Home generator …?

[AJMD429]

.
I installed an auto-start home generator around 2005 or so… at least the ‘electrical’ part (I know how to do that part).

I don’t know how to run and install propane, and the contractor we spoke to at the time was going to run 75 ft of soft copper line buried only six inches in soft sand that went under an area we occasionally drive a tractor on, so we hesitated…then Obamacare hit and my income dropped from $120k to $24k. So we shelved the project.

Now the generator has sat all this time outside, never run, and essentially in factory condition.

We plan to get propane hooked up (even if I have to do it myself since we can’t seem to find anyone who will set up a deeper or more secure run).

However - I’m not sure what to inspect or how to check to see if the generator is ‘ok’ to just fire up without some inspection or maintenance. After all it is 15 or so years ‘old’ but zero run-hours.

Any suggestions…?

[GunnyMack]

CHANGE THE OIL!!

The only thing that might be an issue is the generator portion, lots of dissimilar metals( copper, aluminum, bearings) that sometimes corrosion can seize the genset.
Another thing to think about are mouse nests inside the covers.

I would contact the manufacturer and get info for installers in your area to come do a service call- it will have to have a fuel supply.

18" is the code here for gas lines. I suppose 6" would be ok IF the copper line is inside schedule 40 PVC( 3000 LBS CRUSH).

[Griff]

CHANGE THE OIL!!

The only thing that might be an issue is the generator portion, lots of dissimilar metals( copper, aluminum, bearings) that sometimes corrosion can seize the genset.
Another thing to think about are mouse nests inside the covers.

I would contact the manufacturer and get info for installers in your area to come do a service call- it will have to have a fuel supply.

18" is the code here for gas lines. I suppose 6" would be ok IF the copper line is inside schedule 40 PVC( 3000 LBS CRUSH).

Ditto. I don't know how deep your frost line is, but your line should be at least below that depth. I would also consider galvanized piping, insulating it where it comes above that frost line. I don't know if IN is like TX, but check with your City/County (whichever is appropriate), permit department and they should have whatever info you need for buying any sort of piping.

[ollogger]

Hi Do you have a tank hooked up to it? yep the line should be 18 in, deep with locater tape with it, any more they use a code plastic line for propane, copper & galvinized in time can leak, do you have a local propane company
in your area such as AmeriGas or local CO-OPs? they would be your best bet for help, if i was closer i could hook it up
for ya,



ollogger

[Grizz]

take the plugs out and crank it enough to get the oil pressure up to operating range. seriously, there is no oil in the conrod or main bearing oil passages.

it's normal to run a standby engine periodically to keep it oiled up and keep the seals oiled up. if it were me I would run it with a load on it every other month, and maybe every month in the winter. otherwise you have a big maybe when the lights go off.

[JBowen]

If your inlet pressure to the regulator calls for less than 50 to 60 lbs., then I would go with plastic gas line specifically for propane.
I worked at the gas company for 30 years and I have seen a lot of leaks on copper and steel gas lines. I have been involved in installing
emergency generators at our compressor stations and we used plastic. 18 inches deep should be fine if you don't have heavy trucks running over it and make sure if it is rocky soil to bed it in with sand or top soil.

In my area there are licensed plumbers who are certified and has the proper equipment to install plastic.

What size of a unit is it? Is it an air cooled or does it have a radiator? If it has a radiator it may need to be flushed and refilled with coolant.

JBowen

[Sixgun]

Propane? They can be problematic. Gasoline for mine and easier to get if things go bad….my Generac 6500 will run an easy 12 hours on one tank.

I run all of my small engines….at least 8-10…..at least 15 minutes every other month and always with stabilizer and 93 octane gas.

Like Griz says, if it’s been sitting that long under questionable conditions….pull the plugs and even squirt some rust dissolving oils and slowly crank it…..I’ve seen piston rings frozen to the cylinder wall and break when firing up……...

I hope you don’t neglect your body the same way….——-00

[marlinman93]

I installed generators of every size imaginable for decades, and every generator should be exercised once a month. A brand new generator, or not, sitting with valves partially open in various levels of humidity will be worrisome to me. It's all bare metal inside, and without being turned over occasionally bad things can happen. I certainly hope you get lucky, and yours is fine.
I would at least change the oil as mentioned. I'd not use the idiot who said he'd run copper tubing 6" deep as it wont even meet code at that depth, and needs to be 24" to the highest point of the line until it turns vertical to break ground level at each end.

[marlinman93]

Propane? They can be problematic. Gasoline for mine and easier to get if things go bad….my Generac 6500 will run an easy 12 hours on one tank.

