45-75 brass ?????

.45colt · Post by **.45colt** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:53 am

Hello All, I have waited and watched here for several years now and finally Uberti is makeing the '76. Now does it look like in the near future there will be any reasonably priced brass made for the 45-75?? Thanks, Jim.

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 11:44 am

You must not read the posts by the .45-75 crowd. I've got some of that info here on my blog.

To summarize, there's Bertram and Jamison and reforming/reformed .348 Winchester brass. If you find any, get it. Jamison will NOT be making more for at least 6 months due to defense contracts. Starline doesn't yet make it. The influx of .45-75 guns has gutted the market of available brass and ammo. Buffalo Arms ammo is on reformed .348 brass and they are shipping again. Cost is pretty steep.

Reforming .50 AK or .50-90 brass does NOT require annealing. That seems to be the best method by which to make brass, if it works consistently, but it is more expensive than reforming .348 Winchester brass.

PS I should add that this reformed brass will run through my SRC. However, from what I've read there are some rifles which won't take a wide variety of rim diameter or thickness.

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:36 pm

My .45-75 remains in the box due to no available brass. I have spoken to Starline about it, but they say that isn't enough call for it to make a run worthwhile. I respectfully disagree. More .45-75 shooters need to contact them, encouraging the manufacture of their first class brass in that caliber.

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 12:54 pm

Mike,

Just wrote them again. Squeaky wheel and all that. However, I'm putting in an order for 250 .50 AK cases for reforming. I can't wait to build up using stocks of this cartridge!

Oh, and my Buffalo Arms ammo came into today (did I already post that). They use reformed .348 brass and I've not IDed the bullet. Brass is in the MTM Medium Rifle sized J-20 box which was cracked/broken after shipment.

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 4:57 pm

Hobie, are you gonna run the 50 AK brass through your .45-75 sizing die without any other prep? If that works, I'll do likewise.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 8:36 pm

Hobie

I still haven't found that darn lube yet. I know I saw it about a week or so ago but can't catch up with it now. When I do, I will send it on to you.

How did you solve the extra stress (beyond what you were doing before) of sizing down the larger 50 cal bases?

Mike

Yance · Post by **Yance** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 9:15 pm

Hobie;

In the next few days I'll find out about forming .348 as per your ".45-75 update". A friend will be taking possession of a Chaparall '76 tomorrow or Thursday, (parking in Mid-Downtown Asheville permitting.<G>)

I'm planning on using Lee's 340 gr RF at least for fireforming. Looks like there should be plenty of neck to shove the base into to come up with the correct COAL. Just hope rim thickness isn't an issue.

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 9:30 pm

I didn't get good results just lubing on the pad so I tried spray lube (forgot I even had the stuff). That was fine for making it go in and out of the die but got lube dents. I think it needs to be annealed and/or differentially lubed, i.e. lots a lube on the bottom half of the case, regular on the top half. Going to try that in a bit. Shortening the .50-90 cases is a bear so I'm going with the .50 AK. Bigger rims are a pain to get in the trimmer collet but work and work in the gun.

Mike D., I'll send you a case to try in your gun to see if it will work with the rim. My gun will (the .50-90 and .50 AK rims are supposedly the same) so I'm taking the leap. Worst "case" is that I get a .50 AK...

Yance, these guns seem to be pretty forgiving (so far) and rim diameter is not a big issue BUT the bigger rim of the .50-90 case I've tried made the cartridge (empty case) align perfectly where as the last .348 reformed had to be finessed in the lifter block to work smoothly. That bigger dia rim forces the cartridge into the correct position in the lifter block. AND there is LOTS of neck!

