Puma/Rossi furniture, Buds Guns Wrong pics etc...

[Nixterdemus]

I bought a 20" octagon 44 mag for my brother. However, the pic at BudsGuns shows a 24" rifle. The forearm stock is the same length so now, on the 20" short brl, it appears to be a 3/4 Mannlicher, almost. The price was right, but this changes the entire look. I can understand the rear stock being an inch longer on a rifle than the carbine.

Speak of, I ordered a 20" rnd brl 45 Colt. They showed a pick of a 24" octagon(could've been a bull brl I didn't know it was just larger than the mag tube) w/endcap on the forend stock.

Ya'll already know I received the carbine coz I guess in a 20" rnd brl carbine is the only offering.

I admit to being dumb and using their pictures to make my decisions. The carbine for me looks fine and I have a 45 Colt wheelgun.

I'm not a happy camper on the 44 mag short/mountain/brush rifle octagon brl w/extra long forend stock. I've figured out that is the same length stock that they use on the 24" rifle. It looks funky and I wouldn't have bought it if I'd known.

Sure the extra length helps stabilize the extra 1.6 lbs of octagon brl, but that ain't the point. I went out and over-extended myself to buy a nice gift for my brother and I feel like I've been hoodwinked.

I'm sure ya'll have heard this tale before. Any thoughts?

Edit: Yes, these were the LSI, imported to Reno, A. Rossi S.A. made in Brazil.

Fit n finish looks good and the lever & trigger feel good.

It wouldn't be as bad if Buds hadn't switched the 20" & 24" pics.

[COSteve]

Yes, their pictures don't necessarily correspond to the actual rifle. What you're describing is a Short Rifle rather than a carbine. To avoid your issue, I checked the model number Bud's shows with Rossi's site HERE before I bought both of mine to ensure that I was actually ordering the version I wanted. Rule of thumb, if Bud's lists the barrel as a 20" octagon bbl it's a Short Rifle, if they list it as a 20" round bbl, its a Carbine, however, I still would check before I bought.

[Nixterdemus]

Thanks Steve. As stated the carbine looks fine, but my brother doesn't need a 45 Colt. That's why I order him a 44 mag so he could pick up ammo @ Waly-World.

Ever time I look at the short octagon I think mini-Mannlicher...

It does have two different size screws behind the hammer so I guess I could mount a tang sight? As well another screw came shipped w/short rifle, but not the carbine. Does that have something to do w/tang sight?

Thanks......

EDIT: I looked again and it says for use w/tang sight.

Dang the carbine only has one screw and they didn't send me a spare for a tang.

[O.S.O.K.]

Yeah that's the one thing with Buds that I don't get. Not only is it the wrong pic but they do that on almost all of their listings... how long does it take to match them up?

Take comofort in knowing that you can list your new-in-the-box rifle on gunbroker and easily make a few bucks on selling it and then you can order the one you really want (or order it now...). That's what I'd do if I wasn't happy with it. Their prices on these are exceptionally low...

Their descriptions are correct - and they put the picture disclaimer on every one - but it's a poor practice if you ask me.

I've tried to mention this mismatching picture situaiton every time I recommend them.

And FWIIW, I really like my short rifle. Its got all of the premium features and looks good to me. Handles good and shoots good. The action is really nice and it ejects the cases perfectly - no tuning needed there.

[Nixterdemus]

Of course my main issue is matching up the wrong pic and sometimes descriptions. They also listed the short rifle description as 1.5" shorter than the round brl carbine, go figure.

Compared to the 20" rnd brl carbine the 20" short rifle w/super long forend stock is one ugly duckling, in my book.



It just isn't cricket, kosher or symmetrical mates.

If Rossi had only shortened/provided the short brl w/it's own sized to length forend stock it would look better, to me.

He's gonna be real happy until he see's my carbine.

I e-mailed Buds w/complaints for what it's worth...

[COSteve]

Deleted

[fatoldfool]

The forearm on the short rifle and 24 rifle are the same length...just saves them a few bucks on machinery and parts. I have a Hartford short rifle, and even though I don't like the look of the forearm, it balances ok and swings really good.

[Nixterdemus]

That's the rub, two differing length rifles and the same length stock that starts off a little long in the first place.

Anywho, Buds answered my e-mail and appeared sincere in helping me so, I mailed them back w/couple of options in light of my circumstances.

I'm sure the rifle will function fine. Just as sure that I wouldn't have bought that rifle had they posted the correct picture. The forestock is right at 3" longer than the carbine and w/both on a 20" brl it isn't, as the ladies say, flattering.

I agree that the longer 24" octagon brl looks fine though as previously stated by Steve Rossi did make it 1.5" longer than the original for some unknown reason.

Steve, does the 1.5" extra on the Rossi hold true for the carbines as well?

