OT - Livin in CA

[paulyseggs]

I'm really pullin at strings. The lil lady and I were talkin and maybe we'd like to go out west. She brought up northern CA, I could like it up there. always wanted to pan for gold. Whats the gun laws like?

[jdad]

2 words....oppressive and restrictive.

I lived 30 years in NorCal and when my wife's company transferred us to Oregon it was like moving to a different country.

You may want to check across the border in OR.

[paulyseggs]

funny you should say that. As I researched from when I posted that to right now, maybe 20mins CA is becomming a big NEGATIVE! OR is a possibiltiy, whats it like there? Of course all I hear is it's always raining! but it's a big state. here's what we like to do.

Fish, fresh and salt, hike and be outside, I like to hunt, she hates the cold and snakes.

Guns are a big part of my life, I carry CCW everyday, I love to shoot. CA is rather restrictive so I don't think it'll fly.

Is CCW possible in OR?

[Bob A]

Rural Northern California is pretty much like rural anywhere. The gun laws suck but the only really bad part is the 10 day wait to pick up a new gun. We have concealed carry. Its pretty tough to get in some of the cities but you wouldn't want to live in San Francisco or Sacramento anyway. Out where I am, I hear gunshots (besides my own) almost every day. Dove season is the big thing here in the foothills but there are deer in the Sierra, just up the hill. Trout fishing is very good in some areas but you have to walk up or down stream. Lots of lazy people and boom boxes at the access points, but they don't like to walk. (I suspect thats true everywhere).
The worst part is having to admit that Dianne and Barbara are my senators. I'm sure that rural New York is very different from NYC and its the same story here.

Bob A

[jdad]

OREGON

"Shall Issue" CCW state
Class 3 are allowed
No waiting period
NO SALES TAX
Over 50% of the state is PUBLIC land
Everything stays green, on the west side of the Cascades, but the East is the high desert.
This is the best move we ever made.

[paulyseggs]

jdad

I like it!

What kinda hunting/fishing

I really like small game and waterfowl/upland hunting. I do like biggame hunting but around here it's tough to find places to deer hunt.

fishing wise, I'll try to catch anything that swims.

[Mike D.]

Aside from a 10 day waiting period for new guns, CA is not much different from many other states. In rural areas, CCWs are a given, but not in larger cities. I live in Sacramento, and maintain properties both north and south. I have had absolutely NO difficulties living in the state's capitol city. In fact, I'll probably never leave the area, simply because we have too much invested in land and agriculture.

Folks tout Oregon, but there are already too many displaced liberal Californians up there for my taste. We have investigated AZ, and might buy some property around Bisbee, as more of an investment than a future residency.

[Ysabel Kid]

You couldn't pay me enough money to live in CA. Don't get me wrong, from what I have seen of it (a lot of it), it is beautiful, the weather is beautiful, the women are beautiful, but there are just too many darn people. The laws - including the gun laws - are crazy, and I don't speak Spanish.

[jbm1968]

Glad to rejoin the forum here finally! And good timing too. I live in the South San Francisco Bay and am constantly amazed by the lack of what I consider American Ideals here, even among educated normal working people. This is the land of Socialism and nanny state anti freedom and anti american thought. From what I have heard NORCAL is a different world so maybe it is better. It sure is nice and the weather is great! To bad California is wasted on the Californians! The great hope for the South Bay is when the Chinese finally take charge of the Local Government when their population reaches 50+% in the Bay. They are good capitalists!

[handirifle]

I live in SoCal and comparitively speaking, north and south are two different states. With the exception od Sac and San Fran, they are like LA.

The people in SoCal cities are liberal, CCW in LA county isn't going to happen (unless you're a judge, or politicion, or Sylvester Stalone, who supports the Brady Campaign, by the way), but Kern Co. Just 10 miles north, it's easy.

Hunting is tough here, deer and bear are all over the mountains but nearly impossible to get to. It's either verticle or so badly overgrown a bulldozer couldn't get through.

Fishing is OK if you live near a lake. Most are at least an hour from me.

If I had a choice, I wouldn't be here either.

[ccw9mm]

She brought up northern CA, I could like it up there. Whats the gun laws like?

