Bye-bye Cowboy hat and boots?

Ravenman · Post by **Ravenman** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:21 am

Makes that the world much safer

http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/st ... 30861.html

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/20 ... cing-Video

http://www.policemag.com/channel/patrol ... ttire.aspx

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-wyo ... story.html

Pisgah · Post by **Pisgah** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:14 am

I'd rather see the New Jersey State Police get rid of their Nazi-looking jackboots, riding pants and high-peaked caps...

bdhold · Post by **bdhold** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:47 am

"banned" - obviously that was personal and achieved the desired result.

I think they should dress like Larry the cable guy.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 8:25 am

So... I'm not the only one who noticed...

Somebody needs to tell Mr Sheriff that the SO is NOT the Marines... and then fire (recall/unelect) him.

Because THIS:

Is so much more professional looking than THIS:

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 10:29 am

I don't think I would recognize our County Sheriff without his western hat.

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 10:38 am

Stranger things have happened in Wyoming Sheriff's offices. Here's one from a couple years ago that created quite a stir before it got sorted out:

October 28, 2013 10:22 am • By Bill Sniffin

(0) Comments

Not only are Wyoming’s female deputies not wearing protective vests, but they’re showing too much of their breasts.

That was the conclusion drawn by a Californian who called Fremont County Sheriff Skip Hornecker’s office recently.

The sheriff was being criticized for one of his deputies “having three buttons loose” on her shirt, and obviously not wearing a protective bullet-proof vest and “showing too much skin.”

Sheriff Hornecker thought he better get to the bottom of the complaint as it just didn’t seem to fit his very large department of 100-plus staff, which includes deputies, jail staff and dispatch staff.

He only has one female deputy who handles patrol work. She’s a young Wyoming ranching gal who’s never been seen without her bulletproof vest and always has her shirt buttoned up.

Hornecker discovered the caller had seen a Wyoming sheriff’s deputy on a TV show. The caller was appalled at how the female deputy was dressed.

Our Sheriff Hornecker, who looks like a young Wilfred Brimley with his handlebar moustache, could be a TV star, in my opinion. Plus Brimley is one of his heroes and, by way of note, lives in Greybull.

Hornecker discovered the image the gal was complaining about was from the hit TV show “Longmire,” which is about a fictional Wyoming county called Absaroka. Sheriff Longmire has an Indian reservation in his jurisdiction. This was why the caller deduced that Fremont County, home to the Wind River Indian Reservation, is the locale for what she was seeing.

Lander officer David Hyde writes about police happenings in Fremont County:

“Dispatcher Jenny, knowing complaints about personnel aren’t to be taken lightly, asked for specifics. This lady’s exact complaint was the deputy’s boobs were hanging out. This deputy was performing her duties in front of God, Wyoming, and whoever else has a television, with her uniform shirt unbuttoned, which exposed a fair amount of skin in that particular region that clearly demonstrated there was definitely no protective vest present.

“Jenny advised the caller she had been watching a TV show about a fictional Wyoming sheriff and his fictional female deputy in a fictional Wyoming county dealing with fictional problems on a fictional reservation.

“Apparently this did little to soothe the lady caller, who stated, ‘I’ll just have to call the producers. I was a corrections officer for years and that kind of stuff is just not proper.’”

Longmire is based on books by author Craig Johnson of Ucross. It’s one of my favorite shows.

It’s about a Wyoming sheriff, his daughter and his Indian friend. One of his deputies is a blond female named Victoria Moretti, played by actress Katee Sackhoff. And yes, she shows some cleavage from time to time and never appears to be wearing a vest. My wife reminds me it’s interesting I was already aware of the deputy’s attire.

The town of Buffalo, which is used by Johnson as his model, changed their annual Crazy Days celebration to “Longmire Days” and invited the cast to come enjoy the Real West.

Huge crowds and members of the cast, including Ms. Moretti, showed up and loved the attention. Wyoming and Buffalo threw out the welcome mat for them and treated them to some real western hospitality.

