OT - Anybody seen this before? 30 shot 22 wmr pistol!

arjunky · Post by **arjunky** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:31 am

Just seen this posted on Rimfire.

http://kel-tec-cnc.com/images/pmr-30.pdf

Byron

don Tomás · Post by **don Tomás** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:56 am

Expected MSRP: $415

That doesn't seem too bad at all...

AkRay · Post by **AkRay** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:20 am

I hope it turns out to be more reliable than the Grendel P-30. The one I had experience with was a piece of jammish junk.

Jeff Quinn · Post by **Jeff Quinn** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:37 am

I am an optimist, and have high hopes for the new Kel-Tec. I have one on order, but it will be a long wait.

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:09 am

Looks like Robo Pistol!

Kinda cool.

I always wanted one of the old AMT .22 mag pistols but never came across the right deal.

jb

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:39 am

2ndovc wrote:I always wanted one of the old AMT .22 mag pistols but never came across the right deal.

Hold out for the short barrel (3 5/8"?) version. You can kill it and grill it at the same time! Really lights up an indoor range...

Ak, I never owned a P30 but your comment mirrors what I heard from everyone I talked to who owned one.

jdad · Post by **jdad** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:41 am

Pretty cool, but since you can't reload the 22mag and the cost per rounds is about equal to a .223...........

..........an expensive plinkier.

wilko · Post by **wilko** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:42 am

I'd be interested in one...

i'll wait though untill i read Jeff's writeup about it

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:51 am

That goes to the top of the wish list.

firefuzz · Post by **firefuzz** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:29 am

AkRay wrote:I hope it turns out to be more reliable than the Grendel P-30. The one I had experience with was a piece of jammish junk.

So someone else had one of those, I thought I was the only one that screwed up on that.

. My experience with Kel-Tec has been nothing but great and hopefully this will be another sucess.

Rob

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:36 am

Jeff Quinn wrote:I am an optimist, and have high hopes for the new Kel-Tec. I have one on order, but it will be a long wait.

Kel-Tec has been introducing some seriously sexy stuff recently.

Add this one to the 7.62 front-eject bullpup...

76/444 · Post by **76/444** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:48 am

Ditto on Kel Tec's rep and products in the past. Ya, they had a few hic-ups , but who hasn't. The couple I bought were perfect in every way.

This piece really shocks me! Didn't hear about it coming till now. And i am a 22 mag whore! Circumventing the inherent problems of producing a 22 mag semi-auto pistol has proven disastrous in the past for the few who tried.

Knowing as much as I do about Kel Tec, I get a gut feeling all will be well,.... but, I will wait and see, as I did with all my Kel Tec purchases.

WCF3030 · Post by **WCF3030** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:15 am

I'd love to try one out. Looks like fun!!

Ridgerunner · Post by **Ridgerunner** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:48 am

With 30 rounds, if it feeds reliabily, it might make a good home defense piece with HP rounds for the recoil sensitive. Bill Jordan wanted S&W to come out with one in the '60's for the J-frame, but nothing ever came of it. I recall he wanted it all aluminum except the barrel.....

Doc Hudson · Post by **Doc Hudson** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:14 am

I've not seen that one, but I remember the Grendel m-30 pistol, it was even uglier. The danged thing looked like a kid's toy ray gun.

IIRC, the real downfall of the Grendel, other than a very early attempt at a polymer frame was the fact that the magazine was non-removable and had to be loaded from the top of the pistol. It to was a 30-shot pistol

jdad · Post by **jdad** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:35 am

You guys do know that the top guy at Kel Tec was the top guy at Grendel.....

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:37 am

No, I did not.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:18 pm

This ain't your father's Grendel...

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/rfb.htm

The RFB is a short-stroke gas piston operated semi-automatic rifle in 7.62 mm NATO caliber. It accepts standard metric FAL type magazines which work "drop free" and do not need to be tilted in. Barrels on current models are 18" long, with a chrome lined bore and chamber. The muzzle is threaded 5/8x24 TPI and comes equipped with our A2-style Flash Hider*. Longer barrel lengths of 24", 26" and 32" will be available in the future.

All controls are fully ambidextrous; the reciprocating operating handle can be switched to either side.

Why is there no ejection port (the bane of all bullpups)?

The patented, dual-extractor system maintains control of the case from the moment it leaves the magazine and upon firing, pulls the fired case from the chamber and lifts them to push them into an ejection chute above the barrel, where they exit. The Bullpup configuration and tilting-block mechanism allow the 18" model to be only 26.1" long, or as much as 14" shorter in overall length than its competitors with equal barrel lengths. Furthermore, the stock and mechanism cross-section is similar to a conventional rifle, in stark contrast to existing Bullpup rifles. The RFB is also the safest Bullpup ever developed because the breech is separated from the shooters face by two layers of 1.6 mm steel. In the highly unlikely event of a case rupture, gas expansion is directed downwards through the magazine well to protect the shooters head and face.

This is a really cool design, though I'd like to see run through a mud & sand test.

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:30 pm

It looks very interesting and the 30 round cap is exciting but I have to ask what kind of performance one gets out of .22 Mag from a 4" barrel? Is it notably better than .22LR?

Oly

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:03 pm

Those firearms may be the greatest things since sliced bread, but they have to be the ugliest things I"ve ever seen. Two piece frames held together with screws? That's just plain moronic. Just let Bubba get to it with his Leatherman or Swiss Army knife and in 5 minutes he's got a pile of junque.