Carried in Calif. for years. The far northern counties can be quite gun friendly. "Oppressive" and "restrictive" certainly covers some of the state, but really only in two areas: the mere granting of a CHL, in which you need to have good cause (as deemed "good" by the Sheriff); and coming anywhere near a school while armed. Otherwise, standard fare applies: no carry in the courthouse, at the airport's restricted security zones, anyplace posted (if asked to leave). Not much different than many other states. There's a 10rd magazine limit. You'd better have the guns well secured, else your butt's going to jail if anything happens. Get a safe; get the license; keep your head about you; then, go about your business. It's not much different than anywhere else, in that regard.

[jdad]

........but you can only buy handguns on CA's current approved list. You CCW must be for a specific handgun. Assault weapons ban still applies.

I used to live up in Placer county, in a little "hillbilly" community called Applegate. People knew where it was because it was the first place, on the way to Reno, that they had a snow chain check. It was "Mayberry RFD".

[FWiedner]

Lived in CA years back.

Waiting periods. Assault weapons bans. CCW is a pain. Hunting regs are hit-miss.

I live in TX now.

None of that stuff to put up with. Life is like it oughta be.

I don't even visit that left-coast sh*t-pot anymore.

[bsaride]

jdad,

Handguns are those listed or over 50 years old,
This is how I decide what I will get next, lol.

[Junior]

........ that they had a snow chain check.

Would you explain that to this Louisiana boy?

[Pete44ru]

Prolly the cops would direct vehicles, without chains on their wheels (for snow/ice traction), away from the high passes in Winter to prevent road-clogging accidents.

[jdad]

........ that they had a snow chain check.

Would you explain that to this Louisiana boy?

Junior,
We lived at 2,000 ft., in the Sierra's, so it snowed in the Winter. Traffic would be diverted off of interstate 80, onto the exit ramp, where they would check to make sure trucks & cars had chains, but sometimes snow was deep enough, on the road at 2,000', that chains were required to proceed any further up I-80.

Locals knew all the back roads around the traffic mess.

[Jason_W]

If you want gun friendly states, check out northern New England (Vermont, New Hampshire, and Maine).

Vermont does not require a permit for concealed carry and NH and ME are both shall issue states.

[handirifle]

Junior,
I gotta tell ya, after having grown up in Ohio, learning to drive on my brothers stick shift mustang, IN THE WINTER, it's almost comical watching some of the people here drive in snow.

The California Highway Patrol (CHP) will stop you if the snow is heavy cause most people here think if you're tire's slipping, you need to give it more gas.

I was first stationed here in '72 where I met my wife. We live in a high desert (eLv. 2500) and it does snow here off an on. In 73 I was being sent to Germany, and the only car we had (she was my fiancee then) was her stick shift, '68 Camaro, with wide tires on the rear. We got 16" of snow overnight, and no-one was moving anywhere on the road. Snow plows are almost unheard of here. I needed to get stuff mailed off cause I have to leave for the airport the following day, so I threw a shovel in the trunk, all my stuff in the back seat and headed out. Got stuck once, shoveled a path front and rear, backed up and slowly pulled forward.

People were almost burning their tires up trying to get going, and I just left the car in 2nd gear the whole time.

They haven't really improved much either.

But seriously, there are a lot of good things going on in this state, but a lot of lunacy too. In Oregon, your property taxes will eat you alive. Here, it 1.5% MAX of your assesed property value. If you purchase a home, it's 1.5% of the purchase price, and it takes 2/3 of the voters for the state to add a new tax or raise the old one. Hasn't happened in over 25 years, so far.

[BruceB]

California is lieberal "paradise" Junior and his sqeeze , Hillary, want the ENTIRE country to become.

[Mike D.]

California is lieberal "paradise" Junior and his sqeeze , Hillary, want the ENTIRE country to become.

Not in my neighborhood. The "liberal paradise" you speak of can only be found along the left coast and in the large enclaves of cityhood, like LA and SF. If Hil-Larry is by some slim chance elected then we WILL, as a nation, be in a world of hurt.

I don't understand what all the concern is about carrying concealed. Despite my being licensed for over 35 years, I very seldom feel the need to go about armed. I do not project myself in any way as a "victim", and have yet to be threatened by any person unknown to me.