Lever, I think that Imperial would simplify the lube problem quite a bit. I'll have 250 cases to form, should learn something about it with that many cases.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:06 pm

I never had much use for the "Pam" sprays. In fact, that's why you got lube dents; the spray spits out in droplets that causes the dents. I'll redouble my efforts to find that stuff and get it on it's way. BTW, I don't think it was Imperial. I think it was Rooster Red brand ??71 or something like that. Made for the same thing though. If it doesn't work, it would make dang good butch wax if your old enough to remember those

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:10 pm

I'm also going to take a serious look at 50-70 cases. Only problem is that they are more expensive than 50 AK. A lot of people aren't going to want to mess with long trimming sessions and the 50-70 would solve that. Also, a lot of bullets won't crimp in their designed groove with a 1.88 case though they would in a 1.75" case. It won't be any more of a problem than shooting a 44 special in a 44 mag chamber. Might solve a lot of headaches for the "trim challenged".

Yance · Post by **Yance** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 11:06 pm

Leverluver wrote: Might solve a lot of headaches for the "trim challenged".

I've found that a "Micro Tubing Cutter" saves a LOT of work for the "trim challenged" among us. I use mine after moving the shoulder back on .30 and .357 Herret cases.

A simple stop can be "C" clamped to one side or the other depending on cutter wheel positionand the case run back through the FL size die to remove the "crimp" before final trimming.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 7:14 am

I can't find a tubing cutter I like. Got a photo or source for same?

Yance · Post by **Yance** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 7:55 am

That's like the "best" one I have, but mine doesn't have a name, only stamped 1/8"-5/8".

I learned the hard way (when I misplaced my "good" one) to avoid the ones that use a "V" block instead of rollers.

Both should be available at you local Lowe's or Home Depot.

.45colt · Post by **.45colt** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 7:58 am

Hobie,thanks for the information. and yes I did not read in detail all the posts about the brass. Jim.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 9:59 am

Yance wrote:That's like the "best" one I have, but mine doesn't have a name, only stamped 1/8"-5/8".

I learned the hard way (when I misplaced my "good" one) to avoid the ones that use a "V" block instead of rollers.

Both should be available at you local Lowe's or Home Depot.

Thanks Yance.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:01 am

Leverluver wrote:I'm also going to take a serious look at 50-70 cases. Only problem is that they are more expensive than 50 AK. A lot of people aren't going to want to mess with long trimming sessions and the 50-70 would solve that. Also, a lot of bullets won't crimp in their designed groove with a 1.88 case though they would in a 1.75" case. It won't be any more of a problem than shooting a 44 special in a 44 mag chamber. Might solve a lot of headaches for the "trim challenged".

That would be too short to suit me.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:42 pm

Ok, so using my concept of differential case lubrication I just produced a perfect .45-75 case from a trimmed .50-90 and did the same with one of the .43 Egyptian cases Ranch13 sent me. Those last are made up on .50-70 brass and I thought it should give us a good idea of case length issues.

It isn't as easy as just ramming one up the die and back out again. So far it is more of a bit at a time game. But, it works! And the cartridges function through the rifle. Photos next.

John Boy · Post by **John Boy** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 4:04 pm

My .45-75 remains in the box due to no available brass.

Mike, Buffalo Arms has 45-75 brass. They have even made proper correction to make the base diameter the proper size (was 0.013 too small) with a rim thickness of 057

Also, Chaparral Firearms, USA is going to receive the German made 45-75's from Chaparral Arms - Italy. Has not arrived yet but was told today it will be received in a couple of weeks. The rim thickness on this brass will be 062, the same as resized 348 brass

And Gad Custom Cartridges has reloaded ammo for the 45-75

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:23 pm

GAD want WAY too much for loaded ammo and buffalo's site isn't working at this time. All brass searches go nowhere. I'll get some eventually, so I'm not really worried. I have nearly 40 Winchesters to choose from, so shooting is no problem.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:59 pm

John Boy,

I've got some of the Buffalo Arms brass which they've used to make up their ammo (I got one box, whew!).

The .50 AK will cost me $.87 each before my time forming. The .50-90 is about $.95 a piece. The Jamison would have cost $1.12 each. Did Chaparral give a price? I can imagine with the Euro to dollar exchange rate that it is going to be expensive.

And for those who are trying to visualize the size of this cartridge here is one of Buffalo Arms' loads with a .30 WCF.

