Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Well ... this sure is one of those threads that brings out our true feelings about semi auto pistols, isn't it ? I'll chime in.
For years I liked steel pistols, with hammers, with punch, in the proven caliber of .45 acp. For most folks that means 1911's. The single action trigger on a good reliable 1911 is hard to beat, but ....
The old reliability vs. accuracy deal still exists, despite what the gun writers tell us, especially with all of the hoopla surrounding the 100th anniversary of the 1911. Super accurate, tuned 1911's need some TLC and occasionally, more than just that. Stuff breaks on them on occasion, etc., etc.
Back in the fall of 2010 I went over to the dark side, at least for me. I'd been looking really closely at the Glocks, despite my own personal belief that a more butt-ugly pistol has never been made. I was willing to overlook the cosmetics because of the Glock's well deserved reputation for reliability. Anybody who goes on about reliability issues in Glock pistols clearly doesn't know what they're talking about. But that ugly thing still bothered me, and the no-safety (except in the trigger) thing. Soooooooo...
I bought a Springfield XDM in .45 acp. Since buying my first one I have consistently put at least 1,000 rounds a month through, and its sister. Yeah, I bought a second one about two weeks after buying the first, so that I could "spread the burden" between two pistols. Or maybe it was just an excuse to buy another .45 ....yeah, that's probably more honest.
Anyway, what I like about the Springfield (full size, 4 1/2 barrel) is : grip safety is a nice extra layer of security; it's simple and it works. Grip angle is more similar to the 1911 than the Glocks I test fired. The Glock seems to want to make me cant my wrists down into a less-than-natural position. The XDM is dead-nuts accurate. About the only bullet shape it sometimes has troubles with is SWC's in 200 grain weights, but then, every pistol I've owned in this caliber has been finicky about COL with those bullets. I don't bother with them anymore. JHP's from 185 grain to 230 grain are no problem at all. Never had a failure to feed and I'm at about the 16,000 round mark. Okay, the cons:
The triggers on Glocks or Springfield XDM's are never going to be 1911 triggers, and that's just a fact. However, the Glock has been around for long enough that the really good after-market stuff is well known, and you can get yourself a completely reliable and improved trigger set up with a connector kit for not much more than $20 or $30.
Both of my Springfield XDM's have Powder River trigger kits, and they greatly improve the take-up, and they're not so light that the gun fires if you sneeze on them. The safety in the trigger itself remains the same, but you get a much more crisp trigger pull, faster reset, and, of course, all of this lends itself to more accurate shooting. If you shoot a stock Glock, the out-of-the-box XDM trigger will be familiar, though I think the XDM stock trigger is a little better. The problem with the XDM trigger kits (after-market) is that they're really expensive (mine was $140) and they're not "drop-in" like the Glock after-market stuff is. I think this is just because the XD's and XDM's are relative newcomers to the scene, compared to Glock.
I haven't mentioned an awful lot of the double action triggered guns like the Beretta 92's and many more. I can't stand all of that travel in the trigger, even after the first shot. Years ago I wasted a lot of time trying to learn to shoot accurately with pistol which were really not conducive to serious accuracy. Maybe that comes from knowing what handgun accuracy can be, after shooting 1911's.
I wouldn't turn my nose up at a Glock, and may buy one in the future. Still in .45 acp, though. Hey, some things don't change. - DixieBoy
For years I liked steel pistols, with hammers, with punch, in the proven caliber of .45 acp. For most folks that means 1911's. The single action trigger on a good reliable 1911 is hard to beat, but ....
The old reliability vs. accuracy deal still exists, despite what the gun writers tell us, especially with all of the hoopla surrounding the 100th anniversary of the 1911. Super accurate, tuned 1911's need some TLC and occasionally, more than just that. Stuff breaks on them on occasion, etc., etc.
Back in the fall of 2010 I went over to the dark side, at least for me. I'd been looking really closely at the Glocks, despite my own personal belief that a more butt-ugly pistol has never been made. I was willing to overlook the cosmetics because of the Glock's well deserved reputation for reliability. Anybody who goes on about reliability issues in Glock pistols clearly doesn't know what they're talking about. But that ugly thing still bothered me, and the no-safety (except in the trigger) thing. Soooooooo...
