A random thought about the 45 cal.

[hightime]

My wall display has my Pederosoli Quigley 45-110 and my 1873 Uberti 45 colt. As I am a gun nut that target shoots and hunts white tail deer, I have asked a couple times how these guns would perform on deer. Although I don't think there is much chance of my actually carrying the 15 lb Quigley and shooting a deer with it, I still wonder how brutal the 530 gr bullet might be on the poor deer. I didn't get to shoot a deer with the 45 Colt, but you guys convinced me it's good for that.
Now thinking more about it. They both make pretty much the same size hole. Maybe the 45-110 might mushroom to a little big bigger exit. Maybe the 45 Colt won't go all the way through. I would think it would at under 100 yds and a straight side view shot at the vitals. So if both shoot though and both a 45 cal, is the effect the same or similar? Sorry for all the questions, but I've taken almost all my deer with a 270 in the past. I did shoot three last year with a 45-70 and it was great. Love this new to me method of hunting.

Owen

[piller]

I am sure the bullet would have a big part in whether it worked well or not. A solid lead bullet out of that .45-110 in the vitals or through a shoulder would be just fine, but through the guts would not do you or the deer much good. A good flat nosed bullet would be my choice based on a bad experience I had with round nose out of a .45-70 and a wounded animal. It was a poor shot, but the round nose did so very little damage that it made my error worse. I have used the wide flat nosed lead bullets on wild pigs and love the results, so I assume on deer there would be something similar.

[kimwcook]

Hightime, you're on the right track that both, the 45 Colt and the 45-120 at approximately 45 caliber and will perform approximately the same as your 45-70 did. I don't understand the poor deer statement, but that may be that you're not looking for a bunch of bloodshocked meat. The hardness of your bullets is going to dictate more what happens than anything else because they're all a rather slow moving round as compared to your 270. Most all of those rounds are going to be a through and through on a side shot especially if your shooting under 100 yds.

[Tumbleweeds II]

Either gun would blow a hole clear through a deer if shot broadside. The rifle would do it end to end or diagonal as well. In either case, you could eat right up to the hole because the terminal velocity would be slower than that needed to blood shoot the meat.

The cutoff is 2500 fps. If the bullet is going slower than that when it hits the deer, you want to shoot him in the shoulder to anchor him. If faster, as in a .270, you shoot behind the shoulder to avoid destroying the meat while collapsing the lungs.

[2571]

Reminds me of True Grit I: "Yeah, too much gun"

[6pt-sika]

Reminds me of True Grit I: "Yeah, too much gun"

I'd rather have to much then not enough

[86er]

With hardcast bullets in 45 Colt, 45-90 and even 450 NE I have most often seen a same-sized entry and exit. The deer often run a ways, sometimes aimlessly until they bleed out if shot through the lungs. Using a 530 grain bullet will likely retard expanson unless it is a pure lead or very soft lead bullet or has a hollow cavity. On the other hand, a 546 grain .629 pure lead hollow point (12 gauge slug) expanded to a silver dollar pancake and did not exit a whitetail at 115 yards. The amount of damage to the animal will be consistent if the same style bullet is used in different 45 caliber rifles. If both bullets will not expand, or expand to the same diameter and both have enough velocity respectively to exit there should be no difference in the wound channel. When you change the bullet diameter, or use bullets of different construction the results will change, for example a 500 gr hardcast flatnose hardcast compared to a 500 gr deep hollow point pure lead.

[hightime]

Thanks for your opinions. I'm starting to get it. Like I said comming from the 40 some years of useing the 270 this has got me a little off kilter. I hunt in brushy woods. I wish I had gone to the 45 years ago. So many deer wounded by trying to shoot through brush. Wounded but did not get away. I'm proud of my tracking. Those deer I shot last year with the 45-70 were with a Marlin 1895 Cowboy and the buckhorn sights. It kicks hard and I wont even try a tang peep on it. The 1873 45 Colt is a dream come true for me and I have the Lyman peep set for 100 yards and the buckhorns for fifty. I just didn't get the chance to use it this year. Part of that problem may have been my 10 year old grandson in the stand with me, but it's worth it. Next year he might spend time in his own stand.

Anyway no more 270, 308. I'm hooked solidly on the straight case old western ammo. and Leverguns. I guess that's why I'm here.

Owen

[adirondakjack]

The .45 colt with cast you gotta treat as if it will shoot a clean hole and stop, like GI hard ball.

Now yer .45-110 is in the class of the .50-70 I had. A 450 grainer of WW alloy or softer will ball up and keep plowing through an amazing amount of material. Dave Higginbotham, RIP, said he'd taken 7 bison with the .50, and NEVER recovered a bullet, even shooting straight through a bison end to end or sideways through 3 feet of skull.

