Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.
Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Well I guess I'm one of the prophets of doom, but I prefer the term "realistic"
Perhaps my view is skewed by geography, but I was raised and surrounded by folks who constantly thought of others. They were the generation born 1900-20 in Texas and Oklahoma...farming folk. They would show up on your doorstep to help you with whatever you needed, with the correct set of tools in hand. They would "set a spell" with you because they knew you needed it. Not just once for the church members to see either but because they wanted to serve the Lord Himself with their lives. I don't see much of anything that mimics this today where I'm standing from society at large. Still happens, but much rarer to me. Perhaps I see only what I want to see, but self centeredness, aggression, rudeness and people interested in "their kind" seem very prevelant in my daily circles. Not all of course and I have to say that I too see a lot of promise in the younger generation. Though there is nothing new under the sun, I see an increase in the frequency and severity of crime, porn, the absense of Dads and breakdown of the family, the abuse of children, drugs(it would be hard to even compare the generations)... and so on. Many of these folks are proud to do what they do, whereas before they would have held their head down and perhaps would have even faced retribution for their actions. Something is rotten in Denmark and I believe in facing it. Am I gonna go whine for the past and the good old days? No way, but I do hope to learn from the good and the bad of the past. And yes, even some of us doomsdayers can have a bright hope for the future. I am going to be realistic at the same time though and be prepared for these societal changes. Katrina should show us to be prepared for this "new man" that is emerging, when the stuff hits the fan that is. The new man often has no moral compass but his own instinct to fulfill his/her own needs. So overall I'm thankful for the good folks out there fighting the good fight....hopeful about the future, but REALISTIC about the alternatives that may present themselves.
Last edited by C. Cash on Sat Jan 26, 2008 9:04 pm, edited 7 times in total.
But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Romans 5:8
It isn't all 'doom and gloom' - look what I found on a COLLEGE PROFESSOR'S website, regarding functions of government - HE gets it, and perhaps some of HIS students will get it. After all, WE get it...!
Now, one university course I teach is introduction to political science. Each semester I will review several possible introductory texts (the best measure of the discipline) for the course. I often just shake my head at what I find. Given the democide totaled in table 1.2 the concepts and views promoted in these texts appear grossly unrealistic. They just do not fit or explain, or are even contradictory to the existence of a Hell-State like Pol Pot's Cambodia, a Gulag-State like Stalin's Soviet Union, or a Genocide-State like Hitler's Germany.
For instance, one textbook I recently read spends a chapter on describing the functions of government. Among these were law and order, individual security, cultural maintenance, and social welfare. Political scientists are still writing this stuff, when we have numerous examples of governments that kill hundreds of thousands and even millions of their own citizens, enslave the rest, and abolish traditional culture (it took only about a year for the Khmer Rouge to completely suppress Buddhism, which had been the heart and soul of Cambodian culture). A systems approach to politics still dominates the field. Through this lens politics is a matter of inputs and outputs, of citizen inputs, aggregation by political parties, government determining policy, and bureaucracies implementing it. Then there is the common and fundamental justification of government that it exists to protect citizens against the anarchic jungle that would otherwise threaten their lives and property. Such archaic or sterile views show no appreciation of democide's existence and all its related horrors and suffering. They are inconsistent with a regime that stands astride society like a gang of thugs over hikers they have captured in the woods, robbing all, raping some, torturing others for fun, murdering those they don't like, and terrorizing the rest into servile obedience. This exact characterization of many past and present governments, such as Idi Amin's Uganda, hardly squares with conventional political science.
And yes, I DO see lots of young people who understand the Big Picture of the world. Four of them are MINE! Kind people, Intelligent people, Spiritual people, Honest people. Just too darn many of the other kind running things lately.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws "first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
I heard them & their peers express concerns that this country started going downhill as result of the influx of eastern & southern European immigrants, the meddling of the US in European affairs in 1917, & giving Blacks & women the right to vote. They were also leery of what was on TV & that Christianity was slowly being displaced.
I think it all started with the hippies. I believe that their ideas are mostly what is wrong with our country. All the "make love not war" junk, and the drugs, and free love, and acceptance of other beliefs. I think that tolerance is ok, but now the gov is trying to make you accept others beliefs as if they are as valid as your own, which is wrong. It took a while, probably till the 80's or early 90's for the hippies' ideas to fully catch on, but once they did, it was all downhill fast from there.
"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen" - Samuel Adams
FWiedner wrote:I believe that our current state of degeneration can be attributed directly to unintended consequences of the civil-rights movement of the 1960's, and to the generation of political activists who were adolescents at that time gaining power in government.
Good intentions without thoughtful regulation have caused terrible damage to our society.
Sir, for once I agree with you. When the civil rights of one group became more important than the civil rights of another, the skids were greased. When Ms. Ohare got God booted from the schools, the brakes got loose and the downward spiral began. I experienced this first hand as a child. Now that most of the basic needs of existence are met with little to no effort, Maslow's Hierchy of Needs has been rotated 180 degrees and it is all about self-actualization. One cannot excel, lest he make someone else feel bad about themselves. I train many young folk for the military. You would be shocked at the total lack of knowledge they display about history, math, etc. C'mon, how hard is it to load 6 rounds in a magazine. Routinely, we have to stop training to add rounds or take them out. It seems school is just daycare for the most part. Not to mention many of the male students cannot retract the slide on the M9 Beretta and lock it open, nor take the nut loose that holds the M500 Mossberg shotgun for disassembly and cleaning. 90% of the females just can't do either.
Hobie wrote:
Don't worry guys, everything is cyclical. Pretty soon things will go down hill and be so bad that the old values we miss will come back because living by those old values was how folks survived and folks who didn't hold those values didn't survive. The same thing happened when Rome went down the tubes. It won't be pleasant for our progeny though.