Gangbangers don't concern me, either, except the soulless Asians. On the rare occasion that I could find myself on their turf you can bet that my sidearm will be with me. A .45ACP gives some degree of comfort, not that it would do me much good against their automatic weapons.

[jazman]

I agree with Mike D on the carry thing, I'd like to know how many of you (besides LEOs of course) have ever actually pulled one on another person? How many have blown someone away? If so, how did you avoid becoming a felon to where you can't have any guns?
Lot of venom here about California, hard to understand why. There is no reason to live anywhere but where you like regardless of jobs, money, whatever. If you're not happy get to a place where you are. This is not a dress rehearsal, you only live once so do it where you want to be. If you don't like California move or simple don't move here. Lots of other beautiful places. I am an Oregon native whose folks moved here many moons ago and love both places. If I didn't like it here I'd get the hell out, even if that meant selling some possessions or whatever to be able to.
JMO.

[lever-4-life]

I live in the serrias and fish almost every day. I hunt deer, quail, turkey, and dove. I walk to my hunting spots. You name the fish and we probly have a world class fishery withen 2 hours drive. I love it here and doubt I would live somewhere else.

[Poohgyrr]

I'd say check any place carefully before moving or taking a new job or whatever.

We're fifth generation Northern Californians and I enjoy the good stuff here. I also enjoy bragging that our farmers feed a huge chunk of the USA, and the rest of the world too. I moved back to Northern CA for the blue sky, green hills, and clean trout streams. I miss all the shooting ranges and the warm beaches of Southern CA.

Parts of Sacramento are good, others are not; some folks are good, others should not be out among the rest of us.. Several nearby communities are good. If you are buying, property has become expensive for here.

That said, we plan to retire further north in the state, or to TX (family). We found a nice little town in both places and I want them to stay that way - so I'm treating them like a good fishing hole & not telling anyone where they are..

If you buy a brand new handgun, that means it must be on the "safety list". Buying a used handgun means you can ignore that "safety list". I explain this stupidity as meaning the liberal officials want me to use an 870 on burglars, instead of a wimpy handgun round - makes the Libs cringe.

CCW really depends on where you live. I understand a part of the problem is the crazy lawsuit and jury problem here. The guy authorizing the CCW is putting his home and savings on the line. Every shooting can result in lawsuits - I'd guess bigger cities are worse this way.

I'm not an expurt, but the above is worth what you paid for it.

[eggsucker]

I was fortunate enough to grow up to age 13 just one county away from jdad's place @ Applegate,Ca. There were plenty of more than adequate snow country drivers in Nevada County then !, but darn few soccer moms with SUVs. Left No.Cal.@ Uncle Sam's call to carry the flag,and never went back there to live. Sis did stay,so was/am back 1-2x yearly to see her and Mom. We finally sold the home Place (mom's side) last fall after more than 100 yrs in her family..just missing the top of the real estate boom,but now so glad to be done with it. Those years growing up in Nevada county were as close to an outdoorsmans paradise as one is likely to find,and I question the existence of same nowadays in the original 48.. J.O'C left Az.for Idaho before I got here,and were he a young man again ,I suspect he would have already left here for less crowded space... all that said, One has to make choices fitted to their personal circumstances and try to make the best of wherever that is.. BTW, Applegate is metropolitan compared to Chicago Park, Ca... eggsucker

[jdad]

Don't get me wrong. I grew up in Silicon Valley when it was still full of orchards. I have many fond memories, but the congestion and quality of life, for my family, is not what we wanted. I loved the mountains, but my wife missed "concrete and street lights", so when her company offered her a position in OR we jumped on it.

We've lived in OR 4 years now and we have no real complaints. Yes, the Portland Metro area is a liberal as any large CA metro area, but we have a better quality of life. Property taxes are higher, but you get to write those off. Sales tax you don't.

Eggsucker,
Ah yes, Chicago Park....an enclave for telecommuting techies. I do miss the smallmouth fishing at Rollins Lake, in Colfax.

