OT - what milsurp rifle under $200 makes the best hunter?

O.S.O.K. · Post by **O.S.O.K.** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:50 pm

As-issued that is - not sporterized.

I'm going to start with my choice and why.

The SMLE No4 - either MkI or II.

They shoot a 308 class cartridge that is loaded by several major domestic and a slew of international ammo makers, are iron-sight range accurate, hold 10 rounds in their mags and can be blocked to hold only 5 with just a piece of wood. They are muzzle heavy which makes them great off-hand shooters. They have excellent, fully adjustable aperture sights. They are durable and very fast to cycle. Can be fitted with a bayonet for close quarters hog hunting. And finally, they look cool to me.

So, what's your choice and why?

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:56 pm

Best hunter as in most accurate, largest game it can take, or least expensive - or a combination of all three? The Russian Moisin Nagant in 7.62 x 54R is another fine choice, though ammunition options are not as great - for hunting.

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:58 pm

Back when I bought my three, it was the Swedish 96's

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:05 pm

Well, YK said the Mosin and I agree if the bolt doesn't need opend with a mallet. Makes that follow up shot kinda trickey.

Mojo makes click adjustable arpeture sights for the Mosins and hand rolled ammo will make them very, very deadly. How does a 220gr RN at about 2300-2400fps sound? Sounds deadly to me.

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:09 pm

I'd say those Big 5 Mosin Carbines would be about the cheapest (under $100), lightest with plenty of punch..And has a handy gizmo on it for roasting marshmellos 'round the campfire!

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:11 pm

Yes, but they are uglier than a mud fence

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:34 pm

"Uglier than a mud fence" For sure! I got my Swede 96 for $90 back in the day..My all time favorite Milsurp

mescalero1 · Post by **mescalero1** » Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:59 pm

I think mine were less than that, sad part of story; two of them squandered by unappreciative recipents.

revolverjunkie · Post by **revolverjunkie** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:27 am

i was partial to the m98 mausers when you could pickem up for a song (like $90) if you could get one that didin't have a shot out barrel get some S&B softpoints and get after that elk or bear or whatever your choice of game may be.

revolverjunkie · Post by **revolverjunkie** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:28 am

oh had another thought what are those smle's runing for now anyway iv'e always liked the look but never bougt one

JReed · Post by **JReed** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:48 am

Well here is my No4 Mk1 in her hunting clothes. I have to agree it is a great gun for shooting from field positions is very accurate and is just darn cool when everyne else is shooting modern bolts.

And here is her evening dress

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:41 am

I have a No. 4 (or two) and a Swede. The Swede 38 is a great hunting gun, not so much the 96. We had a forum member who used a K31. Friends used 1903A3s. All about 6 of one half dozen of the other.

aussie · Post by **aussie** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:14 am

I have a SMLE #4 and it is great fun. But you stted 308? Mine's a 303.

aussie.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:33 am

I have a M98 in 7.62 that I paid around $125 for. It's old enough that no FFL was involved. Have the bayonet just in case. But too long for comfortable woods walking. It would make a good 400 yard gun with young eyes or a scope.

I've had my eyes open for an enfield but all the ones I see are hammered and have the stupid importer markings and mis-matched serial numbers. Don't even know why I like 'em, but that would be my .308 choice.

Slick13 · Post by **Slick13** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:48 am

IF you can find one for less than $200, 1903A. Why? .30-06, decent sights, and light weight.

~Michael

Pete44ru · Post by **Pete44ru** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:04 am

I don't expect one could be bought today for under $200, but that's more than what I paid for a #5 Jungle Carbine in .303 British, about ten years ago.
Short/light/handy/powerful/peeped - what's not to like ?

My best friend drooled on it so much, always asking to borrow it, that I finally gave it to him as a gift, one Christmas.

.

Post by **AmBraCol** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:02 am

aussie wrote:I have a SMLE #4 and it is great fun. But you stted 308? Mine's a 303.

aussie.

"308 CLASS" - although I think he got it backwards. The 303 predates the 308 by quite a few years, in other words, the 308 is in the "303 class of cartridges"...

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:03 am

Since my 03A3 won't fit under the $200 catagory

My favorites are my Lithgow No1 and my Finn 39.

The Finn rifle will edge out the Lithgow accuracy wise but I
love the way the Enfield carrys and shoots.

I'll have to get a photo of the 39, worn but a shooter!

My favorite lithgow...

jb

scr83jp · Post by **scr83jp** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:17 am

Long before most of you were born the best deals were with 03A3 Remingtons in 1962 the NRA was selling them for $14.95 change to a Smith Corona barrel,have a good gunsmith drill & tap the receiver,get a good Bishop or Fajen stock.I've seen lots of customized 1903 Springfields & 03A3 Remington Rifles.