I run all of my small engines….at least 8-10…..at least 15 minutes every other month and always with stabilizer and 93 octane gas.

Like Griz says, if it’s been sitting that long under questionable conditions….pull the plugs and even squirt some rust dissolving oils and slowly crank it…..I’ve seen piston rings frozen to the cylinder wall and break when firing up……...

I hope you don’t neglect your body the same way….——-00

Propane is far less trouble than gasoline. Especially today's gasoline that often going to go bad and plug up a carb in a few months. In all the propane or natural gas generators I installed in commercial bldgs., or homes, I never heard of any issues pertaining to them being propane. Lots of issues with those running gasoline.
My home generator is dual fuel, and runs on LPG or gasoline. I chose this because if all the power is out, where will you get gas pumped? Gas pumps need power too! So having both I can run on gas if available, or LPG if it isn't. Hopefully by the time I use up both power will return.

[Sixgun]

Never knew that…….your a pretty smart guy, like really smart…….so smart it’s the first time in 16 years you quoted me……..(you just wanted to show the guys I was wrong about something...…..ooooo, I’ll get him!..)…..our forklifts at work always had issues……….

Well, thanks for letting us know that……I’m going back to Winchesters & Colts…..I’ll still stay with gasoline…too many houses blow up from gas related leaks……

[marlinman93]

Don't worry, I wont ever quote you again.

[Shrapnel]

Never knew that…….your a pretty smart guy, like really smart…….so smart it’s the first time in 16 years you quoted me……..(you just wanted to show the guys I was wrong about something...…..ooooo, I’ll get him!..)…..our forklifts at work always had issues……….

Well, thanks for letting us know that……I’m going back to Winchesters & Colts…..I’ll still stay with gasoline…too many houses blow up from gas related leaks……

Propane or natural gas is a better option than gasoline. "Popgun" doesn't want to be upstaged when he is wrong, but that happens more than he will admit. I live in Montana where there are thousands of homes in every community that heat with propane, thousands more with natural gas and never has one blown up because of a leak. Any gas, propane or natural gas can ignite due to escaping gas, but they aren't any more succeptable to explosions than gasoline that you store in your garage. "Popgun", if you fell off your ego and landed on your IQ, it would kill you!

I have a Generac 10,000 watt generator that is hooked up to natural gas and that is the best solution if you have access to natural gas, as the supply is constant and fresh. Gasoline and diesel generators have fuel that has the tendency to age and deteriorate, making propane and natural gas a better option if available.

[Sixgun]

Propane or natural gas is a better option than gasoline. "Popgun" doesn't want to be upstaged when he is wrong, but that happens more than he will admit. I live in Montana where there are thousands of homes in every community that heat with propane, thousands more with natural gas and never has one blown up because of a leak. Any gas, propane or natural gas can ignite due to escaping gas, but they aren't any more succeptable to explosions than gasoline that you store in your garage. "Popgun", if you fell off your ego and landed on your IQ, it would kill you!

I have a Generac 10,000 watt generator that is hooked up to natural gas and that is the best solution if you have access to natural gas, as the supply is constant and fresh. Gasoline and diesel generators have fuel that has the tendency to age and deteriorate, making propane and natural gas a better option if available

Thanks Shrapnel……Maybe propane is a better choice in your area where it gets cold and diesel will gel…..I don’t know, I’m just an ex blue collar uneducated nobody…….everyday is a learning process…....heck, I still heat with wood as that’s how backward I am….here, we call a 100 watt fan air conditioning.

Other than the trailer park next door, I’ve never seen anyone around here that uses propane and maybe that’s because I heard propane is twice the cost of other methods to heat. I wouldn’t know as I don’t converse with those “uppity ones over there”…..that and I don’t get out anymore as I had to sell my 1973 Jeep just for groceries at Walmart.

Good to hear from you Shrapnel and I hope everything is well and good with you and your family. Tell Mike I said “hi”. I’d tell him myself but our phone service was cut off. I’m over the neighbors house using his ancient iPad.

Your friend——6

[stretch]

Propane issues sometimes result in explosions.......

https://www.newscentermaine.com/article ... 0b42ab1e92

That's why in most areas, hookups have to be done by licensed professionals.
There's gotta be a pro somewhere near ya to do this - it's not a big job - 'course maybe that's
the problem.

In any event, I'd pull the plug(s), squirt some oil into the cylinder(s), and crank the engine over enough
to get oil circulating. Maybe pull the valve cover(s) and squirt some oil in there, too.
Warm it up and change the oil right off, and you should be fine.

