Buffalo Bore 30-30 190 grain

[daisygordoninc]

Does anyone have experience with 30-30 Buffalo Bore 190 grain ammo.
They advertise that it will take down just about anything, has anyone
used these for hunting large game ? I watched a youtube video of a man
taking a large bull moose with one shot with these.
Any thought on this ?

[GunnyMack]

Mass equals energy. We all know that placement of a bullet means just as much as construction. I bet the lower velocity of that 190 rainbows quite a bit more but does that 20 grains more mean the difference of getting thru both lungs of a moose or not with a 170? Lots of variables, hit a rib? Broad side?
Buddy of mine in Colorado uses his original 86 in 40-65 for elk. 265 hard cast at about 1800(IIRC) will go clean thru an elk as far away as you care to try.

[gcs]

No experience with those, but someone on one of these sites showed a photo of two rem. 170 corelokts recovered from a bull moose that were the most perfect mushrooms you could ask for.The moose of course was very dead.
Not sure the BB stuff can make them deader.

[buckeyeshooter]

As far as performance, my bet is you could exceed or equal it with the Barnes 150 grain x flat nose or for fun a 200 grain round nose for the 308 or 3006. Probably no expansion, but beaucoup penetration.

[1894cfan]

I'd rather cast my own with RCBS 30-180FN, that weigh out to 195gr using Lyman #2, and work up a load for whatever out to MAYBE 100yds. That big flat nose out front doing about 1500-1600fps ought to get the job done. YMMV HTH

[Pete44ru]

.

I wonder if Buffalo Bore uses the Hawk 190gr JSP - does anyone know ?

If so, I'd like to give them a try in my .303 Savage Model 1899 - especially since the BB slugs seem to have jackets compatible with .30-30 velocities.

I think that they'll be a nice clone of the old & long-discontinued 190gr .303 Savage factory loads.

(The .303 Savage is a .30 cal ballistic twin to the .30-30)

I would think that most of the other heavy (180gr-220gr) .308" slugs have the thicker jackets compatible with the larger .30 cal standard & magnum cartridges.


.

[FWiedner]

Yeah, OK.

I get that there are myriad of recipes that might 'do better'.

I do pretty danged well with factory 170gr, but I have to say that I can't help but be curious.

Has anyone actually run a box of these through your Model 94?

[tman]

I have not, and am also interested in hearing about some first hand accounts. Savage had an advertisement long time ago about somebody killing a whale with a .303 Savage with a 190 grain bullet, maybe some type of magic there . Perhaps the bullet is some type of hardcast. Be interesting to know what they use. If I was gonna shoot a Brown Bear with a 30-30, I'd probably spring for a couple of boxes of Buffalo Bore. More of a confidence factor than anything else.

[Camel73]

I've been wondering the same thing myself about the whole heavy 30-30 deal.

I found quite the discussion about lower pressures with leverevolution powder and heavy for caliber 30-30 over on the boolit site getting pretty good velocities. Ramps up the muzzle energy..
Interesting for sure.

I just transfered all my info over to the laptop (too many screenshots of good info!) so I'd have to dig if you want the link, but Google should bring it up.

Compared to most of you, I hardly know anything, but it got my attention.

Hopefully this helps

[daisygordoninc]

Buffalo Bore does use Hawk Bullets 190 gr.

[siberian505]

NOE makes a mold for the 30/30 in flat point that weighs 200. Also comes with a cup nose and hollow point plugs. I'm amazed what they will do in a standard chamber and an improved with leverevolution powder. Will be my hunting load this fall for whitetails in the wood river and a cow elk in fifteen mile country. Probably won't use the hollow point on a cow. Will shoot gallon jugs with both cup and hollow next week and report back.

[windy]

About the whale--it's my understanding that native Alaskans don't shoot whales to kill them; if they did, the whales would sink and be lost. They shoot to wound them, weakening them so they can't stay down as long, then chase them down, get alongside, and put a harpoon in them with a barrel or two attached. Once they're unable to sink, they can be lanced to kill them, and safely dragged ashore. My source of this information was an accomplished whale hunter who said that he couldn't use anything more powerful than a 30-06, or the whale was likely to be killed by the shot and lost. I have no doubt that 303 Savage, 30-40 Krag, and 300 Savage, 7.65x54, 303 British all have been used successfully. I remember, too, that back in the '60's, when I bought my first deer rifle at a store in Bellingham WA, a fishing port, the salesman told me that most of the old 30-40 Krags he sold went to fishermen, who used them to kill "blackfish" raiding their salmon nets and pitched them overboard, rusted out, at the end of the season. Blackfish, he said, was their name for orcas--killer whales. I haven't witnessed either event; just sayin'.
mind yer topknots!
windy

[Blaine]

I have "heavy" 30wcf....It's called a .308.....

[Rusty]

I remember reading once that years ago folks used to pull 190 grain .30-40 bullets to load them in their .30-30s. It was my understanding that they did it more for accuracy than anything else.

