OT - CCW on Campus

[cnjarvis]

Here's an article from the Tulsa World -


Bill would let college students bear arms

by: MICK HINTON World Capitol Bureau
2/27/2008 12:00 AM

OKLAHOMA CITY -- A bill that would allow some college students to carry concealed weapons on campus is headed for the House floor.

House Bill 2513 by Rep. Jason Murphey, R-Guthrie, was approved 14-2 on Monday by the House Judiciary and Public Safety Committee.

The bill would allow students to carry firearms on campus if they are at least 21 and are licensed to carry a concealed weapon.

"As long as students kept their weapons concealed, they could go into class with them," Murphey said.

He said he decided that the bill was needed after the Feb. 14 shootings that left six dead, including the gunman, at Northern Illinois University and an attack in April at Virginia Tech in which a gunman killed 32 people.

Murphey said the bill, which would apply only to public colleges and universities, would allow students to defend themselves, especially if they were being victimized by someone.

But the greater value of such a law would be that a potential shooter might be hesitant to come onto a college campus, he said.

"A gunman would not know who might be trained and could defend themselves," Murphey said.

"If you can walk down Main Street with a concealed weapon, you should be able to walk onto a college campus with one," he said.

Rep. Paul Roan, an Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper for 25 years, voted against the bill, saying such a law could greatly hinder law enforcement.

"You wouldn't know who the players are," he said.

Because weapons now are banned, he said, police can tell if someone comes onto campus "with a gun for evil purposes."

Roan, D-Tishomingo, said the amount of training to qualify for a concealed weapon permit is minimal. Those who are granted licenses have to take eight hours of training that includes classes and practice at a firing range.

Roan said the bill would mean that a person who practiced with a simple kind of gun at a range could come onto campus armed with a high-powered weapon.

Murphey's original bill, requested by a constituent, would have changed the law so that a person could transport a rifle, shotgun or pistol "open and loaded" in a vehicle at any time.

He said the bill would have been patterned after the "Texas Travel" law, which provides that Texans can have loaded weapons in their vehicles.

Murphey said the committee did not like that version of the bill, so he decided to scratch that language and insert the new proposal regarding guns on college campuses.

Oklahoma State University spokesman Gary Shutt said OSU is tracking the bill.

Noting that students are not allowed to have guns on campus, Shutt said police still are evaluating the proposal.

My question to myself (or anyone else, particularly LEO) is this: How do LEO's know who the GG's are?

[Andrew]

Sounds like Paul Roan needs to be educated in the 2nd amend.

My question to myself (or anyone else, particularly LEO) is this: How do LEO's know who the GG's are?

Your question presumes that the shooting will carry on for enough time that the police arrive.

[cnjarvis]

My question to myself (or anyone else, particularly LEO) is this: How do LEO's know who the GG's are?

Your question presumes that the shooting will carry on for enough time that the police arrive.

That possibility does exist.

[Tycer]

My question to myself (or anyone else, particularly LEO) is this: How do LEO's know who the GG's are?

Your question presumes that the shooting will carry on for enough time that the police arrive.

That possibility does exist.

If a LEO can't tell the difference, he does not fire. It has been pretty obvious of late who the wackos are - they are dressed and armed for battle, not class. I've had this discussion with LEOs and they agree that the wackos are easy to spot. It's the professional criminal that blends in with the rest by design.

[alnitak]

"Roan said the bill would mean that a person who practiced with a simple kind of gun at a range could come onto campus armed with a high-powered weapon. "

As if one could conceal carry a .50 BMG, or AR-15, or anything else other than a handgun and maybe an extra clip! I'm sure in his mind, a "high-powered weapon" is anything from a .22 on up. What an idiot!

Bleeding heart liberal sheeple just don't think...or use the wrong end to process information.

[Blackhawk]

There was a shooting this week at UALR in Little Rock AR. My wife attends classes there and graduates in May. She is in the process of getting her CCW and will carry no matter the rules. I'd rather her break the rules than be dead. Campus cops or any other LEO is not going to save her when the gun is right there in front of her. I just can't understand someone's logic to put their life in a LEO hands. And I don't mean anything towards LEO's, my brother is one, but I'll call 911 after I'm out of bullets.