Oh - make sure that you inspect the air filter, airbox, and associated plumbing - mice LOVE to make
nests in air filters.

Most of the automagic rigs in our area run on propane. I haven't had the bread, so I have to use an 8K watt
machine that I drag out of the garage and hook up outside. It works, but the hookup is annoying in bad
weather. Not as annoying as a cold shower, however.

Good luck getting it hooked up.

-Stretch

[Old Savage]

You fellows have me chuckling here at 3:30 am with the humor. Now I have to put my coffee back in the electric microwave over top my gas stove where I cooked this chicken.

This is all knee slappin hi-larious

[2ndovc]

One of the best investments I've made in some time. It will run the whole house and then some. Ours is propane driven and have plans to upgrade the size of our tank, just incase of an extended, wintertime outage. It's programmed to cycle on, run for 15 minutes and shut down every other Tuesday. Tucked in behind the house, you have to be fairly close to the property to hear it. Takes about 7-10 seconds to take over during an outage, which happens here all the time.
I have no interest in hauling and storing fuel, so the propane was our best option. The closest Nat Gas line is only 100 yds away, but the gas co won't run it under the river to the rest of our street. Apparently, our water dept. is smarter and the whole neighborhood has city water.



jb

[marlinman93]

I'd venture to say there are likely more gasoline fires from leaky fuel lines than LPG or natural gas fires. And there are millions of homes heated with, and cooking with natural gas. Anything that can cause an explosion inside a engine can explode outside if the system gets in poor shape.
The one drawback to an engine that runs off of natural gas or LPG is horsepower. It's going to produce about 15% lower HP on them than it will on gasoline. Still plenty if you buy a generator sized to handle your load though.

[Grizz]

The closest Nat Gas line is only 100 yds away, but the gas co won't run it under the river to the rest of our street. Apparently, our water dept. is smarter and the whole neighborhood has city water. jb

Nice setup. We have natural gas, but here at Rabbit Ranch I just have this:
.

7_002.jpg

.
It ran the freezer and fridge for a day and a half while the power company fixed something. It's ever-ready and goes anywhere.

My son uses these to run his freezers at his Texas Farmers Markets in Texas Brand heat, they just keep going and going and going . . .

[2ndovc]

I have a small 2500 watt Subaru. Little bugger just runs and runs.
I'd been wanting the big back up gen since I build the house. Constantly dropping hints about it. The all of a sudden Bubbles brings it up one evening and says she'd pay for half of it. I asked "why now?" and she says she wants a safe place for her granddaughter go come to if things get bad. She's something else.

jb

[Sixgun]

I’m mostly concerned about breakdowns and as I do my own maintenance and I know next to nothing about working on propane engines so I stay with gasoline…….the breakdowns ALWAYS come when using it and the last thing I need to do is find someone who will come out instantly to work on it……generators may sit for 6 months and our generator is out by the barn and if it goes down, I can usually fix it myself and if I can’t, I’ll go to the many places around here and just buy another one….no waiting, no kissing a., no nothing…..buy another and bring it home and 15 minutes later I’m good to go.

Try that with a system you had installed and are reliant on someone else. Here, I need no one for anything.

Having anything and thinking it will work when needed is false security. How many times have we heard that people go to use something that’s been sitting for a while and can’t use it when needed? Snowblowers, cars, engines of all types…air conditioners on the first hot day of the year….heaters on the first cold day?

The need for generators always happens during times of some sort of a calamity…..tornados, hurricanes, blizzards and that’s a time when everyone and their moms are calling the repair man and by the time they get to you, if they can, four days later, the damage is done or the electric is back up……

Gasoline leaks can come from only one area, the rubber fuel lines and anyone with 1/4 of a brain knows how to replace them….2 clamps that are already there and your good-to-go. Rubber lines are not what they used to be…..they last decades and are formulated for the unleaded ethanol gasoline…….and if it leaks and catches fire, a quick trip to Home Depot, Lowe’s, or other places and go buy a new one for under a grand……or just keep 2 generators…….we all spend 4 times that much on insurance and taxes and what do we get out of that?

After living 3 score and ten, I’ve never seen a time when I couldn’t get gasoline.

“Reliance” is the key word……..I rely on no one. “Anxiety” is another key word and you’ll get that if you need to call a repair man who has 50 people ahead of you…….——-006 and 3/4

[Rimfire McNutjob]

I installed a 20kW Onan back in 2005. It runs a Ford 2.5L inline four cylinder ... the one in just about every Ford Escort ever made. I run propane ... 250 gallon dedicated tank with a max fill of 200 gallons. I went with this unit because it was water cooled (quieter), runs at 1800 rpm instead of 3600 (quieter), has Class H insulation in the generator head (more rugged), and uses an engine that Ford made millions of. As I recall, the engine had to have been setup with hardened valve seats to handle running on NG or propane as well.

