Wyoming? NC, VA, TN?

[hkfrost]

I see quite a few of you fella's live in Wyoming. My son is showing an interest in applying to the University of Wyoming, Laramie. He is a swimmer and likes what he sees of the swim team there. Wants to study engineering. The tuition looks to be one third the tuition of the public colleges here in the people's repub. of NJ! He likes snow and changes of season. I was thinking of buying some land in one of the "free states" to have when I am ready for retirement. Wyoming is one of my choices. A "ranchette" would be nice. Can you guys give me some insight into to this beautiful state? Taxes, price of housing/land, peoples attitudes to likeminded newcomers etc....

Thanks, Harold

[Leverluver]

Compared to what you are used to, property taxes are quite reasonable, if not cheap. There is no state income tax although they have threatened it before when times were tougher. And in WY, times are either great or tough, rarely in between. It's all based on energy. Right now we are in a "gas bubble", mostly coal bed methane, which has a finite life and many other problems associated with it that will limit expansion of it. If I live long enough I expect to see WY through two full booms and busts. You get used to it and prepare for it.

A lot of the land is locked up by the Federal gov't. What "ranchette" land that is for sale is mostly raw. Watch out as some of the stuff advertised has limited (by legal right of passage or weather) access. Where most of the "cheap" land is for sale has poor or no water so be careful. Pay extra for a proven well (and check the water quality). It will save you tons of money in the long run.

As far as accepting outsiders; your term "likeminded" is the key. I would recommend a long visit to see if you are really likeminded. Some come from other places where they thought they were and found they weren't. If realy likeminded, then a hearty welcome to the greatest state in the union

[jnyork]

Well, coming from NJ to Wyoming will certainly induce culture shock in most folks, that's for sure!!

UW is a fine school and I'm sure your son will do very well there. Having him there will be a good excuse for you to come out and visit a few times and get some knowledge first hand. Be SURE to visit in the dead of winter so you really get a good feel for it, many people from other states move out here and are gone in a year or two due to the long severe winters.

You need to tour around the state quite a bit if you are thinking about buying property. Land values vary drastically from place to place. You will find the "ranchette" properties outrageously overpriced in most areas due to the influx of rich folks from other states, notably California, who will pay any price without blinking. With thousands of square miles of public land to go play on within a few minutes drive of town, I often wonder why anyone would want a "ranchette" with all the attendant PITA worries that go with one . A nice home in a small town might serve most folks better.

You will be welcomed by most of the people here as long as you respect our values, customs and traditions. Unfortunately, far too many newcomers go to all the trouble to move out here and then immediately start trying to make Wyoming just like the place they just left, notably Californians. If this is you, stay away!!

A good idea for you would be to contact Realtors in several towns and ask for a relocation package to be sent to you. This will give you some idea of what each area has to offer. Best of luck in your search.

[Leverluver]

Seems to be a trend as far as compatibility, huh??

One other important thing, make sure wife or significant other is on board. Most (not all, by any means, but a majority) of women in WY would rather live some place else (Denver, etc). Even in our largest cities (only two ~ 50,000) there aren't the amenities that an "eastern" lady is used to, although they are more than adequate. Don't understimate the affect of such a culture change on the female of the species.

[Gun Smith]

The advice given to try living there before you buy is very important. The wife must give her approval before a final move or both of you will not be happy.
My wife and I moved to our current city in Oregon from California and lived there for two and one half months. You will get a feeling for the people, country, cost of living and weather that you cannot get any other way. We also did it in winter. Of course coastal Oregon (lots of rain) has nothing like central Wyoming for weather. We just wanted to feel the difference from where we came from.

[t.r.]

Wyoming has abundant mineral wealth but the state has many ghost towns. When the mining halts, the town dies. But Gillette has been steadily growing since late 1960's. Coal and natural gas are the top minerals. Affordable land can be found in Big Horn and Crook counties.

Casper is a shadow of its former self. The huge petroleum refinery was shut down during Clinton years.

I grew up outside of Powell on Grandad's cattle ranch. It's a very dry region. Strong Mormon country.

