1892 & 1911 (Update: Para range report)

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:32 pm

Gun porn!

Finally had a chance to grab a pic of the Rossi 92 that I found at what I thought was a great price last month ($299) and while I was at it I set the Para hi-cap 1911 I picked up yesterday in the photo too. I "need" another 1911 like a hole in the head, but I've always liked the hi-cap Paras (even more so now that they're made in the U.S.) and I'm worried that they'll either be outlawed or strangled to 10 rounds soon, so I grabbed it while the gettin' was good (frankly, they've been hard to find for some time now, I'm surprised that they had two for sale at Sportsman's Warehouse yesterday). While I was out trolling yesterday I did not see a single "evil" rifle of any kind at any shop. They're still all gone. The guys at SW said that they get in a couple per week and when they set them out they're gone within five minutes. Basically, the first guy who sees it buys it.

At any rate, it occured to me that they are both modern interpretations of classic designs. No bolt safety or lawyer latch or whatever on the Rossi though - it's an older model. It has the integral front sight with the barrel band which I don't like, but that's the only draw back that I can see on it. I look forward to stripping the stocks and letting the wood shine out and also to getting them both to the range when it's not in the 30s or 40s!

Cheers,
Oly

rjohns94 · Post by **rjohns94** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:44 pm

That's a nice combo! Congrats

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:51 pm

Oh and the Leatherman through the 92's lever is the one my wife gave me for Christmas. No prompting! Made me happy and proud that she picked it out for me.

Oly

cshold · Post by **cshold** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:07 pm

Removed

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:15 pm

oly,
Let me know how the stocks turn out, my .44mag Rossi is real dark like yours.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:21 pm

Mescalero wrote:oly,
Let me know how the stocks turn out, my .44mag Rossi is real dark like yours.

You should send that to me, since you're so busy mining....I don't mind dark stocks.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 1:29 pm

Mining ----,
spent all morning playing phone tag with the attorney, consultant, operator.
Got the herd all gathered up and headed in the right direction, will know more with nightly report.

damienph · Post by **damienph** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:01 pm

olyinaz wrote:Gun porn!

Finally had a chance to grab a pic of the Rossi 92 that I found at what I thought was a great price last month ($299) and while I was at it I set the Para hi-cap 1911 I picked up yesterday in the photo too. I "need" another 1911 like a hole in the head, but I've always liked the hi-cap Paras (even more so now that they're made in the U.S.) and I'm worried that they'll either be outlawed or strangled to 10 rounds soon, so I grabbed it while the gettin' was good (frankly, they've been hard to find for some time now, I'm surprised that they had two for sale at Sportsman's Warehouse yesterday). While I was out trolling yesterday I did not see a single "evil" rifle of any kind at any shop. They're still all gone. The guys at SW said that they get in a couple per week and when they set them out they're gone within five minutes. Basically, the first guy who sees it buys it.

At any rate, it occured to me that they are both modern interpretations of classic designs. No bolt safety or lawyer latch or whatever on the Rossi though - it's an older model. It has the integral front sight with the barrel band which I don't like, but that's the only draw back that I can see on it. I look forward to stripping the stocks and letting the wood shine out and also to getting them both to the range when it's not in the 30s or 40s!

Cheers,
Oly

Yes, Nice combo! I especially like your Rossi. I don't think that your stocks are too dark. The figure of the wood still shows through. I've seen some Rossis that have stocks that are almost black; I like yours just as they are. And if I ever run across one locally for $299... well, it will go home with me no matter what caliber it is.

bdhold · Post by **bdhold** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:05 pm

thanks for the flashy photo.

pwl44m · Post by **pwl44m** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 2:34 pm

Now thats just Gorgeous, It is hard to find Marble like that,!

and those Guns just compliment matters. Hey Oly, U want a 22 conversion for that Para ? all joking aside that is a Good looking Combo.
Perry

gak · Post by **gak** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:34 pm

Oly - good finds. I've got several of those Interarms 92s--fine guns. Near the end they were cranking them out fast for CAS'ers and as mentioned went with an almost black - "mystery stain" we've called them. (Must be to cover "lesser wood" by then?) I remember when a local pawn shop in Phoenix had twenty of them-all lined up new--and were selling out. I didn't need another 92 but wish now I would have bitten. Most were .45s or I may have succumbed! All mine are earlier, lighter stocks. The sight on the barrel band does bother a bit, but I figure if it gets to the point it's too much I'll get a band without and have a sight put in the proper spot.

