A Paco Kelly Project
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A Paco Kelly Project
When I last visited with Paco we spent some time going over some of his projects. This is one of them. It began life as a Baikal Bounty Hunter double barrel 12 guage shotgun made in Russia. His is the model that has the barrels threaded for removable chokes. Paco looked the gun over and figured he could make it into a pretty nice .45-70 double rifle! He fitted the rifle barrels to the shotgun tubes and used the threaded portion of the barrels to lock the rifle barrels in the shotgun barrels.
The extractors took a bit of work to make them work with the .45-70 rims but he worked that out just fine. He was able to adjust the rifle barrels in the tubes until he got the barrels to converge at 50 yards. Paco told me they will stay under a 50-cent peice at 50 yards.
The rear sight is an African Express rifle sight with the folding leaf sights.
Paco says that the action is safe with factory-pressure loads.
I am hoping that on my next visit to Tucson we will be able to take it out and shoot it some. I would like to fire a few shots through it.
The extractors took a bit of work to make them work with the .45-70 rims but he worked that out just fine. He was able to adjust the rifle barrels in the tubes until he got the barrels to converge at 50 yards. Paco told me they will stay under a 50-cent peice at 50 yards.
The rear sight is an African Express rifle sight with the folding leaf sights.
Paco says that the action is safe with factory-pressure loads.
I am hoping that on my next visit to Tucson we will be able to take it out and shoot it some. I would like to fire a few shots through it.
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Where there is a will is a way!!! Pretty Awesome.! Wish Paco a Merry Christmas From All Of Us.
- GunnyMack
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I often thought about doing that but couldn't figure out how to keep the liners in place. Choke tube threads of course! That is a great idea.
Here's to you Pacco!
Merry Christmas!
Here's to you Pacco!
Merry Christmas!
BROWN LABS MATTER !!
- fordwannabe
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Hey Gunny when you start on yours jot down all your measurements. Tom likey!
a Pennsylvanian who has been accused of clinging to my religion and my guns......Good assessment skills.
- GunnyMack
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I've always wanted to make a 22 hornet double rifle. I have a 410 SxS but it doesn't have choke tubes. Was thinking about making a new mono block but I don't have a mill, then just fit barrels and regulate! Or 218 bee! Then of course 25-20 is a must!
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I've always thought an excellent all-around hunting gun would be an over-under or side-by-side with an accurate rifle barrel in one side, and the other a smoothbore but also outfitted for indexed (and thus readily and repeatedly sighted-in) full-length barrel-inserts with adjustable front sights exposed. Lots of territory could be covered by such an arm.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
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Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
FWIW, a new monoblock would be req'd only if keeping the shotgun barrel(s) was on the agenda.
Once upon a time, I converted a Beretta Companion from a shotgun into a rifle via heating the monoblock until the solder holding the shotgun barrel in melted - which allowed me to then slip in & solder (and pin) a .44 Mag barrel from Numrich that I had reduced the barrel's chamber end O.D. enough to slide right in.
(I did have to inlet the rear of the .44 barrel to fit the extension I added to the extractor & add iron sights)
.
- GunnyMack
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I'd keep the 410 barrels so yes a new monoblock would be needed.
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- AJMD429
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I think you can fire .410 shotshells in a 444 Marlin, so how about a 444 Marlin double, perhaps with 'minimalist' rifling on one side of you wanted to use shot often.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- GunnyMack
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Barrels are thin , not enough for choke tubes so I'd be leary of 444 out of them.
BROWN LABS MATTER !!
- crs
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
For what it is worth, I seem to remember back when Baikal actually sold the rifled barrel insert kits for their shotguns.
At that time I considered doing a project similar to what Paco did, but my gunsmithing skills are nil as are my tools.
However there are several forum members qualified for such work, so for your reading pleasure and possible use, I recommend the book " Building Double Rifles on Shotgun Actions" by W. Ellis Brown, a custom gun maker in Colorado. Order the second Edition from Bunduki Publishing and save 50% on what Amazon charges.
http://www.bundukipublishing.com/doublerifle.htm
http://www.ellisbrowncustomshop.com/
You may remember this Leverguns report of the October 2018 hog hunt with Ellis using a 45-70 double rifle he made:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=72379&p=827122&hili ... st#p827122
At that time I considered doing a project similar to what Paco did, but my gunsmithing skills are nil as are my tools.