Smart folks, those Buffalo residents. Hope they do it again.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 11:03 am

Several states have 'State-Mandated' uniform codes for various forms of law-enforcement, ie: County Sherifffs, City Police, State Police, Hwy Patrol, etc... Even to the point of requiring private security, if a uniform is worn, to conform. And, while it may not be a "huge" problem in THAT county in WY, for departments of several hundred or a thousand or more officers/deputies it's kinda nice that the guy rollin' up behind you IS your 'buddy' when you've got 3 subjects at gunpoint!

Do I like that a fellar with "3 years experience" in law enforcement making a drastic change such as this? He is the head of the department... if they don't like it that much... maybe they should see their Board of Supervisors or whoever oversees his budget and convince them, if they feel that strongly about it... otherwise, I ain't so sure it's all that news-worthy.

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 12:43 pm

The hat and boot flap is not the real issue, it's just the part of the show that makes the ladies in the crowd go "Awwww... "

The real issue is a xenophobia, in that there is an established good-old boy mentality that resents having an 'outsider' who 'doesn't know what he's doing' come in and start pushing the old bulls around. Assuming that the Sheriff is an elected office, there is probably a reason this guy got the job.

The deputy was obviously ready to retire and just looking for any reason to head out.

Not much of a reason to end a 40-year career, and his statement "I'm not going to change" seems to tell the tale.

Booger Bill · Post by **Booger Bill** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 12:56 pm

As far as the "Pictures" shown, the experienced old duffer with the hat gets my vote over the newbie with the horn rimmed glass`s. Its a age thing, I can relate. It`s interesting to watch the various trends in uniforms and individual styles through the years. Now its a shined chrome dome with black martian glass`s with a band on top your noggin so it dont slip off the waxed slope. Most of my days it was a black mustache with aviator glass`s. I see in jersey its the nazi caps but they dont look right unless you have cauliflower ears to go under em.
I was a lowly security guard for Lockheed aircraft 35 years starting in 1965. Our chief was a retired old spit polish strict LAPD captain. Burbank was hot and we didn't have AC. He insisted on long sleeve wool shirts and neck tie`s. The caps were the old 8 point bus drivers. I have a flat head and if I turned it fast the bill would be pointed north and I was looking east. Miserable! Finally he retired for the second time about the time the rest of the world was going to baseball caps and short sleeves with no necktie. Glory!

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:17 pm

FWiedner wrote:The hat and boot flap is not the real issue, it's just the part of the show that makes the ladies in the crowd go "Awwww... "

The real issue is a xenophobia, in that there is an established good-old boy mentality that resents having an 'outsider' who 'doesn't know what he's doing' come in and start pushing the old bulls around. Assuming that the Sheriff is an elected office, there is probably a reason this guy got the job.

The deputy was obviously ready to retire and just looking for any reason to head out.

Not much of a reason to end a 40-year career, and his statement "I'm not going to change" seems to tell the tale.

"xenophobia" has squat all to do with it. What has happened here is yet another Politician with almost Zero experience LYING to the people who voted for him (or at the very least, concealing his personal agenda from the voters).

"Xenophobia" would only be applicable if the douch in question was a Raghead or Marion Barry wannabe... but he's not. He's just a low experience clown who wants "his" cops to deviate from the image that, in good part, is responsible for much of the tourism dollars coming into a county with no real industry.

Booger Bill · Post by **Booger Bill** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:20 pm

I believe the most ridiculous thing years ago was the blue bow-tie that the CHP had to wear. Next to that for awhile, the Los Angeles Co. SO had to wear the shortie style MC helmet while driving their patrol cars.
Today all seem to wear the BP vests. While I suppose it has no doubt saved many lives, that HAS TO be very uncomfortable in hot desert and muggy areas. The fact is that traditionally overall, it seems the thinking is screw whats comfortable, the brass`s thinking wants to terrorize the public into compliance.
I read a eye witness account from a jewish pow that was forced to be a valet to a nazi commander that said the man seemed to be a average type person but as he dressed him the uniform turned him into a ferocious monster! One guy I worked with was I thought, the picture of melvin milktoast but when he put on his cap and went on duty he became a entirely different type authoritative personality.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:27 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:He's just a low experience clown who wants "his" cops to deviate from the image that, in good part, is responsible for much of the tourism dollars coming into a county with no real industry.