[eggsucker]

jdad: Maybeso you remember when "they" blew up the Narrow Gauge RR bridge over the Bear R. while preparing to put in the dam for Rollins lake??We crossed the river there to hunt the blacktails on the east side upstream from the old diversion dam...and caught lots of trout out of Greenhorn creek,in the area that's flooded over nowadays...Memories:Only myself, a cousin,and B.I.L. ,left from that hunting group.. eggsucker

[Mike D.]

It's downright shameful that the Nevada County Narrow Guage railroad was shutdown way back in the '40s. That little road, once called the "Never Come, Never Go" could still be viable today. It put Chicago Park on the map, so to speak.

Living in this area spoils us for adventure. I'm within two hours, or less, of everything outdoors. We have a cabin in the mountains and one at the beach. There are plenty of deer and bear to hunt, plus thousands of turkeys, pheasant, waterfowl, grouse, and quail, all within a short drive.

My family came to CA during the Gold Rush and in the first decade afterward. Agribusiness has kept our family strong for generations, and hopefully will continue to do so for years to come.

[Old Time Hunter]

There is a reason that more people live in California than in all of Canada, my guess it mostly has to do with the weather. Worked all of California Monday through Friday for the better part of twenty years, 90% of it outside in civil engineering projects. Beautiful state....only once had the gumption to attempt to move there though, my future new neighbor got all excited since I was a avid hunter. He thought that he could tag along when I went back to Wisconsin to hunt. I investigated the local possibilities in California, they had 'em, but not walk out your door type, I would have had to work to explore the opportunities. Actually put deposits down on two houses, one by Arrowhead Lake(SoCal) and the other outside of Gold Rush (NoCal). After going thru escrow, and within a week of closing on the Arrowhead property, a rain storm created a landslide and washed the house down the hill (garage was still there though)...that cancelled that deal. That made me take harder look at the general make up of the California society....it is run by transplanted east coast liberals, especially in the SF-SAC area. Yea, taxes are reasonable, like the 2/3 referendum stuff, but sure like walking out my door with a loaded rifle to hunt, don't even have to get in a car an drive five minutes to hunting, fishing, boating(out my back door), or other outside activities. California does not offer that, unless you are sharing it with 30MM other people. The other thing, what is with all the foreign language signs all over the place...what the heck does espanol mean?

[jdad]

Some more great memories.....

People that have never lived in CA can't get over the fact that the DMV manual is in 20+ languages, but the sign that says "NO RIGHT TURN ON RED" is only in English.

The "late harvest/Fall" farmers markets were the best I have ever experienced.

After experiencing the 1989 quake (7.1) anything under 5.0 is just an "earthburp". We lived about 30-40 miles from the epicenter, at that time.

[handirifle]

Well, I gotta say, this is the first reasonable post I've seen in a long time on CA. Very honest and truthful reasons to live or not live in CA.

I can and is a very beautiful state, but the traffic and liberal morons can really put a damper on things from time to time.

As for me, not wanting to cause a riff with my wife, I'll most likely end up in central CA (her sister leves there). But who knows at this point.

I'll just hunt from wherever I live.

[Mike D.]

I can walk out my back door, front door and side door with a loaded rifle and shoot all I want, as long as we are at one of our ranches. It is seriously frowned upon in the cities, though.

I finished my last certified farmer's market yesterday. We are sold out of pears and have only apples, so called it quits. One of our businesses is the growing of pears along the Sacramento River south of here. Apples, apricots, nectarines, peaches and plums come from a few trees in the family orchard, which is for our consumption, but the extras go to the market. It provides a service to the public by offering fresh, wholesome fruit that can't be purchased at a grocery or supermarket.

The bulk of our several hundred acres of pears are sold to the fresh market and shipped throughout the US. Wine grapes are another venture that has been successful in our area, especially the red varieties. Chards were popular, but are being surpassed by Cabernet and Merlot at this time.

All in all, CA is a great place to live. I pay no attention to the liberal whiners, evn though they outnumber me 6 to 1. LOL Ain't a one of 'em will get off their prissy little butts and make an effort to grow something consumable. You can always tell a citified lib at the markets. they are the ones who haven't a clue what it takes to put put food on the table. They ask the dumbest questions and don't even know that fruit is grown in this area. SHEESH!