Laramie is high altitude. You'll want a warm sweater after dark even in July. I don't know much about their quality of education; you should do some homework.

South Dakota School of Mines & Technology in Rapid City produces exceptional engineers each year. This school has a large student body of Norwegians that go back to their homeland with outstanding educations.

I no longer reside in Wyoming but I go back to elk hunt as a non-resident when I can get drawn for a license.
TR

[Buck Elliott]

Although Wyoming has weather "regions," as would be expected in an area of its size and differing geography, Winter can be brutal, no matter where you are. Dobois and Cody/Powell seem to be the "banana belt" of the state, with milder temperatures and less snowfall than most other areas. That said, we just went through a week of -15 to -20 degrees, but it's warming up right now, and should be in the +40s today. Tomorrow...???

The Jackson/Star Valley areas are always bitter cold in the Winter, with temps that dip into the -50 range. Cheyenne & Laramie have WIND of unbelievable proportions, off and on; Summer, Fall, Winter & Spring. Rock Springs is the World's largest inhabited Gravel Pit, and the country around it is notably short on good water. Buffalo/Sheridan is nice country, with fair access to the back country of the Big Horn Mountains.

As has been said -- spend some time ( a lot of time...) here before you make the commitment.

[jnyork]

in Rock Springs is the World's largest inhabited Gravel Pit, .

.

[rjohns94]

When I went across country, I came through Laramie and fell in love with the place.
that was in the middle of Winter. I could do that for sure!

[Don McDowell]

Leverluver, York, and Buck have all given some sound sound advice.
But just to reiterate one more time , Wyoming WILL be a culture shock to not only you but your wife. The entire population of the state including any number of transient miscreants on a given day may or may not make 500,000. The state is the 9nth largest in the nation and only beaten out of the sparseness of population per square mile by Alaska.
Conversely there's no shortage of days its warmer in Anchorage and Fairbanks during the winter than it is in much of Wyoming. We just get more sun. There are places the wind is exceptionally annoying and there are other places where the wind isn't to bad at all.
Come out here spend a goodly amount of time and pick carefully, and it's best to come take alook right now. Not in the summer when all is fine and all the seasonal business's are up and running.....
The part about when you move here move here because you like what you saw, and not that you want to bring your favorite things about JOyesey with you. You'll get along fine right up to the point you say "yeh that's pretty good, but back in Hobocken, we....." at that point is probably when the welcome wagon will either try and run you over or will stay just as far away from you as it can get.

[Don McDowell]

Sort of fitting and timely I suppose, this just came from a friend of ours that lives in Laramie and has for the most part of her life.
WINTER Poem �

It's winter in Wyoming
And the gentle breezes blow
Seventy miles an hour
At thirty-five below.

Oh, how I love Wyoming�
When the snow's up to your butt
You take a breath of winter
And your nose gets frozen shut. �

Yes, the weather here is wonderful
So I guess I'll hang around
I could never leave Wyoming
I'm frozen to the ground!

[Buck Elliott]

Sort of fitting and timely I suppose, this just came from a friend of ours that lives in Laramie and has for the most part of her life.
WINTER Poem �

It's winter in Wyoming
And the gentle breezes blow
Seventy miles an hour
At thirty-five below.

Oh, how I love Wyoming�
When the snow's up to your butt
You take a breath of winter
And your nose gets frozen shut. �

Yes, the weather here is wonderful
So I guess I'll hang around
I could never leave Wyoming
I'm frozen to the ground!

Priceless...

[Don McDowell]

Yeh that's what I thought also. She said it was -50 with the windchill over there the other day.
She's a fiestly little thing maybe break 5 ft if she's got her stelltos on, so it don't take much snow for her to be.....

[Ray Newman]

I'll add that when considering a retirement home anywhere:

--Consider how close you are to a doctor, dentist, hospital, and other EMT services. Age takes its toll on the body and sickness doesn't care what season it is.

-- A long driveway is a long plow when the snow flies. You'll need to hire someone to keep it clear or buy a plow.

