BROWNING BLR BARREL REMOVAL

[NFG]

I just picked up a Browning BLR 450 Marlin I'm very impressed with and while doing some load workup got to thinking about rebarreling...

HOW IN THE HECK do you remove a barrel in the aluminum framed receiver without taking out the lug or bending the receiver at the same time??

I've been crawling the net for 3 days trying to find out how. Only ONE reference about heating with a propane torch and "burning" out the "locktite".

Is there a tool made to hold the lug while the barrel is broken loose??

Thanks.

[Bruce]

You don't/can't remove the barrel. The barrel/receiver is a press fit, unless it is a takedown model. There is a pin, but it is not your normal assembly. Rebarreling is not much of an option either. The receiver/barrel combination is meant to be one unit. Do a forum search and you can find alot of information.

[NFG]

Thanks...I did a search and read the comments, but have read other comments saying it can be done and it isn't all that much of a problem EXCEPT the barrel is sealed to the lug and the lug is press fitted into the aluminum frame so you have to take care and support EVERYTHING from EVERY DIRECTION.

I can understand why few gunsmiths want to deal with this thing and the reasons why Browning does what they do, partly...and I understand the lawyer-eze...and the Browning fits a "different" niche...there are many out there who want to do some kind of "wildcatting" done IF there were simple ways to do it.

I'm an oldtime, dirt spread mechanic...if I couldn't keep the equipment in the dirt making money I was out of a job... I have a metal shop, I swap barrels around various receivers all the time, make a lot of my own parts and other "thingys" and have fixed lots of things that "can't be fixed"...telling me what Browning does can help or describing "how" it is attached doesn't really tell me anything as I can see that in my rifle...besides...read how many people think the bolt locks into the barrel when it doesn't...it locks to a lug/boss that the barrel is screwed into, that is fitted to the receiver...at least that's what I'm seeing on my BLR...I could be cross-eyed tho'.

I've done some press fit steel to aluminum and alum to steel and have a small knowledge of the requirements, which is why just saying you "can't" doesn't compute...maybe some can't but that doesn't necessarily mean it "can't" be done.

If the barrel is screwed in, it can be screwed out...the only real problem is knowing if the barrel is screwed in so tight the threads are almost welded together, therefore trying to remove the barrel will only serve to destroy both the barrel threads AND the boss threads...THAT IS THE INFORMATION I'm trying to find out...I need specific information.

I was hoping someone who knows for certain, a Browning tech or someone who has gunsmithed Browning BLR/BAR's would give a good description of the why's and whatfor's.

I'm not about to destroy a $1000 rifle, but I've found a few used and abused BAR's in the $350-400 bracket I wouldn't feel too bad about trying to remove the barrel...at least I could send it back to Browning for a repair job and still end up with a nice rifle.

My main problem is the only decent gunsmith I would trust who DOES know about Brownings works when he wants to, hardly answers his phone and I live 50 mile away... ...and he's off chasing gun shows now.

Oh well...as usual...I pick the more difficult things to play with...I will find out for certain before too long.

Thanks again.

[BenT]

To fit steel valve seats into aluminum heads they cool them with dry ice and they just drop in and expand to a tight fit when they warm up. Maybe that is how Browning is getting the steel sleeve to fit into the alloy reciever. Keep us posted on what you find , I'm curious of what you find. When I've checked in the past Browning only sells the barrels mated to a empty receiver for the BLR.

[NFG]

Roger that...setup an interference fit, heat one part, cool the other, stick'um together...quickly...been there, done that. Heat one side of a big piece of steel and squirt water on the other side and watch it bend around in a circle...totally neat way to bend RR track into a circle. Hahahahaha

I sure wouldn't heat the aluminum frame/lug to "burn out" any sealant, but heating the barrel with a large heat sink around the frame area might do the trick. I'll wait to find a cheap rag to test it on.

I've had to do a few heat/freeze cycles with several Remington's, SMLE's and Mauser's before the barrels would come loose without tweaking the action. I did tweak a Sav LA by just a skosh too much muscle on the bar, but got it back almost straight...just a few thou twist that only caused a small problem with the scope mounts and a 0.010" shim fixed that, so lessons are always out there to learn by.