However there are several forum members qualified for such work, so for your reading pleasure and possible use, I recommend the book " Building Double Rifles on Shotgun Actions" by W. Ellis Brown, a custom gun maker in Colorado. Order the second Edition from Bunduki Publishing and save 50% on what Amazon charges.
http://www.bundukipublishing.com/doublerifle.htm
http://www.ellisbrowncustomshop.com/
You may remember this Leverguns report of the October 2018 hog hunt with Ellis using a 45-70 double rifle he made:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=72379&p=827122&hili ... st#p827122
CRS, NRA Benefactor Member, TSRA, DRSS, DWWC, Whittington Center
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Jim, Paco's double rifle is a dandy. That one looks more comfortable to shoot than the original Baikal double imported in .45-70, which I found punishing with "meaningful" loads because of its light weight.
I can vouch for Charles's suggestion of Ellis Brown's book. He is a fine guy.
I can vouch for Charles's suggestion of Ellis Brown's book. He is a fine guy.
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Awesome, apart from the engineering, a Baikal gets to Tucson!
N.
N.
Psalm ch8.
Because I wish I could!
Because I wish I could!
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
We currently have a couple of these projects at our shop ... one is a 38-55 double ... another is a 20 gauge stock left barrel with a 40 Sharps Straight in right barrel.
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I'd take some band aides with you. Paco often treads into places that us chickens don't. Have fun.
"Please don't feed the trolls. Just the user name choice should be enough to ignore this guy..."
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
IIRC 86er used to build some double rifles from shotguns as well.
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tough-
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
- fordwannabe
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Anybody have a guesstimate what something like that would cost to do if I provided the basic shotgun ? Ball park? I don’t know if that’s a $500 job or a $5000 job absolutely no clue. but it is really neat.
a Pennsylvanian who has been accused of clinging to my religion and my guns......Good assessment skills.
- gundownunder
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
That would make a fine black powder gun.
Bob
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- crs
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Rusty, Your memory is good, 86er has built double rifles and double shotguns.
He recently built a flintlock and a muzzle loading SxS shotgun double that can shoot round balls accurately enough for deer hunting.
In fact, his youngest son took a doe with it when we hunted near Victoria , Texas recently. Man, talk about big holes in game!
He recently built a flintlock and a muzzle loading SxS shotgun double that can shoot round balls accurately enough for deer hunting.
In fact, his youngest son took a doe with it when we hunted near Victoria , Texas recently. Man, talk about big holes in game!
CRS, NRA Benefactor Member, TSRA, DRSS, DWWC, Whittington Center
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
- crs
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Fordwannabe,
Check out the link to Ellis Brown web site that I posted above - there may be an estimate there. If not, call Ellis, discuss what you want and ask him about $$.
Check out the link to Ellis Brown web site that I posted above - there may be an estimate there. If not, call Ellis, discuss what you want and ask him about $$.
CRS, NRA Benefactor Member, TSRA, DRSS, DWWC, Whittington Center
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
Android Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/
- fordwannabe
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Re: A Paco Kelly Project
Thank you
a Pennsylvanian who has been accused of clinging to my religion and my guns......Good assessment skills.
Re: A Paco Kelly Project
I have an old 20 gauge side by side. Ellis suggested I try building it into a 9.3X55 or something like that. Not a high pressure round, but big enough to fire a decent sized bullet and it can be done in a rimmed cartridge. Shilen barrels is just a stone's throw from me, and I could probably get two barrels from them. On a 20 gauge frame, it would be best to keep the cartridge moderate and mild. Besides, I have a .45-70 Guide Gun and a model 92 in .480 Ruger for when I need more oomph. Now to read that book I bought from Ellis and pay attention before I mess anything up.
D. Brian Casady
Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost
Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost