OT-Reloading question

505stevec · Post by **505stevec** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:50 pm

I know many will say what has taken you so long but... I am looking now to get into reloading. I have the .45 colt, 45-70 and others that are not cheap any more. What is the best loader brand for the buck? I was thinking Lee. They have a Challenger kit for around $120. I cant seem to find Lee dies for 45-70 however. Do they interchange. I have a guy looking to sell a Dillon 650 plus dies and I am not sure what else for around $1000. Is this worth it? I am not really interested in mass production but I have heard Dillon is great. The money amount scares me but if it were just that great. What else will I need to get started. I have some .357/.38 brass also about 100 .45colt brass.

Post by **Chuck 100 yd** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:05 pm

Start with a single stage press,a set of dies and a good reloading manual. A balance beam scale will get the powder charge right and you can add to this kit as you grow.
Keep it simple and enjoy.

If you buy any of the GOOD load manuals,it will have step by step directions in the front and will guide you how to load that first round safely.

The Lee kit you mention will load ammo just fine . I dont see .45-70 dies either.

Mine are RCBS.

Look here.
http://www.leeprecision.com/

Bis · Post by **Bis** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:29 pm

I have had the Lee Classic press for about 4 years and love it. I reload for 45-70, 35-55, .308, .243, 30-30, 44 mag, .357 mag. I have only had 2 problems. One with my 45-70 factory crimp die and the other with their case trimmer. Both poblems were fixed within a week. For the money you can't beat it.

BTW- Midway list the Lee 3 die set for 45-70 $23.+.

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:40 pm

Here you go: http://www.midwayusa.com/esearch.exe/se ... earch.y=13

I use Lee dies in several calibers and am well satistied with them. Sometimes you can get a fairly good deal on used presses, etc, over at ebay. RCBS makes very fine equipment.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:42 pm

The Dillon IS great. And, depending what comes along with it, that could be a fair price. However, Chuck is right, start on a single stage, they're slower, yes; but, also much more versatile.

Check out flea-bay other forum's classifieds (and this'un) for used. You get a good quality used unit for much cheaper than new and put the savings into components. While I can only recommend Dillon, RCBS or Lyman, it's because that's what I've used and have ever loaded on. I just picked up a RCBS Rock Chucker II for $75.00, except for a lil' grease, it looks new.

Reloadin' is detail oriented, with your safety and those near you on the line; it ain't fer everyone, I learned and developed my knowledge on a friennd's equipment, it ain't any surprise we have near identical stuff! It's a route I recommend; just remember there are no shortcuts. Read everything on the subject you can find and anything you don't undertand, ask. The ONLY stupid question is the one you don't ask.

Now that I'm done with the admonishments, it ranks up there with my top 10 favorite activities! If i was too count in my time, I probably don't save a dime doin' it, but I get great satisfaction from craftin' my ammo and havin' it perform well.

jhrosier · Post by **jhrosier** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:14 pm

Steve,
While it is too easy to say "Buy the best equipment.", there is a large measure of truth in the statement.
You will have your reloading equipment for a long time, so don't cut corners on quality.
The lightweight Challenger press probably won't work well for the 45-70. It is a light duty press, well suited to ocassional use, but not particularly heavy duty.
The Lee Classic Cast press seems to be well liked by most and is reported to be as well made as any of the top end competitors.
I have found most of the Lee products to be well made and a good value.
I am not including the Lee progressive presses in this group.
I have several sets of Lee dies and find that they are as well made as any brand and less expensive than most.
The Lee autoprime has served my needs well for many years.
I prefer the Lyman #55 powder measure over all others, but there is a lot of different opinions among handloaders as to which measure is best.
You might want to browse the classifieds over at the cast boolits forum for used eqiupment. There is a lot of activity over there and a great bunch of guys to deal with.
I generally advise beginners to start with a single stage press while learning the basics. It just seems a lot simpler to learn handloading one step at a time.

Your first purchase should be a loading manual. I find the Lyman manual to be the most useful but the Lee manual has a lot of good information also. You will probably wind up with two or three manuals to cover both cast and jacketed bullet handloading.

You can buy most of Lee's products from thier website, but check out Midwayusa.com and www.fmreloading.com also.

Jack

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:25 pm

I forgot to say, no matter how many manuals you buy, you NEED to get a good friend who reloads to instruct you through the first 3 or 4 sessions at least, and be available to call if you have a question. Also, there are several good reloading instructional videos available that are well worth the money.

piller · Post by **piller** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:41 pm

I have been reloading for about 7 years now, and I still ask questions. I have found that I can start paying attention to the reloading and anticipate the fun of trying the new loads while completely losing track of time. I have tried Hornady, RCBS, and Lee dies. For me, a person who only loads small batches and changes settings fairly often, the Lee dies work better as they are easier to change the settings on. On the other hand, the Hornady dies and RCBS dies feel more solid. Since I don't reload a lot, this is not really a factor.