I only torque my switch barrels to 50 ft lbs which doesn't seem like much, but I've never had a barrel unscrew itself or loosen up...when I get the receiver threads and the barrel threads cut almost perfectly, I can snap the two together by hand and need a barrel wrench to get them apart again...gotta be careful when I'm down to the last couple thou' on the headspace setup.


Someone was asking about the block at the front end of the 450M magazine. My rig came with 3 extra mags so I will also do some fiddling with one of them....I need an additional 0.050" so I can seat to 2.65" to match up several bullets of different weights with the case length/bullet cannelure/touching the lands dimension. These mags are $60 bucks apiece so I wouldn't muck around if I only had one. I't shouldn't be too hard a job just by looking at it, but you know how that goes.

Luck

[Bruce]

I wasn't trying to quelch your adventure or experiments. I was just passing on what I have found through a few years worth of extensive research. I had some unverified information once about a gunsmith (reportedly retired) that could rebarrel a BLR. I tried everything I could to get confirmation and kept running into nothing. I would suggest that you contact http://www.midwestgunworks.com as they appear to be a good source for the Browning repairs/parts etc.., maybe the only good source outside of Browning.

I am 99.9% certain that if you send a barrel, receiver or combination of both to Browning for repair, you are going to get a new set.

If you are successful, there are many who would be appreciative of the information. Please let us know how you proceed.

[NFG]

Thanks Bruce...I understand and appreciate the information, I wasn't trying to come across all weird...I tend to be very direct which is definitely NOT politically correct and takes people aback without meaning any diss.

I'm kinda like the "energizer bunny" when it comes to projects or interests...you'd have to shoot me to stop me.

A lot of information on the net is "Urban Legend" like...everyone has "heard about it" but no one has "seen it", or adds their own version of fact. That's what I'm running into.. So far I've hit 3-4 levergun forums and most of the others with a levergun thread without getting ANY definitive information.

I have gotten barred from a couple by asking the wrong question or saying something they didn't like, getting hammered, then doing my own hammering...unfortunately before I cool down...then regretting my infantilism. My past required direct action quickly to keep all the pieces and parts "staying alive" way to many times...it must have worked because here I am...still, so I apologize in advance for any "untoward" statements.


One thing you can tell me, Bruce...does the steel framed BLR have the "lug/boss" holding the barrel, then press fit into the steel frame?? I've only seen ONE BLR in my area in 15 years and that's the one I bought...one gun shop has two used BAR's in stock now, so I will study those very hard in hopes of gaining some modicum of information.

Thanks again

[Bruce]

The steel framed BLR's are threaded vs. what I call a press fit on the alloy frames. I have never had either apart and have not seen one apart, so I can't absolutely answer your question. I assume you have read this article - http://shootingwithhobie.blogspot.com/2 ... lr-by.html. The barrel/receiver mystery of the BLR has stumped many of us for awhile. It just appears that the machinery required to duplicate the factory system would be way to costly, with the early steel framed models being more easily duplicated, but not easy.

[NFG]

I did scan through that article, but I was looking specifically for barrel/removal etc., references...I will re-read it again, several times, to extract all the tasty stuff.

Cleaned the 450M today and did the mag box. Just popped out the two roll pins and the block came out with a bit of jiggling.

The block measured 0.330" plus and I milled off ~0.050" to bring the thickness down to 0.280" which ended up giving a measured 2.68"....but you can't use all that because you need ~15-20 thou to keep the rounds from binding, ~2.66-67" max COL, and the extra length isn't usable unless the bullet to lands distance fits.

Because the case doesn't have a shoulder the added gap could cause a problem also, but I won't know untill I do some shooting. For all intents and purposes there isn't any gain to be had other than maybe not compressing the powder charge for those that reload.

Hope whoever was asking about the 450M mag box, also is following this thread and gets some good out of it.

