MacFarlane 10 gauge side by side muzzle loader

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:01 pm

Finally dug my old ML double out of the safe , I had thought for some reason the thing was made in London , but it turns out it's marked "MACFARLANE NEW YORK" . I don't have my choke gauge here but I will check them tommorrow at the shop . Looked down the barrels with a bore lite and the darn things look clean and pit free . Little dusty of course . Took the pin out and tried to remove the barrels as they appear to be hooked breech but they're tight . I'll try again at the shop tommorrow when I have a plastic headed persuader (hammer) .

The pics were taken with my I Phone so they aren't the best . But give a slight idea non the less . Oh the locks snap into cock just like a new sidelock would today , very positive half cock and full cock .

Both at half cock .

One at half and the other at full cock .

Both at full cock .

Nipples look to be used very little if at all .

The pattern is still easily seen on the barrels .

Wanna try this thing with Triple 7 2Fg granulated about 80 grains I think and 1 1/8 to 1 1/4 ounce of shot or buckshot .

We've had this thing I think about 30 years so it's certainly time to give it a whirl as it's not been fired since it came into our possesion .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:03 pm

By no means am I sure of date of manufacture but I kinda think it's in the 1855-1870 range . Could be wrong but thats my opinion until I find some info .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:07 pm

If I get a decent buck load worked out for this bad boy and I take a deer I'll have a new oldest gun used as this one should beat my old W&C Scott circa 1881 10 gauge by atleast 10 or 15 years ! This thing may have been pre Civil War but I do not think it was used then as the wear is minimal for something this age . And then again it may not have been down here then . Well as I can remmeber we got it at an antique shop and the fellow was selling off stuff for an older couple that had migrated south after they retired .

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 2:47 pm

Another very fine double, 6 pt. Something particularly crisp about the lock and hammer edges, and the barrel patters are gorgeous. Thanks for putting up the photos.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 3:03 pm

Hopefully it'll get fired in the next two to four weeks !

Thanks !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:03 pm

Loading birdshot for this thing is of no issue .

But I've been thinking of a way to load the buckshot nested as I do in shot shells and make it relatively quick to get in the gun in the field .

I am thinking eight 000 pellets should be a good load with 85 grains of Triple 7 2Fg or 2Fg Goex BP .

85 grains powder followed by an over powder wad followed by a cushion wad followed by perhaps the eight pellets held together with plastic wrap and finally an overshot wad .

Dunno if this will work but it won't cost that much to try , well that is if the plastic wrap holds them together well enough for my purpose . I am sure pushing out the barrel when fired will make darn sure the stuff is shredded .

I also read somewhere a fellow said he used dime wrappers for this purpose in a 12 gauge so I might try nickel wrappers in this 10 gauge !

Nath · Post by **Nath** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 12:24 am

Very nice indeed.
How about making some paper cart's!

N.

M. M. Wright · Post by **M. M. Wright** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:40 am

Please don't use the 777. I think it's just about impossible to get it to quit corroding after even the most meticulous cleaning. Use the Goex ffg. By all means shoot it. Circle Fly or John Walters for wads and such and we need a range report of course.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:10 am

M. M. Wright wrote:Please don't use the 777. I think it's just about impossible to get it to quit corroding after even the most meticulous cleaning. Use the Goex ffg. By all means shoot it. Circle Fly or John Walters for wads and such and we need a range report of course.

Strange I've never seen that with 777 . That stuff literally dissolves with water or atleast thats been how it's done in my Knight rifles .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:31 am

The underside of the barrels !

mergus · Post by **mergus** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 9:32 am

Very nice! That things darn near begs to be shot at high flying geese. Think Bismuth 2's....

Mergus

zzr7ky · Post by **zzr7ky** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:11 am

Very nice. I really enjoy percussion doubles. Love those big bores

I have seen no corrosion issues with 777. However Pyrodex = pitting in my experience.

All the best,
Mike P

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:11 am

zzr7ky wrote:Very nice. I really enjoy percussion doubles. Love those big bores

I have seen no corrosion issues with 777. However Pyrodex = pitting in my experience.

All the best,
Mike P

I'm not a big advocate of BP , but I think Pyrodex is more corrosive then BP .

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 12:00 pm

That is a very nice shotgun. And using Blackpowder in it is a no brainer.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:02 pm

I found my nipple wrench about an hour ago .

This guns been in our house for atleast 25 years and all we ever did with it before was wipe it with a silicon rag and swab the insides of the barrels with a oiled mop . So it's been a good number of years since the nipples were removed .

I put the little TC wrench on them and put a small boxend wrench on the nipple wrench and they eased right out .

Think I'll sonic clean the nipples tommorrow .