Here's one I shot through a 15" diameter rotted "chopping block" and two one gallon water jugs. The bullet skated along the ground afterward, and was found in the leaves.

No deer that even lived would have stopped it.

[BigSky56]

I've dumped wt deer with a 45 LC in a 7.5" ruger using a 255 gr HC and hdy 255 1-20 lead pushed at 900 fps shoots clear thru shoulders or behind the shoulders doesnt matter. If you load a 300 gr and it leaves the rifle barrel at 1500 you have a 45-90 load. danny

[JerryB]

A few years ago one of my grandsons came for a visit. I gave him a box of .45 Colt rounds I had loaded. A 255 grain hard cast swc over 7.8 grain of Unique, my general shooting load for my old Colt. He left here and stopped in Clarksville Texas to visit his mother. On her ranch he shot a 245 pound hog with that load from a Rossi Hartford 20 inch carbine. He told me the bullet went through both shoulders and the hog fell within a few feet.
I reckon the old .45 will still get things done.

[Buck Elliott]

Handloading can easily push 250-grain cast bullets to 1400 - 1500 fps. As has been said, even at 900 fps, it will shoot clear through a deer, side to side, and keep on going..

At 1400+, it wil go end to end and out..

The 300 grainer is a hard fit for the '73, because of OAL limitations..

The old .45 is a real wonder, even in real-world terms...

[adirondakjack]

Handloading can easily push 250-grain cast bullets to 1400 - 1500 fps. As has been said, even at 900 fps, it will shoot clear through a deer, side to side, and keep on going..

At 1400+, it wil go end to end and out..

The 300 grainer is a hard fit for the '73, because of OAL limitations..

The old .45 is a real wonder, even in real-world terms...

139 years of killin what needed it and protecting what didn't. Hard to argue with.

I got three revolvers and three rifles in .45, none of em for sale.

[earlmck]

I wish I had gone to the 45 years ago. So many deer wounded by trying to shoot through brush.

Whoa there, hightime! I'm all for using the 45 leverguns on deer because they are mighty fine weapons for the purpose. But don't expect them to work any miracles shooting through brush. Because they don't. If shooting through brush is real high in your requirements you might look up fellow levergunner madman4570's posts on the subject. He performed tests that convinced me that if you gotta' buck the brush you'll use a shotgun with rifled slug.

[hightime]

I've read those posts. It's not that I try to route out bucks from heavy undergrowth. But inevitably opportunities present themselves to and from the high platforms in the big White Pines.
The dang deer you can't trust them.

Owen

[Griff]

We used to have a very informative, frequent poster here... that used a .45-70 with very heavy, slow bullets to great effect on deer. I miss him. Yer .45-110 ain't all that much more gun...

My personal opinion is... the smaller calibers, with their lighter bullets... even at significantly higher velocities, need that much higher velocity to transmit the energy the bullet has into the deer. In real terms... my mom has dainty little hands... my dad had big ol' meaty mitts... my bottom smarted a LOT more when hit at the same terminal velocity from my dad than my mom's ever did!

[JerryB]

Ya know Griff, I miss reading his post too.

[Booger Bill]

In any case it ought to roll a buck like a window shade.

[6pt-sika]

I wish I had gone to the 45 years ago. So many deer wounded by trying to shoot through brush.

Whoa there, hightime! I'm all for using the 45 leverguns on deer because they are mighty fine weapons for the purpose. But don't expect them to work any miracles shooting through brush. Because they don't. If shooting through brush is real high in your requirements you might look up fellow levergunner madman4570's posts on the subject. He performed tests that convinced me that if you gotta' buck the brush you'll use a shotgun with rifled slug.

I was fortuntae this year and killed everything I shot at deer or bear . And of the deer I killed 3 or 4 were shot thru brush . Not thick brush mind you but rather light to medium brush . Anyway cast bullets of 280-400 grains in the 444 did wonders . Now granted the brush was not super thick and I picked my shots with a bit of care . Still all 4 were hit where I aimed . So that kinda leads me to believe that they hit little if any obstructions in their path to the target !

Now to the shotgun slugs I gotta say I've had wonderfull results with both 12 and 20 gauge saboted slugs in my Savage bolt actions . Killed something like 5 or 6 with the 12 and 3 with the 20 . And of those maybe 3 were in brush to speak of , anyway those that were seemed to be pole axed instantly !

[rjohns94]

Yeah, I was thinking of him too griff. My 45-70 sharps shot through a buff at 75 yards. It was a round nose govt bullet, #2 lead, 520 gr. It was ST's load he shared with us often. I think the bullet is still going.