Something to mull over

[J Miller]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy back when, like around the late 1800s to 1930s, before the govt started taking over every square inch of ground and all the game laws, men were heading off into the wilderness with only one lever gun, a knife or two, and their pack. A couple two or three boxes of ammo and they were good for the season.

Now, 2010, the govt either runs everything, has destroyed it, has all but ruined hunting and it's almost impossible to just walk off into the wilderness for any period of time.
We have a huge selection of rifles and handguns to choose from and many of us have enough spending money to buy what ever they want.
Yet when the subject of "only one gun" comes up, we go nuts cos we can't make up our minds which one gun we'd take.

Kinda funny isn't it? When we were survival hunters, trappers, explorers, had places to go and things to do it was easy to pick a Marlin, Savage, or Winchester lever gun and head out. Now that we are "civilized" and are restricted to where we can go and what we can do, it's hard to choose just one.

I wonder about us sometimes.
I also wonder if it's because of the proliferation of choices or because of the lack of perceived quality of many of the choices we have.

Personally if I were to walk off into the wilderness with only one gun, it would be a Winchester 1894 RIFLE chambered for 30 W.C.F. Preferably an original pre-war version, but a converted pre-64 would be OK too. A hundred rounds of ammo and my cuttin tool and I'd be set.

Only in my dreams.

Joe


Q: O wise one, when I erase a word with a pencil, where does it go?
A: Pencil still in your hand, my son!

[rjohns94]

Joe, thats a great thought. and you have chosen a great rifle to do what you would like to do. I often head off into "the wilderness" with one of my flintlocks, either the .54 rifle or the .62 smoothbore, dressed in period dress, with all my camp fixings, and stay. I would not be too hard pressed to extend that near indefinately if I could add fishing gear and my bow. But to stay on topic, the lever rifle I would choose would depend on the area I am in, what I planned on hunting for. With what I own now, In alaska, I would use my WWG Co-pilot in .457/45-70 or my circa 1903 Model 94 in 30-30 rifle. here in the east, it would be the 30-30 or the 92 in .357. for just plain survival mode, probably the marlin TDS take down in .22lr. Either way, it makes for a real nice day dream instead of doing time at the grind of a job. (Oh, and I would carry my .45 colt FA in all cases except with the 92 in .357 where I would carry a .357 pistol.)

[1894cfan]

I'm with you on the Win 94 30WCF, only I'd also pack a Ruger MKII short barrel for anything else. Oh, and also a pack rod for fishing.

[Blaine]

If it came down to it, I could sell everything except the 12ga SxS and the Single Six with both cyls..... Might make it the 20 SxS Hammer Gun I got off 86er and a 1911 because if it got down to that, I would not be plinking, it would be all business and eating. One long gun and one sidearm is as far as I would willingly go down to.

[rjohns94]

Yeah Blaine, I was thinking perhaps the Paradox 12 gauge sxs as my one and only anywhere with a sidearm. It has a sling, 730grain slugs, can be used for dove to .... anything really, and the sidearm would still be my .45colt or .475 linebaugh.

[Catshooter]

Interesting veiwpoint Joe. There's alot of truth in what you say.

I suffer from just what you're describing. Would I want the Marlin in .38-55 or the Win 94 in the same caliber? The H&R single shot in .45-70 and the eight other barrels? Or, to really launch off into left field, how about the Mosin-Nagant/Finnish rifle in 7.62?

*sigh*

Short guns are much easier . . . huh, I think. Well, maybe not. Shheeeeshh, yer a trouble maker fer sure!


Cat

[TedH]

I believe I could get along quite nicely with my 357 mag model 92. Wouldn't object to a 30-30 either, in Marlin or Winchester design.

[L_Kilkenny]

I'll agree that we have lots of choices today and we make it harder than it really needs to be. I do think you are over simplifing their choices back then though. There were a lot more than just lever guns. Shotguns, single shot rifles, flintlocks, percussions, etc etc. I'm sure what one man thought was perfect another thought was stupid. Same as today. They also had more defense issues to worry about which kinda took .22 rimfires out of there equasion. But I'm sure more than one farm boy headed out to the wilderness with nothing more than a .22 rimfire and many times not even that. I'd be suprized if more than 33% of the men prior to 1890 had a repeating rifle. Or a centerfire revolver for that matter. Curious to find out. Hmmmm...........

I don't know what I'd chose and generally I don't think I have a bad choice in my locker. I'd have to adjust my game to the tools at hand. If I desided on a .22, small game is the order of the day. If I chose a shotgun I'd better not hunt where 100 yard plus shots are typical. If I choose a centerfire lever gun I'm not gonna go wing shooting, etc etc. So my choice may very well change depending on where I think I'm going.

