well I guess I'm a primitive life form
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well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Just got the new field and stream today and was flipping through.
on page 18 is a Q&A with Petzal. the second question is about inherently accurate cartridges. Petzal makes an interesting comment:
No ammo maker with any sense is going to go to a lot of trouble with 30/30 rounds, because the average 30/30 user is a primitive life form who doesn't expect or need a lot of accuracy.
on page 18 is a Q&A with Petzal. the second question is about inherently accurate cartridges. Petzal makes an interesting comment:
No ammo maker with any sense is going to go to a lot of trouble with 30/30 rounds, because the average 30/30 user is a primitive life form who doesn't expect or need a lot of accuracy.
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Whatever Both mine shoot better than I expect them to with iron sights.....The 336 with ghost ring and big old HiViz scored about .6 or so in the Ranch Dog Postal Match. The old 1951 94 into an inch at 50 yards with out even trying very hard with factory sights....
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First
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- Griff
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Another good reason not to subscribe. If it was an attempt at humor... well... what do you expect from an idiot.FLINT wrote:Just got the new field and stream today and was flipping through.
on page 18 is a Q&A with Petzal. the second question is about inherently accurate cartridges. Petzal makes an interesting comment:
No ammo maker with any sense is going to go to a lot of trouble with 30/30 rounds, because the average 30/30 user is a primitive life form who doesn't expect or need a lot of accuracy.
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I'm a huge fan of Jeff Cooper's definition of a "Good Group".....BANG...did you hit it? Yes? Good Group!!
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First
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- 2ndovc
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Every .30WCF I've ever owned has been 1-2" shooter at 100 yds.
My dad has a 1954 Model 94 that I can't make shoot better that 4" at 100 yds. Haven't figured out it's problem yet.
I guess I'm another lesser life form, NOT!
Mr. Whatshisname can blow it out his hole!!
And he better not venture into the Woods of PA.
All those lower life forms may just catch him and grill him.
jb
My dad has a 1954 Model 94 that I can't make shoot better that 4" at 100 yds. Haven't figured out it's problem yet.
I guess I'm another lesser life form, NOT!
Mr. Whatshisname can blow it out his hole!!
And he better not venture into the Woods of PA.
All those lower life forms may just catch him and grill him.
jb
jasonB " Another Dirty Yankee"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Whatever.
Just another nancy-boy who has probably never handled an arm in, or spent time in the field actually hunting with, the caliber of which he is so dismissive.
Just another nancy-boy who has probably never handled an arm in, or spent time in the field actually hunting with, the caliber of which he is so dismissive.
Last edited by FWiedner on Mon Feb 25, 2013 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Don't know who the writer is, but I guess he's just a youngster with dilusions of knowing anything.
Jeepnik AKA "Old Eyes"
"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
"Freedom is never more that a generation from extinction" Ronald Reagan
"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
"Freedom is never more that a generation from extinction" Ronald Reagan
"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Really sad to see . I'm no gunwriter , but i have never shot an inaccurate 30-30 even with boxmart sale ammo.Every one of them shoots better than I can. I have seen ALOT of people who don't know how to shoot. I quit buying gun rags long ago, because of EXPERTS like him
- 2ndovc
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
If I remember correctly this is the same dingle berry that came down on EBR guys @ 6-8 years ago
and got his heinnie handed to him!
Full of stupid things to say apparently.
jb
and got his heinnie handed to him!
Full of stupid things to say apparently.
jb
jasonB " Another Dirty Yankee"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Oooga Maaaaaagimba!! What he know?? Me likum .30-30...
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Does this guy write for The Onion? What a dunce.
Classic example of why I quit, long ago, subscribing to gun rags and hunting rags. Waste of good ammo money.
Classic example of why I quit, long ago, subscribing to gun rags and hunting rags. Waste of good ammo money.
