OT - Ruger Single-Six accuracy

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:22 pm

I need to dial in the Ruger Single-Six I have, as, quite honestly, I have not been overly impressed with its accuracy to date. One of the things on my "to-do" list concerning my collection.

Have any of you that have one of these experienced similar results (and frustration)? Does the Ruger Single-Six like any specific ammunition better than others (in your gun)?

Just a wondering...

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:31 pm

The convertibles apparently have a barrel designed for the 22 mag and don't shoot as well with 22 LR. Paco says all 22s will do better with one ammo over another.

Post by **Hobie** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:32 pm

That's true. Paco's tool will bump the bullet up to .224 improving accuracy. With ammo they like they aren't that bad. Good for squirrel out to 25 yards or so, like my S&W 422. Now, my Ruger MKII 10" will reach on out there to 50 yards or so to take squirrel.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:36 pm

I hit better with the Single Six better than most of my handguns..... I don't really group them on paper much.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:47 pm

Ysabel Kid wrote:I need to dial in the Ruger Single-Six I have, as, quite honestly, I have not been overly impressed with its accuracy to date. One of the things on my "to-do" list concerning my collection.

Have any of you that have one of these experienced similar results (and frustration)? Does the Ruger Single-Six like any specific ammunition better than others (in your gun)?

Just a wondering...

I have an OM Super Single-Six that had dismal accuracy with the LR cylinder. I slugged the chambers and found 5 ( five) different diameters.
So I did a bench test at 25 yards and used 9 different brands / types of .22 LR Ammo. ALL of them would shoot 3 to 4 into a group, then throw 2 to 3 into fliers. Miserable tolerances Ruger allows.

So I sent the cylinder to a gunsmith in Tennessee and had all six chambers reamed out to the same size.
That was very early this year and I still haven't gotten to the range to do an after test.
I've got the first part written up, and I'll finish my "after" report and post it as soon as I can. This is very high on my 'to do' list.

Joe

Lefty Dude · Post by **Lefty Dude** » Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:02 pm

They are very accurate if you find the ammo they like.

I have won several CAS/SASS side 22LR Matches with my RSS Stainless and adjustable sights. Ranges were 25-50 yards and 22 small steel KD targets were used.
Mins shoots very well with PMC Zappers, which are Aquila's. When I found it like the Zappers I bought a case of 5000, all same lot number.This lot of zappers mic out at .2245". A Paco tool is not necessary. They are also solids, the piece does not like the 36 gr. Zapper HP's.
Just get a box of 50, all types and start testing various ones. You will find some it likes and others are stuff.

My blued three screw convertable fixed sight model RSS likes Federal 714 standard velocity the best. They are sized .223 factory. And dislikes the PMC Zapper HV's. Dick's Sporting Goods has the 714's, sometimes.

Try standard velocity's I think you may be surprised how they shoot. I have CCI, Federals & Winchester T22's standards and the 714 shoot the best, then the CCI, and T22's not so good.

Both like the Winchester Supreme Super X for there 22 Mag. cylinders

gundownunder · Post by **gundownunder** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 3:33 am

I found mine grouped better with copper washed ammo than with plain lead and it also used to lead badly with plain lead until I had the forcing cone polished.
If the gun has been around for a few years check that the rear sight is still tight, mine was loose and that affected accuracy as well. I ended up solving that problem by placing a shim under the rear sight and screwing it down tight with the shim thickness adjusted to give me a 25 yd zero.
With Fed bulkpak ammo mine will group into about 2" at 25 yds from a solid rest, I haven't really experimented much to see if another ammo will group better, but I'm sure if I did I could surprise myself.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:29 am

I'd definitely give the Paco tool a try. It seems to help my rifles shoot better.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:39 am

J Miller wrote:
Ysabel Kid wrote:I need to dial in the Ruger Single-Six I have, as, quite honestly, I have not been overly impressed with its accuracy to date. One of the things on my "to-do" list concerning my collection.

Have any of you that have one of these experienced similar results (and frustration)? Does the Ruger Single-Six like any specific ammunition better than others (in your gun)?

Just a wondering...
I have an OM Super Single-Six that had dismal accuracy with the LR cylinder. I slugged the chambers and found 5 ( five) different diameters.
So I did a bench test at 25 yards and used 9 different brands / types of .22 LR Ammo. ALL of them would shoot 3 to 4 into a group, then throw 2 to 3 into fliers. Miserable tolerances Ruger allows.

