Rossi Pum .357 jams

[mran1126]

Just wondering what the most likely cause might be. Happened twice so far. First time gunsmith said he bent the cartridge stop a little. That lasted about 35 rounds. Happened again. 2nd gunsmith couldn't find anything obvious to fix. Told me he saw a big ding on the swc bullet. Told me to try more rounded or round nose bullets. Last time I had 5 rounds in the magazine. First one fired and ejected ok......2nd one fired ....but then it was jammed up. Any ideas as to the MOST LIKELY cause might be? Cartridge stop? Carrier problem? I've loaded up some round nose total metal jacketed bullets..I'll try them....but seems unlikely to me that just bullet shape would cause that problem. Thanks for any ideas.

[mran1126]

Sorry....Rossi Puma. I also have a Braztech .44 mag. Never a problem with it. Shoots everything smooth as butter.

[stickfred]

As to the correction of your problem, I can't help. Still waiting for Rossi to ship some rifles so that I can get the one I want. There are other posts regarding this very issue and using the Search may put you on the path. The one thing that I have learned is that Steve Young, Forum name Nate Kiowa Jones, is the '92 MAN. He's got a DVD he's got a DVD for sale on his site (I believe its stevesguns.com) that shows you how to take apart and reassemble your rifle and how to slick it up. If he doesn't post on your thread, you can call him and ask. He's a really nice guy and has shared much of his knowledge. Some Rossi's have a problem with SWC rounds and others are fine. From what I've read here, those with a problem can usually be made to work without too much effort. Hope you get it worked out and happy shooting.

[Jeff H]

..........First one fired and ejected ok......2nd one fired ....but then it was jammed up...........

If "jammed up" means the lever won't actuate far enough to eject the case in the chamber AND that you have to remove the magazine spring and follower to get the cartridges out and get things going again, then it could be related to the cartridge stop but you wouild then have to determine what's wrong with the cartridge stop or whethert something else is affecting it.

From what little you have described, it sounds like a cartridge from the mag. tube is slipping by the stop and getting under the carrier - preventing cycling the action. THAT could be caused by a number of things itself. This week, I ran into a situation where every one of five cartridges I had in the tube would slip by the stop. Turned out the rims were smaller in diameter than everything else I have shot in it to date. Of course, these things always happen in front of someone.

IF (big IF) cartridges are slipping by, it could be dirt, a burr or roughness hanging it up, the spring not correctly installed, weak, broken, etc., rim diameter, in need of some lube......... a combination of one or more of these things and others.

If you contact Steve, try to write down a detailed description of what is happening first. May save him having to ask a bunch of questions. I personally would be hesitant to hand a 92 over to just any gunsmith (good or not). There's a lot going on inside there. Steve happens to specialize in them and won't miss subtle but important things.

[86er]

I can't help diagnose the problem. Just for informational purposes, Griff has loaned a Puma 357 rifle to my boys. We've shot WFNGC hardcast bullets and everything under the sun and it works properly. I don't know if anything was tweaked on this rifle. What I do know is that they can work correctly. Best of luck resolving the issue.

[Jeff H]

......We've shot WFNGC hardcast bullets and everything under the sun and it works properly. I don't know if anything was tweaked on this rifle............

I still suspect that a recent run of '92s from Braztech specifically was rushed through the factory. Mine had about every concievable "issue" to deal with and it took some time to sort everything out. I may not be done yet. but it runs pretty good at the moment. This one took some slow, careful and deliberate study and observation to sort it all out. Not as simple as a Mauser or Ruger SA inside.

I got mine from Robertson Trading Post and I believe that on their site or one of the others I saw when I was shopping stated that the price was what it was ($399 or $419, I think) because Braztech was waging war against another maker who jumped into the game. That is, I believe, speculation on their part and second hand info on mine, but it sure did seem possible as I worked my way through the issues with mine.

WONDERFUL little gun now and it would not have taken as long to sort out had it not been the forst of these I have worked on. I was intent on understanding how it worked and I still prbably don't know half of it, but it has been a fun experience even though I seem to be complaining about it.

