Sad night in the persion gulf.....

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Ray
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Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#1 Post by Ray » Fri May 17, 2019 7:36 pm

General Quarters !

General Quarters !

All hands man your battle stations !

Set material condition zebra !


220px-USS_Stark.jpg
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m.A.g.a. !

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jeepnik
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#2 Post by jeepnik » Fri May 17, 2019 8:08 pm

Hard to believe it was 1987. We should have nuked the entire region then. It would have saved untold American military and civilian lives.
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Ray
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#3 Post by Ray » Fri May 17, 2019 8:41 pm

Back in the day, those of us on "real" ships mocked the perry class ffg's, calling them coast guard cutters......but after seeing just how tough they were in actual battle damage scenarios, there is no doubt of their resiliency......I don't think the older tin cans of the day could have survived the level of damage that the stark and roberts sustained.....

read this......

On July 14, 2016, the ex-USS Thach took over 12 hours to sink after being used in a live-fire, SINKEX during naval exercise RIMPAC 2016. During the exercise, the ship was directly or indirectly hit with the following ordnance: a Harpoon missile from a South Korean submarine, another Harpoon missile from the Australian frigate HMAS Ballarat, a Hellfire missile from an Australian MH-60R helicopter, another Harpoon missile and a Maverick missile from US maritime patrol aircraft, another Harpoon missile from the cruiser USS Princeton, additional Hellfire missiles from an American MH-60S Navy helicopter, a 900 kg (2,000 lb) Mark 84 bomb from a US Navy F/A-18 Hornet, a GBU-12 Paveway laser-guided 225 kg (500 lb) bomb from a US Air Force B-52 bomber, and a Mark 48 torpedo from an unnamed US Navy submarine.
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Grizz
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#4 Post by Grizz » Sat May 18, 2019 1:53 pm

this might say more about the hellfire missile and the rest of the ordinance than the ship,

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rock-steady
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#5 Post by rock-steady » Sat May 18, 2019 3:52 pm

After the attack on USS Stark, I worked on this ship, repairs at Mayport and later at Pascagoula.

The inside of most of main deck was burnt black. How anyone survived was a miracle....
"People who need long explanations at moments when everything depends on instinct have always irritated me."

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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#6 Post by piller » Sat May 18, 2019 8:21 pm

Never been on a ship. I have seen photos of the damage from WWII. I can imagine the damage now because of the munitions I saw back when I was in the Army. A hellfire missile will take out all but a few modern tanks. Those bombs used are made to tear things up with a fervor. I can surmise that the modern ships are built tough. Does anyone remember when an Exocet(?) almost sank a British warship near the Falklands? I think the ships were reinforced with alacrity. The Exocet is a wimp compared to a Hellfire.
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Ray
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#7 Post by Ray » Sat May 18, 2019 10:16 pm

My point was that both the stark and the roberts did much better than expected. I don't think that a knox or adams class would have survived the same levels of damage simply due to their tendencies to suffer engineering failures when propulsion, electricity and steering is needed most.

The absolutely hardest working sailors underway I ever met were in B division so I am not disparaging the obsolete rate of boiler technicians when I admit the superiority of gas turbine propulsion and power generation.
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jeepnik
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#8 Post by jeepnik » Sat May 18, 2019 11:12 pm

Recent reading mentioned that 500# bombs were less than ideal for war ships. Heck Ole Billy Mitchell secretly switched to 1000# bombs during his testing. Seems the 1000# bombs not only had a lager explosive payload but penetrated deeper into the hull before detonation.
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Rusty
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#9 Post by Rusty » Sat May 18, 2019 11:44 pm

I would think penetrating deeper before exploding would depend on the delay on the fuse more than the weight of the bomb it's self. If you were wanting to sink a ship from the air I would think a shape charged bomb would give more bang for the buck.
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#10 Post by piller » Sun May 19, 2019 12:09 am

Shaped charges are in the Hellfire, the T.O.W., and most torpedoes. A delayed charge in a bomb along with it being a shaped charge should cause tremendous damage.

A shaped charge from a perforating gun can burn a hole lengthwise through a 20 pound sledgehammer head in a fraction of a second, and it is less than 2 ounces. A 2000 pound bomb should do significantly better.
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JNG
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#11 Post by JNG » Wed May 22, 2019 12:46 pm

I was on the USSAmerica Cv-66. Navy sunk her to test out weapons. All I heard is that the Navy was shock how much
damage it took to sink her. I still liked the USS Kitty Hawk-Cv63 better.
Joe

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Ray
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#12 Post by Ray » Thu May 23, 2019 6:42 am

JNG wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 12:46 pm
I was on the USSAmerica Cv-66. Navy sunk her to test out weapons. All I heard is that the Navy was shock how much
damage it took to sink her. I still liked the USS Kitty Hawk-Cv63 better.
Joe
The two circumstances that are unrealistic about such tests are the empty fuel tanks and no ordnance on board......

In real battle, there would have been more boom and uncontrollable class-bravo fires.
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Re: Sad night in the persion gulf.....

#13 Post by JNG » Sat May 25, 2019 7:47 pm

Sir,
From what I knew, she did have a load of fuel and bombs. How much? If you served on a AC in the Kitty Class, there are more voids then compartments. You have 4.5 acres of flight deck, 60" above the water line. I am not questioning you, I would have rather been on a tin can then a bird farm. Please take a trip and see one of these. My Mother came to visit me in Va. She said what are those littles things for? We walked and they were 4 60' whale boats! Then she got the size.

Bless you all this Holiday,
Joe

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