Ed Kettner Drilling in 10.75x65R Collath

[6pt-sika]

Shot the Ed Kettner drilling we've had for about 2 years today for the first time !

This thing is a hammergun in 16 , 16 and 10.75x65R Collath . It however will function with a slightly shorter downloaded 444 Marlin case which I just happen to have an abundance of !

The gun !

[6pt-sika]

Anything I could find about this round said it was a low pressure round that shot a 200 grain bullet at a moderate pressure . And actual diameter was .424" .

So I happened to have some aircooled wheel weight cast bullets from a Castboolits Group Buy 434-207GC mold already cast and proven on deer at what I consider more realistic velocities .

But I decided to try them in 444 cases with 15 grains Unique , 16 grains Unique , 15 grains SR7625 , 16 grains SR7625 , 16 grain SR4756 and 17 grains SR4756 . I assumed all these loads should be 1700 FPS or less . And after the shooting and averaging were done none averaged over 1600 FPS . The old gun has iron sights and a very very thin rifle barrel so I wasn't expecting to much .

This was the first with 15 grains of Unique , for some reason the Chrony didn't pick these 3 up !



This was with 16 grains of Unique for an average velocity of 1580 FPS , I kinda think the wide one was my fault !



This was 15 grains of SR7625 for an average velocity of 1447 FPS .



This was 16 grains SR7625 for an average velocity of 1497 FPS .



Then it was 16 grains of SR4756 for an average velocity of 1408 FPS .



And finally the last one with 17 grains of SR4756 for an average velocity of 1456 FPS .




All in all not a bad first effort .

A little later I tried my semi light pressure #1 Buck handloads . The barrels on this drilling miked around IC and M and both barrels put all the buckshot on the board at 25 yards with the modified doing a bit better !

All of it was good for deer at 25 yards . Next effort will be to see how well or bad I do with the open rifle sights at 50 yards !

[Shasta]

Oh Boy! I can't believe my eyes! Is that a left-handed cheekpiece I see?

Targets are looking pretty good. That old drilling is a beauty and has real shooter potential.

SHASTA

[6pt-sika]

Oh Boy! I can't believe my eyes! Is that a left-handed cheekpiece I see?

Targets are looking pretty good. That old drilling is a beauty and has real shooter potential.

SHASTA

Yes sir it was made for a lefty !

This gun was WWII war booty . A friend thats a 2 star at the Pentagon now got it from his father in law who was either a colonel or a general during WWII and he had brought this gun back along with a couple others as souvineers ! The barrel on this thing is really very then maybe twice the thickness of a copper water pipe . It will however kill a whitetail deer in the next year or so I think .
From what my friend told me when I bought it , the gun hasn't been fired since his FIL brought it back in the mid 40's !

[Old Ironsights]

I love my drilling. 16x16/9.3x72R.

The 9.3 is basically a BP .38-55 as far as loading/ballistics is concerned. The sights are typically lame but it's definitely minute of deer/pig @ 100.

[6pt-sika]

I love my drilling. 16x16/9.3x72R.

The 9.3 is basically a BP .38-55 as far as loading/ballistics is concerned. The sights are typically lame but it's definitely minute of deer/pig @ 100.

This one has a flip over sight . Although they aren't at different heights but rather one is for bright days and just normal blued steel while the flip side is enameled with blue and white for low light conditions . I figure with these sights and where the majority of my hunting takes place 75 yards tops for a long shot . So I should be okay with one or two of the loads I tried already . Although I do need to try it at 50 yards and 75 just to be safe !

[hfcable]

gorgeous gun and great info about using 444 cases
love drillings and have several

[Old Ironsights]

gorgeous gun and great info about using 444 cases
love drillings and have several

I'd love to build a couple.

IMO a caplock 20ga with a 209 fired .36 underbarrel would be the bees knees for BP small critter hunting.

In moderns I'd like a double 3"+ 12 over .308 with a twist that would stabilize .224 sabot loads.

