One rifle, one pistol

[Sixgun]

My Choice. Big Horn Armory 500S&W and a S&W 500 6"

Colorado dude....I've been around one hell of a lot of guns in my time...a lot of big guns and a lot of little guns and most everything in between......in fact I'm taking the BAR out tomorrow with several hundred rounds...but DANG! that is the meanest levergun I have ever laid eyes on in my 64 years. Nice rifle....nice smith too..... ---6

[Sixgun]

Old Savage....I was the first poster on page three...don't I win some kind of a prize? I'll take one of your single action Colts if you don't mind. You can have the soft stuff that's all over where you live...I'll take the Colts...----6

[Poohgyrr]

Well, for now anyway: a Para Ordnance P13-45 and my tuned 16” M92 in 44Special.

[mickbr]

This is an easy choice for me because I already made it. My only rifle is 357 rossi 1892, and I will say any 357 handgun with it.

[Old Savage]

Six, you get my recognition as the most interesting, entertaining and basically erudite writer on gun stuff since Skeeter Skelton.

I was thinking my Ruger 7 1/2"" 45 with an extra ACP cylinder and either my Rem Model 7 stainless in 7-08 it my 94 25-35 with the coveted shotgun safety. I better watch it or I am going to have to delete myself here.

I have to go see Desarae in a while so let's make her the soft stuff of the day.

[David]

Remember I'm a Remington stickler....
Remington model SEVEN , I have a model 7 can't remember if it was made in 1902 or 3, don't have the heart to let that one go that one might go into the casket. (it might get crowded)

[Old Savage]

Mine is a scope sighted bolt action.

[David]

Mine is a scope sighted bolt action.

Mines a 22lr Rolling Block it came out the the Karl F. Mouldenhauer Collection

[Old Savage]

I know these and have seen one. Knew there was a misunderstanding.

[3leggedturtle]

This is an easy choice for me because I already made it. My only rifle is 357 rossi 1892, and I will say any 357 handgun with it.

Curious as to how you only have one rifle. Ive been downsizing the last few years and its getting harder each time to decide which one to sell next....... todd/3leg

[Old Savage]

Collector vs User Easy distinction.

With a .357 Trapper now ... wouldn't need anything else.

[3leggedturtle]

Collector vs User Easy distinction.

I can assure you i aint no collector... tho id be happy to sell any of my guns at "NIB" one of a kind prices!

[Catshooter]

Springfield 03A3, Glock 27. The pistol is set up for 9mm, 40 & 45 GAP.

Of course I cast & reload for both and that increases their versatility by quite a bit.

Both are dead reliable.

The 03 eats cast loads for lunch. A Lyman 3118 over 6.5 grains of Red Dot (about 1200 fps, 120 grains) is quiet and goes into an inch and a half at 100 yards. Over grown .22.


Cat

[Grizz]

Cat, that sounds like a good .308 load for the overgrown .22 role. really like that idea.

[gamekeeper]

OK I've had a rethink perhaps I could have a lot of fun with a Marlin 1894CL in .32/20 with a matching .32/20 SSA Colt.
Cat sneeze loads for squirrels. Two guns I've wanted for too long, probably have to wait for hell to freeze over before I can get the pistol.….

[Old Savage]

gk, your previous choice would actually allow you to get a cylinder which would handle cartridges in some calibers.

[piller]

If the Medusa pistol were to be redone with stronger parts to eliminate the extraction issues and occasional breakages, it would be a candidate for the 1 pistol idea. Anything shorter than 9x18 has accuracy issues in the one I have fired, but the accuracy was good enough with that or longer cartridges.

[piller]

Perhaps a double action revolver which could use moon clips as well as standard .357 Mag rounds.

[KeithNyst]

I really had to think on this. Would I keep modern or old vintage; made an in between compromise and would go with a 1957 Savage Model 99F featherweight in .308 Win and a 1948 Colt Government Model .45ACP.

1957 99F .308 and 1948 Colt Government 45.jpg

[gamekeeper]

gk, your previous choice would actually allow you to get a cylinder which would handle cartridges in some calibers.