[gcs]

Sam Fadala in his book, Winchester 94 , had a whole discussion on pulling 190 gr. bullets from the 300 savage rounds for reloading in the 30-30.
Can't remember the details and I think I have the book somewhere, but the idea was a "heavy" 30-30 round for bigger critters.
However.....Tell the Aussie guy that kills feral brush cattle with 150 gr. factory rounds that he "needs" a heavy thumper. Those bulls are tough ***'s

[tman]

About the whale--it's my understanding that native Alaskans don't shoot whales to kill them; if they did, the whales would sink and be lost. They shoot to wound them, weakening them so they can't stay down as long, then chase them down, get alongside, and put a harpoon in them with a barrel or two attached. Once they're unable to sink, they can be lanced to kill them, and safely dragged ashore. My source of this information was an accomplished whale hunter who said that he couldn't use anything more powerful than a 30-06, or the whale was likely to be killed by the shot and lost. I have no doubt that 303 Savage, 30-40 Krag, and 300 Savage, 7.65x54, 303 British all have been used successfully. I remember, too, that back in the '60's, when I bought my first deer rifle at a store in Bellingham WA, a fishing port, the salesman told me that most of the old 30-40 Krags he sold went to fishermen, who used them to kill "blackfish" raiding their salmon nets and pitched them overboard, rusted out, at the end of the season. Blackfish, he said, was their name for orcas--killer whales. I haven't witnessed either event; just sayin'.
mind yer topknots!
windy

According to the article/advertisement, it killed the whale.

[windy]

If it was an Eskimo doing the shooting, then he'd have to count that shot as a "miss", wouldn't he?
windy

[siberian505]

The NOE 189 grain hollow point at just under 2300 stayed in the seventh water jug. The first three jugs were shredded. Remaining bullet weighed 99 grains. The cup nose was not recovered. It was lost after jug number six. Jug number seven was not injured.
Pretty impressive for the wicked little thirty.

[Carlsen Highway]

I was offered once the most beat up rusted old cut-down Lee Enfield .303 (Still worked but the bore was a sewer pipe) It had been used over the years for killing over a hundred whales. Beached ones, with an FMJ to the head. He said they all died straight off. I am not sure what this proves, except that you can literally say the .303 has killed the largest creatures in the world and you would be right.

[3leggedturtle]

The NOE 189 grain hollow point at just under 2300 stayed in the seventh water jug. The first three jugs were shredded. Remaining bullet weighed 99 grains. The cup nose was not recovered. It was lost after jug number six. Jug number seven was not injured.
Pretty impressive for the wicked little thirty.

Nice write up, thanks. What was the powder type and weight? Todd/3leggedturtle

[Ji in Hawaii]

About the whale--it's my understanding that native Alaskans don't shoot whales to kill them; if they did, the whales would sink and be lost. They shoot to wound them, weakening them so they can't stay down as long, then chase them down, get alongside, and put a harpoon in them with a barrel or two attached. Once they're unable to sink, they can be lanced to kill them, and safely dragged ashore. My source of this information was an accomplished whale hunter who said that he couldn't use anything more powerful than a 30-06, or the whale was likely to be killed by the shot and lost. I have no doubt that 303 Savage, 30-40 Krag, and 300 Savage, 7.65x54, 303 British all have been used successfully. I remember, too, that back in the '60's, when I bought my first deer rifle at a store in Bellingham WA, a fishing port, the salesman told me that most of the old 30-40 Krags he sold went to fishermen, who used them to kill "blackfish" raiding their salmon nets and pitched them overboard, rusted out, at the end of the season. Blackfish, he said, was their name for orcas--killer whales. I haven't witnessed either event; just sayin'.
mind yer topknots!
windy

Here's an interesting video about native whale hunters in the far east Russia just across the Bering Strait from Alaska. Their methods reflect the techniques you described except it looks like they used AKs which isn't surprising they being in Russia.
https://youtu.be/LMjD_wrb3jk

[Camel73]

The NOE 189 grain hollow point at just under 2300 stayed in the seventh water jug. The first three jugs were shredded. Remaining bullet weighed 99 grains. The cup nose was not recovered. It was lost after jug number six. Jug number seven was not injured.
Pretty impressive for the wicked little thirty.

Nice write up, thanks. What was the powder type and weight? Todd/3leggedturtle

I'll second that..
..and what were you shooting it out of?

[siberian505]

Shot from my everyday day rifle. Winchester model 64A so it's a twenty four inch barrel.
Load is 34 grains of leverevolution with both the hollow point and cup point. 2225 fps-33es-16sd for the hollow
2185fps-25es-12sd for the cup. This is the Ackley improved chamber. Tried several other powders, nothing gave accuracy and velocity like LVR in my rifle.

[Ji in Hawaii]

I have a LEE 2 Cavity Bullet mold .309-180 grain round nose gas check. I used this mold to cast a bunch of bullets using wheel weight alloy for my 30/06 probably 2 decades ago. Using pure lead would you think this bullet safe to load in a 30/30 tube fed magazine?