Clones/Replicas

[Old Savage]

While the real old firearms are neat I have to say I like the best of the replicas - Shiloh Sharps, TC, Rossi 92s, Pietta/Uberti the best because they use modern materials and you can shoot them and use them without any concern of doing them harm or abusing their value. I realize the that some of the oldies are OK for that too. I also like to see what modern manufacturing can do for them. I understand the the old 92s will not take the stress the new ones can and the Shilohs are among the strongest out there I understand. Also the new 86s.

[JerryB]

OS, I tend to agree with you on the 92's, don't have any of the others.I have a 1917 1892 32wcf rifle and two Rossi 92's.One is a .357 SRCtaht is my truck gun, and a .45Colt carbine. They are smooth and excellent quality.

[Old Savage]

The 45 Colt 92s can be a little powerhouse. Don't know that any finer firearms have been made that the Shiloh Sharps and of course thrown in the Freedom Arms and the Miroku 86s etc.

[Wes]

I have to admit that I didn't care much for the clones until I had one. The one I'm shooting now is a Cimmaron 92 take down in 44-40. Once I got the right size bullet it works really well. Very slick and fun shooting rifle. Good trigger on this one too.
It's usually loaded and handy by the door for quick use around the ranch and barns for coons, badgers, and various other varmints. Used it butchering beef too.

[Pete44ru]

I especially liked the high grades, like the 1886EL, and some of the commemoratives - since it was a relative inexpensive way to get my greasy paws on a discontinued configuration (like a 24" bbl'd .32 Special) at half or less the $$$ of a gennie.

Besides which, they were puredee to contemplate & enjoy, during those "slow" waiting times on stand/post when game wasn't around.

.

[kimwcook]

I have a Win/Miroku '86 and it's an excellent rifle. I'm on the cusp of getting an Uberti '73 and I hope it's as well made as I've read it is. My only experience (insert bad here) with an Uberti product was years ago on a Cimarron SAA clone and it seems all the metal was too soft and the barrel came loose. It was accurate while it lasted though, will give it that.

I've contemplated getting an original, but like OS said, the new ones are built with modern steels so I can load smokeless or BP whichever I choose. Getting an original in decent shooting shape is usually a high dollar proposition and they aren't close enough to me to personally inspect them. So my alternative would be to purchase without actually inspecting the piece and make a decision on pictures over the internet and seller description. Caveat emptor, good or bad. I'm probably going with an Uberti.

[CowboyTutt]

I think the Rossi '92's can be a bit spotty in the quality control department but can be very nice guns if you find a good one. The quality of the other clones you mention are very good indeed.

-Tutt

[COSteve]

I think the Rossi '92's can be a bit spotty in the quality control department but can be very nice guns if you find a good one. The quality of the other clones you mention are very good indeed.

-Tutt

I must have gotten lucky then as both my 357 Rossi '92s are great.

[Old Savage]

The ones I have seen new in the last 6 months have all been good.

My Pietta 1860 is a fine piece.

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

I have a Win/Miroku '86 and it's an excellent rifle. I'm on the cusp of getting an Uberti '73 and I hope it's as well made as I've read it is. My only experience (insert bad here) with an Uberti product was years ago on a Cimarron SAA clone and it seems all the metal was too soft and the barrel came loose. It was accurate while it lasted though, will give it that.

I've contemplated getting an original, but like OS said, the new ones are built with modern steels so I can load smokeless or BP whichever I choose. Getting an original in decent shooting shape is usually a high dollar proposition and they aren't close enough to me to personally inspect them. So my alternative would be to purchase without actually inspecting the piece and make a decision on pictures over the internet and seller description. Caveat emptor, good or bad. I'm probably going with an Uberti.

The early Uberti SAA's are now known as the "D" cam guns. They had some add-on liability parts that required a funny shaped bolt cam on the hammer. Plus, the bolts where shaped more like the early 1st gen colt and were too pointed. That pointy bolt finger and funny cam didn't last too long. The finger would chew the cam away and before long you had the dreaded ring-around-the-cylinder.
The current Uberti guns don't have those parts and the bolt is more rounded so they tend to hold up better. But, I think the current Pietta made EMF GWII's are even better. They have the round tip bolt fingers plus they have removeable recoil/firing pin bushing and the Ruger type coil spring for the hand/pawl. In the colt that spring and the trigger bolt spring(the flat versions) are the two weakest parts.

FWIW, the Armi Sport Chiappa folks told me they were going to send me one of their 86's sometime around the first of the year.

[Mike D.]

I own both post-1900 1886s and Miroku clones. Frankly, there isn't much difference between the older Nickel Steel guns than the new ones. Both are fine with any modern loaded ammo, including those by Buffalo Bore and Garrett. Winchester rated the NS at 100,000 PSI, and I have no idea what the "modern" steels are rated at. I do know that 50K loads function fine in the Miroku '86s. The so-called Ruger No 1 loads won't damage the new guns, either, but my loads are puny and max out at 38K.

[Griff]

OS, I agree with ya. While I've got several antique Winchester 94s, nobody, since FN closed the doors on USRA, makes a clone; I have no basis of comparison. (I don't own one of the USRA clones either, you know... the AE mdl)!

However, in handguns... I haven't met an Italian clone that is a Colt's equal. The USFA, STI & FA's however... clearly animals of a different stripe, if one is inclined to hang the "clone" label on them.