All in Stainless of course.

[6pt-sika]

All in Stainless of course.

OMG what a comment

That one made me almost spew my dinner

Yuck yuck yuck !

All blued engraved and walnut

[Old Ironsights]

Hey, I'm the guy who likes to go to "reenactment" events with a stainless steel & black plastic Flintlock & Gortex Breeches just to irritate the anal-retentive...

Seriously, my brown Drilling is beautiful and functional, but I rust it by looking at it. I like "weatherable" guns, and my Drilling ain't it.

A SS drilling would be the ultimate non-levergun field gun IMO...

[6pt-sika]

I have a friend thats going to give me a few pieces of 405WCF brass to try out in this drilling . Need to trim 2/100ths , then neck up and fire form .I am thinking I can make do with the 444 Marlin dies as long as I use a .335" spacer . I made two of them today at the shop and will blue them wednesday .

[6pt-sika]

Thanks to Blaine I now have 10 pieces of brass for this thing !

And over the course of last night and today I got it ready to be loaded !

Trimmed it and deprimed it all last .Also expanded the neck on one to see if that would fit as well .

But it wouldn't quite close , so measured the thickness of the 405 WIN brass against the 444 Marlin brass . After all was said and done I took 12 thousandths of the offside of the rim (the side opposite the headstamp) . After doing that the cases went in and the gun closed like a vault . Now this evening perhaps I'll load some for the range trip wednesday and then I can try this thing at 50 yards .

[Pete44ru]

To clarify, for readers who might not be aware - older guns like 6-pt's are NOT chambered for ANY modern 2-3/4" ammo made after the ammunition companies updated the shotshell loading in 1925 to one of much higher pressures than these older guns (and their steel) were designed to handle.

They are usually chambered for the 2-9/16" shell - FIRED LENGTH - which is why an unfired 2-3/4" shell will readily chamber in the short chamber.

Firing the longer shell in the shorter chamber, however, can be very dangerous, since the opening crimp lies in the barrel throat/leade, partially obstructing the passage of the shot charge and raising pressures dramatically - instead of normally laying down in the chamber's forward end, out of the way of the passage of the shot charge.

FWIW- New, low-powered ammo is available today for these oldies - IF they're in good enough condition for firing - from the likes of RST and PolyWad, for those who don't handload shotshells.

(preachin' to the choir - but ya never know)

.

[6pt-sika]

To clarify, for readers who might not be aware - older guns like 6-pt's are NOT chambered for ANY modern 2-3/4" ammo made after the ammunition companies updated the shotshell loading in 1925 to one of much higher pressures than these older guns (and their steel) were designed to handle.

They are usually chambered for the 2-9/16" shell - FIRED LENGTH - which is why an unfired 2-3/4" shell will readily chamber in the short chamber.

Firing the longer shell in the shorter chamber, however, can be very dangerous, since the opening crimp lies in the barrel throat/leade, partially obstructing the passage of the shot charge and raising pressures dramatically - instead of normally laying down in the chamber's forward end, out of the way of the passage of the shot charge.

FWIW- New, low-powered ammo is available today for these oldies - IF they're in good enough condition for firing - from the likes of RST and PolyWad, for those who don't handload shotshells.

(preachin' to the choir - but ya never know)

.

Actually I believe this one to be 2 1/2" after the reading I got off the chamber gauge a week or so ago .

It does however do very nicely with my 8,000 PSI handloads of #1 Buck . Wanna take this thing and shoot a couple rounds of skeet in the semi near future as by my measurments it's light IC and modified .

[Old Ironsights]

To clarify, for readers who might not be aware - older guns like 6-pt's are NOT chambered for ANY modern 2-3/4" ammo made after the ammunition companies updated the shotshell loading in 1925 to one of much higher pressures than these older guns (and their steel) were designed to handle.

They are usually chambered for the 2-9/16" shell - FIRED LENGTH - which is why an unfired 2-3/4" shell will readily chamber in the short chamber.