You can learn a lot about them by reassembling it withouit the loading gate and watching how dummies work their way through the system. You can't see it all but it makes a big difference.

[mran1126]

Thanks for your advice. The thing is.......this gun worked fine for two summers of shooting........then the problem started. And I shot several bullet shapes through it. And Yes.....it is totally locked up when this happens and needs to be taken apart to get all the rounds out. Couldn't open the action at all. I'll try some round nose metal jacketed rounds and see what happens. I just think that if it worked fine for that long ..and then a problem started......must be something that got out of normal working order. Not just bullet shape.

[Jeff H]

....he thing is.......this gun worked fine for two summers of shooting........then the problem started......

Yours is not the vintage mine is then so probably not one of the many issues I had.
Possibly, it's a difference in the ammo - are you shooting the same ammo?
If the case rims are smaller, you could be running into what I did the other day.
My guess is that my cartridge stop is marginally long enough for most ammo but misses others.

It could be gunk built up and not letting the stop actualte fully, bent part, weakend spring, misaligned spring.........

What is odd though, is that there is no chance for a cartidge to get UNDER the carrier after you have chambered a round.
The carrier is UP when the bolt is back and down when the bolt is in battery.
One could get under the carrier when it is UP and then yiou wouldn't be able to CLOSE the action, but you can't OPEN it.
If one slips the stop and you have one on the carrier plus the back end of another, maybe......?
That seems less likely with .357s than .38s.

Like the others said - hard to sort out without seeing it, but maybe the rambling will knock something loose in your observations.

[mran1126]

Thanks, Jeff. Yes....mine jammed after a fired round..couldn't open it to eject the fired one....locked up closed. I'll try to observe things more closely when I try some different bullets......and the ones that jammed were .38's. Just strange that it started after so long a time.......must have had 10 boxes of both .38's and .357's through it over the 2 summers. But I"ll watch closely on my next shooting trip..

[Jeff H]

Steve will be able to do you the most good, but so far it sounds like one of the rounds in the tube jumps the stop. Since the .38s are shorter, the one on the carrier will leave room for the errant round to stick part way out of the tube and over the carrier. The bolt should still be able to come back though because the carrier does not rise until the lever is at it's furthest point of travel forward. If you can't even get the lever to throw/bolt to open, something else may be at play.

When mine did what I described above, the lever worked and the bolt would come back but was stopped dead when the tip on the front of the lever hit the bottom of the carrier. Then, I had to use a stick to push a cartridge back into the magazine and then twist it to flip the nose of the one on the carrier up so I could wiggle it out between the slots in the guides. Real PITA.

[Slick]

Remove the stock and take a look at the recoil spring guide and see if it looks like this~>



After getting this fixed and following the slick-up instructions, my "1892 on the cheap" runs perfect..

[mran1126]

I compared my .44 mag carrier stop to my .357 carrier stop....the .44 mag is completely flat until it meets the small stop at the back.......but my .357 carrier has a little rise on the left side where it meets the stop at the back. Just wondering if that was normal for the smaller case or not. It seems it would push the case toward the loading gate side a little. Just didn't knoiw if it was supposed to have that difference for the different cartridge sizes or not. Still looking for something that might cause that jam problem.

[J Miller]

mran1126,

Just a question; with all the disassembling to clear the jams, have you removed the cartridge stop and cleaned it and the area behind it. Also have you cleaned basically everything?

If it worked for a couple years and suddenly isn't working with the same ammo, then something mechanical has changed, or there is debris stopping something from doing what it's supposed to.

Joe

[Griff]

Joe,

Yes, that 1892 has been slicked up by yours truly... glad to hear it's behaved itself.

mran1126,

Pictures... pictures. But, I'd venture a guess that your left guide rail is loose, and/or the cartridge stop spring is broke or installed "off". Often, the top of the cartridge stop gets a little worn and needs a little build up. That's assuming a cartridge is slipping pat the stop.