it's only 5 shots, but I think it's better to have five controllable shots rather than 50 in a weapon that she can't handle. Been thinking of one of Ruger's LCRx with 3" bbl. Simple point and click (shoot)...
But knowing my wife, she prolly wouldn't shoot a bad guy but would pray for him instead...
But knowing my wife, she prolly wouldn't shoot a bad guy but would pray for him instead...
Mike
Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit...
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit...
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
- Old Ironsights
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Re: Musing over Home-Protection choices...
Oddly enough, the only "gun" my wife will use (other than her Tazer(R)) is my .690 (12ga) Howda.
If it's big enough for Psycho Tigers, it is good enough for her...
If it's big enough for Psycho Tigers, it is good enough for her...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!