Firing the longer shell in the shorter chamber, however, can be very dangerous, since the opening crimp lies in the barrel throat/leade, partially obstructing the passage of the shot charge and raising pressures dramatically - instead of normally laying down in the chamber's forward end, out of the way of the passage of the shot charge.

FWIW- New, low-powered ammo is available today for these oldies - IF they're in good enough condition for firing - from the likes of RST and PolyWad, for those who don't handload shotshells.

(preachin' to the choir - but ya never know)

.

Yep. Had to have the chambers in mine stretched to accept 2-1/2" Polywad "Vintager" shells... still won't chamber 2-3/4 "modern" 16ga shells.

[Pete44ru]

[Anything I could find about this round said it was a low pressure round that shot a 200 grain bullet at a moderate pressure . And actual diameter was .424" ]

The 10.75x65R Collath is an extremely rare cartridge that is slightly necked, has a “W.COLLATH FRANKFURT a/O” hs and has a 11.9mm base. It is a necked version of the 11.15x65R Collath/ 11.15x65 “LK” case. Original cases are Berdan-primed.

Since the .444 cases are working for you, they must be close in dimensions to .45 Basic many others use to form cases with Boxer priming.

If you're not already registered, there's quite a few experienced Europeans on the Nitro Express board:
http://forums.nitroexpress.com/ubbthreads.php?Cat=0

.

[Bill in Oregon]

6-pt, that thing sure is a honey. How do you select the rifle barrel? Switch on the tang? Can't wait for you to whack a whitetail with it -- and some quail.

[rjohns94]

Very neat.

[Blaine]

Very cool. I wouldn't have the patience or knowledge to attempt such a thing...

[Old Ironsights]

6-pt, that thing sure is a honey. How do you select the rifle barrel? Switch on the tang? Can't wait for you to whack a whitetail with it -- and some quail.

The "switch" on top of the tang interposes a transfer bar between the right hammer and the shotgun firing pin that transfers the strike down to the rifle barrel firing pin.

[kimwcook]

Now that's a conversation piece. Very cool.

[6pt-sika]

Since the .444 cases are working for you, they must be close in dimensions to .45 Basic many others use to form cases with Boxer priming.

The 444 works but it's PITA to reform (and I doubt if the brass would like being overly reformed in that manner). Also the rim width is a slight issue as it jumped the extractor a couple times when I tried to remove a fired case . The 405 WIN case is almost the exact same rim diameter as the 10.75x65R cartridge . So trimming the necks a bit and then trimming the inside of the rim on the lathe are actually pretty easy .

[6pt-sika]

Just finished with my 10 cases for the 10.75x65R Collath drilling !



Took the first case and rechecked the trimmed length and then primed them all with CCI200 primers . Next I slightly belled the necks of all them in a raised 444 Marlin expander die . Then I measured out a 16.5 grain charge of Unique and poured it in one case . Well actually before that I set the seating die to crimp on the top of the 405 trimmed case . Then after I put the charge in I seated a Castboolits Group Buy 434-207GC bullet and crimped it . That one was a hair above the crimp groove but it went in the gun okay . Took it outside and fired it into a bank and came back in the loading room !

Took the fire formed case and used a RCBS Universal depriming die and knocked the primer out . Cleaned the pocket and reprimed as well as expanded the neck slightly . Recharged the case with Unique and seated another bullet after adjusting the depth a couple red hairs . Tried the loaded round in the case and it was just a hair snug but thats fine since I hadn't sized the case ANY . Took it back outside and fired it in the bank again no problem , case extracted just like it had before .

So I reloaded the same case for the third time and here's the finished product .





Looks like this thing will get run over the Chrony again wednesday just for kicks . I was getting about 1580 FPS with this load in 444 MArlin brass . So I'll just make sure everything is relatively the same and with 10 loaded rounds I should be able to see how well or bad I shoot at 50 yards with open sights !