For Those Who Fret About .30-30 Power..........

[Pete44ru]

Here's some results of game taken this past weekend, with one (1) shot each, with a .17 HMR (Hornady Magnum Rimfire). The distance was 100 meters, about 110yds.







The shooter gave them all an earache, making them DRT.

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[CalvinMD]

Are you sure the puppy didn't just hold them down while he ran up closer?? Just Kidding..just shows precision trumps power most of the time,...I never would have had the confidence in the tiny caliber,..too afraid of wounding but glad he harvested cleanly

[Pete44ru]

Sorry I wasn't clearer - I wasn't the shooter. It was a fella from New Zealand, where it's Fall now, & the game seasons are open.

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[CalvinMD]

Sorry Pete..I figured it out once I read it again closer...but you're right..a good shooter behind a good rifle beats a bad one even if hes in a tank any day...I know which one I'd be more afraid of any day

[kimwcook]

When I first read the thread I thought were in New England are you hunting those? But, looking further on I read the New Zealand part and now I understand. Placement always wins.

[olyinaz]

A .17 rimfire on (small) deer and goats? I'm not a hunter guys, but seriously, is it ethical to allow this by law?? This guy is obviously a crack shot (although I think I see two rifles there, so perhaps it's more than one ace doing this), but will the next guy be? In America the answer would be NO - 90% of guys trying this would be FOOLS who would wound and maim deer. No?? Or am I off base on this?

Obviously my hat's off to the marksman.

Oly

[AJMD429]

Very good point! It's been said many times here, but shot placement is always # 1, but the problem if you DO miss a head/ear shot (like I'm sure I would ), you may strike the nose or break the jaw or otherwise inflict a severe but non-lethal (or slowly lethal) injury, whereas if you miss the center-thorax, you're likely still to inflict a pretty quick/humane death if you're a few inches off.

[BigSky56]

theres no caliber restrictions or cf/rf on big game in MT except for muzzle loaders. Ive shot alot of predators with a 22 mag, a good rifle and a patient shooter you'd be surprised at what a rimfire can do.
Pete tell your friend good shooting danny

[FWiedner]

Always yanks my chain that somebody starts whining about ethics whenever sombody else demonstrates marksmanship skill by making a shot they themself would not even attempt.

The guy made a couple of great shots and made clean kills with both.

What's unethical is expecting a superior shooter to drop his sights to accomodate another's personal lack of confidence, discomfort, or lack of skill.

[olyinaz]

Always yanks my chain that somebody starts whining about ethics whenever sombody else demonstrates marksmanship skill by making a shot they themself would not even attempt.

The guy made a couple of great shots and made clean kills with both.

What's unethical is expecting a superior shooter to drop his sights to accomodate another's personal lack of confidence, discomfort, or lack of skill.

Always yanks my chain that somebody starts whining about what they THINK was said instead of what actually WAS said. I very clearly asked about the ethics of having this be LEGAL - not the ethics of the shooter. I complimented the fine marksmanship!

Oly

[FWiedner]

A .17 rimfire on (small) deer and goats? I'm not a hunter guys, but seriously, is it ethical to allow this by law?? This guy is obviously a crack shot (although I think I see two rifles there, so perhaps it's more than one ace doing this), but will the next guy be? In America the answer would be NO - 90% of guys trying this would be FOOLS who would wound and maim deer. No?? Or am I off base on this?

If you consider the law unethical, you obviously consider persons who act within that law to be engaging what you consider to be unethical behavior.

I don't believe that I misunderstood or mistinterpreted what you said, at all.

[olyinaz]

A .17 rimfire on (small) deer and goats? I'm not a hunter guys, but seriously, is it ethical to allow this by law?? This guy is obviously a crack shot (although I think I see two rifles there, so perhaps it's more than one ace doing this), but will the next guy be? In America the answer would be NO - 90% of guys trying this would be FOOLS who would wound and maim deer. No?? Or am I off base on this?

If you consider the law unethical, you obviously consider persons who act within that that law to promote what you consider to be unethical behavior.

Nope! What you think is obvious aint. Those guys are some fine marksmen and clearly within both their rights (the law) and capabilities (which is where the personal ethics part comes in - not to be confused with the ethics of law/regulations).