That being said, it time to head out to do something productive.

[Modoc ED]

I live just about as far North as you can get in Northeast CA without going over the CA-OR border. Modoc County -- Alturas, CA.

I've got a rifle rack in the back window of my truck and right now I have a .30.06 in the rack and a 12 Gauge Remington 870 (it's Dove season). The rifle stays there almost all the time. Later this morning I've got to go to town and nobody will even blink when they see the guns in the rack.

I've got a range (500 yds) behind my place and can shoot right off the rail/built in bench on my back porch.

CCW permit is a snap here.

10-day wait sucks but you get used to it.

Hate to tell you guys in OR but your gun laws will soon be more restrictive than they are now. Heard on the Medford news Channel 2/5 last week that someone in your legislature has introduced a bill for a waiting period for all guns.

[Grizz]

Ed, your area looks good. What's the elevation? What's the annual precip?

How's the internet connection? Any live realtime hookups available, like cable internet?

Thanks,

Grizz

[eggsucker]

Heck YES to Alturas,Ca.. and if it's too "Metro" for ya,commute from Cedarville..!! Eggsucker

[Mike D.]

Cedarville is one of my most favoritist places. I go arrowhead huntin' at least a couple times a year. Gotta friend that owns a bunch of property down at Duck Lake.

Back before the silly "zones" were introduced, make that shoved down our throats, I used to hunt mule deer around Likely and Jess Valley.

Modoc County is a special place, but jobs are on the scarce side, unless you work for CalTrans, USFS, PP&L, or the County itself. Most industries have died out up there, especially lumber.

[/code]

[Modoc ED]

If I turn right at the bottom of my driveway, approximately 1-mile down the road is a fence with a cattle guard spanning the road. As soon as you cross the cattle guard you are in the Modoc National Forest and it goes 37-miles North to the OR border and west for about 40-miles. It is huge and most of the area is called the Devil's Garden. If I go out my back driveway, I go less that a mile and I'm on Bureau of Land Management (BLM) land and once again I can go 37-miles North to the OR border or go East about 25-miles or so to the NV border. It's a little difficult getting to the NV border without crossing/traveling private land and a couple State/County roads at some point but it can be done. Across the Warner Mountains and away you go. Lots of good hunting everywhere around me with plenty of Elk (between Davis Creek and New Pine Creek up in the Warners).

The Belding Ground Squirrel is abundant around here (especially in the Alphalfa Fields) and I've killed thousands of them over the years. Not counted as game but they do keep yer shooting eye in condition. They even have an annual Squirrel Shoot over in Ceaderville, CA that draws people from not only all over CA but from all over the country.

People ask me if I go camping and in most cases my reply is no. With my house being located where it is, there is no need to camp. Hell, I'm actually camping 24/7/365. I just jump in the truck or on the ATV and I'm hunting in less than 10-minutes.

Mike D makes a point about employment. Most of the jobs here are local government, State, and Federal. One private industry that does thrive here is irrigation related jobs and there are ranching and farming jobs to be had too. Taes are low. Myself, I'm retired so I have plenty of time for shooting and hunting.

For Grizz, the elevation where I am is about 4800 feet, the precip comes mostly between Sep - May and isn't too bad. Plenty of snow in the winter but Hey!!!! it makes great hunting weather. Depending on where you live the internet connection is both dial-up and DSL. I have dial-up and am connected as I type this at 45.2 Kbps.

Is CA perfect? Hell no!! But it ain't bad either. It's like anywhere else -- ya just adapt to where ya live.

[eggsucker]

ModecEd: About these Warner Mtns.elk, What State are they living in by HUnting Season,and what chance has out of state hunter got . We have pack stock,but no ATV,Yet... Eggsucker

[Mike D.]

This is another reason why I like livin' here. our Sierra cabin is only an hour away, but in a different world. The river is full of trout and our swimmin' hole is cool and refreshing after a hard days fishing, hiking, hunting, or maintenance work.

This big slab of granite is our warming rock after a dip in the river. My wife, Janie, is the one covered by the towel. She's a freckled redhead and burns too easily. My sister is behind her.