So I sent the cylinder to a gunsmith in Tennessee and had all six chambers reamed out to the same size.
That was very early this year and I still haven't gotten to the range to do an after test.
I've got the first part written up, and I'll finish my "after" report and post it as soon as I can. This is very high on my 'to do' list.

Joe

Joe, you TEASE! This is exactly what I was hoping for - someone who took a bunch of different types of ammunition and gave it a run through. I can't wait for the second half of this report!

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:40 am

Lefty Dude wrote: Just get a box of 50, all types and start testing various ones. You will find some it likes and others are stuff.

Therein lies the problem. Most of the candy stores either don't have much of a selection back in stock, or want centerfire prices for what they do have!

Looks like I am going to have to buy a bunch at the next gun show. Scientific research... that's what I'll tell Mrs. YK!

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:41 am

AJMD429 wrote:I'd definitely give the Paco tool a try. It seems to help my rifles shoot better.

On the list - and just moved up!

Post by **AmBraCol** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:41 am

My OM SS that I got from AK Church some years ago gives me no complaints. I don't group it, I hunt it. These were all taken at around 35-40 yards or so.

Post by **AmBraCol** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:42 am

Forgot to mention that it didn't seem to matter if it was CCI Minimags or Remington Yellowjackets - it shot about the same and gave good results. I don't get to shoot it that often, but it heads to the woods with me when I'm up north.

Gun Smith · Post by **Gun Smith** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:12 am

I'm glad someone mentioned forcing cones. Changing (decreasing) the angle of the forcing cone can sometimes improve accuracy. There tends to be less distortion of the bullet in the barrel with this modifiction. Rugers can use this mod.

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:21 am

Lefty Dude wrote: A Paco tool is not necessary.

I didn't mean to imply that it was necessary, only that it can help.

Joe, did you send your cylinder to CAS?

Oh, and my gun seems to like the Winchester Supreme, too. I can reach on out there with that ammo. The gun is in the truck with some of that in the cylinder right now!

Post by **AmBraCol** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:47 am

Gun Smith wrote:I'm glad someone mentioned forcing cones. Changing (decreasing) the angle of the forcing cone can sometimes improve accuracy. There tends to be less distortion of the bullet in the barrel with this modifiction. Rugers can use this mod.

My plan is to eventually have my OM rebarreled and have the new barrel fixed up with a "Taylor Throat" like Jim Taylor wrote about years ago concerning his own Single Six that his dad fixed up. In that case his Dad actually "ironed" the throat into the barrel rather than cutting it. I've shot that pistol and it's a real hoot. Mine took some groundsquirrels this past summer and works just fine "as is". If I ever get a chance at an another unconverted OM SS then I might speed up the process of turning one or the other into "the ultimate Single Six". In the meantime, it's just one more project waiting for me to have time and $$$ to address it during my brief sojourns up north. First on the list is the future "Perfect Packing Pistol" that's almost ready for professional help.

Post by **Old Savage** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:59 am

Mine is very accurate with Fed 22 mags but not so with LRs so far.

Lefty Dude · Post by **Lefty Dude** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:28 am

I had Wes Flowers AKA/ West Fargo tune my Blued three screw convertible. He does a modification to the back of the cylinder of the 22LR. It is rebated about 1/32", this allows the shooter to view where the cartridges are in the cylinder chambers for the load five, carry five.
This is done for CAS/SASS purposes as the Junior shooters can shoot 22's. This allows the loading table Safety Officer to verify, the piece is loaded safely with the hammer down on an empty chamber. Without this mod. to the cylinder it is near impossible for this verification to be accomplished as the chambers are recessed.

Some CAS/SASS Clubs are now doing some 22 side match stages. They use a single 22 revolver, a 22 lever action Rifle,(that can hold 15 or more) and a single barrel Shotgun.

Modoc ED · Post by **Modoc ED** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:29 am

I use Winchester Power Point 40gr HP bullets in all my .22 LR guns -- pistols/revolvers/riles. That particular bullet shoots tiny groups in some guns and larger groups in other guns but shoots well enough in all guns for hunting purposes. If I do my part, my Ruger Bearcat will shoot that bullet into a 1" group at 25-yards.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:47 am

Hobie wrote:
Lefty Dude wrote: A Paco tool is not necessary.
I didn't mean to imply that it was necessary, only that it can help.