This is kinda going back to my one gun, one load post from last week. The project gun from the post would be my pick. An accurate .25 or 6.5mm repeater (bolt, lever, pump). Not a lot it does bad, it does a few things great and a lot of things well. In a wilderness scenraio I don't think the action would mean much as long as it's a light handy gun. Even a sinlge shot would be fine but it's not gonna be my first choice by a long shot. If I was heading into hostile ground would I be happy with a bolt gun considering all the other choices we have today? More than likely not but I'd sure try my best with one though.

Another cartridge I think needs mentioning for a one gun wilderness or survival scenario is the .22mag. Small, light ammo being it's big plus and a little more pop to justify it over a .22LR. In a survival scenraio a person could do a lot worse.



LK

[Jason_W]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy back when, like around the late 1800s to 1930s, before the govt started taking over every square inch of ground and all the game laws, men were heading off into the wilderness with only one lever gun, a knife or two, and their pack. A couple two or three boxes of ammo and they were good for the season.

Now, 2010, the govt either runs everything, has destroyed it, has all but ruined hunting and it's almost impossible to just walk off into the wilderness for any period of time.
We have a huge selection of rifles and handguns to choose from and many of us have enough spending money to buy what ever they want.

Weren't many game species nearing extinction by the end of the 19th century and only brought back by regulation and management?

Also, what do you think limits hunting options more: The government, or strip malls and housing developments erected by private industry?

[adirondakjack]

Joe, while we all enjoy the fruits of modernity (we're all online for example), breaking from traditional life means CHOICES. Most if not all of the history of the Americas is a study in how changes in ways of life effect people and society. Sod-bound serfs left Europe and (eventually) found freedom here. freedonm to do what, exactly? Many didn't KNOW how to choose, so they did what they always did, farmed, but learned how to be businessmen as well. Others took to the frontiers literally, or to the "new technologies that emerged, became engineers, (choo-choo, not slide rule) merchants, miners, cowbioys, god knows what.

But as Margaret Mead observed in her studies, CHOICES are frought with peril. The old ways worked, somewhat, or they would not have survived. Often with change, folks got bit on the butt by the laws of unintended consequences. Early settlers were sold land in places with too short a growing season to bring forth crops, miners went bust or died on the trail due to unforseen hazards, etc.

So I can imagine a kid in 1835 who strikes out with a flintlock rifle, good knife, his pack, and a dream. Were not many choices.....

By 1885, many the same kid might take the train with a steamer trunk of goodies, half of which he ended up not needing....

By 1935 it would be the bus or a dilapidated Model T, carrying stuff as stupid as a violyn.......

Today we have to decide if we have enough backup ways to charge the cell phone, enough water purification (how about building a fire???) and redundant GPS..... Let alone which of our dozens of arms modern life has afforded us to bring along to make memories.

Heck, I've made trips to the range where it took four or five armloads to unload the car...... and STILL forgot to bring the spotting scope, binoculars and/or camera.....

Change is good, sometimes, unsettling always....


PS, psychologists believe humans have just barely begun to deal with the changes brought about by artificial light (sleep and work patterns, etc), let alone the rest of it.

[TedH]

Waaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy back when, like around the late 1800s to 1930s, before the govt started taking over every square inch of ground and all the game laws, men were heading off into the wilderness with only one lever gun, a knife or two, and their pack. A couple two or three boxes of ammo and they were good for the season.

Now, 2010, the govt either runs everything, has destroyed it, has all but ruined hunting and it's almost impossible to just walk off into the wilderness for any period of time.
We have a huge selection of rifles and handguns to choose from and many of us have enough spending money to buy what ever they want.

Weren't many game species nearing extinction by the end of the 19th century and only brought back by regulation and management?

Also, what do you think limits hunting options more: The government, or strip malls and housing developments erected by private industry?

Good points Jason.

Joe, your current location is certainly lacking pubilc ground for hunting on. The west is still full of public ground where a fellow is free to roam and hunt the critters in season. When I lived in Idaho I was amazed at the vast tracts a guy could roam on for days and not encounter another soul.

[lthardman]

Interesting thoughts on the irony of the current situation. It made me think about it a little.

Perhaps it is BECAUSE we have so limited choices for hunting it makes us more picky on the gun we would choose. Can't afford to be wrong and waste the few opportunities we get. I suspect that if the hunting ground and opportunities were doubled or tripled, maybe we would get a bit more adventurous in our choice. If we picked wrong, there would always be tomorrow.