Unfortunately, I live in the real world where I am surrounded by idiots and fools who think themselves marksmen and clearly aren't. I don't know where you shoot, but I do it mostly at a local range and it's sometimes frightening. I feared for my life more than once back in my hunting days and I've actually been shot at (and HIT) doing it so my low opinion regarding John Q. Public and hunting ethics is one I've earned and one I'm not apologizing for. Not that the crack shots depicted in the photos are those kind of people. I really look up to GOOD hunters and marksmen and I think the people on this forum are those kind of folks. However, that said and despite my libertarian leanings, even I have a few laws in mind that I think make some common sense. Which is what I asked about! If you disagree fine - your opinion is valued (I generally find your opinion quite interesting) - but don't tell me or others what you THINK I said and/or call me a whiner while whining yerself about some imaginary meaning between lines or within the folds of my psyche. I asked about the LAW and ONLY the law.

So to restate the bloody obvious: I have no problem with those guys doing what they're doing because they've got the skills. I said hat's off and I meant it. What I'm curious about is what folks here think of the legality of allowing the public at large to hunt deer with a .22 short or parlor pistol or sling shot or whatever. You've made your position clear in your overly assumptive posts. Because I'm open to new thoughts and ideas, I'd like to know what others think. Preferably without insults.

Oly

[harry]

Yep we need more laws thats for sure, kinda like outlawing the texas heart shot or maybe limit guns to hold only one round. Here is a good one, make it illegal to shoot other hunters, oh wait it is illegal. Yep we need more laws to cover the stupid.
Harry

[FWiedner]

A .17 rimfire on (small) deer and goats? I'm not a hunter guys, but seriously, is it ethical to allow this by law??

Well, golly. You sure can dance.

You directly suggest that hunting with a smallish caliber is unethical and should not even be legal. Your own words.

No insult was intended.

The squawking about ethics thing is just a peeve that got poked by your comment, so I squawked too.

[1894c]

nice shot...interesting commentary...as others have stated before--going to go and make some pop-corn now... :)

[horsesoldier03]

Oly,

This is a prime example of what has been stated on this forum numerous times. If you know where you need to shoot and are skilled enough to put the shot there, the caliber really isnt an issue!

A good hunter knows the anatomy of the game he is shooting, the capabilites of the cartridge, and has the ability to place his shots where he calls them.

For the record, I interputed your comment the same as the others.

[tman]

Better a direct hit from a .17, than a poor hit from a 300 mag.

[Rusty]

I was talking to a guy on the CZ forum that uses a CZ .17 HMR with solids to shoot hogs over a feeder. He says he drops 'em with one shot every time.

[piller]

That guy in the photos is certainly a good shot. I see nothing wrong with what he did.

[gundownunder]

The Kiwis don't hunt deer, they kill them, and have done so ever since I was a young'n.
Your average hunter goes for the classic heart/lung shot and needs the power to get into the boiler room and maybe through a shoulder bone too. A killer goes for the brain or vertebrae and kills the animal where it stands.
I've killed northwest bullocks with a 22 mag by simply shooting them in the brain. I also used to know a horse meat trader who used a 22 mag on hundreds of horses, all with brain shots. There used to be a roo shooter here in Oz who used to use a 357 mag rifle to brain shoot camels for the pet food industry. Big roos weigh about the same as a whitetail deer and here in Oz the .222 has harvested them in their millions, all with brain shots.

[Pete44ru]

(although I think I see two rifles there, so perhaps it's more than one ace doing this)

If you look closely, I believe you'll see that what appears at first glance to be two different rifles is actually the same rifle with/without a suppressor.

I wish my state would allow cans, but (alas) they're prohibited, period - BATF/Federal permit or not.

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[2X22]

There used to be a roo shooter here in Oz who used to use a 357 mag rifle to brain shoot camels for the pet food industry.

Holy Mackerel! I admit to knowing little about Australia outside of what I see on the boobtoob so I was a little surprised to see something about camels there. A little research revealed some shocking info, Australia has nearly 1 MILLION feral camels and that number is quickly rising, "as of 2009, the feral population numbered about one million, with a doubling time of about nine years."

That seems like a target rich environment for hunters

2x22

[RustyJr]

I may be wrong but I think the one with the suppressor has a "butter bolt".


RustyJr

[2ndovc]

nice shot...interesting commentary...as others have stated before--going to go and make some pop-corn now...

Jb

[Hankster]

Rusty Jr. GOOD eyes!! Butter knife bolt.. two different guns....