I bought a Springfield XDM in .45 acp. Since buying my first one I have consistently put at least 1,000 rounds a month through, and its sister. Yeah, I bought a second one about two weeks after buying the first, so that I could "spread the burden" between two pistols. Or maybe it was just an excuse to buy another .45 ....yeah, that's probably more honest.
Anyway, what I like about the Springfield (full size, 4 1/2 barrel) is : grip safety is a nice extra layer of security; it's simple and it works. Grip angle is more similar to the 1911 than the Glocks I test fired. The Glock seems to want to make me cant my wrists down into a less-than-natural position. The XDM is dead-nuts accurate. About the only bullet shape it sometimes has troubles with is SWC's in 200 grain weights, but then, every pistol I've owned in this caliber has been finicky about COL with those bullets. I don't bother with them anymore. JHP's from 185 grain to 230 grain are no problem at all. Never had a failure to feed and I'm at about the 16,000 round mark. Okay, the cons:
The triggers on Glocks or Springfield XDM's are never going to be 1911 triggers, and that's just a fact. However, the Glock has been around for long enough that the really good after-market stuff is well known, and you can get yourself a completely reliable and improved trigger set up with a connector kit for not much more than $20 or $30.
Both of my Springfield XDM's have Powder River trigger kits, and they greatly improve the take-up, and they're not so light that the gun fires if you sneeze on them. The safety in the trigger itself remains the same, but you get a much more crisp trigger pull, faster reset, and, of course, all of this lends itself to more accurate shooting. If you shoot a stock Glock, the out-of-the-box XDM trigger will be familiar, though I think the XDM stock trigger is a little better. The problem with the XDM trigger kits (after-market) is that they're really expensive (mine was $140) and they're not "drop-in" like the Glock after-market stuff is. I think this is just because the XD's and XDM's are relative newcomers to the scene, compared to Glock.
I haven't mentioned an awful lot of the double action triggered guns like the Beretta 92's and many more. I can't stand all of that travel in the trigger, even after the first shot. Years ago I wasted a lot of time trying to learn to shoot accurately with pistol which were really not conducive to serious accuracy. Maybe that comes from knowing what handgun accuracy can be, after shooting 1911's.
I wouldn't turn my nose up at a Glock, and may buy one in the future. Still in .45 acp, though. Hey, some things don't change. - DixieBoy
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Guys am I missing something??
Has their been a problem with Glocks as of late (blowing up)in the larger calibers ?
Has their been a problem with Glocks as of late (blowing up)in the larger calibers ?
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Check the Internet. Bottom line, as mentioned - don't handload for a Glock; at least not the .40 SW or the .357 SIG, both of which are high pressure rounds. You will find some photos and videos (e.g. YouTube) of blown Glocks if you look hard enough.madman4570 wrote:Guys am I missing something??
Has their been a problem with Glocks as of late (blowing up)in the larger calibers ?
Glock's design does not allow for the cartridge to be fully enclosed.
Here is one for starters - a few Glocks among others:
http://www.google.com/search?q=glock+bl ... 24&bih=617
But there are several videos and postings, as well.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I like the 9MM and the guns I currently own to fire it are.....
Ruger LC9, SR9 and two P95`s.
The LC is very concealable, accurate and inexpensive .
The SR9 is a mid sized 17 shot 9MM that is very accurate and dependable and reasonably priced.
While bulky (IMHO) the P95 Ruger is the best value for cost of any semi I have shot and it just keeps on ticking like the
proverbial Timex watch.
9mm ammo can be had in some pretty potent loadings and I hand load for range practice for a little over half of new cost.
Wallyworld often has Federal 115 gr on sale for a little over $10 a box.
Ruger LC9, SR9 and two P95`s.
The LC is very concealable, accurate and inexpensive .
The SR9 is a mid sized 17 shot 9MM that is very accurate and dependable and reasonably priced.
While bulky (IMHO) the P95 Ruger is the best value for cost of any semi I have shot and it just keeps on ticking like the
proverbial Timex watch.
9mm ammo can be had in some pretty potent loadings and I hand load for range practice for a little over half of new cost.