Our grandkids and nephew are across the hole, sittin' on a very slippery rock. Old guys like me have a difficult time crawling up it from the water. All you can use are your arms.


BTW, the river is chock full of nice trout and we seldom seein' anyone else fishin' it.

[jazman]

Yes indeed, I can put up with people more liberal than me and a 10 day wait for guns in exchange for living with perfect weather, a 2 hour drive to the Monterey Area, 2 hours to the Napa wine country, an hour from the coast and 4 hours to our place in Tahoe. California is great.

[Modoc ED]

ModecEd: About these Warner Mtns.elk, What State are they living in by HUnting Season,and what chance has out of state hunter got . We have pack stock,but no ATV,Yet... Eggsucker

Last year I didn't draw an Elk Tag and one day during Elk Season, I was heading up to Lilly Lake right otside of New Pine Creek, CA and about half way up to Lilly Lake, I caught some movement out of the corner of my eye. I looked just in time to see about 15-Elk approach and cross the road in front of me. Two huge bulls with a couple of young bulls and the rest cows. Now, don't ya just know that if I'd had a tag, I'd have never seen an Elk that day. It's kind of like they know -- spooky!!!!!
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Mike D. -

That looks like the area going over "Danner Pass" from Sacramento, CA to Reno, NV or vice-versa. Of course there are plenty of places like that througout the Sierras but I have actually been to a place very much like that near the rail road tracks not too far from the pass. Great area and great hunting there. Haven't hunted that area for the last four years but go over the pass about two or three times a year on the way to LA, CA to see the kids. Much more scenic and interesting than going over to Redding and then South to Sacramento.

[JReed]

I grew up here in SoCal. Orange county(nothing like that stupid show) was a great place to grow up 20min to the beach 1hour to the mountains and 2hours to the desert. The only place I know that you can surf and skie all in the same day. Never had problems finding a place to hunt or fish but most of the country is ruff stuff and you have to be in decent shape to hunt it. One thing I always liked was going to the desert for a morning sun rise and then driving to the beach for an awesome sunset. Yes there are more people every year and most of them seem to be rejects from the other 49 states. But as long as you stick to the high country as much as posible they wont bother you to much.

Wouldnt mind living up there buy some of our northern levernuts that is some wonderfull country up there.

[Mike D.]

[quote
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Mike D. -

That looks like the area going over "Danner Pass" from Sacramento, CA to Reno, NV or vice-versa. Of course there are plenty of places like that througout the Sierras but I have actually been to a place very much like that near the rail road tracks not too far from the pass. Great area and great hunting there. Haven't hunted that area for the last four years but go over the pass about two or three times a year on the way to LA, CA to see the kids. Much more scenic and interesting than going over to Redding and then South to Sacramento.

[Mike D.]

[quote
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Mike D. -

That looks like the area going over "Danner Pass" from Sacramento, CA to Reno, NV or vice-versa. Of course there are plenty of places like that througout the Sierras but I have actually been to a place very much like that near the rail road tracks not too far from the pass. Great area and great hunting there. Haven't hunted that area for the last four years but go over the pass about two or three times a year on the way to LA, CA to see the kids. Much more scenic and interesting than going over to Redding and then South to Sacramento.

Ed, our place is along Hwy 50, about 23 miles from the Tahoe Basin. We are elevation 5000'+ and the river runs 15' from our deck. This is what the river looks like in June. No swimming in this stage. I have seen it when every rock is covered and huge boulders are moving beneath. Sounds like monster bowling.

[JohndeFresno]

Man, did you press my button.

I'll post something that I could have never gotten away with, before. We live in a free country, yadda yadda yadda - but for a fact I would have been brought up on administrative charges and my career would have suffered severely if I had told the complete truth as a deputy sheriff. And this has been a thorn eating my flesh for many years. I'm going to leave even my Retired Annuitant (consulting peace officer) status at the end of this year - so here goes:

Not only are California gun laws oppressive and restrictive, like jdad said - they are very repressive (to our ownership rights throughout the entire state) and VERY political. You are at the mercy of the local Sheriff.

Thanks to the Clinton Administration's push, certain laws are on the books where you cannot buy certain firearms that are perfectly legal, quality firearms in other states.