- Ji in Hawaii
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I consider myself above average then.FLINT wrote:Just got the new field and stream today and was flipping through.
on page 18 is a Q&A with Petzal. the second question is about inherently accurate cartridges. Petzal makes an interesting comment:
No ammo maker with any sense is going to go to a lot of trouble with 30/30 rounds, because the average 30/30 user is a primitive life form who doesn't expect or need a lot of accuracy.
Illegitimus Non Carborundum
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
- AJMD429
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I guess I'm used-enough to the 'ribbing' that others shell out that I thought it was kind of funny. Those who know better will just shrug and quietly kill deer with their primitive 30-30's, and those who don't will just have to meet one of 'us' to be enlightened someday...
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I recall reading back in the 70's, that some writers or the factory were testing a new model 94 and a new model 70, and the model 94 was more accurate. May not be typical, but most of them shoot fasirly well. I've had several that have shot under 1" groups for 3 shots @ 100 yards. They may not do it every time, but the fact that they did it puts some of the claims of inaccuracy in perspective.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
- Shasta
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
These are the same guys who think there really is such a thing as "dead", "deader", and "deadest"!
SHASTA
SHASTA
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avatar pic is Shasta Dam, Shasta Lake, & Mt. Shasta
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http://www.hcrpclub.org/schedule.html
avatar pic is Shasta Dam, Shasta Lake, & Mt. Shasta
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Kinda sounds like the guys at the range that lock their .378 T-Rex in a vise and brag about 2" groups at 100 yards with a 12X scope. Then they talk smack about leverguns, but refuse to stand at 400 yards and catch the bullets from such a weak cartridge.
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
OK, I'll bite. Who is Petzal?
2nd, that was Zumbo. And after being dismissed from just about every outlet that used his work due to pressure from gun owners, he "saw the light"...
2nd, that was Zumbo. And after being dismissed from just about every outlet that used his work due to pressure from gun owners, he "saw the light"...
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
- Ji in Hawaii
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Not who, but what!awp101 wrote:OK, I'll bite. Who is Petzal?
Illegitimus Non Carborundum
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
- Griff
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
That made me stew. So I did what I almost always do when I'm upset. Write 'em. If it burns you, write to: fsletters@bonniercorp.com.
Mine:
Mine:
Really? On page 18 is a Q&A with David Petzal. the second question is about inherently accurate cartridges. Petzal makes an interesting comment:
“No ammo maker with any sense is going to go to a lot of trouble with 30/30 rounds, because the average 30/30 user is a primitive life form who doesn't expect or need a lot of accuracy.”
“…Primitive life form…?” As many adherents to the grand ol’ cartridge, {which, if I’m not mistaken, is still the all-time deer getter}, say, “… just how dead does it need to be?”
If this was an attempt at humor, it falls flat. Ranks up there with Jim Zumbo’s comment about ARs in the hunting field. Now I’ll admit that my Remington 700 in 7mmRemMag is more accurate than my Winchester 94 in .30-30… but no one laughed at the ¾” groups it’ll shoot… no one laughed at my 400 yard shot to win a match… no one laughed at the buck I bagged in 2007 at 238 yards.
Seriously, to let a writer denigrate any segment of the shooting public when our freedoms and the very fabric of the shooting sports is under attack from almost all quarters, is both negligent and short-sighted. And from those who are supposed to be an ally.
Sincerely disappointed,
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
- Griff
- Posting leader...
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Thanks Ji! I needed a good laugh!Friends Call Me Ji wrote:Not who, but what!awp101 wrote:OK, I'll bite. Who is Petzal?
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
- Buck Elliott
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I abandoned F&S nearly 50 years ago, because of such lunacy.. Some publishers still believe that Controversy Sells... Maybe so, but BS has the opposite effect !
Regards
Buck
Life has a way of making the foreseeable that which never happens, and the unforeseeable, that which your life becomes...
Buck
Life has a way of making the foreseeable that which never happens, and the unforeseeable, that which your life becomes...
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
That's some funny shtick right there.BlaineG wrote:I'm a huge fan of Jeff Cooper's definition of a "Good Group".....BANG...did you hit it? Yes? Good Group!!
