"Widdermatic" Marlin 1894 CAS rifle video

[adirondakjack]

While most sane people were sleeping last night, I rebuilt my 16" 1894 "Cowboy .45 Special" CAS racegun.

New modified carrier, (actually an old style "junk box" carrier that wouldn't even fit in the rifle met with a big flat file to start the process) some slight bolt mods, slight extractor mod. Feeds any of these:

OAL ranging from empty cases at .895" to 160 gr RNFP at 1.175, and some real headache rounds like my barnstormer HB 125 loaded upside down, the full diameter skirt out front...

It ain't yer grandpappy's Marlin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RssZK2ljFJw

[Pete44ru]

Kewl.......... Ain't it great, when a plan comes together ?

.

[Chuck 100 yd]

COOL !!!

[AJMD429]

[Warhawk]

Nice work, too bad Marlin can't make 'em run like that.

[Ben_Rumson]

Thats just neat Jack..

[Tycer]

And the tutorial can be bought where?

[Griff]

Very good work Jack. Like I said over on the SASS Wire, almost makes me wanna go out and buy a Marlin... almost... but not quite!!

[J Miller]

I don't remember which forum(s) this questions been asked on but the question has been: Was there ever a Win 92 chambered for .45ACP? The Answer: Yes in Mexico for a prison.
At least as best as I can remember.

So, A-Jack, since you made Marlins and the toggle link Ubertis run with your little short cartridge, how about working over a 92 action for them? That will give Griff something to think about.

Just a thought.

Joe

[J Miller]

a-jack,

The video finally loaded. That's pretty slick. I used to have a Colt Govt Mdl .45 That would feed empties from the magazine too.

Do you think you could be convinced to show us this modification or is it patented and copyrighted and stamped "Top Secret"?
Just funnin, but I am curious.

Joe

[adirondakjack]

Nope, I can't sell ya a tutorial, nor can I do the mods on your rifle (no FFL), but ya don't need that.

"Widder" is a kind and generous soul who is ony interested in folks having more fun with their guns, which means making em more reliable for hard and fast CAS use. He started the "Widdermatic think tank", a bunch of folks he talks to on the phone, sharing ideas, that led to the current "widdermatic" and "widdermAJig" mods.

A note on terminology. The original Widdermatic was a .38 special. When we figured out how to do the mods for the Cowboy .45 Special, the short round meant more timing issues meaning a shim JB welded under the carrier, but we stumbled onto the idea that we could make it feed both C45S and Long colt, interchangeably. Widder called that the "WiddermAJic" a nod to the maker of the Cowboy .45 Special (me). In time we noted that it was easier to get the timing spot on if we dedicated the rifle to only one round instead of the long and short combination ("mAJic"), so now any rifle set up for one cartridge is referred to as a widdermatic, while those set up for both long and short rounds are called "mAJic" (and magic they are, simply mind blowing)

Widder has done a pair of articles on these guns:
http://marauder.homestead.com/files/Wid ... Marlin.htm
and a couple of videos (linked on the articles).
Mine is the first "Matic" set up strictly for C45S (no long colt) as I wanted a bulletproof reliable gun with spot on timing, and it is, (feeds empty cases back to back), which is very touchy to get with the dual purpose set up.


I deviate from his setup in the way I cut the bolt face "ears". Widder removes the entire lower right ear and doesn't touch the left lower ear. I remove about half of both of em, angling the faces of the ears to match the case head angle as the case comes into contact with the bolt, so the cartridge slides up the ears, behind the extractor, (controlled feed), but leaving enough vestigal ear to form a shelf the case sits on once it slips behind the estractor. This allows less critical extractor tuning, and gives more positive support for the case, eliminating the potential for a case to drop off on extraction. I also "sharp claw" the extractor leave the point alone, but cut a reverse angle, and reduce the spring rate about half. Ejector spring rate is also reduced by 1/3 to half, tuned to JUST toss empties a hair behind the port (folks hate it when they toss forward, and brass can't be recoved when shooting from a common "hot" firing line.).

Otherwise I followed Widder's article pretty faithfully. Cut the step in the top of the carrier, made sure there was no "hump" but a slick, smooth straight path for the case to enter the chamber, added the jigsaw blade shim, tapered it to refine timing, and that's about it. Yes, ya take the gun apart and reassemble a maddening number of times while fitting and trying, yes ya have to be very very careful when grinding the ears on the bolt (chuck bolt in padded vise facing you, use good light, a fine stone in the dremel and go easy, NEVER touch the actual bolt face! Yes ya might could trash the carrier (on the first gun I did, a "widdermAJic" in .44 russian, special and mag, I wrecked one) But once ya "get it" ya got some kind of fun marlin, especially when combined with a general slicking up, one piece FP, light mainspring, etc....

Here you can see the round on the carrier, the bolt is just touching the casehead. Note the extractor is a hair above the rim, and the rim will slide behind the extractor as soon as the bolt pushes the case forward, sliding it up the angled ramp in the carrier.

[adirondakjack]

I don't remember which forum(s) this questions been asked on but the question has been: Was there ever a Win 92 chambered for .45ACP? The Answer: Yes in Mexico for a prison.
At least as best as I can remember.

So, A-Jack, since you made Marlins and the toggle link Ubertis run with your little short cartridge, how about working over a 92 action for them? That will give Griff something to think about.

Just a thought.

Joe

From time to time the Mexican '92s converted to ACP turn up. They were done to allow use of ACP ammo, millions of rounds of which the US gov't GAVE to Mexico following WWI, and they were lousy, failing to feed half the time, failing to exctract, clunky, uncertain contraptions. Doable? I guess, but the friction feed method of a 92 and the short case is a nightmare. The Marlin is easier, the rimmed C45S case is a lot easier (no need to rechamber or depend on uncertain headspacing off an extractor)

[Griff]

I don't remember which forum(s) this questions been asked on but the question has been: Was there ever a Win 92 chambered for .45ACP? The Answer: Yes in Mexico for a prison.
At least as best as I can remember.
So, A-Jack, since you made Marlins and the toggle link Ubertis run with your little short cartridge, how about working over a 92 action for them? That will give Griff something to think about.
Just a thought.
Joe

From time to time the Mexican '92s converted to ACP turn up. They were done to allow use of ACP ammo, millions of rounds of which the US gov't GAVE to Mexico following WWI, and they were lousy, failing to feed half the time, failing to exctract, clunky, uncertain contraptions. Doable? I guess, but the friction feed method of a 92 and the short case is a nightmare. The Marlin is easier, the rimmed C45S case is a lot easier (no need to rechamber or depend on uncertain headspacing off an extractor)

Hmmm... ya got me thinkin'! I'm gonna find a donor '92 in .45 Colt and make it work; in C45S, not ACP.

[adirondakjack]

Griff, if anybody can do it, I expect you could twist Steve Young's arm into it....