Here in the People's Republic, a firearm must be tested for "safety" (allegedly). Each gun manufacturer must submit each model to test, along with a hefty fee for each test, lots of paperwork, and a significant amount of ammunition for each model. So if, say, a Taurus .44 Magnum comes in different barrel lengths, each one must be submitted. Within that classification, if it has a different finish, then you must submit to the testing criteria for each finish AND barrel length. Add model types, e.g. the Raging Bull versus the Tracker or the Stainless - all which have the same hammer and ignition safety system, those are multipliers, too. So a 8" Raging Bull in stainless is different than the same model with blued steel. You get the picture - a successful blow by the anti-gun weenies in this state to discourage firearms manufacturers from going through all the hoops to sell guns in this state.

It worked. In this state, since Taurus (among many) said, "Look, we don't need California customers that badly - there is the rest of the world" - you CANNOT purchase an 8" Taurus for hog hunting; so I settled on the 6" gun. Taurus just threw their hands up and submitted only a portion of the inventory for testing. I don't really blame them. If you want to see what is legal, the Attorney General of California has a special website link that changes yearly (actually, monthly) - an online database where you can see if your weapon is legal to purchase, transfer, bring into or sell in California. Go to http://certguns.doj.ca.gov/ to see what I mean, and pop in your handgun. If it's not there, you can't even BRING IT IN to California. Correct me if I'm wrong, fellow Levergunners!!

At the very least, you cannot pass it onto a family member in this state, unless it happens to be approved for the particular year and month when the transfer is to occur. Certifications expire.

Secondly, and more telling: In Madera County (where I started as a deputy sheriff), any decent citizen with no felonies or violence on their record, with letters of reference, who passes a firearm safety test after paying a fee and submitting fingerprints (and so on), can be approved to carry a concealed weapon.

Yet in the very next county, it is (or at least WAS) extremely political, despite the Sheriff's statements to the contrary. I won't say under which Sheriff; but I was a Fresno County Detective when my honest, hard-working brother-in-law (who has never been arrested for anything, only having a few speeding tickets as a teenager) applied for a permit. He lived in a neighborhood where there was a fair amount of crime; and in fact ran after one person with a screwdriver when he saw him trying to burglarize his pickup truck one morning (no - not too smart!).

At my urging, he went through the process of requesting a gun permit, but was turned down with absolutely no explanation. He got some type of notice that indicated that it was decided that he did not demonstrate a real need for one, or something to that effect - political smoke and mirrors, that the Sheriffs in this state have the authority to hide behind. He's not rich, is not a political figure - he's a working stiff like the rest of us. However, he is an excellent shot, a sportsman and hunter, and in fact was on the Naval Reserve (SeaBees) shooting team. He belonged to a gun club. He was popular with his neighbors. He never fought in high school. He's good to his wife, kids and mama.

Under the same Sheriff whose deputies denied my brother-in-law a permit (and I think it was the same year), and while I was a Detective there, I overheard one established, very well-known Detective telling the Detective in charge of approving gun permits to make sure that he grants a certain candidate the right to carry a concealed weapon, because "he's a big supporter of the Sheriff" (quotes exact - I never forgot it).

If you want to move to California, make sure that you ask locals the REAL possibility of getting a permit, in the precise city or county area where you plan to live. But don't just ask the rich businessmen. Most of those rich businessmen I have known who had permits just happened to be supporters of the Sheriff in the county mentioned! I liked the Sheriff, too, for the most part - but I consider the system to be subject to corruption, for the implied reasons stated.

This is precisely why I believe that the Sheriff, Police Chief, or Attorney General should have NO right in deciding who gets a gun permit. It should be strictly codified and enforced by a body of people who are fair-minded, and not political appointees (especially of a Democratic politician).

[Mike D.]

For the reasons you have stated, John, I will not purchase a new handgun in this state. I'm happy to keep the few I currently own.

You really hit the nail on the head with the politicizing of concealed carry permits. You donate a substantial amount to a Sheriff's campaign and BINGO, you're home free. It really helps if you have friends and family in LE, too.