Click on the pics to get a larger size image.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 7:29 pm

Man, I'm just so excited! As so often happens a thing isn't impossible to do but one has to hit on the technique to make it possible given the tools available. I knew that I could reform the .50-90 brass but hadn't hit on the technique necessary.

As can be seen in the above pic, I can now reform the .50-90 (and this means the .50-70 and .50 AK as well) brass to .45-75. What's best NOW is that I can do it in a single lever stroke in the full-length resizing die. I think the base is still a bit of a problem, but with differential lubing (and some folks with good lube to begin with

won't need to do this) a trimmed case can be run into the die in one stroke and go get 'em.

This really makes using the .50 AK brass more cost effective. With the .348 brass being about 1/2 to 3/4 the cost you can save in a lot of time in converting a lot of brass. I want to have a lot of one load loaded because I want to use the gun as I would any other gun and that means having brass to have ammo loaded for everything from plinking to groundhogs to deer. That's a lot of case forming. I'm not going back to reforming .348 Win unless I run out of everything else. I will have to try the Jamison if it comes back on the market or Starline if they ever produce it but I can see being able to have enough ammo to truly use the gun. I'm really chuffed about it!

John Boy · Post by **John Boy** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:52 pm

Did Chaparral give a price? I can imagine with the Euro to dollar exchange rate that it is going to be expensive.

Hobie, No price per Charles Brown, President - Chaparral Firearms - USA. It's my understanding that the brass is being made by a Alfred Buhlert in Germany

Mike D. · Post by **Mike D.** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 9:51 pm

AT $2.08 each Buffalo can keep theirs. I have no use for unneeded greed on a manufactures part, so they are on my "do not buy from" list.

mod71alaska · Post by **mod71alaska** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:25 pm

ReedsAmmo indicates they have 45-75 WCF brass available. Don't know the price.

Here's the link:

http://www.reedsammo.com/WildcatCartridges.html

John Boy · Post by **John Boy** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:59 pm

Just hope rim thickness isn't an issue.

Yance: You shouldn't have a problem with the thickness:
* Old 348 brass is 065
* The new bags are 062
* The boys in Italy, when they re-engineered the rifle, used a January 1911 blueprint of a 45-75 cartridge that had a rim thickness of 062 - 068. This also is the spec that they are using for their 'Chaparral 45-75 Cases'. Original 45-75 cases of the 1800's had a thickness of 057

Now the only worry item is headspace. Rifles in the 800 serial range have a headspace that accommodates brass with a 057 rim thickness. Later production rifles have the headspace for 062 brass.

And then there is me ... with 062 brass. I have excess headspace of 011 because some nimwit indexed the barrel incorrectly when they cut the threads. I have a new breech bolt base coming with the lower rim support lip. If this doesn't reduce the space ... I''m SOOL! That will force me to get a replacement barrel from Charter Arms or a new replacement rifle which I don't want because the barrel on this one is a tack driver

Grizzly Adams · Post by **Grizzly Adams** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:15 pm

John Boy wrote:
Just hope rim thickness isn't an issue.

And then there is me ... with 062 brass. I have excess headspace of 011 because some nimwit indexed the barrel incorrectly when they cut the threads. I have a new breech bolt base coming with the lower rim support lip. If this doesn't reduce the space ... I''m SOOL! That will force me to get a replacement barrel from Charter Arms or a new replacement rifle which I don't want because the barrel on this one is a tack driver

I would keep the rifle and have the barrel set back to correct the headspace.

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 6:49 am

mod71alaska wrote:ReedsAmmo indicates they have 45-75 WCF brass available. Don't know the price.

Here's the link:

http://www.reedsammo.com/WildcatCartridges.html

Thanks, I wrote for a quote.

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:01 pm

There is one fly in the ointment of using the .50 caliber cases. That is that the cases don't fix any shell holders for the Lee Auto-Prime and the cases won't fit in the throat of the Auto-Prime.

My answer is to re-install the priming arm on my Rockchucker and prime on the press. I don't think I'll be reloading such volume of the .45-75 that this will be a problem. After the first 270 it will all be ok...