Yup but even if I found a cylinder I would then not legally be allowed any ammunition for it, plus the cylinder is verboten in this happy land were I live....

[gamekeeper]

gk, your previous choice would actually allow you to get a cylinder which would handle cartridges in some calibers.

Yup but even if I found a cylinder I would then not legally be allowed any ammunition for it, plus the cylinder is verboten in this happy land were I live....

[Catshooter]

Cat, that sounds like a good .308 load for the overgrown .22 role. really like that idea.

That bullet and Red Dot are a combination made in heaven.

Not tried it in the .308, but five grains in the .30-30 is mid-1200s and shoots very well. No recoil of course and very quiet.


Cat

[Grizz]

Cat, that sounds like a good .308 load for the overgrown .22 role. really like that idea.

That bullet and Red Dot are a combination made in heaven.

Not tried it in the .308, but five grains in the .30-30 is mid-1200s and shoots very well. No recoil of course and very quiet.


Cat

Perfect. Thanks again, going to try this one. I have a 30-30 too, I think. Somewhere. Where did I put that thing?

[mickbr]

This is an easy choice for me because I already made it. My only rifle is 357 rossi 1892, and I will say any 357 handgun with it.

Curious as to how you only have one rifle. Ive been downsizing the last few years and its getting harder each time to decide which one to sell next....... todd/3leg

Well I have a 22LR as well/combination 410ga shotgun, but technically one centrefire. I came at it the other way, I sold all my guns years back.Then years later decided to get one, and the 357 was it. The game I shoot is mostly hogs, rarely a deer. The 357 mag stoked out of a 24" does that. I shoot it to near 200 yards on select shots. Everyone says its a 100 yard cartridge, sure it has less killing power getting past 120 yards but it still kills. I grew up watching my grandad shoot a lot of things with a 22LR and I also hunt closer with rounds loaded down to 38 special levels, so you can see I am in 'that camp' and obviously this mindset does not suit every one.

What are you current guns 3leggedturtle and what are you trying to cull?

[Old Savage]

A note on the .357, the optimum length for velocity in a rifle appears to be 16" according to the velocity by the inch site. I believe that's where I saw the data.

[COSteve]

Done

[Grizz]

Steve, you are one of the best at systematic record keeping. Thanks for the info.

[Old Savage]

:Interesting. I have seen rifles of various calibers vary quite a bit with the same loads. You will see this from various loading manuals.. Makes me wonder what loads optimized for 16' would yield. Speer gets higher velocities from a .308.with 150 gr bullets than they do from the .30-06.

[Old Savage]

When I get a new rifle I shoot some factory through it to see what that will chronograph and to see what the primers and cases will look like. Then I load a better load for that caliber and find a manual that matches it then use that as my primary source. For my stainless Rem Model 7 7-08 that turned out to be the Hodgdon 26 almost exactly.

[mickbr]

A note on the .357, the optimum length for velocity in a rifle appears to be 16" according to the velocity by the inch site. I believe that's where I saw the data.

Problem with BBTI is they use different makes of gun to test the data. Their 18" barrel 357 is a stoeger buntline for example, aka revolver with the open cyclinder gap, which is probably why it runs slower than the 16" which is a winchester 94. They don't test any higher than 18" either. They should really be comparing apples to apples with their tests and using same gun type at least.

I do find 24" gets decent increase over my buddies 16".

[Paladin]

I'd love to say my 1895 GS and Single six. But the truth is it'd be my Springfield Scout Squad and my Randall lefty 1911A1. I know the 7.62x51 and the .45 acp well. I know they work when it counts.

But you forgot one shotgun. In that case my choice is a lefty Remington 870, 12 gauge of course.

+1

[KWK]

Using a full charge of Lil'Gun... my 24" Rossi .357mag rifle shooting 158grn Zero JSP bullets... produced 2,005fps.

Nice! That exceeds the performance of the early .30 WCF loads.

[Old Savage]

But they are different guns as you say. I have a Rem 22" 30-06 that significantly out strips a 24" Win velocity wise.