Gobbler
Click Click Boom
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I think the really unfortunate thing about comments like that - is that there are probably lots of people out there that don't know any better - and will think that he is right. Maybe these are people just getting into hunting or shooting, and will be ignorant and biased from the outset and will miss out on the enjoyment of some of the types of guns and cartridges that all of us love so much.
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Dunno if Petzal was serious. Here is some bio on him:
David E. Petzal, the rifles field editor of "Field & Stream," has been with the publication since 1972. A graduate of Colgate University, he served in the U.S. Army from 1963 to 1969, and he began writing about rifles and rifle shooting during his service in 1964. He is a Benefactor Member of the National Rifle Association and a Life Member of the Amateur Trapshooting Association. He has hunted all over the United States and Canada, as well as in Europe, Africa, and New Zealand. Petzal wrote "The .22 Rifle" and edited "The Encyclopedia of Sporting Firearms." In 2002, he was awarded the Leupold Jack Slack Writer of the Year Award, and in 2005 he received the Zeiss Outdoor Writer of the Year Award, making him the first person to win both.
David E. Petzal, the rifles field editor of "Field & Stream," has been with the publication since 1972. A graduate of Colgate University, he served in the U.S. Army from 1963 to 1969, and he began writing about rifles and rifle shooting during his service in 1964. He is a Benefactor Member of the National Rifle Association and a Life Member of the Amateur Trapshooting Association. He has hunted all over the United States and Canada, as well as in Europe, Africa, and New Zealand. Petzal wrote "The .22 Rifle" and edited "The Encyclopedia of Sporting Firearms." In 2002, he was awarded the Leupold Jack Slack Writer of the Year Award, and in 2005 he received the Zeiss Outdoor Writer of the Year Award, making him the first person to win both.
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
all the rags write for their real audience - the sponsors.
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I never really cared for Jim Zumbo's writing anyway. It's amazing how the sudden loss of revenue enables some to "see the light". Didn't he claim that his statements were "misrepresented" or something like that?awp101 wrote:OK, I'll bite. Who is Petzal?
2nd, that was Zumbo. And after being dismissed from just about every outlet that used his work due to pressure from gun owners, he "saw the light"...
I am a dedicated drinker of the levergun koolaid but I really like popping prairie dogs with my 24" AR!!
- Ji in Hawaii
- Senior Levergunner
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Hopefully Pretzal's comments will make people want to get rid of their 30/30s and flood the used gun market with cheap 30/30s.
Illegitimus Non Carborundum
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
Akā, ʻo ka poʻe hilinaʻi aku iā Iēhova, e ulu hou nō ko lākou ikaika;
E piʻi ʻēheu aku nō lākou i luna, e like me nā ʻaito;
E holo nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e māloʻeloʻe,
E hele mua nō lākou, ʻaʻole hoʻi e maʻule.
`Isaia 40:31
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
He's entitled to his opinion, and we are entitled to laugh at him....Just like SoreShoulder and his silly 10mm
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First
Proud Life Member Of:
NRA
Second Amendment Foundation
Citizens Committee For The Right To Keep And Bear Arms
DAV
Proud Life Member Of:
NRA
Second Amendment Foundation
Citizens Committee For The Right To Keep And Bear Arms
DAV
- ollogger
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Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
Griff nice letter!
yea the guys a moron, or a Pretzal or Zumbo or sumthin
ollogger
yea the guys a moron, or a Pretzal or Zumbo or sumthin
ollogger
Re: well I guess I'm a primitive life form
I recently received my first issue of F&S in many years. It contained the article being referred to. I was blown away by the absolutely worthless content of this magazine. For openers, it is only about half the size it used to be. One of the main articles was a ridiculous piece on 1,000 yard 'sniping'! This in a supposed hunting and fishing publication. I was so disappointed in this 'rag' ,I was tempted to write it and tell them to cancel my subscription. I will predict that it will go 'belly-up' very soon. It is a poor shadow of its former self from back in the 60s and 70s. As for Petzal, I have always regarded him as a bozo as far as gun writing goes.