People come visiting to see the Sheriff and his deputies? Really????

And, here, I thought people that watch sitcoms for entertainment have issues...

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:35 pm

I'm sure as hell more scared of Sgt Fife (above) than Deputy Dawg... and if you have ever worked with/around the new "crop" of "I wanna wear a Uniform" n00bs (like I have) you would run screaming for an attempt to rehire as many cowboy-hat wearing Old Dogs as cound still walk without a cane...

Respect, and LEGITIMATE "authority", does not come from simply putting on a Barney Fife Suit...

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:38 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:
Respect, and LEGITIMATE "authority", does not come from simply putting on a Barney Fife Suit...

Or a Cowboy hat - much as I like to wear'em

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:39 pm

BrentD wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:He's just a low experience clown who wants "his" cops to deviate from the image that, in good part, is responsible for much of the tourism dollars coming into a county with no real industry.

People come visiting to see the Sheriff and his deputies? Really????

And, here, I thought people that watch sitcoms for entertainment have issues...

No, people coming to Sublette County, usually on their way to or from Yellowstone, are looking for an "authentic Western Experience" - which is why "True West Magazine" put Pinedale, one of Sublette County's three genuine towns, into their "Top 10 Most Authentic Western Communities".

Tourists in Sublette aren't looking for Andy and Barney, they are looking for Marshal Dillon... and that IS an important part of the culture there (here).

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:41 pm

When I go there, that's the last thing I want to see. Some cop that thinks he is Wyatt Earp, or Marshall Dillon. Never heard of anyone going there to see any of that. Sounds like you have been Californicated.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:43 pm

Booger Bill wrote:As far as the "Pictures" shown, the experienced old duffer with the hat gets my vote over the newbie with the horn rimmed glass`s. ...

Sgt Horn Rim is far from a n00b. He's been working Detention for longer than the Sheriff has had LE experience.

But he's typical of that (new) breed of Deputy... and it ain't pretty... but that's apparently what Sheriff n00b thinks is the "best" way to present his Deputies ti the County and its Visitors...

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 1:56 pm

BrentD wrote:When I go there, that's the last thing I want to see. Some cop that thinks he is Wyatt Earp, or Marshall Dillon. Never heard of anyone going there to see any of that. Sounds like you have been Californicated.

Then don't come. We won't miss you.

I live just over the hill (OK, South Pass...) from Sublette Co.

I abhore the ninjification of Policing (something that started only after they started calling themselves law ENFORCERS), and am solidly behind those Officers, Chiefs, Deputies and Sheriffs who still hold to Peele's principles. I have not yet had the opportunity to chat with my (new to me) Sheriff, but I had a good working and personal relationship with the one where I used to live... and HE, as often as not, wore a cowboy hat and carried a "BBQ Gun" in .45 Colt... or a nice 1911. On occasion he would carry his "issue" Plastic, but generally not. Oh, and if you think his choice of sidearms had more to do with being reactionay than Modern, his BUG is an HKP7... that he is Eyeball Accurate with.

BUT... He is Sheriff of a Cow Town/County, and knows how important it is for that county that he and his Deputies maintain a particular Image - to the extent that if he gets a complain't that one of his Deputies is not "yes m'am" Cowboy Courteous, that Deputy gets reprimanded... quickly.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:03 pm

I'm not much for folks that need to cultivate an "image". I'm far more interested in substance. Fortunately for both of us, I spend most of my time in WY over the hill in the Wind River range and northward.

Booger Bill · Post by **Booger Bill** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:14 pm

I once worked with a guy who told me he had been the police chief from back home in the mid west. I asked him how big the department was. He gulped and admitted he was the whole department! I have a BIL who was the chief of a small town in Colorado. I just looked it up and the town has 340 population. I will have to ask him how many he had under him. He did leave that for a patrolman on a much larger department. On my job we had about 250 when I hired in. The majority was retired leo or military from all over the country. I was told I was close to the first that wasn't. That all soon changed after me. When I hired in there wasn't one female on our department. Later it was something like 25%. The whole world changed in the mid 60`s during Vietnam. I dont think for the better. (Except for air conditioning.)