Can I safely assume that the 16" carbine would have the same length forestock as the 20"?

[COSteve]

Deleted

[Hanzerik]

I personally like the look of the 20" Short Rifle. Here is a pic of the 20" with my 16"

[O.S.O.K.]

I like my short rifle:



It handles and points really nice. Feels good in the hand.

Just today I installed sling swivels. I'm also going to switch out the front sight for a Marbles fiber optic and then I'll be done fiddling with it.

[Nixterdemus]

I like the shorter stocks. Everyone has their own feel.

Steve, I noticed that my carbine had a roughly 1" shorter butt stock than the short rifle.

Hanzerik, your short rifle looks good w/16" to me coz they both have the same amount of brl sticking out.

There's nuttin' "wrong" w/20" short rifle. The furniture doesn't enhance towards my taste.

I have nothing but good things to say about everything else. Especially the price.

But, whadda I know? I just ordered three Chuck Daly 18.5 HD 12 gauge(Not from Buds) scatterguns in the evah popular Nickel finish...

One as a gift, one for me and I guess one for parts....
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I'm not picking on Rossi for trying to save a buck. Budz needs to do the tighten-up on their website. I'm sure the short rifle stock would grow on me. I like the 20" brl and consider it the best of both worlds in a pistol cartridge.

I'm looking at possibly buying another and giving my brother his choice. If he doesn't pick the SR then I'll slap a tang sight on 'er and go about my rat killin'...

[rodeo kid]

Better watch out Nexredemus, or the Feds will get you: it is illegal to buy a firearm for another person, even your brother. Just friendly advice.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

Buds also advertises these as walnut. That aint so. Rossi uses a brazilian hardwood. The only rossi's to ever get walnut were the, no longer Navy imported Rossi's.
Size wise the carbine wood is almost identical, but compared to the original Win 24" oct rifles the Rossi butstock and forend are each about an 1" longer. I too think the forwood looks odd on the short rifle. This customer had me cut it down.
This is a 20" oct but it now look proportional.



Here's a 20" that was cut to 16" at the receiver. The butstock looks a bit long now.

[Nixterdemus]

Thanks for the advice Rodeo. I am not nor ever will be any part of a straw purchase. I can buy and gift as an American to family members the last time I checked. Howevah, I think if I buy two pistolas in a week the goobermint wants to know if I'm arming a billhilly militia...

Nate, proportional is the word. Thanks for the pics. I didn't figure there was a way to cut the forestock cheaply. I'll buy a carbine to play it safe and end up w/44 mag short rifle. Not that there's anything wrong w/that. I do have a tang sight.

The Feds will probably come get me after I mount the other tang on that Turkish riot pump for mortar work. Maybe some kinda abscam two-way mirror tape in the hotel room w/belly dancerset-up. Code name: Little Eygpt or Elvis a Go-Go...

How hard was it to cut the forestock? I'd like to take 1.5" off the butt as well.(Insert joke here)

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

Thanks for the advice Rodeo. I am not nor ever will be any part of a straw purchase. I can buy and gift as an American to family members the last time I checked. Howevah, I think if I buy two pistolas in a week the goobermint wants to know if I'm arming a billhilly militia...

Nate, proportional is the word. Thanks for the pics. I didn't figure there was a way to cut the forestock cheaply. I'll buy a carbine to play it safe and end up w/44 mag short rifle. Not that there's anything wrong w/that. I do have a tang sight.

The Feds will probably come get me after I mount the other tang on that Turkish riot pump for mortar work. Maybe some kinda abscam two-way mirror tape in the hotel room w/belly dancerset-up. Code name: Little Eygpt or Elvis a Go-Go...

How hard was it to cut the forestock? I'd like to take 1.5" off the butt as well.(Insert joke here)

You are correct, buying it as a gift for a person that you have no prior knowledge of being restricted is not a straw purchase.
If it were then Sara Brady would be in jail.

Cutting the fore-stock isn't that hard. But, you will have to cut a new dovetail for the forend cap tenon and make a filler for the old dovetail. If you look close you can barely make out the filler. Believe it or not cutting the crescent butstock is a PITA. Cutting it into the top and back end is bad enough, but you will also need to trim the plate and most likely narrow the wood on the sides. Now you have refinishing of both wood and metal to do.

I try to talk folks into a shotgun style but if they want it shortened too. This stock on that 16" oct I think would have look a bit more proportional.

[Warhawk]

Better watch out Nexredemus, or the Feds will get you: it is illegal to buy a firearm for another person, even your brother. Just friendly advice.

Big difference between a straw purchase and a gun bought as a gift.

Gift's are 100% legal.