Joe, did you send your cylinder to CAS?

Oh, and my gun seems to like the Winchester Supreme, too. I can reach on out there with that ammo. The gun is in the truck with some of that in the cylinder right now!

Hobie,
No not to CAS. I sent it to Gatgun98. He posts over on Levergunlovers.com forum. He and I had discussed it for some time and me being molasses slow I'm just not getting things done like I should. When I get to the range to do the 'after' tests I'll give name address and phone number as well as all the brands of ammo I tested.

Joe

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:51 am

Thanks Joe...

JB · Post by JB » Fri Oct 09, 2009 12:32 pm

I carry a stainless Single-Six when I run my traps. I've fired a number of them over the years. Most were only plinking accurate, but a friend of mine once owned one that would shoot with most good automatics. I just about cried when I found out he's sold it without checking with me first.

TedH · Post by **TedH** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:48 pm

I've only tried a couple different kinds of ammo in mine so far, but it does shoot the magnums better than 22lr. The best magnums were the Winchester Dynapoints. Shot a full cylinder into about one and a half inch at 25 yards. Bulk Federal 22lr will do about 2 and a half inches at that range.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 3:05 pm

Ysabel Kid, Hobie,

Since this was a Ruger I originally posted it over on The Ruger Forum and a couple other places.
Here's the link to the thread:
Inconsistent Spr Sgl-6 chambers - Update-range report
http://www.rugerforum.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=37909

I've come down with a stinking upper respiratory thing so I'm being delayed again. As soon as I get over this I'll beat cleats to the gun range and finish this little project. I wanna know if the chamber equalization worked at all.

Joe

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 3:39 pm

Thanks Joe.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:59 pm

Hobie wrote:Thanks Joe.

+1 - hope you get to feeling better soon!

Lefty Dude · Post by **Lefty Dude** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:59 pm

Joe;

FWIW, you can buy a replacement 22LR cylinder at a gun show for $40.00-$50.00. And sell the other for the same amount. I would not spend money on the original cylinder.
I bought my three screw RSS W/O a 22Lr. cylinder, all it had was the Mag. I bought a used cylinder at a local GS and it was a drop in. I had Wes Flowers check it out when he did the action & mods. Just make sure you get the right vintage cylinder. The new ones will not fit. Mine also came with the little red storage bag.
The throat reaming will help, I would say the important issue is the out of round throats. I have a pair of Uberti Bisley 44-40's accuracy was so-so. I found that over half the throats were out of round. We throat reamed the chambers and both guns stopped flyer shots, and were consistant. Groups shrank in half.

Good Luck

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:56 pm

LeftyDude,

In the thread on TRF I said I'd already had the chambers reamed out. Months ago actually. I've just pretty much lost interest in shooting here in IL, especially in indoor ranges. That and other things have just kept me from shooting the pistol.
As for finding a cylinder here in IL, that's all but impossible. The gun shows here are dismal at best.
Besides, I have no way to measure the chambers to see that I don't get one just as bad as this one. So, it's best to have a known entity worked on, than try to find another with potential unknown dimensions and problems.

I've had experience with out of round and undersized throats on my OM BH .45. In my not so humble opinion the chambers, throats, forcing cone and bore are the heart of a revolver. And unfortunately that's where Ruger ( and others ) all too often drop the ball.

Joe

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:59 pm

Kid,
I've owned many Ruger single actions over the years and have come to know what to expect.
1.) I ain't foolin' with no "accuracy tool" for .22's.

2.) Ruger Single Six's made after about 1962 have
fat .224 bores. Some shoot, most don't,

3.) You want a Single Six that shoots and will be
darn near guaranteed 1"---1 and 1/2' at 25
yards? Get a Flatgate or early 3 screw with a
serial number below 164,000. No rarity here
or high collectors value---there are 164,000
of them floating around.

----Sixgun

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:10 pm

Sixgun wrote:Kid,
I've owned many Ruger single actions over the years and have come to know what to expect.
1.) I ain't foolin' with no "accuracy tool" for .22's.