Old Time Hunter · Post by **Old Time Hunter** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:26 am

Well, let me see, have M1, a few K98k's, a No1 Mk3 ($5), a few Mosin's, a M96 Swede, a bunch of Springfield Trapdoors (yes, Melvin they are Milsurps), and a type 99 Arisaka 7.7. My most accurate is probably the M96, the smoothest is the Enfield, and the most powerful are the K98k's. But...if I have to beat anyone over the head with 'em, I'll take the cheap Mosin's. Fairly accurate, a ton of load options, rugged as a tank, ugly as mule (but not as ugly as the Enfield), and comes equiped with a really neat screw driver that can be used as a pig sticker.

O.S.O.K. · Post by **O.S.O.K.** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:49 am

Yeah, the .308 Win is a .303Brit/30-40Krag class cartridge for sure

And yes, I'm talking about what you can get right now for $200 or less that makes the best hunting rig - as-issued. Though, putting your rifle into a poly stock for hunting w/o modifying anything is a great idea - keeps the wood in good shape!

I love my m96-38 Swede Mauser, but it's a $350-400 gun now.

The current choices are something like this:

various types of Mosin Nagants (though the Finns are now above $200)
SMLE's - and they are edging up in price
Mausers like the 24/47 Yugo
K-31 Swiss
Hungarian 1895's
Yugo SKS

And I think that's about it...

slimster · Post by **slimster** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:30 pm

Still plenty of 98k mausers around out there due to total production (iirc) of 10-13 million from the Nazi beginnings through the end of wwII. Many of these can be had for under 200$ due to the collector value being ruined because of the irrational dinking of any and all Nazi markings due to sentiments after the war in addition to being mis-matched in component serial numbers. The 8mm mauser is a fine cartridge in the 30-06 category and makes a fine all around hunting choice. In my opinion the K98k is also one of the best looking of the military arms ever. Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend!

O.S.O.K. · Post by **O.S.O.K.** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:22 pm

Well, to be consistent, the 30-06 is a fine cartridge in the 8mm category

I chose the SMLE - specifically the No.4 because of the sights - I can still shoot Mausers and such pretty well but I'm getting to the point where the "close to the eyes" aperture sights are really apreciated.

Bruce Scott · Post by **Bruce Scott** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:18 pm

Another vote for the LE.

The No1 Mk III was for many years the high power hunting rifle in Oz and they took everything, including buffalo. My favourite is the No5 carbine but they are well over $200 now

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:02 pm

I like the No 4 sight but ladder down only..flip that sucker up and pert near half the field of view is blocked... So I guess I really like the No1 MKIII* better... smoother action too.. as for the aperture.. It will soon be wearing this P.H. Model 5a

O.S.O.K. · Post by **O.S.O.K.** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:08 pm

As issue.

And I don't agree about the sight picture on the issue No.4 sights. They are fine for me.

Both eyes open right?

That's an elegant piece of machinery there though - very nice.

And the SMLE is the undisputed King of international hunting rifles - due to the proliferant and extremely sucessful British Empire. No doubt.

I am proud that at least 1/2 of my ancestory is from the UK. The other half from Bavaria.

And now, an American and also very proud of that

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:23 pm

Both eyes open...Just felt like I wasn't seeing all I wanted with the ladder up...It was OK for paper punchin and slow fire plinking.. Got the best of both now with the Smelly

horsesoldier03 · Post by **horsesoldier03** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:47 am

My model 44 Mosin Nagant would be the rifle hands down. I purchased the rifle 2-3 yrs ago for $70 out the door. Its a great shooter and pretty much shoot to point of aim with iron sights out to 200 yards. The only draw back is trying to mount a scope.

Borregos · Post by **Borregos** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:27 am

SMLE No 4 is my choice.
I have one that the Canadian Armoury rebarreled to 308, I would take that!

preventec47 · Post by **preventec47** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:11 am

If you ad cheap milsurp ammo availability then you are limited to 8mm Mauser
and 7.62 x 54R Since you are on a gun budget it is doubtful you want to blow
a lot on plinking ammo.
I think the Turk Mausers are the over best deal going but they are big
and long and consequently dont kick much but are the devil to carry
to some. Once you get to the stand, it doesnt much matter.

I hunt with mine at 12 pounds ( incl scope ) and slung over my back by
sling, heck the extra few pounds is about the same as drinking a
couple softdrinks and a few bergers. I really dont notice the weight
unless I am carrying it like a barbell. Sure is pleasant to shoot.

I just got some 125 grains 323 Hornady bullets and have a load recipe
for 3200 fps out of the Mauser. I now call it my deer huntin varminter!