+1
The ball is rolling. Gathering speed. No one can know when TSHTF, might be generations from now, but I believe being prepared mentally and physically for survival is imperative for me, my family and my friends. This is not some doom and gloom thought process, it's something the Bible and the Boy Scouts taught me: Be Prepared, and pass it on to the generations to come.
Hobie wrote:Don't worry guys, everything is cyclical. Pretty soon things will go down hill and be so bad that the old values we miss will come back because living by those old values was how folks survived and folks who didn't hold those values didn't survive. The same thing happened when Rome went down the tubes...
Well, Rome did come roaring back...
...Oh, wait...
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.
History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
Hobie wrote:Don't worry guys, everything is cyclical. Pretty soon things will go down hill and be so bad that the old values we miss will come back because living by those old values was how folks survived and folks who didn't hold those values didn't survive. The same thing happened when Rome went down the tubes...
Well, Rome did come roaring back...
...Oh, wait...
"Rome" didn't but the Italians did. Don't confuse government with people.
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
The posters who have said it "all began with the New Deal" might be interested in this essay by Garet Garrett (1878–1954), who was writing on the New Deal.
His premise in part was that for the people who are worried about the future, and losing our freedom, we probably have overslept, and the 'revolution' is already over. I hate to say it, but he's right. The only good news is that maybe it's not ALL the way over... That was about 18 presidential elections ago, so maybe if we have 18 good ones now we can back things out to a Constitutional Republic?
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws "first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Here we go. Get a cup of coffee or a beer and sit down and I'll tell you how everything went to hell.
The year was 1942. The US was in full "going to war" mode. The men that were signing up and/or being drafted left gapping holes in our industrial manpower. These holes were filled with women. With all the Rosie the Riveter posters and ads saying that that was the right/American thing to do, American women lined up. Not only out of a sense of patriotic duty, but as a way to make ends meet without their husbands around. This need grew because as time marched on we had a bumper crop of widows on our hands with little mouths to feed. So off to work the women went... and stayed. At first the men came back from the war and things semi went back to normal (except for the war widows) but things were not all as they seemed. Women had gotten a taste of earning there own money. A taste of not having to answer to a husband on the spending of that money. Some would argue a taste of freedom. I would not. Why? Here is an interlude:
In this day and time: A husband works and the wife stays at home. "Lucky wife" some would say. Switch that around and it is "what is his problem" or "he's a bum". Men in western civilization have been trained for the last few hundred years (or arguably longer) that they are responsible for the economic failure or success of the family. Women, particularly at that time and yet even now to a degree, do not have the same onus placed upon them by society as a whole. So they're family economic world view is/was different than that of a mans. They were more free to spend without consequence. At firs this could be tolerated because of the difference in yesterdays economy and the production culture of America. As opposed to todays consumer (instant gratification) culture. Interlude over.
With more mothers working the American family had more money than they had in sometime. Now they can have cars for pleasure. Newer and nicer ones than ever before to run on Americas growing web of highways and interstates. TVs, vacuum cleaners, TV dinners and more all to entertain and make life easier for the busy working mother to help her take care of the family that she was no longer there to care for herself. Thus the rise of the latchkey kids. With mom (and dad of course) away the children will play. Raising themselves without the moral guidance and the loving watchful eye to protect them. It is not a large step from here to see how these children lost what family meant. Respect does not exist for those who are not around to earn it. So with the parental authority our of the way... so went all authority, or at least the respect there of. When you raise yourself there are no rules. What you want to do, you do. Say hello to the love/drug movements of the 60s-70s. These latchkey kids are now adults with kids of there own, without the parenting skills that can only be learned by example. For that matter without the concept of family that needed those skills. So them family falls apart. Divorce rates climb. As does substance abuse and violence. The absence of a respect for authority means to show authority for the flawed and corrupt thing that they hope it is so as to justify their lack of faith in any system. Here you can see everything from Watergate to priest pedophiles.
So where/when does it end? Not with all the voting you could ever hope to do. Because the voting is like killing ants with a hammer. While it may beat letting the ants run free, eventually you'll loose. It ends when people stop acting like spoiled children and start acting like the men and women they think they are. Be a man, a husband, a father. Keep your word. Keep your head. Keep you pants zipped. If you are a woman: Be a woman, a wife, a mother. No, it's not always about you. But do your best and it will be more times than not. Raise you children to respect. If not the man, the office. If not the teacher, the position. If not the legislator, the law. If not the priest, then God. Teach them to be people of character. Then when they are running things, and they one day will, we will not have to see all our days of glory as a faded, and singed, flag.
Last edited by mklwhite on Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
This is kinda on the same subject. This morning at church one of the petitions for prayer was "the fair and equitable distribution of the worlds wealth and resources".To me that sounds like socialism ,but my wife would hear none of it.I just grit my teeth to keep the peace in the family.
mklwhite wrote:
So where/when does it end? Not with all the voting you could ever hope to do. Because the voting is like killing ants with a hammer. While it may beat letting the ants run free, eventually you'll loose. It ends when people stop acting like spoiled children and start acting like the men and women they think they are. Be a man, a husband, a father. Keep your word. Keep your head. Keep you pants zipped. If you are a woman: Be a woman, a wife, a mother. No, it's not always about you. But do your best and it will be more times than not. Raise you children to respect. If not the man, the office. If not the teacher, the position. If not the legislator, the law. If not the priest, then God. Teach them to be people of character. Then when they are running things, and they one day will, we will not have to see all our days of glory as a faded, and singed, flag.
THAT should be on a bronze plaque somewhere, especially:
"Be a man, a husband, a father. Keep your word. Keep your head. Keep you pants zipped.
If you are a woman: Be a woman, a wife, a mother. No, it's not always about you."
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws "first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