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:37 pm

I forgot about the narrow mouth of the Lee primer. Luckily I have one of the old, old Lee cricket primers (aluminum and one at a time) that will handle the situation.

I'm leaning toward the 50 AK like you. I'll save my 348s for my estate sale

Maybe you can clear up some confusion. 1) Modified 348s swell in the chambers so the chambers are basically sized for the old original brass head diameter. 2) 50 cal brass has a larger base diameter than 348s. 3) You have a tough time sizing 50 cal with your die because of that larger head diameter. 4) If the chambers are original size, one would think the 50 brass would be a better fit. My assumption from all this is that the die is sizing down to a dimension smaller than the original head diameter. Is that assumption close to correct?

I probably already asked but forgot your answer; what brand die are you using?

Mike

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:06 pm

I'm using Lee dies.

I'm not seeing a lot of working of the case head. However, it is larger than the .348 Winchester (don't ask me why). Thus it won't fit through the throat of the AutoPrime even though the .348 Win will. Well, it will now. I ground out the throat a bit with my Dremel tool so that the .348 will pass. This shouldn't need to be done as Lee sells a shell holder for the .348. I guess your mileage may vary on this. That .348 brass is tough and hasn't expanded enough to fail to be primable in the AutoPrime. Lee doesn't (apparently) make a shell holder for the big .50 cases in the AutoPrime.

To get back to the sizing question. I think it was a matter of the larger overall case size and inadequate lube. Once I changed the lube it was a breeze.

I mentioned it earlier but don't know if you noticed... I found that the .348 based brass needs the last round inserted into the mag which rests in the lifter block to be aligned so that it will feed. Following rounds are shoved into the correct position. The larger diameter rim of the snaps right into place and one can cleanly feed even an empty case (that bottleneck does wonders I think).

Genius that I am, I realized that I was also making .50-95 cases preparatory to reforming. I might have to save some of my . 50 AK cases for that...

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 2:15 pm

Sorry I didn't find that case form lube yet. If you want to try some of my 50/50 lanolin/castor let me know. I can get that right out. Did you find your old jar of lube?

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 3:11 pm

Leverluver wrote:Sorry I didn't find that case form lube yet. If you want to try some of my 50/50 lanolin/castor let me know. I can get that right out. Did you find your old jar of lube?

No, I haven't found my Imperial sizing wax yet.

You'd think such things would be easy to find. I'm sure I put it in a safe place...

I'm not too worried. The current system of lubrication is working a treat. I'm mucking about with trimming now, when those .50 AK cases come in that will be a really job. The rims are different enough I might need a different box for the loaded ammo as well...

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 3:50 pm

What is the rim diameter and thickness of the Starline 50 AK?

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 6:29 pm

Leverluver wrote:What is the rim diameter and thickness of the Starline 50 AK?

When I looked it up it was the same as the .50-90 Sharps and .50-70. However, I'm not with the dimensions at the moment. I will say that they work in my SRC.

Poohgyrr · Post by **Poohgyrr** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 7:38 pm

Boy, that 45-75 looks pretty studly standing next to the 30WCF like that.

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 7:21 am

I've gotten no updates/prices that I requested. Perhaps they lost my e-mail...

I can't find my priming arm for my Rockchucker either! Now that's frustrating as I thought it was in a safe place. However, my loading area is VERY clean this morning...

I've now done 18 .50-90 Sharps to .45-75 conversions and had zero problems after changing the case lubrication. I had 20 cases, one got a severe "case" of lube dents and the other was saved for the collection. Kinda relieved I could convert these as I can see having to buy a .50-90 Sharps rifle to use them if I didn't.

Mike D., it was easy to just run the cases up in the die and out after trimming and then final trim. They grow about .020" in the process so if you trim close to 1.88" you can square them up when you final trim and chamfer.

Rimfire McNutjob · Post by **Rimfire McNutjob** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 8:51 am

I can't find my priming arm for my Rockchucker either! Now that's frustrating as I thought it was in a safe place. However, my loading area is VERY clean this morning...

