30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

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bluesman423
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30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#1 Post by bluesman423 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 6:08 am

I thought this would be an easy answer but have been searching for over an hour. Maybe I just don't know how to effectively use my computer.

Can anybody tell me the actual velocity of a 150 or 170 grain factory 30-30 load out of a 16" barrel?

Thanks!

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FWiedner
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#2 Post by FWiedner » Sat Dec 11, 2010 7:10 am

What's your baseline for performance?

That is to say, what barrel length are you comparing it to, and what's the velocity from that barrel using the same ammo? Where are you starting? What sort of trajectory information can you provide?

Unlike men, not all ammo is created equal.

As I recall, many factories provide their measurements from 24" test barrels. A method of rough estimate that I use is to add or subtract 40fps per inch of barrel length.

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TedH
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#3 Post by TedH » Sat Dec 11, 2010 7:28 am

I agree with Fred's estimate of 40 fps per inch of barrel length, but there's no way to say without running them over a chrono. The velocity of a particular load can vary greatly within different barrels. I have a 20" Winchester that is always slower than my 18.5" Marlin.
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bluesman423
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#4 Post by bluesman423 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:04 am

What I am lookling for is the velocity of a 150 gr or 170 gr factory load out of a 16" barrel. I will then compare that to the published velocity of the same factory load from a 20" barrel.

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Tycer
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#5 Post by Tycer » Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:25 am

This does not answer your question as it deals with pistol calibers, but it's a great resource"

http://www.ballisticsbytheinch.com/results.html
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#6 Post by Tycer » Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:53 am

A start from a google search " winchester 30-30 velocity 170 grain 16" barrel" and "remington 30-30 velocity 170 grain 16" barrel" You can search further on the Rem one, I stopped after a couple of pages
William Iorg from b2b http://forum.exbabylon.net/showthread.htm?t=16754 wrote:With the 170 grain Sierra bullet ahead of 30.0 grains of IMR 3031 we got 1902 fps from the Trapper and 2065fps from the 20" Canadian Centennial barrel. 163fps or about 40fps per inch. I find 3031 to be just on the fast side for the .30-30 even though it was the standard powder for the cartridge for many years.
This thread: http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... 59&start=0

Section1_Operations from http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?17250-Ballistics-Involving-the-AK/page5 wrote:.30-30 Winchester 150 gr JSP Silvertip (#X30302)
velocity: 2211 fps
penetration: 18.9"
expansion: 0.57"
recovered weight: 125.8 gr

.30-30 Winchester 170 gr Power Point (#X30303)
velocity: 2036 fps
penetration: 20.5"+
expansion: 0.62"
recovered weight: 158.0 gr

* Note the 30-30 loads mentioned above were fired from a 16" barrel Marlin carbine, not the 20" rifle.
ENGLANDER FROM b2b http://shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?p=98181 wrote:Hello from Scotland~

Yesterday i put the first factory ammo though my Marlin L.T.S 16" .30-30 .............. up to now ive only shot home loads both jacket and recently cast.

I got hold of some Factory Remington 170 gr Remington core-lokt soft point in a green and yellow box.

Results:

1993 fps
1996 fps
2019 fps
1902 fps
1997 fps

Anyone else clocked the speed of factory ammo in their 16" .30-30 be it Winchester Marlin or other ????
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#7 Post by J Miller » Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:03 am

bluesman423 wrote:I thought this would be an easy answer but have been searching for over an hour. Maybe I just don't know how to effectively use my computer.

Can anybody tell me the actual velocity of a 150 or 170 grain factory 30-30 load out of a 16" barrel?

Thanks!
Bluesman,
Most if not all of the old line ammo makers use 26" test barrels for their published velocity.
Each gun is a law unto itself so the only way to be really sure is to chronograph them in your gun.
That being said, back in August of '08 Old Savage posted some chrono results of 150gr ammo in various 30-30 barrel lengths.
Here's his results:
I have recently chronographed Federal PowerShok 150s in three Winchester 30-30s:

2350 fps in the 20" barrel
2407 fps in the 24" barrel
2467 fps in the 26" barrel

And, Winchester PP 150's:

2244 fps in the 20" barrel
2349 fps in the 24" barrel
2430 fps in the 26" barrel

Those are averages.

Some folks a while back were interested in the comparisons of 30-30 velocities in the various barrel lengths.
Although he didn't include the 16" barrel, you can see how the velocities dropped with each shorter barrel.

I though I had some 16" data as well, but so far I haven't found it. If I do I'll edit it in.

Joe
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Pete44ru
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#8 Post by Pete44ru » Sat Dec 11, 2010 1:25 pm

Just my $0.02, but I don't think there's any dead deer, that ever knew the difference (in .30-30 barrel length/velocity).

Jes' sayin' ............................ :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#9 Post by KWK » Sat Dec 11, 2010 5:54 pm

The Powley Computer generally gives good estimates of performance for pressures around 40,000 CUP. Here, it predicts a 170 gn load going 1987 fps from 16", not too far off the numbers Tycer found for you. Going to 20" the Computer estimates 2058 fps or about 18 fps/inch.

Powley worked with single base powders. Some of the modern dual base ball powders can beat it's estimates. For instance, it predicts only 2115 fps from 24", but ball powders listed in Hodgdon's data can beat this by 100 fps. However, Hodgdon appears to have recently tested again all the IMR single base stick powders -- on which Powley based his data -- and the Computer's estimate is pretty close to that data.

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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#10 Post by tman » Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:06 pm

If you shoot an elk at 200 yards , he'll never know the difference 8)

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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#11 Post by jd45 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:58 pm

Hello right back to ya, Englander 2b2, thanx for your post, Merry Christmas. to you & yours
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bluesman423
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#12 Post by bluesman423 » Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:03 pm

Thanks for the many helpfull answers, guys. I actually prefer longer barrels in a 30-30 from 20" to 24".

But this year I have cut 18 30-30 leverguns down for customers and have three more waiting. Not sure why this sudden interest in "trapperizing" a 30-30.

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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#13 Post by J Miller » Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:29 pm

bluesman423 wrote:Thanks for the many helpfull answers, guys. I actually prefer longer barrels in a 30-30 from 20" to 24".

But this year I have cut 18 30-30 leverguns down for customers and have three more waiting. Not sure why this sudden interest in "trapperizing" a 30-30.
Maybe a {no names asked} poll would be informative. You could share the info with us when you get some answers.

Personally I have an original 1980 Win 94 Trapper in 30-30 and it's one of those I will never part with. But, it's really no more handy than a 20" carbine, and doesn't balance as well either.

Joe
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#14 Post by Old Savage » Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:38 pm

People do seem to want to jump on that band wagon as if there is some inherent advantage. Unless they are hunting from a vehicle I don't really see it.
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#15 Post by OldWin » Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:00 pm

It's funny you talk about cutting these rifle down as a trend. Almost 20 years ago I got a hankerin for a trapper as we hunt a lot of thick woods. I have a gunsmith friend and we built one on an early factory rebarreled 94 in 32WS. It came out great and looks authentic. Velocity dropped from just shy of 2100 to 1970FPS. We've since built a pair of early 336's in 30-30 and a 92 in 44-40. Without fail everyone that sees these things comments and asks where we got em. My buddy has built litterally dozens of these things for all kinds of people and himself since.
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Re: 30-30 velocity loss in 16" barrel

#16 Post by FWiedner » Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:07 pm

Shorter rifles are easier to handle in the woods.

For fast shots under 100yds, which most shots where I hunt are, a trapper profile just can't be beat.

:)
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