If you could have just one 92 ...
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If you could have just one 92 ...
The current threads on the capabilities of the .357 Magnum in a carbine have set me to thinking about putting a Rossi 92 back in the lineup.
I have a great fondness for the .44 Special and not much love for the .357, so I am leaning toward finding one in .44 Magnum that will feed .44 Specials -- or Skeeter loads in .44 Mag brass. (Seems I have heard of some feeding issues with the Keith bullet in. 44 Special, but I am not wedded to that design.)
My thought is that the .44 Magnum chambering is more versatile, but am willing to hear arguments for the .357 instead. I live in elk, bear and oryx country, hence my preference for the heavier blow ...
I have a great fondness for the .44 Special and not much love for the .357, so I am leaning toward finding one in .44 Magnum that will feed .44 Specials -- or Skeeter loads in .44 Mag brass. (Seems I have heard of some feeding issues with the Keith bullet in. 44 Special, but I am not wedded to that design.)
My thought is that the .44 Magnum chambering is more versatile, but am willing to hear arguments for the .357 instead. I live in elk, bear and oryx country, hence my preference for the heavier blow ...
- GunnyMack
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Bill both of your thoughts are relevant and thats why I went 41 mag. Heavier bullets , flatter trajectory. Just my $.02
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
watch the twist rate. it's OK if you never want to go much over 240Gr. the stock twist rate has ruined a lot of guns to my way of thinking.
i've been thinking about 44-40 in a 92, but haven't explored the ballistics with a modern steel firearm. 44 magnum is great IMO, but don't know how they feed a longer round, like a 405Gr cast ...
i've been thinking about 44-40 in a 92, but haven't explored the ballistics with a modern steel firearm. 44 magnum is great IMO, but don't know how they feed a longer round, like a 405Gr cast ...
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Thanks, guys. Grizz, yes, twist rate is key for the longer, heavier slugs, so I will take careful note. If in .44, I need a barrel that will easily stabilize 325-grain slugs or heavier.
Hey, Gunny, have we had a recent photo of Parker?
Hey, Gunny, have we had a recent photo of Parker?
- CowboyTutt
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
The Rossi 454 Puma will always hold the best of all worlds in this category if yours holds together or after modification. -Tutt
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Rossi Trapper 357 has been good. It is a handy level of power and range.
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Bill, sounds like the 480 Ruger in a Rossi 92 would be perfect for you. I wish Rossi would make em again.Bill in Oregon wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:59 pm I live in elk, bear and oryx country, hence my preference for the heavier blow ...
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Bill,
I went with a Model 1892 in .357 because I had settled on the .357 revolver and wanted the same caliber in my rifle, Then I was fortunate to come across a good bargain on the M92 357 rifle.
So, just decide which is best for you and go shopping.
Enjoy!
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I think my 16" 454 Casull would be my choice; I use mostly 'warm' 45 Colt loads, but like the margin of safety plus can use full power loads if needed, as well as 45 Colt 'cowboy' vintage loads. The Marbles 'Bullseye' rear sight is incredibly fast to acquire in 'ghost rimg' mode yet allows precision if you take an extra second or two to use the inner aperture. Front Williams Firesight is good as well.CowboyTutt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 7:26 pm The Rossi 454 Puma will always hold the best of all worlds in this category if yours holds together or after modification. -Tutt
I don't use such hot loads that recoil is an issue and I like the compact size even though it 'only' holds 7 shots I think. Otherwise I'd go for a 20" one.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Doc, my best friend and I chronographed Hornady 300 grain factory 454 loads between his 16 inch barrel, and my 20 inch barrel years ago. The difference was only 50 fps. Your in good hands. -Tutt
"It ain't dead! As long as there's ONE COWBOY taking care of ONE COW, it ain't dead!!!" (the Cowboy Way)
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel
-Monte Walsh (Selleck version)
"These battered wings still kick up dust." -Peter Gabriel
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
all the suggestions are great
mine is a 38-40 .....1st on in the pic, and very accurate for a 97 year old shooter! the others are 44mag, 45lc, 44-40 and 357
mine is a 38-40 .....1st on in the pic, and very accurate for a 97 year old shooter! the others are 44mag, 45lc, 44-40 and 357
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Bill I chose 357 myself but almost chose 44 just as subsonics or low powered shooting which I do some of favors the bigger calibre. I have a 480 ruger on the way which has finally scratched that itch. If I were to get a 44mag lever Id like it to feed 44 special as you say. When I got my 2x 357 rossis I took 38 special dummy rounds loaded with seated out wadcutters and speer 135gn hp into the LGS to function test. The owner was happy to do so but insisted on loading it himself to make sure the load gate area didnt get scratched up. Some of 357's lesser known advantages are it has some crossover primer wise with 223( CCI small pistol mag and small rifle primer are the same primer), it also carries almost as light as 223- About 2.8-3lbs per 100 rounds and stacks denser in a 50cal can, about 1500 will fit.