Johnny

[Ram Hammer]

"Roan said the bill would mean that a person who practiced with a simple kind of gun at a range could come onto campus armed with a high-powered weapon. "


As if one could conceal carry a .50 BMG, or AR-15, or anything else other than a handgun and maybe an extra clip! I'm sure in his mind, a "high-powered weapon" is anything from a .22 on up. What an idiot!

alnitak,
Thanks for pointing this out.

I had a Concealed Carry License in Oklahoma when I lived there. These fools throw out stuff like this and their ignorance shines!!

First, simple and complex are different from weak and powerfull. Second, Oklahoma issues you a permit based on what you qualify with during the CCW class in this order
Deringer
Revolver
Pistol

Your permit will reflect which you are allowed to carry and you cannot upgrade your carry piece without modifying your permit.

Finally the concept that a weak or high powered weapon is on campus deflects the discussion from the original concept of the bill in the first place..... Give people the means to defend themselfs from those who would go on a shooting rampage. Once a legally carried weapon is brought to bear in a self defence situation, the CCW holder will probably wish they had a more powerfull handgun!

[cnjarvis]

"Roan said the bill would mean that a person who practiced with a simple kind of gun at a range could come onto campus armed with a high-powered weapon. "


As if one could conceal carry a .50 BMG, or AR-15, or anything else other than a handgun and maybe an extra clip! I'm sure in his mind, a "high-powered weapon" is anything from a .22 on up. What an idiot!

alnitak,
Thanks for pointing this out.

I had a Concealed Carry License in Oklahoma when I lived there. These fools throw out stuff like this and their ignorance shines!!

First, simple and complex are different from weak and powerfull. Second, Oklahoma issues you a permit based on what you qualify with during the CCW class in this order
Deringer
Revolver
Pistol

Your permit will reflect which you are allowed to carry and you cannot upgrade your carry piece without modifying your permit.

Finally the concept that a weak or high powered weapon is on campus deflects the discussion from the original concept of the bill in the first place..... Give people the means to defend themselfs from those who would go on a shooting rampage. Once a legally carried weapon is brought to bear in a self defence situation, the CCW holder will probably wish they had a more powerfull handgun!

The guy is a retired OHP trooper and should know better.

[Leverdude]

My question to myself (or anyone else, particularly LEO) is this: How do LEO's know who the GG's are?

If this gets to be law the GG will be the one still standing.
Seriously, I dont think it would be hard. The police never seem to have to make this determination anyway, they generally kill themselves. But if they didn't I think it would be easy & if its not then thats their problem. Theyre better at solving crimes than stopping them anyway.

[AJMD429]

This all illustrates the folly and danger when we let our public servants have the power to "license" us to carry or not carry, and dictate to us what we shall be allowed to carry.

These idiots need to be reminded that the citizen has an intrinsic, God-given right to self-defense, including defensive use of concealed firearms, whether or not the public officials "approve" of it or not.

Perhaps the solution would be to revoke ALL the LEO's, Mayor's, Legislators, and their bodyguards' gun priveleges, and remind THEM that it is THEY who bear arms at OUR discretion, not the other way around!

The difference is crucial to understand - it is the ONLY fundamental difference between a free Republic, and a dictatorship. All the other stuff is merely window-dressing.

[505stevec]

Does the Federal Law for Guns on Campus include Colleges? I was wondering because I have violated that one many many times. If it is conceled then who would know unless you have to save the day so to speak and if that happens who will care? other than Sarah Brady and co.

[Leverdude]

Does the Federal Law for Guns on Campus include Colleges? I was wondering because I have violated that one many many times. If it is conceled then who would know unless you have to save the day so to speak and if that happens who will care? other than Sarah Brady and co.

I dont think its a law but a policy. Thing is if they say you cant bring a gun in there then its against the law to do so. Just like you can forbid a person from bringing a gun onto your private property. College campuses are private property mostly. State schools are probably covered by the federal laws.

I think that if you saved the day in most places you'ld still be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

[Andrew]

That possibility does exist.

I know, I just don't like the odds. You know the expression, "when seconds count, the cops are only minutes away".

I feel sorry that they have to ask permission to protect themselves.