Wallyworld often has Federal 115 gr on sale for a little over $10 a box.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Factory block barrels are also not generally kind to cast bullets (or the other way around). Something about leading and guns firing while not fully in battery.
When I was shooting my G27(.40) with a lot of cast I bought an aftermarket barrel with traditional rifling because of the warnings by Glock Guys against lead in polygonal barrels...
When I was shooting my G27(.40) with a lot of cast I bought an aftermarket barrel with traditional rifling because of the warnings by Glock Guys against lead in polygonal barrels...
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
John,JohndeFresno wrote:Check the Internet. Bottom line, as mentioned - don't handload for a Glock; at least not the .40 SW or the .357 SIG, both of which are high pressure rounds. You will find some photos and videos (e.g. YouTube) of blown Glocks if you look hard enough.madman4570 wrote:Guys am I missing something??
Has their been a problem with Glocks as of late (blowing up)in the larger calibers ?
Glock's design does not allow for the cartridge to be fully enclosed.
Here is one for starters - a few Glocks among others:
http://www.google.com/search?q=glock+bl ... 24&bih=617
But there are several videos and postings, as well.
Here is a dumb question----
What do you mean when you say cartridge fully closed???
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I like 'em all and am not a brand snob. The only one I don't have much history with is 10mm and I just don't see me ever doing that due to recoil, of which I am not a fan.
I am leaning back towards 9mm however due to ammo capacity and the excellent heavy loadings available for it now. So much so that I may just burn up my .40 ammo (it'll take a while...) and then sell them off. I like my .45s however and am not parting with any of them.
Glocks? I only have one, the rather unique G36:
I like it and the lack of a grip or thumb safety works in this case because it's not a gun that gets unholstered much, but I don't have any other use for a Glock at this time.
I've never heard of one going boom with factory ammo though - it seems to be a reloads-issue.
Cheers,
Oly
I am leaning back towards 9mm however due to ammo capacity and the excellent heavy loadings available for it now. So much so that I may just burn up my .40 ammo (it'll take a while...) and then sell them off. I like my .45s however and am not parting with any of them.
Glocks? I only have one, the rather unique G36:
I like it and the lack of a grip or thumb safety works in this case because it's not a gun that gets unholstered much, but I don't have any other use for a Glock at this time.
Fully enclosed means around the case head - the way the round sits in the chamber. The bottom of the case is somewhat unsupported in .40 S&W Glocks due to the design and shape of the feed ramp etc. It's probably an issue in some other arms as well, but in the case of Glocks it seems to be of particular concern.John,
Here is a dumb question----
What do you mean when you say cartridge fully closed???
I've never heard of one going boom with factory ammo though - it seems to be a reloads-issue.
Cheers,
Oly
Cheers,
Oly
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Oly
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
1911 in .45, browning hp in 9mm. Kind of a toss up between the two for me.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Two Colts, first year Officers model and a Combat Gov. model.
Two SA`s, a fully loaded with Crimson sight and a SA- XD
All 45
Two SA`s, a fully loaded with Crimson sight and a SA- XD
All 45
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Always consult an expert first.
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God Bless America.
Disclaimer, not responsible for anyone copying or building anything i make.
Always consult an expert first.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
The question was "Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol" not "which is best for the money" or "which is best for duty" or "which is best in the event of TEOTWAWKI", hence my opinion... I am not a "brand snob", am don't care what the ammo costs, I simply prefer the Colt 1911 and derivatives in .45 ACP. I have others.
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
So BigSky56 does not feel alone.
I have a FEG (Hungarian clone of the hipower) all tricked out.
I would not feel inadequate if this were all I had when social skills were called for.
I have a FEG (Hungarian clone of the hipower) all tricked out.
I would not feel inadequate if this were all I had when social skills were called for.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Being in Illinois, everyday carry is not a possibility for me, so you all can judge this how you want. However I do have a Florida non-resident CCW and do carry when traveling out of state. Frankly i usually carry a J frame Smith with +P .38s. I also like the Ruger LCP in .380 when nothing larger can be managed, mine has been 100% in nearly 500rds.