Other than that I'd like to shoot that RFB rifle. That thing is an EBR if I ever saw one. Whoo Hooo, lets all make the commies in DC get their panites in a wad

.

Joe

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:12 pm

J Miller wrote:...Other than that I'd like to shoot that RFB rifle. That thing is an EBR if I ever saw one. Whoo Hooo, lets all make the commies in DC get their panites in a wad .

Joe

My thoughts too. IMO a PROPER combat rifle shoutl be easily shootable with either hand/eye.

A TE Winny works good there. This RFB with its "front eject" looks interesting too - if grundge won't hork it up.

And their use of an existing Magazine platform deserves extra brownie points too.

There was a good writeup in one of the "cop guns" rags.

I'd like one with a 24" bbl (OAL of 32")

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:34 pm

I went over to the Kel-Tec site and read what they had to say about it. Since I would prefer peep sights to a scope and it don't come with sights, just where would one go to get sights? I don't think Williams makes an FP for it.

Joe

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:43 pm

J Miller wrote:I went over to the Kel-Tec site and read what they had to say about it. Since I would prefer peep sights to a scope and it don't come with sights, just where would one go to get sights? I don't think Williams makes an FP for it.

Joe

The article I read used a new Eotech holosight setup that looked pretty fast/reliable. But I agree, I'd like to see Irons available.

Hey, there's an Idea... Piccatinny mountable Irons for Bare Guns...

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:05 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:
J Miller wrote:I went over to the Kel-Tec site and read what they had to say about it. Since I would prefer peep sights to a scope and it don't come with sights, just where would one go to get sights? I don't think Williams makes an FP for it.

Joe
The article I read used a new Eotech holosight setup that looked pretty fast/reliable. But I agree, I'd like to see Irons available.

Hey, there's an Idea... Piccatinny mountable Irons for Bare Guns...

I wonder if those Piccatinny rail sight Ruger supplies for their EBR would work?

Joe

Rimfire McNutjob · Post by **Rimfire McNutjob** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:50 pm

Nice looking gun. My AMT 6" is loud as all get out though. This one's probably similar.

Jeff Quinn · Post by **Jeff Quinn** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:01 pm

I have been shooting the RFB a bit. Details and video here:
http://www.gunblast.com/KelTec-RFB.htm

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:05 pm

Thanks Jeff! Now, would you do me a favor and low-crawl through the mud in an attempt to get gunk in the ejection port? That'a about the ONLY concern I've had (other than no $$$) with this design.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:08 pm

Gonna go read his article, but it looks like Jeff is shooting a blow torch

Joe

Jeff Quinn · Post by **Jeff Quinn** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:26 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:Thanks Jeff! Now, would you do me a favor and low-crawl through the mud in an attempt to get gunk in the ejection port? That'a about the ONLY concern I've had (other than no $$$) with this design.

I have not packed it with mud, but looking at the design, the track is open almost its entire length. Crud can easily get out, and also access to clear the track is quick and easy, by just pushing one disassembly pin. Here is a picture:

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:34 pm

Those people sure can build some ugly guns.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 6:02 pm

Jeff Quinn wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:Thanks Jeff! Now, would you do me a favor and low-crawl through the mud in an attempt to get gunk in the ejection port? That'a about the ONLY concern I've had (other than no $$$) with this design.
I have not packed it with mud, but looking at the design, the track is open almost its entire length. Crud can easily get out, and also access to clear the track is quick and easy, by just pushing one disassembly pin. Here is a picture:

Jeff,
Are the empties free to fall out if you tilt the muzzle down, or does the one behind have to push the front one out?

Joe

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 6:42 pm

Jeff Quinn wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:Thanks Jeff! Now, would you do me a favor and low-crawl through the mud in an attempt to get gunk in the ejection port? That'a about the ONLY concern I've had (other than no $$$) with this design.
I have not packed it with mud, but looking at the design, the track is open almost its entire length. Crud can easily get out, and also access to clear the track is quick and easy, by just pushing one disassembly pin. Here is a picture:

Thanks for the pic. That makes sense.

Ah well... maybe someday I will have the money for a Gas Gun... but for now it's down on my list. It's moved up a bit, but it's still down there a ways.

Chas. · Post by **Chas.** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 7:39 pm

Whole lot of corners.

76/444 · Post by **76/444** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:57 am

Rusty wrote:Those people sure can build some ugly guns.

Never met an ugly gun!

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 3:18 pm

Back to the original post,
I don't like the non-adjustable sights,
but if J Quinn gives it a pass, I am going to get one.
Quite useful here in the southwest.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:19 pm

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:28 pm

Yeah,
With 30 rounds, good for ALL kinds of varmits.

arjunky · Post by **arjunky** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:52 pm

Rimfire McNutjob wrote:Nice looking gun. My AMT 6" is loud as all get out though. This one's probably similar.

6" is annoying, but the 4" AMT reminds me of my .30 carbine blackhawk.

Byron

sore shoulder · Post by **sore shoulder** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:10 am

MY WAAAAAAANNNNNNNTTTTT!!!!!!!!!

I have a Kel Tec rifle and pistol and they work very well. I'm very impressed with Kel Tec. Apparently Ruger is too.

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:52 am

Go for it , KelTec.