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:26 pm

Let's look at this from another perspective as well.

The Sheriff is an Elected position, one that requires little Policing experience. Why? Because it is, in many respects, largely a Public Relations job with oversighe of County Law Enforcement.

In short, as a Elected Official, his job is NOT to make unilateral decisions, but to take those decisions that are in keeping with the expectations of the constituency that elected him.

Things like this, that change the public perception of the entire department, require Public buy-in. He is effectively REQUIRED by his elected status to engage the community stakeholders BEFORE taking such an action.

He didn't do that - which means as far as he is concerned, the Community can take a flying leap - which seems awfully typical of the kind of person that seeks to be "elected" (D)uh(R) any more. And it's not the kknd of dictatorial attitude I want to see in any County's "Top Law Enforcer".

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:29 pm

jnyork wrote:Stranger things have happened in Wyoming Sheriff's offices. Here's one from a couple years ago that created quite a stir before it got sorted out:

October 28, 2013 10:22 am • By Bill Sniffin

(0) Comments

Not only are Wyoming’s female deputies not wearing protective vests, but they’re showing too much of their breasts.

That was the conclusion drawn by a Californian who called Fremont County Sheriff Skip Hornecker’s office recently.

The sheriff was being criticized for one of his deputies “having three buttons loose” on her shirt, and obviously not wearing a protective bullet-proof vest and “showing too much skin.”

Sheriff Hornecker thought he better get to the bottom of the complaint as it just didn’t seem to fit his very large department of 100-plus staff, which includes deputies, jail staff and dispatch staff.

He only has one female deputy who handles patrol work. She’s a young Wyoming ranching gal who’s never been seen without her bulletproof vest and always has her shirt buttoned up.

Hornecker discovered the caller had seen a Wyoming sheriff’s deputy on a TV show. The caller was appalled at how the female deputy was dressed.

Our Sheriff Hornecker, who looks like a young Wilfred Brimley with his handlebar moustache, could be a TV star, in my opinion. Plus Brimley is one of his heroes and, by way of note, lives in Greybull.

Hornecker discovered the image the gal was complaining about was from the hit TV show “Longmire,” which is about a fictional Wyoming county called Absaroka. Sheriff Longmire has an Indian reservation in his jurisdiction. This was why the caller deduced that Fremont County, home to the Wind River Indian Reservation, is the locale for what she was seeing.

Lander officer David Hyde writes about police happenings in Fremont County:

“Dispatcher Jenny, knowing complaints about personnel aren’t to be taken lightly, asked for specifics. This lady’s exact complaint was the deputy’s boobs were hanging out. This deputy was performing her duties in front of God, Wyoming, and whoever else has a television, with her uniform shirt unbuttoned, which exposed a fair amount of skin in that particular region that clearly demonstrated there was definitely no protective vest present.

“Jenny advised the caller she had been watching a TV show about a fictional Wyoming sheriff and his fictional female deputy in a fictional Wyoming county dealing with fictional problems on a fictional reservation.

“Apparently this did little to soothe the lady caller, who stated, ‘I’ll just have to call the producers. I was a corrections officer for years and that kind of stuff is just not proper.’”

Longmire is based on books by author Craig Johnson of Ucross. It’s one of my favorite shows.

It’s about a Wyoming sheriff, his daughter and his Indian friend. One of his deputies is a blond female named Victoria Moretti, played by actress Katee Sackhoff. And yes, she shows some cleavage from time to time and never appears to be wearing a vest. My wife reminds me it’s interesting I was already aware of the deputy’s attire.

The town of Buffalo, which is used by Johnson as his model, changed their annual Crazy Days celebration to “Longmire Days” and invited the cast to come enjoy the Real West.

Huge crowds and members of the cast, including Ms. Moretti, showed up and loved the attention. Wyoming and Buffalo threw out the welcome mat for them and treated them to some real western hospitality.

Smart folks, those Buffalo residents. Hope they do it again.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:30 pm

Old Ironsights wrote: Things like this, that change the public perception of the entire department, require Public buy-in. He is effectively REQUIRED by his elected status to engage the community stakeholders BEFORE taking such an action.