- GunnyMack
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I'll try to remember to post a couple Bill!
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- Scott Tschirhart
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Jim Taylor's old .357 Rossi would be the last one I would sell. It seems to have the right combination of everything I love in a levergun.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Great Parker pictures Gunny. She is all grown up now.
Back to the Rossi, I was looking for data on twist rates and several sources said all the Rossis are 1 twist in 30 inches. Is that right?
Back to the Rossi, I was looking for data on twist rates and several sources said all the Rossis are 1 twist in 30 inches. Is that right?
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I was gifted a Henry Big Boy .357, but I surely wish it was a USRAC 92 Short Rifle in .357.
No doubt about the Henry quality, but is a unwieldy behemoth with a slippery brass buttplate.
No doubt about the Henry quality, but is a unwieldy behemoth with a slippery brass buttplate.
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First
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- wvfarrier
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Well, considering Im the fella who keeps harping on the awesomeness of 357 mag.......I say go 357 but variety is the spice of life. I recently picked up a Henry X model in 44 mag and its pretty sweet however it recoils almost as much as my Marlin 45-70. The wife fired 3 rounds thru and said "no thanks".
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I have original 92s in 38 and 44wcf, a Browning in 44 magnum, and a 20" .357 Rossi.
In the originals category, the 38-40 has it all over the 44. I can shoot the same load in all 7 of my 38-40s. I have to do something different for every 44 (3). The 38 gives me more consistency and accuracy in every case.
In regards to the .357 and 44 magnum, it gets a little more blurry. While the quality of the 44 Browning is head and shoulders over the Rossi 357, the Rossi shoots every bit as good as the Browning.
While we have big black bears and moose here, I don't necessarily feel unprotected with either. I probably carry the 44 more in the woods, but if I go to the range to have some fun, the 357 is the hands down winner. It is cheaper to shoot due to less lead and powder, but makes very good use of such a small amount. Even with warm loads, it makes no noise or recoil. It's just enjoyable all around.
I just realized I probably didn't help you decide at all.
In the originals category, the 38-40 has it all over the 44. I can shoot the same load in all 7 of my 38-40s. I have to do something different for every 44 (3). The 38 gives me more consistency and accuracy in every case.
In regards to the .357 and 44 magnum, it gets a little more blurry. While the quality of the 44 Browning is head and shoulders over the Rossi 357, the Rossi shoots every bit as good as the Browning.
While we have big black bears and moose here, I don't necessarily feel unprotected with either. I probably carry the 44 more in the woods, but if I go to the range to have some fun, the 357 is the hands down winner. It is cheaper to shoot due to less lead and powder, but makes very good use of such a small amount. Even with warm loads, it makes no noise or recoil. It's just enjoyable all around.
I just realized I probably didn't help you decide at all.
"Oh bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round.
- fordwannabe
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
OK I will be the voice of GUN forum reason! WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD YOU LIMIT YOURSELF TO ONE? Somebody was thinking that even if I wAS THE ONE SAYING IT. I have two 357,two 44, two 38-40, and a 1889 Marlin(close to 92) in 44-40, so obviously my suggestion is GET SEVERAL! You don't have to thank me, I am just glad to be able to add some reason to this discussion. hahahaha
a Pennsylvanian who has been accused of clinging to my religion and my guns......Good assessment skills.
- Scott Tschirhart
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
We are such enablers!fordwannabe wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 2:47 pm I am just glad to be able to add some reason to this discussion. hahahaha
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Browning B92, 44 Mag.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
As I understand that is correct Bill, across all calibres.Bill in Oregon wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:11 am Great Parker pictures Gunny. She is all grown up now.
Back to the Rossi, I was looking for data on twist rates and several sources said all the Rossis are 1 twist in 30 inches. Is that right?
- GunnyMack
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
My Ruger carbine has 1:38 I believe. It shouldn't shoot 300gr as well as it does but it doesn't like to feed them from the mag tube. I remember seeing somewhere that the 44 twist rate was increased for the use of heavier bullets. What it was changed to I don't remember...
Anyhow the 1 and only pig I ever shot was about 20 yards, that 300 gr XTP went through both lungs/top of heart, through the off side, expanded to about 3/4". The pig didn't even know it was shot and walked about 15 yards and fell over. When I looked at the gun it failed to feed a second round, fortunately I didn't need another!
Anyhow the 1 and only pig I ever shot was about 20 yards, that 300 gr XTP went through both lungs/top of heart, through the off side, expanded to about 3/4". The pig didn't even know it was shot and walked about 15 yards and fell over. When I looked at the gun it failed to feed a second round, fortunately I didn't need another!