2.) Ruger Single Six's made after about 1962 have
fat .224 bores. Some shoot, most don't,

3.) You want a Single Six that shoots and will be
darn near guaranteed 1"---1 and 1/2' at 25
yards? Get a Flatgate or early 3 screw with a
serial number below 164,000. No rarity here
or high collectors value---there are 164,000
of them floating around. ----Sixgun

Yeah I agree with 99.5% of what you say Sixgun. I don't shoot rim fires enough to buy an accuracy tool either. Besides the idea of beating on a rim fire cartridge scares me to death.
Not sure about the no rarity part though. You see the collectors over on TRF are hogging them.
Not all later single sixes have the large bores, mine runs .2217" to .222" depending on which land my micrometer lands on.

If you want tack driving accuracy out of a Ruger Single six, you'll need a cylinder with the correct chambers for the 22 LR, and a good barrel. They are out there .... you just gotta find one. Good luck.

Joe

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:00 am

Joe,
Yep! (on the good luck part

) Maybe its my vivid imagination. It just seems like every flatgate or early OM I'v shot is a tackdriver while the later ones will give 2-3" accuracy. Its the same with the old Marlins/new Marlins. Most new Marlins are good for hitting steel at about 50 yards. Colt handguns/'Smith handguns---Colts have tighter tolerences. -------------Sixgun

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Sat Oct 10, 2009 2:37 pm

Sixgun wrote:Joe,
Yep! (on the good luck part ) Maybe its my vivid imagination. It just seems like every flatgate or early OM I'v shot is a tackdriver while the later ones will give 2-3" accuracy. Its the same with the old Marlins/new Marlins. Most new Marlins are good for hitting steel at about 50 yards. Colt handguns/'Smith handguns---Colts have tighter tolerences. -------------Sixgun

Well, my opinion is based on the guns I've owned and I've had three Colt .22 Single Actions, and one Ruger Old Model Super Single-Six.

All three Colts, even the aluminum framed one would out shoot the Ruger every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Much better guns.

Ruger changed their barrel tolerances when the .22 Mag was introduced. That's when they went to the .224" bore. The sloppy LR chambers are due to Ruger's gang reaming the cylinders.
For those that don't know; Gang Reaming means they ream all six chambers at the same time with six different reamers. The reamers do not all wear exactly the same so you get really bad variations. Supposedly they went to using one tool for each chamber with the introduction of the New Vaquero. But I've since heard from those who've bought them that they are back to the sloppy throats again.

Someone once said that Ruger single actions were a perfect project gun right out of the box. Or something like that. They were correct. Every one I've ever owned, including my three Old Models needed / need something. If I ever get them all finished I'll be thrilled.

Joe

BUCKNIFE · Post by **BUCKNIFE** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:22 am

well darn i guess i will just have to get rid of mine i didnt know it wouldnt shoot. i guess all those snakes, rabbits, and squirrels just died from a stroke when they heard me shoot. seriously i have had no accuracy problems with mine, besides i dont care for the overly loud muzzle blast from the magnum plus it still ruins too much meat. when i squirrel hunt or other small game i want as much quiet as possible. just my experience.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 3:48 pm

Hey Rick, don't be so down about it. You know, accidents happen. It's just one of those good ones that Ruger accidentally let out of the shop. Slipped through the QC dept. You can always send it back to Ruger for repair.

Joe

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 7:42 pm

Sixgun wrote:Kid,
I've owned many Ruger single actions over the years and have come to know what to expect.
1.) I ain't foolin' with no "accuracy tool" for .22's.

2.) Ruger Single Six's made after about 1962 have
fat .224 bores. Some shoot, most don't,

3.) You want a Single Six that shoots and will be
darn near guaranteed 1"---1 and 1/2' at 25
yards? Get a Flatgate or early 3 screw with a
serial number below 164,000. No rarity here
or high collectors value---there are 164,000
of them floating around. ----Sixgun

Sixgun - mine is an Old Model, but made in 1966. I would jump on a flatgate - just haven't seen one at any of the shows in just about forever!

TX Gun Runner · Post by **TX Gun Runner** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:08 pm

Or buy a Cimarron , I have my fill of SS 22 that leadup and don't shoot .

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:20 pm

tn gun runner wrote:Or buy a Cimarron , I have my fill of SS 22 that leadup and don't shoot .

That's good shooting tn gun runner - with cheap bulk ammo to boot!

Remington40x · Post by **Remington40x** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:14 pm

I've had very good results with my Ruger Bisley version of the Single Six using the CCI Standard Velocity ammo. I did do a "poor man's trigger job" on the revolver, which definitely improved the trigger pull, making it easier to shoot accurately. I use it for casual bullseye pistol shooting and it will keep 10 in the 9 ring on a slow fire pistol target at 50 feet if I do my part. Better if I bench rest it.