But what lays on the nightstand and what I would carry if I could is a 1911 in .45, my preference is Colt however when I go for a walk in the woods, I often slip a Kimber Pro CDP in the belt. Mine will shoot into 2" @ 25yds if I do my part and has proven itself reliable.
Glocks don't do it for me, maybe to many years of revolvers and 1911s, but Glocks always naturally point way high for me. I've shot them some and that grip angle is just wrong for me.
I've also shot and been impressed by the Springfield XD, and the new Ruger LC9 interests me some if we ever get concealed carry in Illinois.
But what lays on the nightstand and what I would carry if I could is a 1911 in .45, my preference is Colt however when I go for a walk in the woods, I often slip a Kimber Pro CDP in the belt. Mine will shoot into 2" @ 25yds if I do my part and has proven itself reliable.
Glocks don't do it for me, maybe to many years of revolvers and 1911s, but Glocks always naturally point way high for me. I've shot them some and that grip angle is just wrong for me.
I've also shot and been impressed by the Springfield XD, and the new Ruger LC9 interests me some if we ever get concealed carry in Illinois.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Wow - several pages in this thread in a couple days - on a LEVERGUN forum, no less...
Unless you have short fingers or fat hands, try a double-stack .45 ACP in a 1911 format.
Unless you have short fingers or fat hands, try a double-stack .45 ACP in a 1911 format.
- 1911 format - ultra reliable, 'generic' parts and upgrades, and - they just WORK
.45 ACP - again - it just WORKS- 10mm not needed for humans, .40 less power and what gain? 9mm gotta have ideal ammo for decent effect
- to me, it avoids the 'deck of cards' feeling of the single-stack grip
why stick with 7 or 8 rounds if you can have 14 or 15...?
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"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Madman, What Oly said!olyinaz wrote:Fully enclosed means around the case head - the way the round sits in the chamber. The bottom of the case is somewhat unsupported in .40 S&W Glocks due to the design and shape of the feed ramp etc. It's probably an issue in some other arms as well, but in the case of Glocks it seems to be of particular concern.John,
Here is a dumb question----
What do you mean when you say cartridge fully closed???
I've never heard of one going boom with factory ammo though - it seems to be a reloads-issue.
Cheers,
Oly
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
My statement comes from firing the gun before I knew that Col. Cooper put it into print. During qualification, we had various drills where we had to shoot, for instance, three shots and holster; three shots and holster. Or two to the chest and one to the head (slow down an attacker, then make the head shot if he has a bullet resistant vest).GoatGuy wrote:Yeah, I've read that argument, originally in Col. Cooper's writings in his continuous support of the 1911 platform (I believe he referred to it as the solution to a problem that didn't exist) and then picked up by others in print and at the counters of the LGS as time went by.JohndeFresno wrote:
I liked those SA/DA Smiths...The only drawback to DA/SA is that you have a different grip and trigger pull for the first shot than you do for follow-ups; so you need to be aware of that and make adjustments. Due to this difference, many departments (including one I was with) eventually went with the Glock. However, in a self-defense situation at correspondingly short range, that grip difference between first and second shot does not amount to much, as long as you practice with some triple shot drills.
At short distances and with the large target of body mass, there is no problem. But in refining one's trips (triple shot rapid strings), it was very difficult to drop all three rounds into the same place; the first shot is a bit wild because of the longer bull. Then, you don't spin your hand around the grip or anything that dramatic for the next shot, but there is different pressure against the right side of the grip with a double action pull than there is when you are using the tip of your finger to pull straight back on a single action trigger - "press" the trigger straight back as we were taught. Your grip pressure and duration of trigger pull are not consistent, so your "grip" is not consistent.
With shots demanding more critical placement, such as defensive firing where there may be other bystanders, it can become somewhat problematic, especially when the adrenaline is pumping as you are trying to return accurate, aimed fire using two different methods. If you look at a range training chart, you can see that if your hold places too much pressure in one area of the gun, you print your rounds high right, or high left, or low right... etc. Your pressure changes from the DA "grip" to the SA "grip." I could show you at any range if we were close; I remember my groups. Without constant practice, I would have fliers. It has nothing do to with whether Jeff Cooper wrote something in a magazine or not. Rather, it is a reality that he correctly observed from a wealth of observation and experience, and therefore reported.