[L_Kilkenny]

Boy, I'm really messed up. I like the looks of the longer forearm on the short rifle. But then I've always heard about shorter forearm lengths on some the the 16" models over the years and could not figure out why someone would have an issue with a standard carbine forearm. Also on stock length... I do realize that companies like Henry are putting on longer stocks. They are just making them more in line for Length of Pull of other guns. 2 other points: People are bigger now than in the latter part of the 19th century. Heck, even in the last 25 years people have gotten bigger. When I was growing up I was average height at 5'10". Now, 25 years latter, if you're a male and not over 6' your a pip-squeak. Also 99.99% of Henry .22 buyers could care less about stock length compared to original Winchesters. Most have never even handled a Winchester.

As for Bud's I've HEARD (not to be confused with anything close to personal knowledge) that many buyers are having issues with em. And their pics and descriptions are generally not very good. Look at the link I posted in the Pump Guns thread. It list the M32C as both a lever and a pump. But dang do they have good prices!!!

LK

[COSteve]

As for Bud's I've HEARD (not to be confused with anything close to personal knowledge) that many buyers are having issues with em. LK

Can't speak for 'many buyers' but I got two Rossis from Buds this year and had no problems. The trouble with passing on what 'they' say is you have no way of knowing that you've got your head up your keister.

[Nixterdemus]

That makes sense w/shotgun pad. I would try to use that w/20" brl if I wanted a shorter overall length before dropping 4" of brl to the 16". It wouldn't look correct either, but in that case I would take function over form coz I really like the 20" brl and could probably get within 2" of a 16" carbine/trapper.

Come to think of it the 20" short rifle might be just the candidate for 2" - 3 " of shaving.

Then I would need the extra long forestock of the 20" short rifle to help balance the overall shorter rifle. Ha! Love it when I come full circle. I'd have to love the utilitarian feature of lopping up to 3" off the buttstock coz I'm afraid I'd have one ugly gun. The O.L. of a 18" carbine w/5/8 Mannlicher stock. Oh yeah it would get a tang sight and some kinda fancy name. Forward recon, confederate sniper, long shortie or sommething along those lines. Could be a new trend and then yrs down the road folks would be able to explain the reasoning behind the extra long 20" short rifle forestock.

Bound to be a country song/ballad in there somewhere.

Your pic of the 20" SS octagon forestock looks like 8" then 8" to the dovetail/lug/magtube/brl connection/support then 4" to the brl, evah so roughly. It just looks right.

I'd heard that Walnut was considered a generic term these days in certain circles.

Compared to a similar priced semi-auto pistola though the lever is a lot of gun and a bargain in my book.

Thanks again Nate.

"I like the looks of the longer forearm on the short rifle."
Nuttin' wrong w/that as it falls under individual taste.

Go to the Taurus site sometimes and find guns they were gonna make and listed yet fell through for whatever reason.

I understand Buds using stock pics from manufacturers. I just don't understand why they don't go through them later on and correct them. I'm guessing that most manufacturers aren't a problem. Now that I understand that there's only one forestock shared between 16" & 20" carbines and one forestock shared berween 20" & 24" rifles it falls into place. Does the same sharin' hold true for buttstocks? Carbines are rnd brl and one inch shorter overall than rifles that are octagon brl due to the buttstock length.

At least I think that's the way it works...

[Roland]

Since we're asking for pics, anyone here bought a 20" or 24" rifle with the round barrel? The pictures on the rossiusa site are lacking to the say the best, I'd like to see some real photographs of these guns.

[Nixterdemus]

I may be wrong. but I don't think Rossi makes a 24" round barrel just like they don't make a 16" octagon brl short rifle.

Rnd brl is carbine and octagon brl is rifle. The buttstock is one inch longer on the oct brl rifle producing one inch overall longer length over the rnd brl carbine.

As I understand anyway. Maybe the new Chippia/Italian/Rossi offerings are different.

[Roland]

No it seems you are right and I am wrong. I based my earlier false belief on the pictures on the rossi website, some of them looked like they weren't octagonal, but it's merely the substandard photography at work, in combination with them being cut out of the background.

If only they'd just take some real photos with a real background, so you could get an impression of what the rifle really looks like, this is like watching a drawing of the rifles.

[Nixterdemus]

I ordered two Puma/Rossi levers and neither looked like the pictures, but they were the correct model.

A carbine is roughly a pound and a half lighter than a rifle, but the nose heavy octagon brl rifle should be easier to hold on target.

Pictures threw me off till I realized that the magazine tube would be about the same size as the brl on a carbine and considerably smaller on a octagon brl rifle.
---------------------------
Put in another order w/Buds and waiting on confirmation of shipping.

[Warhawk]

Since we're asking for pics, anyone here bought a 20" or 24" rifle with the round barrel? The pictures on the rossiusa site are lacking to the say the best, I'd like to see some real photographs of these guns.

www.rossiusa.com has pics of all of them

[Roland]

Yes I know about that, a few posts above I aimed a litany complaints regarding the shoddy product pictures on their site.