Cast Performance Lube

[Rimfire McNutjob]

So being new to this SAA thing, I've been looking at pre-cast bullets for reloading as well as casting equipment, etc.

One thing that sort of stumps me is the bullet offerings from Cast Performance ... apparently now owned by the Grizzly Ammo people.

Their bullets appear un-lubed as compared to all others I've seen for order on the net. They claim that that they have some magic clear lube formula that they use. I might have thought Alox but the bullets don't have that sort of light brown splotchy look to them.

Is this really just a clear powder coat versus a lube? Powder coating seems to be all the rage these days and it apparently handles the lube duties on cast.

Thoughts? I am pretty cast bullet ignorant other than knowing how to pull out a credit card and order some.

[GunnyMack]

I've seen the same thing Nut, the bullets don't look lubed at all. Can't help you with regard to how they work as I'm still using up a bottle of Alox. ( I don't shoot much cast )

[Walt]

McNutJob, I think you need to be cautious here. I once bought a box of 500 machine cast bullets from Sportsman's Warehouse which were made by an outfit called West Coast Bullets. They appeared to have no lube on them although the sales people at Sportsman's swore that they were, in fact, lubed with an "invisible" lube. So much b.s. They were not lubed and suspecting as much, I looked down the bore of the revolver from which I'd shot them after a dozen rounds and saw strands and slivers of lead obscuring the view down the barrel. I don't like returning stuff so I ran them through my sizer/lubricator; afterwards they shot fine. I later went back to Sportsman's to give them an earful and was told that they dropped that supplier.

I think you should be able to see some signs of lube on machine cast bullets.

[Scott Tschirhart]

Cast Performance is owned by Grizzly now.

I have tried this lube and it works surprisingly well.

I’m still a fan of lubes that flow easily (messy) but I have to admit that this works.

[bcraig]

I dont cast anymore but when I did I cast LBT Plain base Wide Flat nose bullets for revolver use From one of Veral Smith LBT Molds and LBT blue Lube which I just put on by Hand.
Good Bullets and Good Lube.Easy to do.

I also Made Paper Patched Bullets for use in a 10 inch barrel 44 Magnum on a T/C Contender to use as pure of lead that I could find for absolutely amazing expansion and penetration on Big whitetail deer.

The Ductility of the almost pure lead Meant that it would not fragment and just keep wadding up and penetrating ,If I remember right I was using a 300 or 320 LONG flat Nose from a LBT Long flat Nose Mold for that endeaver and I used stick on computer labels for the Paper patching to keep from having a lot of leading in the barrel.

It was not uncommon to get over 2 foot of Penetration and 1 1/2 -2 inch exit from any angle.

[Sixgun]

The best lube in the history of mankind and all through the universe will do noting if the bullet is undersized to the groove diameter. If everything is right, as to tolerances, a minimal amount of lube will work. Unless you’re doing match shooting with a $5,000 rifle, the majority of cast bullet shooting can be done with simple Lee Alox, spread around in a small tub….unsized….

I’ve been using 50% alox/beeswax for 50 years and I get zero leading I can see, but I know how to size and use the proper alloy/gas checks for the velocity and gun in question. It’s not rocket science.

I’ll take a thousand 9mm bullets cast from a $1.98 Lee six cavity mould, use liquid alox and load them unsized and hit beer cans at 100 meters or the 10” steel plate at 200 meters with the Uzi that has a 10 lb trigger pull.——-006

[Walt]

I use Glen Fryxell's lube formula of Sta-lube automotive grease containing lithium, moly and graphite, mixed 50/50 with beeswax. It works better than anything I've used before and I size my bullets so I can push them through the cylinder throats of the revolver for which I'm loading. It does tend to be somewhat messy in warm temps but that's something I don't mind putting up with.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

This is what I've ordered before (Montana BW) ...

MontanaBW-45Colt-LBT-280GR.-WFN-GC.jpg

This is what I see on the Cast Performance site ...