Onan ended up getting acquired by Cummins I believe.

I've changed the oil a few times and flushed the coolant once. It exercises for 7 minutes every weekend. I've been through several batteries ... the heat down here kills them off at the 5 year mark. I'm very happy with the unit. It's got some rust on the enclosure panels, but it still gets the job done and runs a lot of my stuff ... just not the whole house.

The thing with propane is ... it's in a sealed vessel and doesn't spoil. I think that's already been mentioned. We have diesel generators at the office and we got into a situation one hurricane season where we couldn't get diesel because the stations all had no electricity. Hospitals and fire/police stations are at the top of the list for fuel deliveries whereas commercial entities are near the bottom. The last time a hurricane came through and clipped my power for 3 days and I still was able to get a delivery of propane on day 3 just in case. I can run about 6-1/2 days on a full tank during the Summer.

[Sixgun]

I installed a 20kW rricane came through and clipped my power for 3 days and I still was able to get a delivery of propane on day 3 just in case. I can run about 6-1/2 days on a full tank during the Summer.

Holy Smoleys!!! McNut Job…..you must have a 10,000 sq.foot house! (Can I be your son or at least your brother?))……that’s what I call a real deal unit….in-line 4…that’ll last your lifetime and the next three peoples……..

In your case, it makes sense the same way a corporation or factory as those people have in-house mechanics. That’s serious loot with what you have set up…….your needs are in between a factory and a peon. ….but your burning somewhere around 30 gallons a day where what I have uses about 6-8 gallons…….I ran mine (6500) for a solid 8 days (except for midnight to around 9 am) back in 2019 when we had the tornado and I may have used around 40 gallons….couldn’t use the dryer, oven and could only use one or two burners at a time on the stove….we have a full electric house……but it ran everything else fine which included the fridge, well pump, and water heater.

We mostly use a clothes line anyway……

Everyone else on our street had electric after 6 days but I was b.s. en with the electric guys and told them I was a Trump fan and they deliberately didn’t hook mine up. They were from Maryland…a.h.’s…..Could not get in touch with PECO and I finally flagged down a PECO truck and those boys hooked me up. —-00

[Griff]

We don't have natural gas down our street, ½ mile from the highway where they do... but, the expense to be the first to have it piped here is more costly than my property is worth! I rely on two Honda 5K generators. Or... I just sit and wait, light the propane or kerosene lanterns and read a book. Summer time, I'll light off one of the generators to run a few lights, the refrigerator and the whole house fan. I bought the first one in 1988 to run the camper. It still runs and works fine. The 2nd one is less fancy, has no electric start capability, so I have to NEED it to use it.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

I installed a 20kW rricane came through and clipped my power for 3 days and I still was able to get a delivery of propane on day 3 just in case. I can run about 6-1/2 days on a full tank during the Summer.

That’s serious loot with what you have set up…….

It was $6200 back then ... I ordered it from Colorado Standby and installed it myself. I had to pour the pad and rig up a pulley system to lower it down a ramp just behind the garage. I had those front hooks on my '98 Ford Expedition that I tied a braided steel cable to in order to slowly lower it into place with my brakes.

I had a generator sub-panel (100amp) put in when the house was built in 2000 so I only had to install the transfer switch once the genset was in place.

Around here, if you feed a generator with propane, the propane company requires you to buy the tank instead of leasing it. They buried the tank though and ran the line to the generator so I didn't have to handle that part.

The house isn't nearly that big, but I have 3 separate small AC units to handle different areas of the house ... it's Florida after all. The generator can't run everything though ... nor would I want it to. As long as the air-conditioner runs and the TV works during an extended power outage, I'm golden with the wife. And that is it's real purpose.

[Sixgun]

Thanks for the info…….yea, I can understand the need for ac in high humidity. Humidity about shuts me down and it gets harder the older I get. Good when you bought it when you did…..6200 may just buy the engine today…..

[marlinman93]

We have a Firman generator that's 11,000/9200w. depending on whether I use gasoline or propane. It will easily run our two refridgerators, the freezer, and almost anything we need during a power outage. We got it a couple years ago when Costco had them on a sale for only $730 with rolling stand, and accessories.
I wired in a manual transfer switch so when power goes out I fire the generator and then just choose the circuits I have marked with a yellow dot on each breaker for Em. use.