Your priming arm is sitting over there next to your Imperial sizing wax. Can't you see it ... right there.

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:26 am

Rimfire McNutjob wrote:
I can't find my priming arm for my Rockchucker either! Now that's frustrating as I thought it was in a safe place. However, my loading area is VERY clean this morning...
Your priming arm is sitting over there next to your Imperial sizing wax. Can't you see it ... right there.

You're probably right, I should look for both of them together!

One good thing though, the loading bench, powder shelf and die shelf are clean and organized... now.

John Boy · Post by **John Boy** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 3:31 pm

For Those That Are Interested:
The "Chaparral Brass" is coming from Italy - all calibers. Was told in about 2 weeks... but don't try holding your breath though

Price? TBD

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 21, 2007 7:16 pm

John Boy wrote:For Those That Are Interested:
The "Chaparral Brass" is coming from Italy - all calibers. Was told in about 2 weeks... but don't try holding your breath though

Price? TBD

With the Euro so strong...

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:12 pm

The .50 Alaskan brass arrived from Starline today. I'm chuffed. Great stuff. Although I had Mom here for dinner tonight, I grabbed a couple of minutes to trim and run one of the cases through the .45-75 full-length sizing die. Good to go. The one empty case ran slick as snot through the action. I haven't had a chance to get the rim dimensions (just dropped Mom at home) but will post ASAP.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:55 pm

Along with the rim dimensions, it would also be interesting to know what the outside neck diameter is with a .459 bullet seated and then compare that to a modified 348 with the same bullet.

Yance · Post by **Yance** » Thu Sep 27, 2007 10:18 pm

OK, readin' and learnin', and learnin' the hard way.

Expanded, trimmed, expanded some more, trimmed some more, and finally ran 50 348 cases through the Lyman FL sizer.

Left the cases .100 too long, (need to write stuff down), "finish" trimmed them to 1.900. Loaded up 26.0 gr SR4759 under the Lee 340 RF and let my buddy fireform "most" of the cases.

Seems like I'd have remembered "Bigger = Shorter" when forming cases, but I didn't. Cases are now around .025 short! ARGHHH!!!!! No big deal, just aggrivating personally. Note to self; Initially trim cases to 1.930"

Thought I'd see just how much the cases would "grow" when FL resized but stopped on the first one when it met resistance only about halfway into the die.

Not being one who likes overworking cases, especially when they're as "dear" as this 50 rounds, I was figuring on just reloading them like I do my .45-70 BP carts.

With the remainder of the drimp ironed out a .460 diameter bullet is a nice slip fit. Case neck is only .005 over loaded round dia. Case capacity is just over 75 grains of "dumped" Goex Cartridge. 24" drop tube gains about .250" of empty case which leaves roughly .250 compression for the Lee bullet.

Now questions

Is anyone using Lyman dies finding that they size a LOT?

Anyone reloading fireformed cases without sizing at all?

Anyone loading "real" black under the Lee 340 RF, and if so do those little grooves carry enough lube for the 28" barrel?

I know where MY Imperial wax is

and I'll be getting a few .50AK cases to try next.

The only negatives with the rifle so far was when the lever lock dropped off after about 20 rounds. Fortunately I happened to be picking up a fired case and saw it drop, and without my "sissy pad" that steel buttplate HURTS shooting off the bench.<G>

Think I'll stick to my Sharps.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Thu Sep 27, 2007 10:57 pm

"Is anyone using Lyman dies finding that they size a LOT?"

From what I've seen, all brands of 45-75 dies "size a lot" if you mean do they push the shoulder back much more than required for the round to freely enter the chamber. I don't know whether that is the fault of the die dimensions of the chamber dimensions but it appears that they all took their numbers from the same book. It sure seems to me that the dies all make the neck longer and body shorter than anyone's chamber requires.

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:25 am

Here's some dimensional info.