A Remington SP-10 fits in the muzzle relatively easily this thing might be a 9 gauge . Think I'll take some measurements tommorrow as well .

jjames · Post by **jjames** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:59 pm

I also have never had issues with 777. I shoot it in my Ithaca Flues and my Burgess with no notice of corrosion. I get them cleaned within hours of shooting though. The strangest thing happened last time I shot 25 through the Burgess with 777. When I cleaned it a huge long chunk came out in a single limp black mass. Gun was almost clean after a single pass.

ice of corrosion

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:51 am

Finally got around to shooting this thing yesterday ! Used 85 grains by volume of Triple 7 2Fg and 1 1/8 ounce of shot . Both barrels fired fine . Next couple days I wanna take it yo the range and try I t with 000 Buck !

Nath · Post by **Nath** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 6:32 am

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:37 pm

I'd be more concerned about the extra yield from 777 vs. Goex. Fine lookin' old ML.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:32 pm

Went out after dinner and tried some 000 at the gun club range . Started with 80 grains Triple 7 and nine pellets . That didn't look so hot at 25 yards 3of 9 on the target. Then I tried the same e except I put the pellets in a cut down nickel wrapper and it improved some and got 6 of 9 on the target. Next I tried it with 12 pellets and got 2 of the 12 on paper . Tried 90 grains with 9 pellets in the wrapper and it was 5 of 9 . Tried 9 with no wrapper and 80 grains but held a shade lower and put 8 of 9 on target , also added the trimmings from the nickel wrapper on top that time as the over shot wads are a red hair or two to small . After that I tried the left barrel with 80 grains and nine pellets with and without wrappers and got the same results after I added a little extra on top . Loaded both barrels with 80/9 and some extra wrapper on top . Shot the right barrel and then checked the left barrel , sure enough they had loosened a bit . So I tamped them down and let fly with the same pleading results ! Tomorrow I wanna try and make a die to cut over shot wads a bit larger then what I have . I'm fine with the 80/9 load I just need to get wads big enough in diameter to stay tight after a shot in the o t her barrel .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:34 pm

I better check my velocity also as the load with 80/9 was rather pleasant from the bench .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:36 pm

Since I can't afford an 8 gauge Parker , Smith or LeFever cartridge gun I think I need to find a nice percussion 8 gauge double barrel !!

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 2:54 am

I see London proof marks on the underside of the barrels, did MacFarlane import the barrels from England and then finish the gun in New York?
Nice to see a well looked after old gun still being used.

Nath · Post by **Nath** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 4:26 am

Good work with the buck shot! Sounds interesting.
We get the odd cheap 8g show up over here, I often wonder how one would fair on fox with 2oz of course shot. #2-AAA maybe!

N.

Dusty Texian · Post by **Dusty Texian** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 7:21 am

Very nice old shotgun! Would be Great to see it used on Wild Game . Now that is sporting! ,,,DT

rjohns94 · Post by **rjohns94** » Thu Aug 28, 2014 4:12 pm

Very nice

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:33 am

Made a over shot wad punch yesterday . With calipers the barrels measured .788" at t he muzzle in both barrels . So I took a piece of 1100 12 gauge barrel and bored it out to .790" . Th e over shot cards I bought measure .750" . Need to try these new cards and see if they stay tight and if not run the boring bar back thru and take another .005" or so.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:36 am

I have a W Richards 12 gauge percussion SxS I might work with once I get this one blooded . Also seems to me we have an O/U percussion cape gun floating around somewhere in the safe .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 6:05 pm

Well thin cardboard wads cut with my homemade punch are tight going in . But when I shoot the first barrel it seems the load in the other barrel still backs out a touch . Using the cardboard from Pepsi containers might not be th e correct thing . Maybe I'll try and find something a little thicker .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 11:21 am

Got the over shot card thing worked out !

I am using "used" gunsmith repair tickets . They're kinda stiff and with my homemade punch they're stiff . Two of those over top seem to do just fine .

Tried them last friday . Loaded the left barrel with 9 pellets of 000 and the right with birdshot . Shot the right barrel and checked the left it was still tight or so it seemed . Reloaded the right barrel with 9 pellets of 000 and fired it at my pattern target . Again I checked the left barrel and they seemed tight so I fired it also at the 25 yard target board . Of the 18 pellets 14 were on my target . This should work as I try and keep myself in situations where a 25 yard shot is max . Well to be honest I'll use this thing shooting from a treestand and will also have a rifle with me . So that being said I can choose and pick the shots I take with this old shotgun !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 11:23 am

Strangely this old gun balances in the hand very well for something from this time period . Granted it's a bit heavy .

I have no doubt if I were so inclined to shoot a round of trap or skeet the old gun would most likely do fairly well as long as I did my part of course .

Bill in Oregon · Post by **Bill in Oregon** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:23 pm

Dang it, that is such a lovely shottie.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:30 pm

Bill in Oregon wrote:Dang it, that is such a lovely shottie.

Yes sir I like the old gun a good bit !