CastPerf-45Colt-LBT-265GR.-WFN-GC.jpg

I think I see something in the grooves, maybe. It's got a bit of a mottled color to it overall so maybe it's got their "clear lube" as they say. You see how the main lube groove is kind of rounded off like there's something clear in there partially filling it? I would think they sell tons of these ... being that they are out-of-stock and all. It's just not what I'm used to seeing.

Could we actually be looking at a clear powder coat?

I'm still trying to learn. I appreciate the info.

[Rockrat]

If you use a lube/sizer, I would suggest White label lubes. I use Caranuba Blue lube for just about everything from 800fps to 2500fps, except for the big boy that gets Caranuba Red, a bit sitffer lube. Used to blend my own lube , with lubes from different makers, but the Blue stuff worked well, so I went to it.
Glenns XLOX is a good sub. for Lee's lube. I have used it, but cut it down to 1 part lube to 8 parts mineral spirits. Tumble lube and let dry a few days. I have done powder coating for some boolits. Some for my 44's cast a bit undersize and the powder coat adds from 0.001 to 0.002 to the diameter and has helped a lot with my 445 sm and works the same with my 500 S&W

There was a clear lube that you just tumbled the boolits like Lee liquid alox, but dried clear. I think it was called Rooster Jacket.

If you have any question, just tumble them in LLA, let dry, load, and go shoot.

I usually get my powder coated bullets that I use in my 45 and 38's from Chey Cast bullets, out of Cheyenne, WY

[Sixgun]

I use Glen Fryxell's lube formula of Sta-lube automotive grease containing lithium, moly and graphite, mixed 50/50 with beeswax. It works better than anything I've used before and I size my bullets so I can push them through the cylinder throats of the revolver for which I'm loading. It does tend to be somewhat messy in warm temps but that's something I don't mind putting up with.

Yep! Good ole Walt is doing it right although I’m semi old and tend to hang on to the old ways…..see, he “pushes them through” the cylinder throats. Most people do not understand simple mechanics and Walt pushes them through with the right amount of pressure to “just make it through”. These punks today only know what the college that educated them taught them and most of it was communism……they say, for example, We must force, by law, and written by AOC that ALL manufacturers to make ALL cylinders throats all the exact SAME and force them to retrofit ALL cylinders to be exactly the SAME diameter so the stupid people can load one same sized bullet, EVEN IF THEY ARE OUT OF BUSINESS FOR A 100 years.” . . .

Oh, the wonder of it all!——006…..nothing personal my fine friends but I’ve tried most of the lubes on the market and I have yet to see a difference in 50/50 alox/beeswax……..but that’s me, only testing it out of a truckload of old and new guns…..nothing large….—-0006

[JimT]

For the last 35 years I have not used anything except Paco's Apache Blue. He made me up a couple #10 cans of it many years ago and I still have part of one can left. It will last me the rest of my days. When he made it there was nothing in commercial lubes that came close except Veral Smith's LBT Blue. Since I have never tried any other lube in an awfully long time I cannot speak to other lubes these days. All I know is Paco's lube works well in hot or cold weather, doesn't run, won't crack and fall out of the lube grooves and works good at handgun and rifle velocities over 2000 fps. I have never tried it beyond that.

The sad part is, he hasn't made any in 15 or 20 years. Most likely the formula will die with him.

[Rockrat]

I also used Paco's Apache Blue lube. Once I started using it, nothing else would do. Ran out of it a long time ago. Think I bought 10 sticks when I bought it, wish I had bought 100.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

There was a clear lube that you just tumbled the boolits like Lee liquid alox, but dried clear. I think it was called Rooster Jacket.

I wonder if it's Rooster Jacket. I might try some. I do have a mold with "tumble lube grooves" or so they call them ... a Ranch Dog mold for my rifle model TLC-460-425-RF. I'm still a ways off from casting yet.