Code: Select all

                       .348 Win       .50 Alaskan        .50-90 Sharps
Rim Diameter              .603"                .6015"               .651"
Rim Thickness             .0665"               .067"                .064"
Case Head Dia            .546"                 .545"                .5585"

This surprised me because I saw and was told that dimensions for the .50 Sharps and AK were the same. I'll have to load the cases to get dimensions on neck diameters as requested. The .50 AK case sized in one go and with the smaller case head they are noticeably easier to size than the .50-90 Sharps. Both cases will go in one go.

As to sizing, the shoulders in my chamber seem to be forward of those in the sizing die. This could result in working the brass excessively. I'm thinking that the rifle manufacturers used the original chamber dimensions from original rifles and the die makers used the cartridge dimensions as published by Winchester and, as with many BP cartridges of the time, there's some slop to allow for reliable functioning despite fouling. Yance and I (at least) will probably partial full-length size these cases. If you look at the 2nd and 3rd case from the left in the below photo you can see just what Yance, Leverluver and I are talking about here... (click on the photo to go to a larger version)

It is a trick to find the right pre-fireforming trim length when sizing this case up from .348 Win or down from one of the big .50s. Some good news is that .50-95 shooters will only need to trim the .50 Alaskan case to length.

Yance · Post by **Yance** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:52 am

OK, this morning's fun.

#1, Fireformed .348 cases are TUFF to FL resize. Even with a Rockchucker and Imperial I had to size halfway, relube, and finish.

Smoked the shoulder with a candle flame and set the sizer die to just "kiss" the shoulder, leaving an even ring of soot about 1/16" above the bottom of the shoulder.

Sizing the neck effectively lengthened the shoulder, decreasing the angle maybe a degree or two and making the neck around .050 shorter.

The case body diameter was reduced by .004 at the shoulder, and .009" at the expansion ring.

The big change was in case length. Sized cases are .022 longer , bringing them up to 1.882".

Hopefully you can see the difference in shoulder length and angle and body diameter in the photo.

Unfortunately the .458 expander I have for my .45-70's won't work for this one. The fat pig won't come close to going in the die body. Guess I need to call Lee for some parts.

I should have the rifle in hand later this AM and we'll see if resizing is really needed or just flare, charge, compress, thumb seat, and crimp.

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:15 am

Yance, I don't find the fired cases any harder to size than other cases when they fired cases were fired in my rifle. I've no experience with other rifles.

Also, the .50 AK is just the right size to use the .348 Win shellholder. This is as it should be as the case is supposedly a development from the .348 Winchester. The .50 AK is MUCH easier to form than the .50-90 Sharps due to the differences in case head diameter. Normal lubrication is sufficient.

Mike, you can just trim, form, final trim and load. E-mail me your address and I'll send you one to try.

Leverluver · Post by **Leverluver** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:37 am

I'm certain that us "small" band of 45-75 brothers are boring the heck out everybody else but I find this whole conundrum fascinating.

Hobie, I presume that when you were having forming problems you were talking about with the larger base 50-90 brass and from that you thought ,or were told, that 50AK was the same. Now it appears, as I initially thought, that the 50AK IS based on the 348 case head and is not too bad to size. Now Yance has modified 348 fired cases that he has fired and the sizing is difficult, even with a reduction of the exp ring dimension, which doesn't really need to be reduced as the case head of the 348 or 50AK are smaller than the 45-75 is supposed to be in the first place. Dang, with that much slop, how much BP fouling were they planning for anyway, firing a thousand rounds without cleaning?

Thanks for the offer of the case but I have some coming so I can see from those. Plus, I will be using Lyman dies and there may be a small difference.

As of now mine is still a 45-60. I will have a reamer made and it's dimensions will be based on limiting the excessive over-working of the brass you guys are seeing. Basically, I will be reverse engineering in that I will base the chamber dimensions on the die dimensions instead of the usual opposite. Hopefully I can be flexible enough to allow the use of all (348, 50AK, factory) brass but I may need to specify just one if the differences are too great.