Here in Sacramento Co. permits are getting increasingly difficult to obtain. The current Sheriff is open to new permits, but with serious reservation, and NO political "gifts". The COP is reviewing city permits and will probably revoke some "for cause". If I lose mine, so be it. No sleep will be lost over it.

[JohndeFresno]

I guess that was my "mistake," Mike. I've always been an honest cop, and although I was in a prestigious investigative position and well known myself, I never mentioned that my brother-in-law was applying for a permit.

I was naive in thinking that he would be able to obtain one because he is a good citizen. And all of that aside, I would not have dreamed of using my "color of authority" to influence anybody in the process - I don't believe in that stuff.

Anyway, my family and extended family are now all situated back in a county where we can obtain CCW's without any problem. But that could all change with the next Sheriff for all but the retired cops in my family, for "cause" as you correctly put it.

Incidentally, carjackings and shootings are quite common in the Central Valley; an almost daily occurrence. And we've had a few armed home invasions, lately. It seems that all of the areas where there is oppressive gun control, there are more citizens at risk per capita.

(Edited for security reasons - JdeF)

[JohndeFresno]

I agree with Mike D on the carry thing, I'd like to know how many of you (besides LEOs of course) have ever actually pulled one on another person? How many have blown someone away? If so, how did you avoid becoming a felon to where you can't have any guns?
Lot of venom here about California, hard to understand why. There is no reason to live anywhere but where you like regardless of jobs, money, whatever. If you're not happy get to a place where you are. This is not a dress rehearsal, you only live once so do it where you want to be. If you don't like California move or simple don't move here. Lots of other beautiful places. I am an Oregon native whose folks moved here many moons ago and love both places. If I didn't like it here I'd get the hell out, even if that meant selling some possessions or whatever to be able to.
JMO.

Jazman,

I can give you a couple of instances where I pulled out a handgun - off duty - but I don't want to get into a long diatribe. ONE example, however, was in Fresno at Roeding Park, when my as of then young wife was carrying a baby and walking with the other girl - a toodler. I spotted a person, jogging, at a time when there were several purse snatches that left female victims downed and injured by just such a jogger. He was jogging, then started at a dead run toward my wife and her babies - her purse dangling from a shoulder.

He didn't see me because I was getting stuff out of the trunk of our car near her, but I was pretty much covered by the trunk. As he made a beeline towards her, I jumped out and turned sideways, my hand on the butt of my .38 Detective Special 2" - just enough where he could see it.

Guess what? I could never have arrested him before the act and proven in a court of law what he was intending to do. And no doubt, because he was a member of a minority group and I was not, I would have been sued and the Sheriff's Office would have been demonstrated against, had I done anything else except act after my wife was assaulted. But when I showed the gun without pulling it, all of a sudden the runner had an immediate interest elsewhere and veered almost 90 degrees in another direction, then running around and behind a fence that borders the zoo.

Just because you may live in a safe area, does not mean that others of us do. And, what do I do? Never take my family to the zoo?

As for this "love it or leave it" thing - there are those of us who are too old to change careers, who make healthy paychecks where we are (in my case, from the State). There are many reasons why several people are stuck where they are, and would rather make things better than to just jerk up stakes and run away from their state, careers, family and friends.

Sorry for the sharp retort, but I am a little weary of this type of statement when it comes to my bemoaning how our beautiful state has been hijacked by the ultra-liberal gun-grabbing politicians. Maybe if I complain at the appropriate times, somebody might read a post and decide to change their decision at the ballot.

As for anybody bragging on the Internet, which is a world-wide exposure, as to when he has pulled a gun or blown somebody away, I don't think you are going to get a lot of takers on that question. That doesn't serve the best interests of the poster.

[Mike D.]

In 35 yrs I have never displayed, or had a reason to draw, my weapon. Call it luck, if you will, I certainly am better off for it. Anyone in possession of a CCWP knows the drill, the use is for dire emergency situations only. If some fool goes around using his sidearm as a threat to others, his permit will rightly be revoked.

[JohndeFresno]

Hmmmm...nice.

I guess the appropriate response is, since I couldn't get to my wife on time from where I was... any simpleton who is not willing to stick his neck out to keep his wife and children from getting hurt, has no business carrying a loaded firearm.