32-20 Again!(pic heavy)

[rost495]

Well, quick part of this story for those that have followed.... I wasn't expecting to do anything more this season with my gun. But got back from the deer lease and got a wild hair, loaded 5 rounds, 13 of 4227 and 100 xtps... shot one, it was same 3 inches high up close. Had a tight schedule as it was less than an hour from dark but a cold front coming in 12 hours.... I walked to my ground blind as fast as I could, no deer. Good luck. Sat down at 519 pm. At 523 pm a spike that I've been trying to shoot came out with a nice 2.5 year old 8 point. Spike came in to around 10-15 yards, probably about 12. Shot quartering away attempting to take the top of the heart as it exited and from the looks of it probably did or came close. Blood all over the deer as he took off, ran off balance about 50 yards and jumped a fence and collapsed. Probably 3-5 seconds at most. 8 point never knew what happened but decided to leave anyway.

Gotta eat, but the good news is once I get a chain and hoist etc... I'm home, wife is home, we ahve 3 cameras and will get pics of internal damage. I know for sure this round cracks a LOT louder.

More to come. Thanks for putting up with me.

Jeff

[kimwcook]

Good for you. Can't wait to see the pic's.

[JerryB]

Sounds good, I reckon that 100 grain XTP should do a great job. I won't get a chance to try mine until the 3 day Christmas hunt. Looking forward to the pictures.

[rost495]

Deer and gun

entry

exit

skin side entry

skin side exit

deer carcass entry

deer carcass exit

interior damage, lots of blood

inside, entry side(looks like it should be the exit side.... but its correct)

inside exit

lungs

lungs

lungs. Missed heart by appx half an inch. Heart still firm, could not find fragments in the heart but may have missed that. Suffice it to say it mushed the lungs good and bled out quickly. We went back with a shotgun from the upwind side and found him just where I thought I saw him dissappear in a pile. Looks like he might have wobbled a bit and turned a circle. Evidence by position that he quickly laid down and bled out, as his body was in a bedded position, and the head simply slumped to the ground. Like I mentioned in the one picture, there was LOTS of gelled blood inside the carcass. He might have lived more than the 3-5 seconds I thought, but I doubt that it was much longer.
Comments welcome. Hope this turned out to post correctly.
BTW the ammo is a bit warm, I'm going back to 11 of 4227 and work back towards 13, extraction was sticky and the brass was obviously swelled a bit. Seems that the chamber may have some pitted areas in it. No idea of weight. I'm guessing live weight at 130. He was quite a bit more than the doe. For this size deer and 50 yards and less this is a killing round now. Though I need to do some penetration testing, might have to look towards a 115 type. Will be working on cast 115ish bullets too, with soft noses to open up.

Jeff

[C. Cash]

Congratulations and very cool 92. Love the long barrel!

[JerryB]

That is going to be some fine eating. That looks like a 24 inch round barrel, that is what I have, made in 1917, bought it from my uncle in 1954.
I have the same problem with tight extraction with a load to hot, I have to back down and start back up but I sure do love that old rifle.

[rost495]

Octagon tube FWIW.

Watch out on your hunt, I believe your deer are bigger than ours. I'm not 100% sure of how much that bullet will penetrate. I'd avoid the shoulders going in if at all possible. Lets just say I could see plenty of blood at the hit, and lots coming out as he ran off and that was a good angle, such that I had trouble seeing his side adn could still see blood plus as he veered blood out the exit side. If I can get a shot at one and take the shoulder out on the exit I'll know what I have for bone issues, as is on a lung shot it did super.

Jeff

[WCF3030]

Now that is cool.
Great job making meat with that "little" round.
Hope the 115 cast works out well for you.
Should be a keeper.

[Old Savage]

Proof is in the pudding.

[KirkD]

Rost, that 14 grains is pretty steamy alright. I find that 5744 and 4227 give almost identical ballistics. With that in mind, I've chrono'd 11.1 grains of 5744 under a 90 grain RCBS bullet at 1,424 fps, so 14 grains of 4227 will speak with authority. Snooky Williamson has a few published loads using 4227. One of them was 15 grains under a 100 grain Remington bullet for 1,946 fps. Another was 14 grains under a 117 grain cast 311316 bullet for 1,848 fps. Another was 14.5 grains under a 110 grain Sierra bullet for 1,876 fps. I'd estimate your bullet was doing at least 1,800 fps. One thing for sure, it certainly put that deer of yours down.

If you go with a 115 grain bullet, somewhere around 12.5 grains of 4227 should give you somewhere in the ballpark of Winchester's original 'High Velocity' load for the Model 92 .... 1,635 fps. That should be a pretty good load for the size of deer you've been taking and maybe a bit larger. My only recommendation by way of interest would be to try some soft cast 115 grain bullets; I think they will give good expansion at that velocity and should be devastating. Very interesting report and photos. Thanks for posting.

[20cows]

That deer looks pretty dead to me!

[rost495]

I'll go back to 11 with the 100s, and then work forward as needed/if needed. With that bullet expanding at that speed, I think it'll do fine also 200 fps slower if I end up like that. Gotta check accuracy too. At 12 yards it wasn't an issue and I knew a max shot was about 25 yards or I'd pass.

I need to slug the bore at some point, then I'll work on getting the cast bullets too. With soft noses are gas checked to prevent leading I should be fine too.

Jeff

[Nath]

Very good report and I am happy for you
Don't shy from reporting like this
I know you have it in control but just watch you don't pop a case head off

Nath.

[rost495]

Ain't shooting that load anymore, other than the 2 I have left. One round crushed on crimping... Then its time to back it off and see what we have. I'm not fond of pressure in these guns.

Jeff

[dbateman]

32-20 is an grate round cool pics thanks for shareing

[Hobie]

Neat post! Thanks for sharing.

[ScottT]

Good job. That probably was not the first deer killed with that rifle!

[nemhed]

Excellent report and photos!

[joe in fl]

I have a Model 92 of around the same vintage. It was given to me by my late uncle. It belonged to his father who was given the rifle instead of pay at one of the farms he was overseer on in Tn. I have taken many deer and hogs with this little rifle. It seems to me the 32-20 is very underated as well as the 25-20 I also have. It also has taken a few deer.
And Congrats on the nice deer with the little power house 32-20.
Joe

[w30wcf]

rost495,
Nice deer with your vintage .32-20! Thank you for sharing your story.

Historically speaking, back in the mid 1930's when the Dupont IMR series of powders were introduced, DuPont came out with a booklet of suggested loads with their new propellants.
Here's their data for the .32-20:
NOTE: NOT FOR '73 WINCHESTERS
IMR 4227
80 gr. bullet / 13.0 / 1,710 f.p.s.
80 gr. bullet / 17.0 / 2,220 f.p.s.
115 gr. bullet / 10.0 / 1,400 f.p.s.
115 gr. bullet / 13.5 / 1,760 f.p.s.
Of course, as we know, different lots of powder can = different results.

w30wcf

[rost495]

Nice info! I simply know from shooting that the 13 might be safe, but not in this gun/chamber. I"m not sure if its pressure only or some pitting in the chamber but know that I'm going to back down and start over.

Nice info that its still in the ballpark of when the powder came out though. A few hundred FPS(if I loose even that much) is not a big deal.

Jeff