If I were you guys, I'd seriously look into a neck sizing setup. I built an extension for the die and use a 41 Mag carbide die to neck size my 40-90 cases. Works great and does not require lubing and sizing the whole body. The body didn't need sizing anyway and was only done to get the neck back down to size.

I don't know whether a 45-70 neck sizer could be made to work. It might require shortening or even taking a boring bar to the inside to gain clearance for the larger body. It might also be possible to diamond lap out a carbide 45 Colt die and use it just like I do the 41 Mag die. As it is now, I'd just be worried that, even if just setting the 45-75 sizer die to just kiss the shoulder, you will still be over-working the body and shortening the life of those exp[ensive and tedious to make cases.

Mike

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:35 pm

I don't care if it does bore anyone, it doesn't bore me. I think I'll now make up a batch of 60 cases from the .50 AK. I had a passing thought of selling some reformed brass but will hold off until you guys figure out if it will work in your guns.

I've got to get casting. Need bullets badly. Everything is set up just need time. So the next question is why do these guns seem to be so picky about bullets and what do I have that will work in my gun.

As to priming the .50-90 Sharps, I'm going to make up a rod that will just fit in the case mouth and use it in conjunction with my drill press and flat drill table top to press the primers in. It will work, but will be a bit slow. But, hey, I've only got 18 of the converted .50-90 cases (that's 2 full loads for the SRC).

John Boy · Post by **John Boy** » Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:39 pm

Is anyone using Lyman dies finding that they size a LOT?

Yance, a friend of mine called Lyman with specifications that are incorrect with the Lyman resizing die. Off my tongue, don't remember the exact details but Lyman's Tech said ... 'Oh shi**"

Anyone reloading fireformed cases without sizing at all?

Yes ... have found that with the thick walls of the 348's, even trying to fireform with 20grs Red Dot does not do much to blow out the shoulder and forget about a pregnant shape towards the base. IMHO, just reload the cases with 65gr FFg (AFTER THE CASES HAVE BEEN ANNEALED DOWN TO ABOUT 1/4" FROM THE WEB) ... and shoot them. The spiking pressure curve of BP does a better job blowing the cases then smokeless powder. Did this with 50 cases and no splits

Anyone loading "real" black under the Lee 340 RF, and if so do those little grooves carry enough lube for the 28" barrel?

Yes. Shoot the Lee 457-340's and use a soywax based lube that leaves a small amount of lube on the muzzle. So, no lube starvation and absolutely no leading with good obturation using bases that are 460

And for the good of 45-75 Chaparral Owners - Working the malfunctioning parts off, one by one:
* Italy (Nicola) sent me their new modification to keep the magazine tube from becoming an 'extension tube' ... about 2" past the barrel. It is a threaded oversize magazine ring screw. Have to drill out the ring pin hole, tap it and screw the new one in. When you drill, metal will be removed from the tube and the new treaded screw sits deeper to hold it from moving. The plug is still incorrectly made being that the ear is too short and will not fully seat in the barrel cut slot ... no plans from Italy to make correct plugs

* Charter Arms sent me a new breech bolt base ... WITH the lower cartridge rim support lip. Now the lip base rides nicely in the Carrier channel cut and applies support to the extractor when ejecting ... BUT

* My Carrier Block developed a 040 droop below the frame after 100 rounds. When I put the new bolt in, the bolt lip jammed up against the bottom of of the carrier channel cut. The issue relates to the Carrier, which also wobbles forward and back 081 with the lever cocked. Plus, the carrier (fully raised) has an 053 space between the back of the Carrier and the frame. Charter is sending a new Carrier Block

* And finally, the excess head space issue of 014 still remains. So, I talked with Nick Ecker and he agreed to look at it when I go to CT in a couple weeks. IF - IF ... they have a LONGER breech bolt base or LONGER toggle links at CT, then it's a minor fix. They do not install new barrels there, so this option is out to fix the cause of the excess head space ... an incorrect indexed barrel when the treads were cut.

PS: I won't leave the rifle there and expect a long turn around

45-75 brass ?????

45-75 brass ?????

45-75 caseforming OOPS!