Also have a 243 BLR that starting loads are almost maximum. Very fast out of a 20" barrel. Two seemingly identical Ruger 270s that are about 100 fps apart. Many examples of either premise.

I guess as you suggest it might be necessary to take the same barrel and progressively shorten it but even then you don't necessarily have data that would apply to your firearm.

[Streetstar]

I'll say my 20" model 94 carbine with the addition of a small variable optic. 30-30

I'll cheat a little and say a Dan Wesson 357 pistol pack with an 8" barrel for game, and a 2.5" barrel for keeping hidden



Hypothetical TEOTWAWKI example i might use a boring 'ol Colt AR plus hi cap Sig Sauer 9 or .40. Model #s dont matter because anything from Colt or Sig works

[Grizz]

But they are different guns as you say. I have a Rem 22" 30-06 that significantly out strips a 24" Win velocity wise.

Also have a 243 BLR that starting loads are almost maximum. Very fast out of a 20" barrel. Two seemingly identical Ruger 270s that are about 100 fps apart. Many examples of either premise.

I guess as you suggest it might be necessary to take the same barrel and progressively shorten it but even then you don't necessarily have data that would apply to your firearm.

as for comparison testing,

I have killed deer with a 4" Mod 66 using, I think, 158gr cast, not sure. I have a Winch .357 that I have not hunted with, but have chronoed. Can't find my notebook.

I have killed a substantial number of deer with 44 mag rifle and pistol using 240gr semi-jacket and 325gr pbhc.....

Regardless of velocity info, in my experience the 44 is FAR MORE EFFECTIVE in taking deer. By that I mean the wound forensics are visibly and noticeably greater by every measure......

I understand the relativity of this. I have a friend who is a good shot and took a deer with a .22LR thru the eyeball.

I shot a deer in the ear with the Mod 66 and it was dead before it hit the dirt.

But for all 'round hunting in woods with 5 to 10 yard shots common, and 50 yard shots rare, coaxing a little extra oomph from a .357 is still not in the same league with 44 mag, in my humble and grateful experience. I hunted for meat and fed the hungry little mouths and tried lots of stuff and settled on heavy for caliber hard projectiles as the most efficient and effective for my purpose.

And yes, I can make meat with a .22. it's easy-peasy. But when brer bear comes stomping my direction to jump on me like a wolf mousing in the snow, then the 22 and 35 pistols don't get my vote.

Danny for one has an entirely different perspective on this, as do most of Y'all, since perspective relates to point-of-view. That's what makes this topic so interesting and gets my nod as one of the best of the year. So far.

Grizz

[Old Savage]

5-10 yd shots common ... 50 rare. Here 200 - 300 yd shot s ate common here. 50 might be rare. but at say 125 yd and in, rifle impact would be at .357 pistol muzzle velocities at minimum.

[Grizz]

5-10 yd shots common ... 50 rare. Here 200 - 300 yd shot s ate common here. 50 might be rare. but at say 125 yd and in, rifle impact would be at .357 pistol muzzle velocities at minimum.

that's absolutely correct, and the kills I've made with .357 pistol instruct me not to hunt for meat with it.

actually, my 180gr .357 load from my winchester 94 have close performance to 30-30 out to around 100 yards. which is why I don't hunt with 30-30 either!

[ChuteTheMall]

Because the OP specified "unlimited support" and "found a ton of ammo" I won't consider resupply issues, and I'll take my AK47 underfolder and Glock 17.
Both are pretty concealable, accept 30-33 round mags, common military choice, and reliable even during high round count torture tests in the dirt and sand.

The AK underfolder fits in a tennis racket bag, and the Glock fits IWB.

[AJMD429]

A note on the .357, the optimum length for velocity in a rifle appears to be 16" according to the velocity by the inch site. I believe that's where I saw the data.

Problem with BBTI is they use different makes of gun to test the data. Their 18" barrel 357 is a stoeger buntline for example, aka revolver with the open cyclinder gap, which is probably why it runs slower than the 16" which is a winchester 94. They don't test any higher than 18" either. They should really be comparing apples to apples with their tests and using same gun type at least.