In rifles, it gets more convoluted, IMO. The Browning 1886 I have is every bit as good as any of the originals my BIL has... and superior metallurgy, IMO. The Rossi clones of the 1892, however, are NOT nearly as good as the one original winchester 1892 I've owned. I do believe that they are made of better steels, just poorly finished. The Uberti 1873 rifle and 1860 steel framed Henry I own are both GREAT copies, smooth and slick outta the box, with good wood to metal fit and nicely finished. I have HEARD of folks that don't think much of their Uberti Model 1873, but haven't personally experienced same.

I can't speak to the shotguns, such as the clones of the Colt 1878 and Winchester's 1887 or 1897 from China, even though I have shot one of each. I wasn't particularily impressed, but then the only original of the 3 I've shot was an 1897... and that didn't impress me much either.

So, while I generally agree, and substantially so when you consider the far longer life you leave the original when you shoot with a clone.

However, I must admit... I love my 1905 Elgin sz 16 pocket watch, with it's 17 jeweled movement... It's a far handsomer piece than any of the quartz clones I've seen... no matter how fancy they try to make 'em!

[rjohns94]

I like the quality of the guns you mention. What they miss for me is the history factor. I like the feel and the connection of the old to the present. My original 1886 and 1890's shotgun just feel right while in the field hunting game. I also like the replicas for their functionality and feel, my NKJ '92 in .357 and my FA in .475 Linebaugh. Only problem is my hunting is only two weeks with all these firearms and I have a hard time knowing which to use.

[Old Savage]

rj - for me, I am making the history with them that is important to me. Except of course the ones that were given to me.

[Ysabel Kid]

Nothing like a true original in ones hands, but for most folks, the cost is simply prohibitive. The modern-made reproductions put the same kind of gun affordably in the hands of many shooters, who then go out and really shoot the darn things since they don't have to fear the loss of potentially thousands of dollars of value with even basic ongoing use. A win-win if there ever was one!

[phc45-70]

It would seem to me, a gun you will not shoot for fear of it loosing monetary value, ceases to be anything more than an expensive paperweight. This is akin to what I have seen a lot of older folks do who went through the depression. They would save things for what they called the " good". Things like linens and china and table cloths. These people died, never having used these things they were saving for the "good" and their decendants or whomever became the only people to benefit from it.
That being said I picked up a Taurus "Gaucho" a clone of a Colt SAA and I am very pleased with it and it didn't cost an and a leg.

[Hobie]

I wanted a firearm to shoot to experience. I didn't want to expose an original to what might be my ham-handedness. In that regard the repro is the way to go and what I did to experience the Winchester 1876 toggle link gun.

I do get the greatest pleasure of "ownership" (as temporary as it might be) when I hold an artifact and reflect on the history in which it may have participated. A connection with those who have come before.

[pharmseller]

I do like my Browning model 71!




Pharmseller

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

Collect-ability isn't an issue for this fella either. He plans to use this Browning 71.

[El Chivo]

in general I don't see the thrill in old guns, I do see that for other things like guitars and violins, but guns should be new.

I think the replicas are a great idea, especially if they work a little better.

[CowboyTutt]

Collect-ability isn't an issue for this fella either. He plans to use this Browning 71

Steve, I hope you do! I look forward to hearing about it. Very beautiful rifle (and yes, I'm a tad jealous!)

-Andy

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

Collect-ability isn't an issue for this fella either. He plans to use this Browning 71

Steve, I hope you do! I look forward to hearing about it. Very beautiful rifle (and yes, I'm a tad jealous!)

-Andy

It's not mine. It belongs to a customer. I just mounted the Scout scope for him.

[Grizzly Adams]

I love old Winchesters, and have a number of them. My favorites are the models 1873 and the 1876. Now for shooting, the new replicas of both those models are, IMHO, far better than the originals. Better materials, and safer to use with smokeless powders. The Browning/USRA/Japanese copies are unmatched in quality and strength.

[Slick]

I'm quite fond of my modern-day Miroku 1886 take-down in .45-70



It handles anything a Marlin 1895 will take. The barrel is quite slick as I've pushed OT cast bullets at close to 2300fps without any leading...

The short gun case conceals (somewhat) the contents of the package (and holds a Trapper as well).

[the telegraphist]

I have a Win/Miroku '86 and it's an excellent rifle. I'm on the cusp of getting an Uberti '73 and I hope it's as well made as I've read it is. My only experience (insert bad here) with an Uberti product was years ago on a Cimarron SAA clone and it seems all the metal was too soft and the barrel came loose. It was accurate while it lasted though, will give it that.

I've contemplated getting an original, but like OS said, the new ones are built with modern steels so I can load smokeless or BP whichever I choose. Getting an original in decent shooting shape is usually a high dollar proposition and they aren't close enough to me to personally inspect them. So my alternative would be to purchase without actually inspecting the piece and make a decision on pictures over the internet and seller description. Caveat emptor, good or bad. I'm probably going with an Uberti.

Gday Sir,
I bought a Uberti 1873 2 years ago now in 44/40, the wood to metal fit is excellent. Shes a 24 inch octagonal barrel and shoots really well. I would not hesitate to buy another in 38/40 if I could find one. Love the classic cartridges. The Winchester originals in my part of the world are very expensive and in not that good a condition to shoot. So progress has overtaken nostalgia in all practical terms.

Rgd