Having said all that, at 7 1/2 yards and shooting at middle body mass, it probably doesn't matter. But there is a problem with consistency when you extend the range of such an encounter, unless you prepare the gun so that the first shot is also SA.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
My choice of handgun is usually a sixgun but when it comes to autoloaders the Lightweight Commander with good sights (in 45 ACP of course) is my choice. It's the only centerfire autoloader I've ever really felt comfortable with and through thousands of rounds I've had no problems except when I tried to get target loads too light. While I would prefer my Model 58 or 2.5" Model 19 I would be okay with the old Commander if a sixgun was out of the picture.
Eric
Eric
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I have a Kel Tec P3AT for when I cannot conceal something bigger, and with the self defence rounds from Grizzly, I don't feel undergunned for most close range interpersonal crisis situations. For anything more, I have a S&W model 99 compact in .40 that is a great pistol. My daughter has a Kahr CW9, but does not yet have her concealed carry license, and she is a college student, so it stays home. The Kahr is a really nice gun. I don't have any Glocks as I just don't like the way they point somewhere off in the general direction of lobbing rounds into the next grid square for me. No matter how reliable a firearm is, if it doesn't fit, it is not what I will choose. PillHer is happy with her XD sub compact. Now, if I could carry it and not have it print, I would be carrying my RIA 1911 in .45ACP.
D. Brian Casady
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
olyinaz wrote:I like 'em all and am not a brand snob. The only one I don't have much history with is 10mm and I just don't see me ever doing that due to recoil, of which I am not a fan.
I am leaning back towards 9mm however due to ammo capacity and the excellent heavy loadings available for it now. So much so that I may just burn up my .40 ammo (it'll take a while...) and then sell them off. I like my .45s however and am not parting with any of them.
Glocks? I only have one, the rather unique G36:
I like it and the lack of a grip or thumb safety works in this case because it's not a gun that gets unholstered much, but I don't have any other use for a Glock at this time.
Fully enclosed means around the case head - the way the round sits in the chamber. The bottom of the case is somewhat unsupported in .40 S&W Glocks due to the design and shape of the feed ramp etc. It's probably an issue in some other arms as well, but in the case of Glocks it seems to be of particular concern.John,
Here is a dumb question----
What do you mean when you say cartridge fully closed???
I've never heard of one going boom with factory ammo though - it seems to be a reloads-issue.
Cheers,
Oly
Ok, yep, I was thinking that it was something like that but wanted to be sure!
Thanks!
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I have several Glocks and feel they're great weapons, but prefer a DA/SA with no manual safety for all around use. My Sig 9mm's are probably my current favorites.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Wow. This is one of those "depends" questions.
No, not the adult diaper - the situtuation.
For carry, I prefer a smallish single-stack auto. My personal choices are both 9mm but could just as easily be 40 S&W - at least one could. The Kahr 9 is a great carry piece. Mine is older and electroless nickeled steel. The trigger is outstanding as-is the accuracy. Reliability is 100%. Another that I carry most of the time now is a Keltec PF9. I carry this because of its light weight and slim profile. This one holds 7 rounds in the mag.
For home defense... not for concealed carry, I say go with 45 ACP or 10mm - you're choice. The 45 isn't as loud... but the 10mm holds more rounds in a high capacity rig.
Here's one of my choices: Glock 20SF (10mm):
This is a gen 3 and has the rail for a tac light. I like the light for home defense. The light points right at where the round goes, so it can be used like a "gross" laser sight in close quarters and has the added benefit of blinding the bad guy.
The 10mm round is basically a 40 caliber round with .357 Mag "heavy" terminal ballistics - your hp rounds will expand very reliably and you will get very good penetration.
But I say, choose what feels right to you - that fits your situaiton the best.
No, not the adult diaper - the situtuation.
For carry, I prefer a smallish single-stack auto. My personal choices are both 9mm but could just as easily be 40 S&W - at least one could. The Kahr 9 is a great carry piece. Mine is older and electroless nickeled steel. The trigger is outstanding as-is the accuracy. Reliability is 100%. Another that I carry most of the time now is a Keltec PF9. I carry this because of its light weight and slim profile. This one holds 7 rounds in the mag.