[Scott Tschirhart]

My favorite lube is a 50/50 mix of black moly grease and beeswax. It’s smelly, it’s messy, but once you coat the bore, if is amazingly effective. And I like a bullet that needs some effort to push it through the cylinder throats.

[JimT]

When I was a kid 60=some years ago my Dad had me read THE BULLET'S FLIGHT FROM POWDER TO TARGET by Dr. Mann. It was written in 1909 in the days of lead bullets and contains some of the best information on how lead bullets act in the transition from cartridge to the bore to the target. I highly recommend this book. It will probably challenge some current cast bullet beliefs. I found it helpful in a lifetime of cast bullet shooting.

1.JPG

https://www.amazon.com/Bullets-Flight-P ... 1167012542

[Walt]

Thank you, Six.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

When I was a kid 60=some years ago my Dad had me read THE BULLET'S FLIGHT FROM POWDER TO TARGET by Dr. Mann. It was written in 1909 in the days of lead bullets and contains some of the best information on how lead bullets act in the transition from cartridge to the bore to the target. I highly recommend this book. It will probably challenge some current cast bullet beliefs. I found it helpful in a lifetime of cast bullet shooting.

https://www.amazon.com/Bullets-Flight-P ... 1167012542

Ordered and on it's way. Thanks.

[Jeff H]

For over ten years now, I've been using a couple tumble-lubes on almost all my cast bullets, up to 1840 fps, which really are essentially "invisible." You have to stick your nose into the container they're in and SMELL. If it smells like lube, then I lubed it.

Prior to that, I used straight LEE, Liquid Alox on commercially cast bullets which came with some kind of decorative, colored stuff in the lube groove, which didn't work well. That method worked well but was a pain and messy. The stuff I use now dries DRY and can't be visually detected unless I got a little too much lube in the bag when lubing them.

I made up some 45-45-10 some years ago and it has lasted a long time. I believe someone sells the stuff now ("Lars?") and it's pretty cheap. It's not difficult to make, but for what little they ask for it, I'll buy the next batch.

I also use one called "BLL" (Ben's Liquid Lube) which is easier to make and as easy to apply. Recipe is available on The Art & Science of Bullet Casting forum.

Either of these actually DO DRY and do not leave the old tell-tale brown splotches that full-strength Liquid Alox leaves.

If someone is advertising "invisible lube," well, it's possible, but I have no idea ho w well theirs works. I know the two I've been using for a long time work plenty well. If the gun's dimensions and alignment are good and the bullets sized correctly, made of an appropriate alloy for the pressure, etc., it works great.

[Ray]

These folk have quite an assortment of bullet lubes.....

https://www.lsstuff.com/

[Jeff H]

These folk have quite an assortment of bullet lubes.....

https://www.lsstuff.com/

That's the place! Like I said, I won't bother making 45-45-10 again when these guys are selling it so cheap.

[Scott Tschirhart]

I’ve never tried any of the tumble lubes or the baked on coatings. But I hear that some people have had great luck with them. When I was shooting black powder cartridges I learned a lot about lube as lubrication was critical to consistency.

With smokeless I’m having very good performance with the waxy lube that Hornady uses for their Cowboy bullets. They are dead soft but I don’t get any leading or any significant fouling even if I step on them a bit.

Waxy lubes have been used on .22 rimfire ammunition for many years.

Hard to argue with success.

But I have to admit that I feel better with something that is more gooey in a large lube groove.

[piller]

You should send an email and ask. Mike is a shooter and hunter along with having a Petroleum Engineering degree. He might not give you any secrets, but he would give you some information.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

Waxy lubes have been used on .22 rimfire ammunition for many years.

This is what intrigues me about the Rooster Jacket tumble lube. It's supposed to be a wax emulsion and once the carrier dries, it ends up like the lube on modern .22 rimfires.

[earlmck]

From your picture the bullet definitely has some kind of coating that I am not familiar with. There is a clear powdercoating but that isn't it. I'd bet that it works for you: the Cast Performance folks wouldn't have stayed in business this long if they produced bullets that didn't work for folks.