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- earlmck
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
My Rossi 357 (I have the 24" octagon bbl version) is one of my favorites so will be with me until some grandkid gets it later on. Gets used on tin-can shooting expeditions and would be my "go-to" baby for jack rabbits if we could ever resurrect that critter in these parts. But all that shootin' is close-range stuff with a long shot going out to maybe 75 yards. And my 180 grain LBT bullet that I have shot in revolvers forever works fine in the Rossi out to that 75 yards but it has fallen all apart by the time I want to plink our 150 and 200 yard steel targets for our monthly levergun shoot. Dang slow twist rate they put in the longer guns is just stooopid. I am now using a cute little 135 grain gc bullet from an Arsenal mould that looks like it will put the 200 yard ram in some kinda' danger.
I have the same model Rossi in 44 mag version and have the same troubles getting out to the longer ranges. I tried a nice-looking 250 grain gc bullet in it a few months ago and got a 1-hole group at 50 yards. Figured I was really on to something! And then couldn't even keep it on the paper at 200 yards. Same struggles with twist rate I'm sure. I know that I can find something to work, I just haven't got back to it yet.
But the biggest animal I am likely to shoot with my pistol-cartridge levers is a jack rabbit. When I go for bigger critters and want a light and handy rifle I'll take the Rem 14 in 35 Remington. Or maybe the Marlin 30/30 short rifle. The Rossis fill a different niche for me than you are wanting to fill.
I have the same model Rossi in 44 mag version and have the same troubles getting out to the longer ranges. I tried a nice-looking 250 grain gc bullet in it a few months ago and got a 1-hole group at 50 yards. Figured I was really on to something! And then couldn't even keep it on the paper at 200 yards. Same struggles with twist rate I'm sure. I know that I can find something to work, I just haven't got back to it yet.
But the biggest animal I am likely to shoot with my pistol-cartridge levers is a jack rabbit. When I go for bigger critters and want a light and handy rifle I'll take the Rem 14 in 35 Remington. Or maybe the Marlin 30/30 short rifle. The Rossis fill a different niche for me than you are wanting to fill.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Earl I believe you have that Quick Load and those are clearly not the bullets for those long jobs so what is the scoop here?
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
"elk, bear and oryx country" would seal the deal for me in favor of the 44 magBill in Oregon wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:59 pm The current threads on the capabilities of the .357 Magnum in a carbine have set me to thinking about putting a Rossi 92 back in the lineup.
I have a great fondness for the .44 Special and not much love for the .357, so I am leaning toward finding one in .44 Magnum that will feed .44 Specials -- or Skeeter loads in .44 Mag brass. (Seems I have heard of some feeding issues with the Keith bullet in. 44 Special, but I am not wedded to that design.)
My thought is that the .44 Magnum chambering is more versatile, but am willing to hear arguments for the .357 instead. I live in elk, bear and oryx country, hence my preference for the heavier blow ...
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Earl, thanks for the intel on the .357 and .44 Rossis having issues with stabilizing heavier bullets out beyond 100. No, they are not big-game cartridges way out there, but still it is fun to be able to tickle the steel as you are doing at the COSSA range.
I am sorry to hear the Eastern Oregon jackrabbits still have not rebounded. Is it rabbit hemorrhagic fever, climate change, too many coyotes?
I am sorry to hear the Eastern Oregon jackrabbits still have not rebounded. Is it rabbit hemorrhagic fever, climate change, too many coyotes?
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I been looking for on the last 6 months, few, far between and spendy.
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Old Savage wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:01 am Earl I believe you have that Quick Load and those are clearly not the bullets for those long jobs so what is the scoop here?
Greenhill formula is really useful here and matching bore to the bullet. -Tutt
"It ain't dead! As long as there's ONE COWBOY taking care of ONE COW, it ain't dead!!!" (the Cowboy Way)
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
I have just 1 Winchester 92. It's a Turnbull deluxe takedown in 44-40. I chose 44-40 over 44 Magnum for the following reasons; I shoot Cowboy Action and I use 44-40 for black powder classes. (I use 44 magnum for smokeless and have a marlin 44 mag for that). Second, 44-40 is an original chambering and finally, with the strength of the new manufactured rifle, I can load near 44 Magnum loads in it if I want to.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
closer look
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- Scott Tschirhart
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
That's a gorgeous rifle!!!
Getting back to the original post.....I've thought about it and I definitely would stick with the .357 in either a Rossi or a Winchester (though I really dislike that tang mounted safety). Shoot 180 gr XTP or WFNGC bullets if I wanted to shoot anything big.
Getting back to the original post.....I've thought about it and I definitely would stick with the .357 in either a Rossi or a Winchester (though I really dislike that tang mounted safety). Shoot 180 gr XTP or WFNGC bullets if I wanted to shoot anything big.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
3leggedturtle wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:54 pmI been looking for on the last 6 months, few, far between and spendy.