--If you ever think about making an offer on a house, ask to review the previous year's (or years') heating bills.

--If considering buying raw land, the costs of "improvements": well, septic, telephone, & other utilities, may not make it seem like such a good price afterall.

--If you having a house built, install quality widows and the maximum am't. of insulation possible. Also think of a low maintenance exterior, yard, etc.

--Re and re-read what Leverluver, Buck Elliot, Don McDowell, and jnyork posted about winter and land.

I know a couple who moved to WA from CA and now has “problems.” Visits were short and usually in the fall, summer, and spring. They really dislike the high sales & property tax as well as the cold and rain plus the fact that it can freeze the roads and snow.

--Also, prices for food, gas, etc., can and maybe higher than what you are accustomed to due to the added transportation/shipping costs.

When we were looking for a retirement location, we considered 3 different states and visited each area. It was soon down to one. Since I’m retired from the USMC, we considered the proximity of military bases and the VA facilities. Drew an approx. 25 mile circle around ea. base/facility and started to consider those areas. Looked on the internet for housing, prices, tax base, etc.

Sometimes it will pay to work with more than one realtor.

You really need to do your homework as a realtor’s best interest is to sell you a house or sign a lease and collect a commission....

[Kansas Ed]

Buck and others hit the nail on the head...Lord...every year in Star Valley we could count on 1 full week of temperatures which never got above -20 below. The snow would pile up so high that you could walk up on top of my garage from the barn lot...no ladder...and get used to shoveling the roof if you have a cornice that doesn't sluff the snow.

One thing that people in other parts of the country take for granted that really hits home in Wyo is the travel time to anything resembling what you are used to in other parts of the country...

For instance: From Freedom Wyo it was:

70 minutes to the nearest Mcdonalds
90 minutes to the nearest Walmart
90 minutes to the nearest large grocery store.
10 minutes to the nearest Convenience store
25 minutes to the nearest pharmacy/doctor/hospital
Burger King....Don't know if I ever saw one in the 8 years we were there.
Taco Bell....nope...
25 minutes to the nearest theatre (one movie)
70 minutes to a Multiplex

I'm sure that it's changed some since we left, but just so you know...grocery shopping takes a whole day....travel time to...and travel time from....and of course all the above times are with clear roads. Most women don't care for that...but if you've got a spender on your hands it could be a good thing for you

Ed

[hkfrost]

You guys are great. Thanks for all of this excellent input! We would definitely check it out in winter. Our retirement short list also includes the mountain triangle of NC, Virginia and Tenn. I guess that would be a more gentle place climate wise, but still getting the benefit of changing seasons. One thing is for sure: Gotta get out of Joysee!

[Hobie]

We've had a lot of emigrees from NJ this past year. The weather is usually some better but not this winter!

[Lastmohecken]

I was only in Wyoming in late June, one time. The mountains sure were beautiful. But the wind was a little sharp around sundown, even then. It is my favorite western state, that I have been to.

I found the locals to be friendly, but the tourist traps, were often run by outsiders, or newcommers and I didn't find some of them to be so friendly.
I do remember a little hole in the wall cafe in downtown Debois, the food was down home cooked, and the people were very friendly. I have a good friend from Wyoming, that lives here in Arkansas now, and has worked with me for several years, the one thing that I did learn about Wyoming is that the winters are long and rought, and unless you have a darned good opportunity up there, it's best to bring money with you, because I didn't see a lot of good ways to make a living up there, unless you had ties, or owned a ranch or business or something.

If I was rich, I would have a summer home up there, but I would probably go south for about 8 months out of the year.

[Hanzerik]

I moved from NJ to WY in 2006 (military). Spent 8.5 years stationed in NJ and was glad to move out. I have only been here for a little over three years, but plan to retire in place and call Wyoming my permanent home. Gun laws, or the lack of gun laws, are great. The people of Wyoming, or the lack lack of, are great folks as long as you don't try to tell them how to live their lives. People here pretty much mind their own business, which I like. I even like the weather, it keeps the riff-raff out.