For home defense... not for concealed carry, I say go with 45 ACP or 10mm - you're choice. The 45 isn't as loud... but the 10mm holds more rounds in a high capacity rig.
Here's one of my choices: Glock 20SF (10mm):
This is a gen 3 and has the rail for a tac light. I like the light for home defense. The light points right at where the round goes, so it can be used like a "gross" laser sight in close quarters and has the added benefit of blinding the bad guy.
The 10mm round is basically a 40 caliber round with .357 Mag "heavy" terminal ballistics - your hp rounds will expand very reliably and you will get very good penetration.
But I say, choose what feels right to you - that fits your situaiton the best.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I've had a .40 Daewoo with its slick "tri action" for years. Sweet piece. My only "complaint" is a bit girthy grip--for its modest (10 or 11) capacity for my small-ish hands. Not bad but not ideal. Though I realize the 9mm loadings have advanced, narrowing the gap, a good .40 still trumps a good 9 IMO. So, of the newer crop (to me, which means anything last 15 years!) the S&W M&P40c and similar Ruger SR40c--or their 9c companions were I to jump to the dark side --kinda speak to me. Lotsa firepower in a compact package.
I realize the popular Block's reputation and goodness, but grip/ergo's/aiming don't do it for me--as much as I try to like, after spending some time with several models the closest I can get is feeling luke warm about them. Of the traditional "classic" autos, just about any HP or single stack 1911 are about perfect for me. I've loved the "original" CZs (naturally morphed from the HP design) from the get go, but their longish pull (again for me) has kept me from biting. The newer-gen designs evolved from that original platform seem to be better in that initial pull department.
I realize the popular Block's reputation and goodness, but grip/ergo's/aiming don't do it for me--as much as I try to like, after spending some time with several models the closest I can get is feeling luke warm about them. Of the traditional "classic" autos, just about any HP or single stack 1911 are about perfect for me. I've loved the "original" CZs (naturally morphed from the HP design) from the get go, but their longish pull (again for me) has kept me from biting. The newer-gen designs evolved from that original platform seem to be better in that initial pull department.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Most of my life has been spent with revolvers, both single and double action, so when I decided to branch out to the auto side I found the Glock to be the most natural due to the lack of extraneous safeties. Simple, reliable, fits me very well, and the stock sights are the easiest for me to see and use. I have a couple of Model 22s (40S&W) but have been real tempted to pick up a 9mm as well.
Well done is better than well said.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I'm pretty satisfied with my choices: Colt 1911, 45acp (my workhorse); Kimber commander sized 1911, 45acp (carry); KelTec .380 ( pocket carry ); Springfield XD, 9mm ( for my wife if I'm away).
However, if I lived on the border we'd be talking high caps all the way.
However, if I lived on the border we'd be talking high caps all the way.
- 2ndovc
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Grew up shooting a lot of ammo through 1911s. They will always be my favorite.
That being said when I was hooked on IDPA matches I started looking at all the
time and money I was spending on reloading .45 ACPs not to mention
putting a lot of wear and tear on my pistol that I'd already spent
a bunch of money on. At the time a case of 9mm was less than $100!
I liked the Springfield XDs but went with a pair of Glocks, a G 19 and G 26 in 9mm.
My thoughts were that I could get parts and mags just about anywhere.
I've put thousands of rounds through the G19 with one single stoppage with a Blazer
case and that was mainly because I was screwing around firing from odd positions like we did in IDPA.
The empty case ended back up in the ejection port backwards. I think it bounced off a tree limb.
Now it spends most of it's time on my nightstand with a light on the rail.
I switch back and forth for my carry gun between the G 26 and my little
Sig P238/ .380 depending on what i'm doing or where i'm going.
But if I could pick just one it would be the G 19 and I'd spend some time on
the best way to carry it for me.
Forgot to mention that my IDPA scores went up switiching to the 9mm Glock. Just faster for me.
jb
That being said when I was hooked on IDPA matches I started looking at all the
time and money I was spending on reloading .45 ACPs not to mention
putting a lot of wear and tear on my pistol that I'd already spent
a bunch of money on. At the time a case of 9mm was less than $100!