The 91/30's and M44's are certainly the cheapest but I want to throw
up my breakfast when working the action compared to the Mauser
and that is after doing work to smooth the action.
Surely the extra fifty bucks for the Mauser is worth it to have
a fine engineering and precision machining over the clunky Russian Rifles.

dennie · Post by **dennie** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:00 am

I have a M-N 44 and am wondering how you get the safety off for a quick shot, when needed.
I am not a small or weak fella, but jeez, that safety must be the worst on just about any rifle.
Could carry with an empty chamber, I guess, and just crank in a round when needed. That would seem faster to me than trying to get the blessed safety off. However, you make tons of noise when loading the round.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 10:08 am

Slick13 wrote:IF you can find one for less than $200, 1903A. Why? .30-06, decent sights, and light weight.

~Michael

...light weight...

With the original wood, mine seems only marginally lighter weight than a Garand. Still - a nice gun. I always wanted to put aperture sights on it but haven't found any to fit it.

cjm135 · Post by **cjm135** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 5:01 pm

horsesoldier03 wrote:My model 44 Mosin Nagant would be the rifle hands down. I purchased the rifle 2-3 yrs ago for $70 out the door. Its a great shooter and pretty much shoot to point of aim with iron sights out to 200 yards. The only draw back is trying to mount a scope.

My M44 would diffentely do the job. Use a 180g SP (Wolf brand). The 7.62x54r is equal to the Winchester .308. Are far as a scope set up, there is a mount that requires no drilling. It is attach to the adjustable rear sight bracket. Here is where you can buy one. Contact Darrell.

Darrell's Scout Mounts
e-mail m39scout@bellsouth.net
phone 251-937-7035
Darrell Harrison
PO Box 727
Bay Minette,AL 36507

shawn_c992001 · Post by **shawn_c992001** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:39 pm

If you can find one a Ismash (sp) Enfield jungle carbine in .308 Win. Short, light, detachable mag, and mine is a tack driver. They were made by an Indian firm.

Slick13 · Post by **Slick13** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 5:58 pm

AJMD429 wrote:
Slick13 wrote:IF you can find one for less than $200, 1903A. Why? .30-06, decent sights, and light weight.

~Michael
...light weight...

With the original wood, mine seems only marginally lighter weight than a Garand.

Garand's have always felt much heavier to me than my 03A3.

Maybe well balanced is a better description than light weight. While not a Winchester Model 94, there's something about an 03A3 that feels right and makes it easy to carry.

~Michael

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 6:40 pm

shawn_c992001 wrote:If you can find one a Ismash (sp) Enfield jungle carbine in .308 Win. Short, light, detachable mag, and mine is a tack driver. They were made by an Indian firm.

Ishapore is what you're thinking of. Never had one but I hear good things about them.

O.S.O.K. wrote:The current choices are something like this:

various types of Mosin Nagants (though the Finns are now above $200)
SMLE's - and they are edging up in price
Mausers like the 24/47 Yugo
K-31 Swiss
Hungarian 1895's
Yugo SKS

And I think that's about it...

Yeah and the SKS really isn't .308 class or so I hear.

Even beater Arisakas go for over $200 around here. The SMLE No1 MKIII* gets my vote along with the K31 based on your parameters.

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 6:51 pm

awp101

Ishapore is what you're thinking of. Never had one but I hear good things about them.

http://www.izhmash.ru/eng/product/weapon.shtml

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:37 pm

Ben_Rumson wrote:awp101
Ishapore is what you're thinking of. Never had one but I hear good things about them.
http://www.izhmash.ru/eng/product/weapon.shtml

They don't make .308 Enfields though...Ishapore in India did.

Izhmash makes good stuff though.

Ben_Rumson · Post by **Ben_Rumson** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:45 pm

levers · Post by **levers** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 11:08 pm

I kind of like the Jap 99 in 7.7. Easy to reload and VERY strong. Mine is quite accurate. It liked the old Remingon bulk 215gr .313 diameter (I can't find them anymore) and it does pretty good with the .312 diameter bullets too.

I don't know how cheap they are anymore. Usually the cheapest ones are the ones already sporterized. You have to watch them as I've seen several that the safety would pop off and the insides of the bolt slide out the back......not sure what causes that.

Kansas Ed · Post by **Kansas Ed** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 7:15 pm

I like the #4 SMLE also, but mark me up for the Canadian Long Branch model...Canadian Walnut...usually fairly nice pieces of it too...and the absolutely slickest action of ANY bolt rifle I've ever shot....

Ed

Mutt · Post by **Mutt** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 7:57 pm

The rifle pictured looks like a 303 Brit that I once owned . Strong tough and good shooting ammo . Would last several more or better life times . You can't beat it. Even tigers and larger game have been taken with this. Not counting war time success..................................Mutt

don Tomás · Post by **don Tomás** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:34 pm

ceb · Post by **ceb** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:36 pm

I too have one of the Canadian Long Branch No4* rifles. Slick and accurate, its my choice.