#1 1/2 Rolling Block Cadet

[marlinman93]

Now this doesn't look like much, and being military appearing, it's outside my area of collecting. But it's one of only three I've ever seen, and they were never cataloged by Remington. And no mention in any of the various Remington Rolling Block reference books either!
What you see was listed as a .43 Spanish Rolling Block, with a 28" barrel. But if you look closely you might notice this isn't a military action at all, it's an octagon top Sporting Rifle action! And looking at the buttstock it's also a Sporting Rifle buttstock and buttplate too! And unless somebody did something stupid these were all chambered in .45-70, which is very rare considering these were built on the smaller #1 1/2 actions! This is a very rare #1 1/2 Cadet rifle built on special order for military academies, and the only #1 1/2 chambered in .45-70 cartridge! The 28" barrel would be odd for any military Rolling Blocks, but correct for the 1 1/2 Cadet rifles.
I called the auction back when this auction opened to ask how they determined it was a ".43 Spanish" and they said it was a "walk in" by a local seller, and he told them what cartridge it was in. So obviously they didn't check, which made most collectors ignore it at the auction thinking it was a South American full sized military rifle.
Images from the auction. I'm only 40 miles away from the auction, so I can drive there next week and avoid shipping charges, or delays in shipping!

[marlinman93]

Got the notice I won two items. Completely forgot I put a low bid in on an early Lyman #17 globe sight also! It's made before they had changeable apertures, so has a peep and a post with a tiny screw you turn 1/4 turn to flip up the peep or the post. They're pretty neat old sights, and it slipped through at just $23.

[Bill in Oregon]

First he has a successful TURP, and then right after he wins this fabulous Rolling Block. Vall, your golden touch continues, bro.

[marlinman93]

First he has a successful TURP, and then right after he wins this fabulous Rolling Block. Vall, your golden touch continues, bro.

Thanks Bill! I owe it all to not playing the lottery!
Saving all my luck for important stuff!

[yooper2]

Really interesting rifle and great catch figuring out what it is! I was totally unaware of their existence.
I always go to the preview days for auction I'm interested in now, too many poor or inaccurate descriptions.


Eric

[marlinman93]

Really interesting rifle and great catch figuring out what it is! I was totally unaware of their existence.
I always go to the preview days for auction I'm interested in now, too many poor or inaccurate descriptions.


Eric

Even very advanced Rolling Block collectors don't know about this model, except for a very few who've owned one and discovered what they are. I sure wasn't aware of their existence when I first saw it. Took me a long time to search and find out what they are, and luckily the auction is a month long so it allowed me a lot of time before putting in my bid.
I looked at this gun several times before I enlarged it to see what the action was. After that I was very interested, and spent hours looking to gather info on this model. I normally ignore military Rollers, as they're not in my collecting area of interest. If I can buy a junker cheap enough to get the action for a build I do so. Otherwise I usually pass on them.

[marlinman93]

Just got back from picking up this # 1 1/2 Cadet rifle. As soon as I got out to my car I dropped a .45-70 cartridge into the chamber, and it's a perfect fit! So all is as I expected, and it's a rare .45-70 Cadet 1 1/2!
The auction pictures did no service to this Rolling Block, as it's a much nicer rifle than the pictures showed. The stocks and metal are both dark, but very smooth and no damage to metal or wood. Bore is very nice, likely because it sat without owners knowing what the chamber was.
I was surprised by the size of the gun since pictures made it look like any military Rolling Block. But with the Sporting action and buttstock the barrel and forearm are shorter and lighter, so next to a #1 military it's about 20% smaller, and lighter. A very slender, lightweight version.
Thought I might do some mild cleanup, but now having it in hand I wont do a thing to it, other than take it down, to inspect, clean, and oil internals.
Try to get some pictures today or tomorrow.