Take the time to try a wide variety of .22 ammo in the gun. I've done accuracy testing on a number of different .22s, rifle and pistol, and have found that ammo makes a huge difference. One rifle I tested showed differences of well over an inch for average group size using 10 five-shot groups, depending on the ammo used. Oddly enough, it's not always expensive ammo that is the best in the particular rifle. My Kimber (Oregon) Model 82 prefers Federal Lightning over far more expensive target ammo. Why? I haven't a clue.

Whit Spurzon · Post by **Whit Spurzon** » Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:36 pm

I've owned a number of Single Sixes, all were good shooters. This one is my favorite but not my most accurate.

A cylinder's worth at 25 yards

jhrosier · Post by **jhrosier** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:51 am

I have a whole flock of Single-Sixes and each seems to have a preference for one type of ammo or another, very confusing.
The one that I shoot most of the time is a 6-1/2" stainless. It likes the Federal 36gr bulk pack ammo best. It won't shoot for beans with Federal Auto Match or Winchester T22s.
It seems that the best argument for having a bunch of .22s is that there will be one that likes whatever brand of ammo that is currently available.

Jack

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:57 am

jhrosier wrote:I have a whole flock of Single-Sixes and each seems to have a preference for one type of ammo or another, very confusing.
The one that I shoot most of the time is a 6-1/2" stainless. It likes the Federal 36gr bulk pack ammo best. It won't shoot for beans with Federal Auto Match or Winchester T22s.
It seems that the best argument for having a bunch of .22s is that there will be one that likes whatever brand of ammo that is currently available.

Jack

And this is why I don't shoot my .22s much. They are just too picky. If you have only one and it's will only shoot accurately with one brand and style of ammo, then if you can't get that ammo, you've got an inaccurate paper weight.
Too much trouble for the results you'll get.

................................................

Another thing I've noticed about this thread is those with New Model Rugers have reported better accuracy than those with Old Model Rugers.
And I don't remember those with S&W or Colt .22s complaining about this much fickleness with their revolvers.

This is a very interesting thread.

Joe

Lefty Dude · Post by **Lefty Dude** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 11:40 am

I have several 22's, Rifles & Revolvers the only Auto Rifle is a Remington 550-1 and it likes everything I feed it. This one is kinda nice as it has a Williams patent floating chamber and will digest shorts, longs, & LR's as an Auto-loader tubular magazine. It also has a full size stock.
I agree the Rugers are very picky as to what ammo they like, and yes I think the older models are much mo so than the new crop. I have one of each and my New Model RSS is much more accurate than the three screw. And forget the BC's they are a piece of Dung. I have had several and not one would give a decent group.
For a small 22LR revolver the only one that is good is not made any more and is the S&W 34 Kit-Gun, in blue or stainless. Last year I attended an Estate Sale and bought one for my Son. A like new 4" blue model made in 1958, and in almost new condition. We paid $275.00 for the piece, and were very grateful. The Kit-gun have very tight chambers, If I am out plinking, target shooting or hunting I always have a short cleaning rod in my pocket with a 25 cal. nylon brush attached so I can keep the chambers clean. After about 30-50 round they get so tight it's hard to feed. It's a shame they stopped making the 6" models after WWII as the I frame.When they came back in the early 50's, as the J frame was only made in a 4".

jhrosier · Post by **jhrosier** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 3:14 pm

The one thing that nobody has mentioned is the noticeable decline in quality of .22 ammo.
Except for the $8 per 50 rds. target ammo, the rest varies wildly in quality from box to box.
I shot the plain old high velocity Remingtons for years with very good results.
The last couple of boxes that I bought had loose bullets, crushed cases, and many misfires.
I've shot .22 ammo for 45 years and never had so many dud rounds as I've gotten in the last couple of years, and this is with several different manufacturers.
I keep expecting to find "made in China" on the bottom of the boxes.

I can hear and feel the difference in recoil and report when I shoot my rifles.
The rounds with less report always hit low out of the group.

Jack

a357lever · Post by **a357lever** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 6:07 pm

i found the magnim to shoot better than long rifle in my 51/2".