[Jason_W]

I consider myself to be interested in guns and interested in hunting independently of one another.

I don't really need more than the beat up old 870 20 ga my dad gave me for my 12th birthday. It's accounted for more game than any other gun I own or have owned so far.

I keep buying guns (when I can afford to) simply because guns are cool.

[Blaine]

I may actually thin the herd a bit----I really want a drift boat that I'd rather not finance.

[Malamute]

There's still some places with room ro roam. There's vast areas of National Forest in the northern Rockies that would take years to see in detail, and few people truly get out into. It wouldnt be tough to roam on foot or horse for months on end without stepping on anyones toes, or breaking any laws. In the fall, starting the first of Sept, there's some big game or small game open through the end of the year. Black bear opens about then, and some deer and elk general seasons (over the counter tags for residents) go for a couple months overlapping starting in mid or late Sept, or different areas close to each other that you could stay looking if you didnt get anything. Grouse is open then also, and runs through Nov.

[Ben_Rumson]

Put it this way.. Are you willing plunk down the bucks for one of them new/old fangled Model 89 SS Leverguns in a new caliber? That idea and investment might put you in the shoes of a fella bent on gearing up & heading out way back when...Rewind to the 1890s - 1900...”Hmm should I try a rifle that uses the new fangled gee whiz smokeless powder? Mebbe a Model 1894 30WCF Rifle... Hmmm I don’t know .. Maybe I ought to split the difference and get one in 32 so I can reload with BP...I know it’s tried & true... I hear they both shoots pretty flat.. Or maybe I should get that 1895 Winchester...But I’ve read some have better barrel steel than others... Hmm...This is a serious investment ...I’ve got other gear to get too.. Hmm.. Do I really need a repeater? Those surplus single shot breach loaders will make good meat...Hmm.. Sharps are pretty cheap these days..

[rimrock]

I've been reading a book with the title of "Three Cups of Tea". It's about a guy who builds schools in the Himilayas of Afganistan and Pakistan. The author describes how happy these people are with the most basic stuff for daily living. I think there is a lot to consider in Joe's thoughts.

Back on topic, It's an easy choice for me right now as I have one rifle in .444 and a .45C revolver. I'm working hard on the theory that you should be cautious of a man with one gun because he most likely knows how to use it. I could disappear with these 2 guns and enough stuff to reload 4-500 rounds of each, $500-$1000 in cash in small bills, a few clothes, my machete, 2 knives and little else and be just fine.

rimrock

[rjohns94]

rimrock, excellent book.

Blaine, I'm considering it too. If I do, its going to be a BIG sale. I'm looking at two pistols, a .22 rifle, the paradox and one centerfire rifle to keep, (and 2 flintlocks). The rest will be going. I'm doing the same with my fishing stuff.

[AJMD429]

Put it this way.. Are you willing plunk down the bucks for one of them new/old fangled Model 89 SS Leverguns in a new caliber? That idea and investment might put you in the shoes of a fella bent on gearing up & heading out way back when...Rewind to the 1890s - 1900...”Hmm should I try a rifle that uses the new fangled gee whiz smokeless powder? Mebbe a Model 1894 30WCF Rifle... Hmmm I don’t know .. Maybe I ought to split the difference and get one in 32 so I can reload with BP...I know it’s tried & true... I hear they both shoots pretty flat.. Or maybe I should get that 1895 Winchester...But I’ve read some have better barrel steel than others... Hmm...This is a serious investment ...I’ve got other gear to get too.. Hmm.. Do I really need a repeater? Those surplus single shot breach loaders will make good meat...Hmm.. Sharps are pretty cheap these days..

I like the way you put things in perspective. Always interesting to mull over what would go through the minds of our ancestors, on any topic.

[AJMD429]

I may actually thin the herd a bit----I really want a drift boat that I'd rather not finance.

When we needed to finish out our upstairs, add dormers, and so on, a fair number of non-essential guns were parted with to ease the financial strain; some of them were 'generic' enough that I later found ones to replace them when the cookie jar was back to normal.

[C. Cash]

The Mod. 94 Win. makes a bunch of sense on many levels. It is as the old timers used to say, a "proven" design. Mine never seems to fail and I've got a good number of rounds down it. I can't say that about some of my guns....only my Rugers and my 870 Rem. have earned the same reputation. Mine is in 356 Win. but loaded like a warm 35 Rem. with 200-210 gr. cast bullets. It wears a Williams FP rear and Ashley Front. It would be my go to rifle in a bad/extended situation.

PS: make sure that knife is sharp Joe!