I liked the Springfield XDs but went with a pair of Glocks, a G 19 and G 26 in 9mm.
My thoughts were that I could get parts and mags just about anywhere.
I've put thousands of rounds through the G19 with one single stoppage with a Blazer
case and that was mainly because I was screwing around firing from odd positions like we did in IDPA.
The empty case ended back up in the ejection port backwards. I think it bounced off a tree limb.
Now it spends most of it's time on my nightstand with a light on the rail.
I switch back and forth for my carry gun between the G 26 and my little
Sig P238/ .380 depending on what i'm doing or where i'm going.
But if I could pick just one it would be the G 19 and I'd spend some time on
the best way to carry it for me.
Forgot to mention that my IDPA scores went up switiching to the 9mm Glock. Just faster for me.
jb
jasonB " Another Dirty Yankee"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
After messing with many other makes and types, I've come back to the 1911 platform. I can make myself work with just about anything I've tried and some of the other choices make much better logical sense, but in the end, it just seems the 1911 fits me best. Not just physically (although I find it points more naturally than lots of others), or in making me feel better about carrying it (manual and grip safety, one good trigger pull all the time), but also in terms of aesthetics. If I'm going to spend this much time closely associated with something of my own volition, I'd prefer it to be something I'm pleased with the looks and feel of and I won't begrudge it a little extra care if that's what it takes. Kind of like with the Mrs.
Or maybe our leverguns...
Or maybe our leverguns...
Molasses
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Agreed.JohndeFresno wrote:My statement comes from firing the gun before I knew that Col. Cooper put it into print. During qualification, we had various drills where we had to shoot, for instance, three shots and holster; three shots and holster. Or two to the chest and one to the head (slow down an attacker, then make the head shot if he has a bullet resistant vest).GoatGuy wrote:Yeah, I've read that argument, originally in Col. Cooper's writings in his continuous support of the 1911 platform (I believe he referred to it as the solution to a problem that didn't exist) and then picked up by others in print and at the counters of the LGS as time went by.JohndeFresno wrote:
I liked those SA/DA Smiths...The only drawback to DA/SA is that you have a different grip and trigger pull for the first shot than you do for follow-ups; so you need to be aware of that and make adjustments. Due to this difference, many departments (including one I was with) eventually went with the Glock. However, in a self-defense situation at correspondingly short range, that grip difference between first and second shot does not amount to much, as long as you practice with some triple shot drills.
At short distances and with the large target of body mass, there is no problem. But in refining one's trips (triple shot rapid strings), it was very difficult to drop all three rounds into the same place; the first shot is a bit wild because of the longer bull. Then, you don't spin your hand around the grip or anything that dramatic for the next shot, but there is different pressure against the right side of the grip with a double action pull than there is when you are using the tip of your finger to pull straight back on a single action trigger - "press" the trigger straight back as we were taught. Your grip pressure and duration of trigger pull are not consistent, so your "grip" is not consistent.
With shots demanding more critical placement, such as defensive firing where there may be other bystanders, it can become somewhat problematic, especially when the adrenaline is pumping as you are trying to return accurate, aimed fire using two different methods. If you look at a range training chart, you can see that if your hold places too much pressure in one area of the gun, you print your rounds high right, or high left, or low right... etc. Your pressure changes from the DA "grip" to the SA "grip." I could show you at any range if we were close; I remember my groups. Without constant practice, I would have fliers. It has nothing do to with whether Jeff Cooper wrote something in a magazine or not. Rather, it is a reality that he correctly observed from a wealth of observation and experience, and therefore reported.
Having said all that, at 7 1/2 yards and shooting at middle body mass, it probably doesn't matter. But there is a problem with consistency when you extend the range of such an encounter, unless you prepare the gun so that the first shot is also SA.
I still carry my Beretta sometimes & will carry my 39S&W once I get its issues worked out. I couldnt overcome the differences in the first & subsequent shots to my satisfaction. Concentrating hard its fairly easy, but just picking up the gun & shooting its not. So I just carry them both with the saftey in the fire position and the hammer down on a hot chamber. Both have decockers & neither will fire if the triggers not squeezed and I find thumbing back the hammer as I draw second nature so thats how I taught myself to do it.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Glock 23 in 40S&W. Perfect combination of power, conceal-ability and shoot-ability.