Hats??? Hats require public "buy-in". sounds like you want California-nut referendums on every *******' detail.

Maybe he is more interested in policing or LE than he is in image?

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:33 pm

BrentD wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote:He's just a low experience clown who wants "his" cops to deviate from the image that, in good part, is responsible for much of the tourism dollars coming into a county with no real industry.

People come visiting to see the Sheriff and his deputies? Really????

And, here, I thought people that watch sitcoms for entertainment have issues...

The London " Bobby" is popular with tourist from all over the world, not so popular with me (sorry Perry) but the traditional image is what tourists expect when in England.
When I was touring around Arizona and Utah I was pleased to see ordinary folks dressed in modern western wear, only the American tourists looked out of place in their shorts and sandals...

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:40 pm

BrentD wrote:
Old Ironsights wrote: Things like this, that change the public perception of the entire department, require Public buy-in. He is effectively REQUIRED by his elected status to engage the community stakeholders BEFORE taking such an action.
Hats??? Hats require public "buy-in". sounds like you want California-nut referendums on every *******' detail.

Maybe he is more interested in policing or LE than he is in image?

There is a whopping 10,000 people and three real towns in the entire county.

Image IS policing.

But then, maybe you like Barney the Ninja Wannabe. Fear the Jackboot.

In my case, this guy remindes me more of a Ring Knocker who thinks he knows more about operating In Country than the First Shirt who has re-upped for two extra Volunteer Tours.

There's a reason why those butter bars melted.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 2:46 pm

Pisgah wrote:I'd rather see the New Jersey State Police get rid of their Nazi-looking jackboots, riding pants and high-peaked caps...

+1.....!!!!!!!!!!!!

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:03 pm

I guess tradition no longer counts in some places....

That New Guy? Pfffft, I knew him a hundred times over in the Army....As soon as they start a sentence with
"In ROTC, they taught us........." Trouble is, oft times they FUBAR it before they dry out behind the ears.....
NCOs should be allowed to kick the stuff out of 2lts....

sore shoulder · Post by **sore shoulder** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:20 pm

What I wanna know is why anyone voted for someone for Sheriff that had only 3 years experience? Whats the story with whoever he was running against? What lies did he tell?

sore shoulder · Post by **sore shoulder** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:22 pm

BlaineG wrote: NCOs should be allowed to kick the stuff out of 2lts....

Nothing like having a fresh from college PL thats younger than your kids trying to run things. In the infantry, it's really funny.

"Here's some paperwork sir."

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:26 pm

sore shoulder wrote:What I wanna know is why anyone voted for someone for Sheriff that had only 3 years experience? Whats the story with whoever he was running against? What lies did he tell?

I really don't know anything about the opponent/incumbernt he ran against.

Honestly, it looks like he got the nod by playing up his (Legitimately Honorable) Service as a Career Marine and playing down his lack of experience in PR/LE &/or his desire to "improve" the "skittles platoon" that he had the misfortune of inheriting...

Booger Bill · Post by **Booger Bill** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 4:35 pm

Some of those small poor county`s dont pay jack. When I was a kid in some villages the town constable got paid nothing and the title was passed around. I had a cousin who`s husband was sheriff of our county. When he started around world war two it was just him finally he got up to maybe three or four deputy's. Later the new sheriff built it up to over 40 deputy's. This was about 35 years ago, the last time I visited him back home. He died not much later. He resented the newer sheriff and tried to talk me into coming home, get on the dept and then had visions of grandeur on backing me in a run for the job after working several years. I declined as I had a good job. His gripe with the newer sheriff was that he had back stabbed him on a incident. Specks had just retired after quite a few years. (Actually, his wife my cousin had also been sheriff due to term limits). A new inexperienced guy that had been a county road worker ran and got the job. The infamous Ed Gein case happened and the new sheriff called Specks (Leon) Murty up as he was at a loss as what to do. Specks solved the case and arrested Gein. The new sheriff talked Specks into being quiet and then turned around and sold the story to LIFE Magazine, and took all the credit. Got to run, maybe more later.

Bye-bye Cowboy hat and boots?

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