TedH · Post by **TedH** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:41 pm

One of the best buys out there is the RCBS Rockchucker Kit. It has everything you need to get started (plus some) except dies.

Post by **Hobie** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:58 pm

TedH wrote:One of the best buys out there is the RCBS Rockchucker Kit. It has everything you need to get started (plus some) except dies.

I'll go with that as I love the RCBS equipment. However, most any of the long time makers has good equipment that may or may not suit you for some reason including price. I've never regretted getting my Rockchucker press and have used most other brands with only one or two things I absolutely don't care for.

One thing is for certain, you will never know it all, i.e. you will always be learning. Every cartridge, component, and gun brings together a unique combination of variables that can be wonderfully challenging.

BenT · Post by **BenT** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:59 pm

I started with the Lee Manual. It's staight forward and easy to follow. I would suggest buying Lee's Manual. Read it and then determine what equipment to get. Most of the book is load recipes. There are chapters that won't pertain to what your trying to reload. Reading it first will give a better understanding on what options you have and it's only $13.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:08 pm

Yep, found them at Midway as well. This is where I normally get my Lee Precision dies (and other stuff) - cheaper than going to Lee's website direct. I have a set of .45-70 Lee dies, including the Factory Crimp Die, and highly recommend them.

You can start with a simple "C" style or "O" style single stage press, all the dies you are talking about, a Lee priming tool (highly recommended). A few other odds and ends, but you'll be in the game for about $100. You said you weren't looking for mass-production, so this is a great way to start. Even if you get bitten by the bug, and decide to "progessively", my bet is you'll keep the single-stage press. Everyone needs one!

Good luck!

505stevec · Post by **505stevec** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:46 am

Thanks for the help. I will get the manual and look for a Lee loader this seems to fit my budget best at this point.

Driftwood Johnson · Post by **Driftwood Johnson** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 2:36 am

Howdy

I would suggest buying the manual first, then don't spend another penny on equipment until you have read the chapters on the actual reloading process. Keep an open mind on what type of equipment you want to buy, there are a lot of choices; single stage, turret, and progressive.

Like many others, I recommend learning to reload ammo on a single stage press. It is less confusing. You are just pulling the handle and can concentrate on the reloading process. Too many shooters who learn to reload on a progressive press just become equipment operators. They don't spend the time to fully understand some of the intracacies of reloading. Don't get me wrong, I have two progressive presses, but I taught myself to reload on a single stage press.

If you are mechanically inclined, you can learn to reload on a progressive press, but you must take the time to run a whole bunch of rounds through the press one at a time, until you thoroughly understand not only the reloading process, but what the machine is doing mechanically. It can be a lot to absorb.

If at all possible, hook up with somebody local for a mentor to teach you the ropes. And try to get some actual hands on experience with various brands and styles of presses before you spend your hard earned money. Some of them are very different from others. Don't jump at the first press you see, there are lots of them on the used market.

Lastly, there are several good reloading manuals out there. Lee is good, so is Speer. I taught myself to reload out of the Lyman Pistol and Revolver Handbook, but it does not cover 45-70. The regular Lyman manual covers pistol and rifle loads.

gon2shoot · Post by **gon2shoot** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:42 am

Lee equipment is not expensive and generally will serve you well. I use a Lee hand press when I'm on the road, which is most of the time, but I do prefer RCBS dies.

505stevec · Post by **505stevec** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:24 am

do the dies interchange? I am just wondering because I usually see dies and a few other things at yard sales, swap meets and such but would hesitate to get these for this reason.

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:49 am

505stevec wrote:do the dies interchange? I am just wondering because I usually see dies and a few other things at yard sales, swap meets and such but would hesitate to get these for this reason.

Dies can be used on other presses.

Except: Dillon dies, Star dies, the blued Lyman 310 dies need an inexpensive adapter, the Lyman Tru-Line Jr. press only accepts 310 dies.

But Lee, RCBS, Lyman, CH, Redding and others are all interchangeable.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:53 am

I'm a little odd I suppose, but I've decided to do ALL of my .45-70 reloading with a simple Classic Lee Loader. I like the control on the larger cartridges.

And I don't have to change dies in my single stage or mess with my .357 Progressive.

Post by **AmBraCol** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:13 am

505stevec wrote:do the dies interchange? I am just wondering because I usually see dies and a few other things at yard sales, swap meets and such but would hesitate to get these for this reason.

Steve, MOST dies interchange. There's a standard thread size (7/8X14???) that is used by all the modern manufacturers. So if you stick with RCBS, Lyman, Hornady and Lee you'll have dies that will work in any modern press. The one exception to that are the Lyman 310 and Junior dies. They are a smaller thread than standard and require an adapter to use in a modern press. It's usually cheaper to go ahead and buy a new set of dies unless you find them in an obsolete caliber that you can't find modern dies for.