RustyJr
RustyJr
Life is a storm, my young friend. You will bask in the sunlight one moment, be shattered on the rocks the next. What makes you a man is what you do when that storm comes.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I'd trust my life with a Glock, but I just can't warm up to their looks or the way they feel in my hand, although the Gen 4's seem a bit more promising with the ergonomics. They feel much better in my hand, but I haven't had a chance to shoot one yet.
If I have reliability issues with my new carry piece I will seriously look into a Glock, but I much prefer a Springfield XDM as far as feel goes, and even looks, although that is last on the list when your life is on the line.
If I have reliability issues with my new carry piece I will seriously look into a Glock, but I much prefer a Springfield XDM as far as feel goes, and even looks, although that is last on the list when your life is on the line.
"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen" - Samuel Adams
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
I shoot'em both every week and alternate them for carry -
But - just can't make up my mind which I like best -
But - just can't make up my mind which I like best -
OJ KING
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- Rube Burrows
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
The gun I carry most is the Glock 19 and the Glock 22 or 31 which can be switched from .40 to .357sig. The .40 is a pleasure to shoot while the .357sig is a heck of a caliber with good ballistics.
The G19 is easier to conceal and goes with me more places but my G22 has about 20k rounds through it now with no breakages. Its a generation 2 and was carried by my father when he was on duty. Many of those rounds came from qualifying and practice.
The G19 is easier to conceal and goes with me more places but my G22 has about 20k rounds through it now with no breakages. Its a generation 2 and was carried by my father when he was on duty. Many of those rounds came from qualifying and practice.
- Streetstar
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Mine too, but i have predominately switched to Glock too for pretty much constant sd use also. mine is the 20 in 10mm.Charles wrote:My emotional choice would always be the grand 1911 pistol in 45 ACP.g .
almost as often i am carrying a 357 wheelgun though
----- Doug
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
have a lot, really like glock , sig, and HK, and the keltec P3at 380,
but.......the one go to for me is glock 30
and if i couldnt have it then my HK P7M10 in 40
but.......the one go to for me is glock 30
and if i couldnt have it then my HK P7M10 in 40
Last edited by hfcable on Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
cable
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
How about a Desert Eagle in .44 Magnum...
Better yet, if you wear bulky clothing - a Calico 9mm with 100-round helical magazine...!
Better yet, if you wear bulky clothing - a Calico 9mm with 100-round helical magazine...!
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
At the present, Glock 21 in 45 acp. However, I feel a 1911 format urge coming on strong. Fits my hand better and a better natural pointer.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
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"From birth 'til death...we travel between the eternities." -- Print Ritter in Broken Trail
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
Like my .32 long load., anytime you get near doubling the primary, you are doing things correctly.
Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
alnitak-
Cool chart, but I wonder what they are shooting them out of. Assuming those are factory loads (recognize the slug), from winchesters ranger T-series the 230gr.HP .45 clocks at 950+ft/sec. in my kimber.
My choice is for auto loaders.
#1 1911 for a real gun
#2 springfield xd for plastic guns
Glocks never have agreed with me. I can't shoot them for some reason, we just don't get along.
Cool chart, but I wonder what they are shooting them out of. Assuming those are factory loads (recognize the slug), from winchesters ranger T-series the 230gr.HP .45 clocks at 950+ft/sec. in my kimber.
My choice is for auto loaders.
#1 1911 for a real gun
#2 springfield xd for plastic guns
Glocks never have agreed with me. I can't shoot them for some reason, we just don't get along.
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Re: Which one do you like in a semiauto pistol
well, depends on whether your shooting is for a game [ competition] in which case the 1911 is great, or real life, dependability.....if so stick with the glock 21 or the 30redhawk wrote:At the present, Glock 21 in 45 acp. However, I feel a 1911 format urge coming on strong. Fits my hand better and a better natural pointer.
those are my two go to choices if i am betting my life.
cable