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:07 pm

Jack,

Has this reduction in quality come from any particular brands or all of them in general?
I just don't shoot that much .22 RF so I'm not the one to know about this.

Although the absolute worse .22LR I've ever shot is that black cased Russian stuff that was available about 10 or 12 years ago. Talk about zero consistency. I think out of a brick of 500 no two were close to being alike.

Joe

Lefty Dude · Post by **Lefty Dude** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:57 pm

Try some of the Winchester 333 or 555 bulk copper washed.
36 gr. Rimfire hollow point 1280fps. Cabela's or WM.

Also Federal makes a 510b, 40 gr. solid. WalMart carries these.

jhrosier · Post by **jhrosier** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 10:04 pm

J Miller wrote:Jack,

Has this reduction in quality come from any particular brands or all of them in general?
...

Joe,
I hesitate to paint with too broad a brush, but a lot of the .22 LR ammo that I have recently bought made by Federal, Winchester, and Remington seems to show inconsistencies at best, and poor quality control in general.
I don't see any reason that the least expensive ammo should be made with missing priming compound, loose or crooked bullets, or cases bulged or dented so as to be unable to chamber, yet I see these faults regularly in most domestic brands.
I don't expect field grade or promotional ammo to give gilt edge accuracy, but there is no reason that it should not be reliable.

As I said earlier, the premium priced target ammo seems to largely free of these sort of defects, while the field grade or promotional ammo has become increasingly and noticeably unreliable.
I believe that the root of this problem is that lawyers and accountants run the ammo companies and the current crop of new shooters are poorly educated consumers who are willing to accept poor quality as the norm.

As to accuracy, it has long been recognised that there are subtle differences in the loadings of even the best quality ammo and the most carefully constructed firearms, and these differences can make an important difference in performance. It seems like there are few firearms that will perform equally well with every brand of ammo.

The best promotional ammo that I have used for the last couple of years is the Federal 36 gr in the 550 rd bulk packs. I shoot about 5000 rounds of this a year and have noticed very few duds or loose bullets, considerably less than 1% .The Federal 40 gr Auto Match bulk pack ammo is also very good stuff. Between these two I can get acceptable accuracy for casual target shooting in just about any gun. For finicky autoloaders, the CCI MiniMags, while not inexpensive, are still the best first choice. They are higher in velocity than most other brands and will function even the famously balky Sig Mosquito.

My favorite ammo used to be the Remington #1522, 40 gr solids, now known as Remington Golden. I shot many cases of this stuff back in the day at NRA Hunter's Pistol competitions. It had just a bit more power than most other brands and the acuracy was more than sufficient for competition. The last two bulk pack that I bought of this stuff was world-class bad. It had every fault named above, in addition to a few rounds missing either bullet, powder, or primer!

I have not heard anyone speak well of any of the Winchester promotional ammo and have not bought any recently for this reason. The recent shortages of ammunition have limited my ability to evaluate most others, and the shortages in my wallet have limited my purchases of 'target' ammo to practically nothing.

Jack

Post by **Old Savage** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 1:29 pm

I measured all the cylinder chambers in the LR cylinder in two aspects 90 degrees to each other and found them to be consistent at .225 and none seemed to be out of round. This is a recent manufacture convertible blued with 6.5 in barrel - seems to be quite accurate with mags and less so with LRs but I haven't shot it enough to be sure.

My very accurate K22 appears to measure .2235 to .224.

J Miller · Post by **J Miller** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:05 pm

Old Savage wrote:I measured all the cylinder chambers in the LR cylinder in two aspects 90 degrees to each other and found them to be consistent at .225 and none seemed to be out of round. This is a recent manufacture convertible blued with 6.5 in barrel - seems to be quite accurate with mags and less so with LRs but I haven't shot it enough to be sure.

My very accurate K22 appears to measure .2235 to .224.

The point is, the chamber dimensions are consistent. This is what is important I think. My LR chambers were all over the place. Now they are consistent. Weather or not this will make a dramatic improvement, I don't know yet.
And it falls into what I've seen here on this thread. The newer Single Sixes seem to be made with closer attention to tolerances.

Perhaps I should look for a NM LR cylinder?

Joe

Post by **Old Savage** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 2:48 pm

Yes Joe, this example seems excellent in all the ways I look at it. Ruger has been uneven in this respect over time.

I measured some Win 22 LR and Mags and the what I could measure of the bullet by the rim they both measure .2235" to .224".