Rossi Puma jam

[mran1126]

How far would I have to break down my Rossi to get a jammed receiver fixed. Pretty sure a cartridge slipped by the cartridge stop. Had five cartridges in it. Fired first one. All jammed up. Can't open the bolt. Everything is jammed tight. Just wondered how far it might need to be taken apart to get access to the jammed cartridges. It's done this before and I've taken it to a gunsmith to fix it. He couldn't see anything really wrong to cause it. But after this 3rd time, I'm getting tired of paying to just get it unjammed. I have Steve's video but have never tried to take the gun apart and not sure how it would be with it locked up like it is now. Anyway....any tips or advice would be welcome. Thanks.

[Lefty Dude]

Are ya shootin hand loads or factory ?

[mran1126]

Hand loads. But it might go through 2 boxes before it jams. This is a .357. I also have a Braztch .44 mag. All handloads and it has never had any kind of problem..

[AJMD429]

A few suggestions:

1. (you probably already know) - never FORCE anything, especially after a gun jams (I learned that the hard way... )

2. Post more specifics on type of ammo, bullet profile, etc. PICTURES would help alot.

3. If at all possible, pictures of the gun once 'jammed' might help, if the action is open at all.

4. NKJ or someone more knowledgeable will likely post before long, and may have an answer.

In the meantime, the Rossi manual might offer disassembly instructions, but if not, there are such on-line here on the forum somewhere, and on other sites. Just be sure that you're not working with a gun that has a CHAMBERED live round, or if it does, I'd put it in a vice pointed at a safe backstop during ALL the disassembly process. EVEN a non-chambered round can detonate if the primer is smashed by a loose or out-of-line part, but isn't as lethal (or predictable/limited in trajectory) as a chambered round.

The NKJ "Rossi Video" he offers for sale is helpful with disassembly and so on, and you might want to obtain a copy. I've done alot of kitchen-table gunsmithing, and am good at getting things apart, but not always back together quite as smoothly. The DVD helped me there, plus even helped me take it apart 'better' by doing it in the right order.

[Pete44ru]

I would confirm that the bolt's lever pin stop screw (the large-head screw, mid/upper LH side) is fully bottomed in it's left receiver wall hole, preventing the lever pin from partially working it's way out of the bolt to the left, catching on an interior receiver recess, stopping bolt travel.

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[AJMD429]

I would confirm that the bolt's lever pin stop screw (the large-head screw, mid/upper LH side) is fully bottomed in it's left receiver wall hole, preventing the lever pin from partially working it's way out of the bolt to the left, catching on an interior receiver recess, stopping bolt travel.

Real good idea. One of mine had problems with that screw, only it was too long, and when I tightened it, it actually bound on the side of the bolt.

Removing that screw and drifting the pin which it covers (the pin goes through the bolt and anchors the lever to it) 'in' a bit further (or drifting it the other way, through the tiny access hole on the RH side of the receiver) might just make a difference.

[COSteve]

I would confirm that the bolt's lever pin stop screw (the large-head screw, mid/upper LH side) is fully bottomed in it's left receiver wall hole, preventing the lever pin from partially working it's way out of the bolt to the left, catching on an interior receiver recess, stopping bolt travel.

Real good idea. One of mine had problems with that screw, only it was too long, and when I tightened it, it actually bound on the side of the bolt.

Removing that screw and drifting the pin which it covers (the pin goes through the bolt and anchors the lever to it) 'in' a bit further (or drifting it the other way, through the tiny access hole on the RH side of the receiver) might just make a difference.

The problem with that is that if the bolt is jammed, he won't be able to move the lever and bolt so that the Bolt Lever Pin lines up with the access hole.

[pokey]

pull the mag plug up front, and dump ammo out.
try and work any in action forward.

after that the situation will need reevaluation.
still stuck, partial movement,etc.

good luck.

call your gunsmith and ask what he did last time?

[Griff]

pull the mag plug up front, and dump ammo out.

Yep, 1st things 1st.

...call your gunsmith and ask what he did last time?

Don't bother,if this is the 3rd time he's "unjammed" it for you, he didn't do anything except generate a bill.