Lee makes good dies and you can buy them fairly cheap from Midway, Graf and Sons and other such retailers. You can get started with just a Lee Loader tool, a mallet and a solid surface to pound on. I loaded hundreds of rounds of 38 with my Lee Loader when I first got started. When it's properly used a Lee Loader can turn out some incredibly accurate ammunition.

The Lee Handpress is another way to get going fairly cheap - and when you get another press it's still a handy thing to have. You can set in front of the TV or out on the porch or ??? and resize cases instead of being stuck in your reloading room or basement or wherever. So take a look, you can sometimes find them for less than $20.

Don't scrimp on the scale. Get a good one. I do NOT like Lee's "Safety Powder Scale", the Lyman or RCBS is a MUCH better unit. When it comes to safety and repeatability and all that it's hard to beat a good quality scale.

AND as mentioned by several, buy loading manuals - modern ones especially that deal with current powders and such. Lyman's has given me good service over the years and in the front section they walk you through the basics. My wife bought me a Lyman loading kit years ago. It came with all the bells and whistles and has loaded thousands of rounds for me over the years. To get your feet wet a simple Lee Loader or Lee handpress is an inexpensive way to go. As you get more confident and want to expand then you can invest in better quality tools. Yard sales are SOMETIMES a good source. I picked up a lot of stuff that way, including a Lyman bullet sizer/luber and a bunch of misc casting/loading stuff. Reading the manuals will give you an idea of what you're seeing and whether it's worth your time or not.

Some older presses use proprietary dies, I THINK the Hollywood press is one of these, but admit my knowledge of such is limited and I could be confusing it with others. Unless they come with dies for a caliber you need, such presses are rarely worth more than what you can get from the scrap yard unless you can find a sucker on Ebay or some other type of auction...

Above all, read, study, learn and be safe. DON'T second guess the manuals, stick to the max loads listed - but don't start there. Start about the middle of the load range and work up - or down - looking for accuracy more than "singe their whiskers" velocity. The heaviest load in the manual is worthless if your gun won't shoot it worth beans.

junkbug · Post by **junkbug** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:20 am

I use a Lee Hand Press even for the 45-70. With proper case lubrication, this is not that difficult. You might want a little more lube than for a 30-30, but not that much more. The spray on type (or even PAM) should be fine.

Sean

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:38 am

I started with at @15 with my Grandfather's Old Hollywood press ( that does use standard dies by the way) and a half dozen die sets. My Dad got me started on how to do everythig but the Lyman Reloading Manual was invaluable.

Picked up many more good used die sets at gun shows over the years. Usually half the price ( or less) of new dies.
Also have a Dillon progressive for large amounts of ammo, but still use the Hollywood for rifle caibers.

Good way to spend a couple hours on cold snowy / rainy days.

Post by **AmBraCol** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:45 am

2ndovc wrote:I started with at @15 with my Grandfather's Old Hollywood press ( that does use standard dies by the way) and a half dozen die sets. My Dad got me started on how to do everythig but the Lyman Reloading Manual was invaluable.

Picked up many more good used die sets at gun shows over the years. Usually half the price ( or less) of new dies.
Also have a Dillon progressive for large amounts of ammo, but still use the Hollywood for rifle caibers.

Good way to spend a couple hours on cold snowy / rainy days.

OK. I stand corrected on the Hollywood press. Does it use standard shell holders too? There's some oddball presses out there and my mind tells me that at least one was some kind of California branded (or based from?) name... So it wasn't the Hollywood, what WAS it????

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:05 am

You are correct, I had to get an adapter for Lee/ RCBS/ etc. style shellholders. Did it so long ago I forgot.

At one time I had a set of .22 K-Hornet dies that were smaller diameter than standard but can't remember what brand they were. I want to say "CH" but don't know for sure.

jb

Post by **AmBraCol** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:11 am

2ndovc wrote:You are correct, I had to get an adapter for Lee/ RCBS/ etc. style shellholders. Did it so long ago I forgot.

At one time I had a set of .22 K-Hornet dies that were smaller diameter than standard but can't remember what brand they were. I want to say "CH" but don't know for sure.

jb

OK. So I misremembered in that it was the SHELL HOLDER and not the dies that are different. Is the Hollywood the one with a long shell holder instead of the coat button sized ones?

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:03 am

Right. The shell holder kind of through bolts to the press. The priming "Ram" would pass up through the shell holder and prime the case. That's very slow so I switched to a Lee hand primer. Broke three of those and have an RCBS now.

The one thing that I love about the Hollywood press is that it's massive. It takes very little effort to size cases.

jb

Maddog521 · Post by **Maddog521** » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:32 pm

Sometimes on the Lee web site they have "seconds" for sale. The seconds have the same warranty that the "firsts" have. You might be able to pick up a 3 or 4 hole turret press at a very good price. I have a 3 hole turret from 1982 and it works just fine. My brother gave me a RCBS Rock Chucker so I should be set up for the rest of my reloading days. Check out the "seconds" you might find what your looking for. Good luck.