But here's a 1903-04 catalog ad from M. Hartley, (Marcellus Hartley) who owned Remington at that time. They show the middle rifle in their ad listed as their No. 206 in .45-70 for $9, with a Trapdoor style bayonet. Ad states the guns are 25-30 years old, but seems far fetched considering the #1 1/2 action didn't appear in catalogs until around 1884. So maybe the ad means how long the Rolling Block had been in service, not this particular action.

[Old No7]

...I'm only 40 miles away from the auction, so I can drive there next week and avoid shipping charges, or delays in shipping!

Or a broken stock!

That looks like a fun one, congrats!

Old No7

[KWK]

It does have nice lines for a military rolling block. Congratulations.

I still feel the No.5 sporting was the best looking of all the Remingtons. They, too, are quite rare.

[marlinman93]

It does have nice lines for a military rolling block. Congratulations.

I still feel the No.5 sporting was the best looking of all the Remingtons. They, too, are quite rare.

Thanks. It's only 7 lbs. so a real lightweight compared to most Rolling Block military rifles. I'll have to work up some lighter loads using a 400 gr. mold I have and keep them around 1000-1100 fps to be comfortable.
I'm on the other end of the spectrum as it comes to good looking Rolling Blocks. I think the Creedmoor models with their long barrels, pistol grip stocks, and deluxe wood are the most appealing to me. I never cared for the shorter, lighter, tapered round barrels that most #5 have as they looked odd on an old Rolling Block to my eyes.

[KWK]

The No.5 had a few differences with the smokeless military jobs, which are often mislabeled a "No.5". The hammer (and I think the trigger guard) is finer of line, and of course the stocks are, too. I actually like the contrast of a slender, smokeless barrel to the archaic action. We, uh, are not going to find common ground with the pistol grip versions.

7 lb for your recent acquisition is remarkable. My 30-40 from Lone Star has the smokeless contour barrel but a rebated No.1 action with more or less No.5 stocks. It's 6-7/8 lb with the 30" barrel. Dave and I were both pleased with the result.

[marlinman93]

The No.5 had a few differences with the smokeless military jobs, which are often mislabeled a "No.5". The hammer (and I think the trigger guard) is finer of line, and of course the stocks are, too. I actually like the contrast of a slender, smokeless barrel to the archaic action. We, uh, are not going to find common ground with the pistol grip versions.

7 lb for your recent acquisition is remarkable. My 30-40 from Lone Star has the smokeless contour barrel but a rebated No.1 action with more or less No.5 stocks. It's 6-7/8 lb with the 30" barrel. Dave and I were both pleased with the result.

I believe the #5 Smokeless Sporting Rifles also had a unique shape to their receivers at the front and rear edges. Marcot mentions this frame oddity in his book on the Sporting model Rolling Blocks.
Yes, there's #5 Sporters, and then Smokeless action military rifles like the vast number of 7x57 rifles. Surely built on the same base action, but like earlier BP action Sporters and military not the same appearance.
I've always loved pistl grip vs. straight grip stocks better on all the old 1800's single shots. A PG stock was a deluxe upgrade, and they fit my hand better when shooting.

[KWK]

I do like the look of pistol grips, on say a low wall, but not on some actions, such as the rolling block. On an Alex Henry side hammer the pistol grip is very attractive.

[GunnyMack]

Straight or pistol on the rolling blocks are both pleasing to my eye. The pistol grip isn't really a pistol grip as the angle of the grip doesn't have a huge change, its just a straight grip with a lump of wood below your pinky. That lump has character if shaped correctly.

[marlinman93]

Straight or pistol on the rolling blocks are both pleasing to my eye. The pistol grip isn't really a pistol grip as the angle of the grip doesn't have a huge change, its just a straight grip with a lump of wood below your pinky. That lump has character if shaped correctly.

Although not as dramatic as some modern pistol grip stocks, the Remington certainly is far more than their straight grip as it's almost 1.5" lower than the lines of their straight grip stocks. It's also very similar to what other makers did with their PG stocks of the same era.
My Ballard rifles with PG stocks feel very much the same as my Rolling Blocks.