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All this talk of the .444 has thinking I need one for these monster TX whitetails I hunt every 20 years or so.
The first deer I took was with a .30-30 20+ years ago (despite what the pundits claim it can do he was DRT ) and the second was a Blackbuck doe with 86er in August with a .44 Mag 94AE.
If I ever get a chance to get back down there with 86er I want another BB (or whitetail) and a hog. A .45-70 will certainly do the job, but maybe the Marlin 1895CB or H&R Buffalo Classic needs to become a .444 Marlin (by way of trade or new barrel of course )?
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
H&R is now building .444 rifles. So I would send the Buffalo Classic back for a barrel. It would handle really nice too I imagine, with the straight grip of the Classic. Alot cheaper and your not gettin' rid of any guns to do it. Thanks, Tom
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CEMENTHEAD wrote:H&R is now building .444 rifles. So I would send the Buffalo Classic back for a barrel. It would handle really nice too I imagine, with the straight grip of the Classic. Alot cheaper and your not gettin' rid of any guns to do it. Thanks, Tom
Good point...
Given that I want to send the SB2 Handi in for a couple of barrels, why not do the BC as well?
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
Borregos wrote:There is nothing wrong with having 45-70's and 444's in your safe
No, they weren't arguing...maybe they're just pleading for me to buy them some new friends...yeah, that's it...now I KNOW I'm hearing voices...!
Maybe they were plotting over what to do if you don't follow through on their wishes. My grandfather's 94 in .30-30 has organized the 742 in .30-06 and the Model Seven in .308 and now they want a Puma 92 in .357 and a Marlin 1895 in either .45-70 or .450 Marlin, and maybe a Mossberg 464 in .22 LR when they finally come out. Since all three (94, 742, and Seven) have taken deer for me, I'm thinkin' that I need to listen to them.
My Remington Model Seven in .308 ganged up with several of my milsurp rifles and a custom .303British and made me add a Ruger .44 carbine and a Marlin 1895 in 45-70.THEN...that group had enough organization to force the addition of a Ruger 7-1/2" super Redhawk and a Taurus .44 Special.I've given up trying to control it and just got them their own credit card.Last I heard they had gotten a super deal on a Walther P-38 and an M-1 Garand.
Now they are talking another safe due to space limitations.
Stan
The more I listen,the more I hear....and vice versa.
Boy, I wouldn't get rid of the Marlin CB... no way.
I know I'll probably rile some by saying this, but the 45-70 is the better (practially speaking) caliber. You can down load both so they are equal in that regard, but the 45-70 can push a 400 grain bullet 2000 fps or better and it can go up to 500 grains at 1600 fps if you want that. The 444 is pretty much topped out at 300 grains.
And you can load the 45-70 with 300 grian bullets to match the 444's velocity and it only gives a little BC up to the 444.
So, I would keep the Marlin.
If you're dieing to get the 444 then definately get a barrel fitted to your H&R. That'd be what I'd do.
Glad you brought up the voices from the gun safe. I though I was the only one who heard them at night. Have 3 45-70's, 444 Timber Carbine and 6 other levers. When they start talking I can't resist.
Borregos wrote:There is nothing wrong with having 45-70's and 444's in your safe
Are your sure they won't quarrel with one another...? Sometimes I hear voices coming from the gun safe, and it sounds like fighting.
Maybe not. That's crazy to think guns would argue like that. What was I thinking.
No, they weren't arguing...maybe they're just pleading for me to buy them some new friends...yeah, that's it...now I KNOW I'm hearing voices...!
And I thought I was the only one... but whenever I open the door, they all seem to be sayin' "ME... ME... ME... no ME!"... sure makes deciding amongst the many difficult.
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession! AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
O.S.O.K. wrote:The 444 is pretty much topped out at 300 grains.
I have run across data up to around 400 grains, and the twist rate was apparently adequate for stabilizing the rounds; the main problem was having to use a Lee "Factory Crimp" die and crimp forward of the bullet groove.
Still, I'd agree that if you want the really big bullets, the .45-70 obviously has an edge; unfortunately, the OAL limitation for the .444 complicates things, and the twist may be adequate, but is marginal, for the long bullets.
Best answer - get BOTH!
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws "first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
in winchester rifles, the only real reason to choose a .444 over a 45-70, is the rifles themselves. the 94 vs. the 86. the 45-70 will always be a more powerfull, more versatile, cheaper to shoot and easier to obtain cartridge. for the big stuff, elephants and buffaloe, you can't beat the 45-70. the reason to choose the .444 bb over the 86 45-70, is smaller, shorter and lighter, better handling. the 444 is enough for nort hamerican game. the 45-70 does better on big stuff. the trade off is the difference in size in weight between the 1894 and the 1886src. just my humble opion.
I would shoot one before you abandon your .45-70. I had one of each for awhile, then sold the .444. The .45-70 will do all the .444 will and a lot more. Have had a a few dozen .45-70s since, and plan on getting more before it's said and done. Just my thoughts
I decided if I wanted big I would go with big after having both and selling both I bought a 45-70. Then ---- I bought another 444 because ---- I like the rifle.
In the High Desert of Southern Calif. ..."on the cutting edge of going back in time"...
) and the second was a Blackbuck doe with 86er in August with a .44 Mag 94AE.
Thanks, Tom
coming from the gun safe, and it sounds like fighting. 