Just wish I could find a double 8 percussion in as nice shape to go with it

The british cartridge paradox hammerguns with under levers are getting my intrest lately . I've found a few for sale that I like . Matter of fact a friend of mine's father has a shop in the UK and he has a rather nice H&H hammer 12 paradox that I like a good bit . He also as a matter of fact has a double 8 percussion that very nice . Only thing keeping me from either of these is the amount of schekels I'd need to come up with !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 6:35 pm

Incidently I got an email today from a friend telling me about an auction in PA next week that will have a very nice Remington 32 4 barrel set I would love to have and was actually considering going to see .

But about 2 hours after I heard about that I found out another friend is thinking of selling his Parker VH 20 gauge that I've known for well over 40 years and I think he's owned for about 55 or so years .

My pop and I both have been after that Parker for atleast 30 years . He told me today that he wanted to get a fair appraisal and then I had first refusal .

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:16 pm

I really need to do something with my Damascus 16...

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 7:56 pm

This is what I do with my damascus 16.

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~jessie/P ... 0small.jpg

http://www.public.iastate.edu/~jessie/P ... 202011.jpg

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:10 pm

Damascus Fear Not

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Tue Sep 16, 2014 9:29 pm

Very nice turkey and shottie - more info on both?

Over the 1k pixel bag limit I'm afraid
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~jessie/P ... -Scott.jpg

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 2:00 pm

Well so much for getting the Parker VHE 20 gauge . My friend wants about twice what I would try and sell the thing for if I were the one selling it . Maybe if we don't sell it at the shop the price will reduce over time .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 2:02 pm

It is a rather nice gun however . 28" M&F blueing and wood finish are a conservative 60-70% . No major dents or scratches . I had thought the gun had an added recoil pad , but it has the correct dogs head buttplate .

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:42 pm

How about a picture of that Parker girl

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:46 pm

BrentD wrote:Very nice turkey and shottie - more info on both?

Over the 1k pixel bag limit I'm afraid
http://www.public.iastate.edu/~jessie/P ... -Scott.jpg

Brent,
Unfortunately I don't know anything about that beauty.
I stumbled upon her in a Google picture search.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:23 pm

BrentD wrote:This is what I do with my damascus 16.

...

Mine does not look all that different... but it is off face and needs a new hinge pin before I even TRY to use low-pressure 16ga loads.

BUT, as it is, it does OK with .410 chambers. I've thought about getting 20ga chambers, but what I REALLY want to do is get full-length .45-70 sleeves...

Maybe when I win the lottery I don't play...

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:32 pm

Don't do the .45-70.. It's not worth it for a nice gun. And if it is a 12, it is going to be very heavy.

There is a book about permanently converting double shotguns to double rifles like this, by W. Ellis Brown. If you want a signed copy, I'll part with mine. I had the dream, but I got over it before I did anything crazy

.

Brent

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:39 pm

BrentD wrote:Don't do the .45-70.. It's not worth it for a nice gun. And if it is a 12, it is going to be very heavy.

There is a book about permanently converting double shotguns to double rifles like this, by W. Ellis Brown. If you want a signed copy, I'll part with mine. I had the dream, but I got over it before I did anything crazy .

Brent

It's not a "nice" gun... it's an old no-name Damascus that was saved from being a permanent wall hanger at a Cracker Barrel.

But it IS an INTERESTING gun that I wish I could use in more productive ways.

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:43 pm

Sounds familiar. Did you buy it from me?

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Sep 17, 2014 10:20 pm

No, I don't believe I did.

If anyone can read the proofs and make anything of them I'd be interested to know, but the bore is pitted and there is pitting around where the forearm touches the barrels. If this is more than a "Project gun" to be relined I will be very, very surprised.

http://s5.photobucket.com/user/MrMisant ... eshow/16ga

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:51 am

Old Ironsights wrote:No, I don't believe I did.

If anyone can read the proofs and make anything of them I'd be interested to know, but the bore is pitted and there is pitting around where the forearm touches the barrels. If this is more than a "Project gun" to be relined I will be very, very surprised.

http://s5.photobucket.com/user/MrMisant ... eshow/16ga

Dr. Drew Hause is the go to guy.
I would do some research on that old girl before putting permanent nails in her coffin.
https://sites.google.com/a/damascusknow ... m/www/home

Link to his pictures & blog's
http://www.picturetrail.com/homepage/revdocdrew

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:31 am

you can still see quality inletting there. Looks very germanic to me.

A doll's head lock up would not be my first choice for sleaving to a double rifle. I'd prefer a Greener crossbolt for that purpose.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:01 am

It's definitely Germanic. Got it at the same time/from the same person I got my 16x16/9.3x72 Driling. It was a "bring back".

I don't want to destroy it. Not even sure about permanent sleeves. I've mostly considered long removable liners like Briley etc.

But, like I said, it's badly off face and needs a thourough workup before I run anything through it heavier than .410 birdshot. (Guagemates work great...)