I thought one of those 'velocity versus barrel length' sites used single-shot Contender or Encore barrels and cut them off inch-by-inch, and part of their reasoning was to not violate laws when they got below 16" if the cartridge was a 'rifle' one.

[Old Savage]

AJ I also thought there was a site that cut the same barrel down. I was mainly interested in what I would be giving up at 16". Finding a specific load for a specific rifle not in my interest. For instance, 24" barrel, why not just take my 35 Rem., 2200 from a 20 barrel. Essentially gives up the compactness.

Kind of all depends on individual point of view.

[mickbr]

I thought one of those 'velocity versus barrel length' sites used single-shot Contender or Encore barrels and cut them off inch-by-inch, and part of their reasoning was to not violate laws when they got below 16" if the cartridge was a 'rifle' one.

Doc Some do. The most quoted site these days seems to be BBTI (Ballistics by the inch). They seem to go to a lot of effort to get all the data they can but stop at 18" for 357 and that in a buntline revolver so its a bit incomplete.

[mickbr]

AJ I also thought there was a site that cut the same barrel down. I was mainly interested in what I would be giving up at 16". Finding a specific load for a specific rifle not in my interest. For instance, 24" barrel, why not just take my 35 Rem., 2200 from a 20 barrel. Essentially gives up the compactness.

Kind of all depends on individual point of view.

I dont think youd be giving up much old savage with 16", I wouldn't suggest people get a 24" just for more power in 357. My personal reasons are relating to a 6'9" wingspan Im comfortable with a longer gun and also it keeps the noise a little further from my ears, any extra velocity is just a side bonus.

[Scrumbag]

Well, my view would be this:

Rifle

Drilling in 16gx16g and 7x65r and a .22lr “einstecklauf” (Insert for the shotgun barrel)

16g because the 12g tend to be rather heavy and not swing nicely
7x65r nice handy 7mm pill which will work on most game (8x57r might be good if you have bear issues. They do make 9.3 guns but they get very heavy. However, if you had seriously large animal issues might be good)
16g Slugs / buck will work for where you might want a slug
The .22lr barrel great for small game and with subs sneaky quiet.

Pistol

Maybe the 9mm Sig P226 I used to have as just worked and pointed where I was looking
A decent revolver – maybe a 3” 357 Smith?

Or if you aren’t too worried about concealing it –

AR-15 or AK47 type pistol with an arm brace

[AJMD429]

"...or if you aren’t too worried about concealing it –
AR-15 or AK47 type pistol with an arm brace ..."

That would be a classic pairing for the drilling....!

[Scrumbag]

"...or if you aren’t too worried about concealing it –
AR-15 or AK47 type pistol with an arm brace ..."

That would be a classic pairing for the drilling....!

Hey, I'm all for mixing it up a little!

[HillbillyGadget]

If bad times or perhaps I found myself in a financial quandary, and given I live in the West and the availability of calibers on the shelves. I choose a Ruger GSR and a Glock 19.
The G-19 will handle all my EDC chores and the GSR will take care of the hunting chores and things beyond the role of the handgun.

If I lived back East My little 30-30 Marlin lever scout would probably get the nod instead of the GSR.

[tomrkba]

Rifle: Primary Weapons MK218 Mod 1 in 308 Win/7.62x51mm
Pistol: SIG P220 Legion SAO

[91B40]

Remington Marine Magnum 870, (12 gauge 18" barrel) Rifle sights would be nice.
5 1/2 inch stainless Single Six with both cylinders.
Problem is, no matter what you'd choose, it would be wrong. Oh, well.

I once wrote a story about a guy that got caught up in the collapse of civilization as he was traveling in his motor home. He was armed as above because that is what he had with him. One of the lines I have him speak was, "Hell, if I'd known that the world was going to end I'd have armed myself better."

[jeepnik]

Ok. On reflection I thought of all of the firearms I have and have changed my mind.

Pistol - Luger P-08, artillery model. Dad's bring back from WWII.

Remington 700 lefty in 30-06 (my first lefty rifle, a gift from dad).

Are they the best for any imagined scenario? No. But they are the last ones that would go.