Bill, to answer your question, it would be a 16" stainless version in 357. Todd/3leg
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
- earlmck
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
In this particular game I don't need to knock the target over, just get a hit on it, so maintaining stability enough to be accurate at 200 yards is the only requirement. But I've recently also been shooting the knock-down style targets with the pistol-silhouette fellows and I may find this little bullet doesn't get the job done when the target needs to fall down.Old Savage wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:01 am Earl I believe you have that Quick Load and those are clearly not the bullets for those long jobs so what is the scoop here?
Bill, I never did try jacketed bullets as that is just not something I do. CO Steve posted quite a lot on his success with the 357 out to longer ranges and I think he always used jacketed bullets in the 150 grain range.Bill in Oregon wrote: ↑Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:56 pm Earl, thanks for the intel on the .357 and .44 Rossis having issues with stabilizing heavier bullets out beyond 100. No, they are not big-game cartridges way out there, but still it is fun to be able to tickle the steel as you are doing at the COSSA range.
I am sorry to hear the Eastern Oregon jackrabbits still have not rebounded. Is it rabbit hemorrhagic fever, climate change, too many coyotes?
Lotsa' theories on why the rabbit (and mule deer) populations are waaay down in this area. My theory is that we've done too good a job at stopping the rampant overgrazing that occurred through the 1950's. Jackrabbits, deer, and sage grouse populations all boomed during those years that we had the worst of the overgrazing situations. But most of the current crop of experts think the opposite and feel that when we get rid of the last of the livestock we'll return to the land of plenty.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Earl, that did occur to me after I asked. You are one of the most knowledgeable guys here so I did wonder. I look at these as 100-125 yd guns. I have had five. 357 Trapper is the favorite. In ballistics by the inch it appears there is little or nothing to be gained with more than 16”. I do remember COSteve did have loads that would.
Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Mostly feast and famine. Prey numbers go up and preditors move in. Prey numbers go down and the preditors go elsewhere or die off.Lotsa' theories on why the rabbit (and mule deer) populations are waaay down in this area. My theory is that we've done too good a job at stopping the rampant overgrazing that occurred through the 1950's. Jackrabbits, deer, and sage grouse populations all boomed during those years that we had the worst of the overgrazing situations. But most of the current crop of experts think the opposite and feel that when we get rid of the last of the livestock we'll return to the land of plenty.
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- marlinman93
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Not wanting a Win. 92, but if I got a wild hair to buy one it would have to be in an old caliber. .38-40 or .32-20 would be my choice. It would also have to be a long barreled rifle, and a special order 30" would really excite me! And if it was a deluxe pistol grip, checkered stocks with 3x or 4x wood, then I'd consider it perfect!
So likely wouldn't ever get it.
So likely wouldn't ever get it.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Gee ya don't want much do ya
But boy that sounds good, ill take one in 25-20 if ya find one on your end and I'll look for a 32-20
But boy that sounds good, ill take one in 25-20 if ya find one on your end and I'll look for a 32-20
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Gunny, our friend Vall sets a very high bar.
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Having 2 of Rossi 1892s in .357 for my wife and son to use in cowboy action matches... when my son said he wanted something larger, I bought him a Rossi "Short Rifle" in 45 Colt. Does anything the 44 Mag can do, with a much greater selection of leveraction friendly bullets!
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Got one in a 20”. 360 gr at 1350fps down to round ball with 5 gr of Bullseye if you like. 250 gr at 1100 fps is a natural.
- marlinman93
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
That's probably why it takes me decades to find a gun I want. I don't have decades left, so if I started today it would likely be a futile search.
Pre WWI Marlins and Singleshot rifles!
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Veral Smith from LBT moulds sends his wife out after elk every year with a '92 .357 using his 180 grain cast bullets and she makes meat every year.
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tough-
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
- Scott Tschirhart
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
If I could only have one it would be the one my father in law sold in the late 70's. Originally a 25-20 bored to 32-20 no bluing to speak of and wide checkering if you could call it that but I have a picture of him ,his dog , rifle and the buck he shot in the back of his truck. Have one in 45 colt and one in 38-40 but that would be the one.
- Sixgun
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Depends on your purpose.....and regular outdoorsman would choose a 32-20......big game hunter would choose a 44-40........a collector/investor/shooter would choose the below pictured rifle......I've seen this rifle before and it's ultra rare.....a saddle ring carbine with full factory engraving and a half mag. Any special order feature is extremely rare on any carbine.....
This one is in 38-40 and was made in 1906.....ooooo wait, I've seen this before...can't remember where....mmmmm..my safe ?
This one is in 38-40 and was made in 1906.....ooooo wait, I've seen this before...can't remember where....mmmmm..my safe ?
- Old Savage
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Re: If you could have just one 92 ...
Two 32-20s from 1906 yowser!