Folks including our own NKJ hve said in 2000 (after Interarms ended/had morphed into LSI as the largest distributor) Rossi retooled and subsequent guns have been smoother, better. Perhaps so--and my two pre safety EMFs ca 2002-2006 wouldn't entirely refute that--but I never have had a problem with my Interarms 92s. They've all been pretty smooth with only levering and shooting, and certainly none have been "rough as cobbs" as some have said. And, at least two I bought new in the 80s were slick right out of the box as anything more recent. I don't know if I saw you said what caliber?

Pitchy · Post by **Pitchy** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:20 pm

Very nice indeed.

44-40 Willy · Post by **44-40 Willy** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:22 pm

gak wrote:Folks including our own NKJ hve said in 2000 (after Interarms ended/had morphed into LSI as the largest distributor) Rossi retooled and subsequent guns have been smoother, better.

Around 98 or 99, Rossi started making an upgraded gun for Navy Arms who sold it as their 1892. Real walnut and better fit and finish along with smoother working action. Then shortly afterwards, the regular Rossis started showing up smoother and better as well.

Anyways, that's a nice 92 and I think I missed what caliber too.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:18 pm

The sight on the barrel band does bother a bit, but I figure if it gets to the point it's too much I'll get a band without and have a sight put in the proper spot.

I have seen old winchesters with that sight-band arrangement, it's traditional.

I think.

Grizz

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:31 pm

1892&1911, two of my favorite numbers!!

I have a Rossi that looks just like that in .357 worked over by NKJ. One of my favorite fun guns. Font sight \/band is the
same but separate on my Winchesters.

I don't have a Para Ord, but have six 1911s and need to buy another one this year since I just turned 45.

Really like the Springfield 6" "Long slide" that came out last year but can't find one right now.

jb

gak · Post by **gak** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:29 am

Grizz wrote:
The sight on the barrel band does bother a bit, but I figure if it gets to the point it's too much I'll get a band without and have a sight put in the proper spot.
I have seen old winchesters with that sight-band arrangement, it's traditional.

I think.

Grizz

I think maybe "traditional" only on one of the periods of the '73, never on the '92. I don't know '76s well so can't say on those. Little known factoid, one of the ways to spot the Spanish El Tigre 92s right off in the old westerns is the sight is in front (toward the barrel end) of the band like the '86s, versus "behind" on the Win 92 carbines (and is also correctly placed on recent decades' Rossis and Chiappas)..

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:22 pm

gak wrote:
Grizz wrote:
The sight on the barrel band does bother a bit, but I figure if it gets to the point it's too much I'll get a band without and have a sight put in the proper spot.
I have seen old winchesters with that sight-band arrangement, it's traditional.

I think.

Grizz
I think maybe "traditional" only on one of the periods of the '73, never on the '92. I don't know '76s well so can't say on those. Little known factoid, one of the ways to spot the Spanish El Tigre 92s right off in the old westerns is the sight is in front (toward the barrel end) of the band like the '86s, versus "behind" on the Win 92 carbines (and is also correctly placed on recent decades' Rossis and Chiappas)..

I think you're right there! It's a '73 thing and not correct for a '92.

The 92 is in .45 Colt if I forgot to say so. Back home and the weather has broken so maybe I can get to the range tomorrow.

Oly

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:05 am

OK, I was wondering what cal. So let me know what you find in testing the Rossi. Mine shoots larger .454ish bullets much better than the smaller ones. Wish I had a new hot chic pic for you but here is the reason I won't be testing anything for a while yet. Just came out of the splint from the second surgery to put in new steel two weeks ago. - 35 staples came out.

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:58 am

I like my 1892, and my 1911.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:21 am

Like all of life, firearms ownership is a progression.

Winchester & Colt enjoyed a long relationship. With a few sidekicks thrown in!

OS, take care of that!

Panzercat · Post by **Panzercat** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:15 am

Man, that lever/45acp combo makes me jealous. When fiances firm up, I'll probably pick up an American Classic II in hard chrome to give my lever some company

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:46 am

OS,
That has got to hurt.

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:35 pm

It'll get better Mesc, then I'll be able to rejoin the party with these 45 fellers. Just ordered a Baranti proto type for the 3 screw.

Panzercat · Post by **Panzercat** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:55 pm

Old Savage wrote:What, this little scratch? I got it in a bar fight protecting an innocent young virgin from a marauding gang of bikers. And Nazis. Um, Biker Nazis. And they were undead too. I was protecting her from Zombie Biker Nazis and a pack of wild badgers. They were undead too, but nothing I couldn't handle. Just a flesh wound.