Many questions come to mind afore a diagnosis and fix can be recommended. Starting with, when you say "...locked up, won't open...", it that the bolt closed (forward), partially opened (& how far), or fully retracted?

Did the one round fired eject, or is that case still in the chamber?

Ammo? .357M or .38Spl? Cartridge OAL? Bullet shape/length?

Other questions will be needed after you answer those, but generally the Rossis jam in 1 of 2 ways; a 2nd cartridge slips by the cartridge stop, or, as said above the lever/bolt pin can move into the hole made for disassembly/assembly. Neither is terribly difficult to remedy.

[mran1126]

First round was fired....still in chamber. Locked up closed. .357 was the cartridge. I did dump out the loose cartidges, so there is a fired one in the chamber and probably the second one is jammed under the carrier. I went through almost a whole box before this happened......Pretty sure it's a cartridge that slipped past the cartridge stop. The last time he looked at everything and couldn't see anything obviously wrong. And it is an intermitant problem. I have seen a cartridge slip past the stop before, but was able to catch it before I closed the bolt and just pushed it back behind the cartridge stop. Question is...what cases them to slip past the stop? And only once in a while? Thanks for your replies.

[mran1126]

And, Griff, if it is the cartridge stop, what is the fix? I have the same rifle in a .44 mag and it works flawlessly. I wish this .357 was as reliable. I read about a similar problem someone had like this.....intermittent cartridge stop problem. He just said he did some filing and tweaking to fix it.....but never said exactly what.

[J Miller]

mran1126,

I am not an X-spurt on the 92 design but I agree with Griff when he says forget the gunsmith you've been taking it too. He's seen this jam three times and hasn't fixed it. Strike three he's out.

Is the case jammed in the chamber? Somewhere else I read a thread about a jammed lever gun and the owner was told to use a thin blade screw driver to lift up the extractor and then open the action when it was off the case rim.

I do not know if that is the problem in your rifle but it might be something to try. If it IS the problem then either your loads are too hot or there is something amiss with the chamber.

Just an idea ....

Joe

[Griff]

The "fix" is to 1st check that thhe cartridge stop spring is installed correctly. It is held in place by the left cartridge guide screw. The lip of the spring should be "under" the rear edge of the stop, arch inward, when tightenned, this pushes the leading edge of the stop toward the center of the magazine. The carrier, when lowered will push it out the way and allow a cartridge to run back onto the carrier. That cartridge acts as the stop so no addittional; cartridges try to exit the tube. This is why overal carttridge length is important on these and most other leverguns.

If the spring is installed right, then a small bead of hardface material can be welded to the upper "curve" in the stop and then reshaped back down to just allow a cartridge to slip past when the carrier is down. This can be fairly easy to accomplish by using harden steel, or by just weld rod and then quenching it to harden it after it's final shape and dimension is determined.

However, if you've got all the previous cartridges out, and the action still won't open, it sounds as though your bolt/lever pin stop screw is too short. This allows that pin to slip to the left side and move into the gap in the left rail and hang the bolt up right there. If it is, no problems, just remove the screw, drive the pin the rest of the way out (there's a small hole on the right side of the receiver to accomplish this). Then, you can remove the bolt and that empty from the chamber. Then it's a small matter to make that screw a tad longer and re-install.

If one of THOSE two fixes don't fix it... well, something's being left out! Let us know.

[mran1126]

Thanks Griff. I think the cartridge stop is the right track. Not all the cartidges are out....just the loose ones that I could dump out. I don't think the pin is the problem. I have seen cartridges try to slip by the stop, but I have seen them in time to push them back. So I think it is the stop that needs adjusting. Thanks for your " fix" information.

[Griff]

If you can gget the bolt closed and the lever up against the lower tang, the bolt/lever pin will be aligned for easy removal. Then you can remoce the carrier and the left guide & stop. It'll just be "trial & error get the final shape needed. By the time you get right, you'll an expert at gettin' that left guide in & out! This is a perfect time to do those tune-up mods on Nate's DVD! You won't recognize the gun when you're done!