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:09 pm

Nice guns Oly and an especially nice marble top. You made a good move on the Para.

Griff,
Nice looking hammer double barrel you have there!

And OS, why don't you tell us how you really got that long slice. Did she have razor blades in her bra?

------------------------------6

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:25 pm

Actually Six, her name is Emma, she seemed cute and sweet when we first met, very engaging and understanding, very willing to discuss what I wanted her to do for me - but the she drugged me with the help of another woman and some Asian guy - I was powerless to resist. She pulled a knife on me but I did solicit her and paid $125 - my wife wrote the check and was there when we discussed "services" - she seemed to approve. When I came to, I was in the hospital. A French woman I know happened by to console me. Another woman gave me more drugs before my wife took me home.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:49 pm

Last time I went to the hospital some fat guy knocked me out and stuck a big long tube down my throat.
OS how come our experiences are so different?

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:08 pm

Sixgun wrote:Griff,
Nice looking hammer double barrel you have there!
And OS, why don't you tell us how you really got that long slice. Did she have razor blades in her bra? ------------------------------6

Sixgun,
That's a different one. TTN 1878 clone.

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:15 pm

Old Savage wrote:OK, I was wondering what cal. So let me know what you find in testing the Rossi. Mine shoots larger .454ish bullets much better than the smaller ones. Wish I had a new hot chic pic for you but here is the reason I won't be testing anything for a while yet. Just came out of the splint from the second surgery to put in new steel two weeks ago. - 35 staples came out.

Yikes! Got me beat! Hang in there.

Oly

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:47 pm

Not sure what I got you beat on Oly - lots more staples on the first go round - BUT, I am interested in what you do find shooting that 45 Rossi. Tutt gave me some loads that put out a custom Keith 360 gr at 1350. I would like an easier accurate load an got some 300s in .455 - .456 but didn't get to load them before I was sidetracked by the adventures in surgery and recovery. Hopefully sping/summer I will be able to re engage. Til then my friend I would like to see what you can come up with.

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:03 pm

Mesc, only guy I saw was Asian aneshtetist, otherwise about a dozen different women squire you through all the stages. Shana - the gal that seemed to be in control of the pre op procedures told me that there would a representative from Smith And Wesson in the operating room. Shana and Barbara S the dilauded gal are shooters - seems we all shoot at the same range. Now Smith and Nephew or similar name apparently manufacture the steel plates and screws and are apparently there with what looked like a tackle box of plate and screw options. I can see by the post xrays that they match up the length of the screw to the bone. Gerry G and Henriett, volunteers, (lovely) ladies and Henriett used to own a local Basque restaurant with wine from her town in France - so nice to see her - she works part time as a receptionist for another chiro in town. All in all I think God provided me with much feminine support through out the experience and Dr Emma Woodhouse who did the work is wonderful in her care. The recovery room nurse was great - we were laughing and joking through that process - she was making faces to liven me up to move that along faster. And let's not forget Mo - the surgical nurse, a sweetheart.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:46 pm

Your experience was a lot more pleasent than mine.

Post by **Old Savage** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:59 pm

What happened to you, pm if you like.

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:32 pm

Nothing as dramatic as you,
endoscopy & expand or stretch esophagus.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:26 pm

A real cool "combo" set that covers all bases:

Rossi 92 in .45 Colt
Ruger Blackhawk in .45 Colt/.45 ACP for 'field' use
1911 in .45 ACP for CCW

It does somehow seem funny to pair a levergun and a 1911, but they are of pretty similar vintage.

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:14 pm

I managed to find an hour and a half to get out to my local range, so I grabbed the 1911 as I wanted to function test it. I shot Winchester ball, Federal ball, Blazer aluminum (don't hate - I got a ton of it cheap and I like it for when I'm out in the boonies and I know that brass recovery will be hard to impossible), Wolf steel (again, don't hate - same comment as previous), Hornady TAP 200 gr +P, and Winchester PDX 230 gr +P.

I put 220 rounds down range, and after working through all of the ball ammo (200 rounds) in both magazines and loading each one to capacity (14, that last one is a real bugger to get in there), the Para had not had a malfunction. This despite the fact that somehow my gun oil had gone missing from my range kit so I had to apply a very small amount of grease to some of the high friction areas on the 1911 before getting started.

After 200 rounds the pistol was extremely sooty (the Wolf in particular shoots very dirty), but I pressed on and loaded the +P home defense ammo into mags and got started with that. First, it became clear very early that this pistol with the standard recoil spring is not happy shooting +P ammo. The slide was ramming back with too much snap for my tastes so I stopped after ten rounds of the Hornady +P and tried the Winchester 230 gr +P. Yes, there was little chance that it would be better, but I was testing so I tested. Sure enough, the Winchester was just as bad and I was going to call it quits after ten rounds but on the 8th round (217 rounds down range at that point) the pistol malfunctioned, and I'm happy to say that it was only a simple failure to return fully to battery as the gun had just gotten too dirty. The slide didn't make it home the last 16th of an inch. I pushed it home and fired the last two rounds without incident, but I was done at that point.

If I'd called it a day after the 200 rounds of ball I'd have gone home and cleaned the gun and never been the wiser. And who knows, it may have kept on chambering ball ammo just fine, but the gun was unquestionably dirty at this point and as mentioned before I had not properly lubricated it, so I'm giving it a pass on that 218th round not going home. Zero stove pipes or failures to eject or failures to feed of any kind.

Also, I note that Para is now sourcing their mags from Mec-Gar of Italy. This is NOT a bad thing as Mec-Gar makes some of the finest pistol mags in the industry.

Lastly, the pistol shoots a bit low and left. It's not a huge problem as I'll probably have it fitted with adjustable sights anyhow, and even if I didn't it could be corrected by drifting the rear and filing the front, but it's always an annoyance when a fixed sight gun does not shoot to point of aim.

That's all I got for ya! It was a pleasure to shoot. I like the feel of a high cap 1911 (always have and I make no apologies for it), and Para seems to be continually improving the fit and finish of their arms. It's not a Kimber, but it's right in the pack with the Ruger or Springfield 1911s for finish.

Cheers,
Oly

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:38 pm

I see no reason to have a '1911' that isn't a 'double-stack' one.

Kind of like preferring a Garand over an M1A [

] other than for sentimental reasons. My fingers are long enough that a single-stack 1911 grip feels uncomfortably 'flat', so why not fill in the space with 7 more rounds of ammunition...?

I love my Para-14 and my 'little' Officer's-model-sized P-12, though it "only holds 12 shots"...

Rock Island makes a good double-stack clone as well.

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 11:53 pm

I haven't seen the Rock Island double stacks but I'd like to. I did check out a Springfield double stack and it was inferior to the Para. I'll keep my eyes peeled for one. They've just come out with some sort of .22 cal uber velocity chambering that is intriguing also...

Oly

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:12 am

you can buy two of these for the cost of two, or one and two thirds of those. with the 10 round mag it conceals as well and as easily as my xd9sc.

accurate and reliable and lighter than the metal jobs.

Grizz

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 1:50 pm

Grizz wrote:
you can buy two of these for the cost of two, or one and two thirds of those. with the 10 round mag it conceals as well and as easily as my xd9sc.

accurate and reliable and lighter than the metal jobs.

Grizz

They are indeed and I have some of those too, but they're not 1911s. Always going to be a special place in my collection for 1911s.

Cheers,
Oly

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:39 pm

I have a milspec 1911-A1 clone that I enjoy shooting. Just doesn't meet my carry needs as well as the xd. My wife and kids all prefer shooting the 1911, it's that sweet.

I'd love to shoot a hi-cap 1911 just for the fun of it.

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:48 pm

Grizz wrote: I'd love to shoot a hi-cap 1911 just for the fun of it.

Sounds like another call for a Great Southwestern Leverguns Meet 'n' Shoot. You can shoot mine.

Oly

Mescalero · Post by **Mescalero** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 6:29 pm

Can I come?

olyinaz · Post by **olyinaz** » Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:35 pm

Mescalero wrote:Can I come?

Heck yes!

Oly

flightsimmer · Post by **flightsimmer** » Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:08 pm

A friend of mine went to the SHOT show and he said he saw and handled one of the new Winchester model 1873 rifles in .38/.357 Magnum ($1299) and oddly enough he said he would rather have the Rossi 92.
Anyone have a second opinion?

Grizzly Adams · Post by **Grizzly Adams** » Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:52 pm

flightsimmer wrote:A friend of mine went to the SHOT show and he said he saw and handled one of the new Winchester model 1873 rifles in .38/.357 Magnum ($1299) and oddly enough he said he would rather have the Rossi 92.
Anyone have a second opinion?

Odd indeed! I'd rather have a Winchester 1873 than three Rossi 92's!