My 450M with the Hornady 350 JFP is 2.62" to the lands so the extra gap doesn't much matter...but I have some 500 gr bore riders that measure 2.78" to the lands...and I can seat the 430 TrueShot to 2.65-66" OK...even if that means into the lands a bit. The 300 gr offerings can stand all the length I can get, but I don't see buying a 45 cal then using light bullets....THAT doesn't compute at all...I use big calibers especially for big bullets and BIG game....I have plenty of other heavy hitters from 338 t0 50 cal, plus all the smaller stuff. 50 plus years of playing has it's advantages.

After looking at my rig thoroughly and now understanding the steel frame is threaded, my first thought is the thinness of the frame walls...there just ISN'T much support for the torque pressure to be spread around. A Marlin has the trigger group which is screwed on in several places which, when clamped in a wide supporting block stops any forces from collapsing the frame walls...the Browning needs some kind of block inside the magazine well along with a stub fitting the grooves for the bolt on the aluminum frame to keep the pressed in lug from turning, THEN a clamp on the outside of the frame and a barrel wrench.

I now see why no one wants to deal with it and why Browning sells "barreled receivers" instead of just barrels. Compared to a Marlin or just about any other receiver, a guy would go mighty hungry trying to survive on Browning fare.

What I DON'T understand is with todays CNC machinery, tools/fitted "torque blocks", could be made fairly inexpensively for both the steel and aluminum frames that could open up a small niche for those wanting a different caliber using the same case with the Browning...maybe The Browning barrel is a simple design without a lot of chewing for extractor slots or dovetails and such. I could see a 45 or 50 cal using the RUM or Lapua case or a 348 case with an extracter groove instead of a rim. Not sure many could take the kind of recoil level a 525 gr, 50 cal bullet would produce in a light Browning. My 510 Makatak, Rigby cased, tang model Ruger with a heavy #5 taper barrel and added weight at 12# plus makes me hurt just thinking about working up loads on the bench.

I'm going to take a shot at making a "lug wrench" to fit into the bolt slots and maybe some kind of magazine cutout block...I only have manual machines without even digital readouts...I have to do it the old fashioned way...with a dial indicator and hope.

Luck

[NFG]

Thanks 1886 for the address...I've been looking for quite a while.

Luck

[MZ5]

NFG, did you get any further with this project?

[AJMD429]

I have gotten barred from a couple by asking the wrong question or saying something they didn't like, getting hammered, then doing my own hammering...unfortunately before I cool down...then regretting my infantilism. My past required direct action quickly to keep all the pieces and parts "staying alive" way to many times...it must have worked because here I am...still, so I apologize in advance for any "untoward" statements.

Reminds me of when I built my house (myself) - I just read about stuff and combined it with common sense and what I'd done as a farm-kid doing outbuildings, etc., but kept running into people who told me "they don't make those" or "you can't get those" when I wanted things out of the ordinary or didn't know the proper name so described a part. I even had three different building supply places tell me there was no place that made an electrically-operated water-valve for 1" pipe (so the burglar alarm could shut off the interior water in case a pipe burst when we weren't home) - this near a city full of industry where I'm sure there are literally millions of electrically operated valves capable of shutting on and off caustic things at 400 degrees and 400 psi, much less tap water at 40 psi... I also learned "they don't make" furnace-fans, too - I guess the Pope or somebody just comes into the furnace-factories at night and makes them magically appear right there inside the furnaces...!

Do you think Browning would re-barrel it for you, or sell you a barreled receiver in the chambering you're looking for...???

[Tycer]

The pre-81s have threaded barrels with the lugs part of the receiver. The lugs are part of the 81+ barrels.

[Coloradoyaler]

NFG

This is a 416 Ruger Wid West in Anchorage, AK, built. I talked with Brian, one of their gunsmiths, and he said they made a special tool for removing the barrels. Give them a cal. The last I talked with them they only charge $600 to rebarrel the blr. Not bad by todays standards! They also chambered them in a 375 Ruger.

[MZ5]

The lugs are part of the 81+ barrels.

No, they're in a barrel extension which the barrel screws into, just like on an AR.

[MZ5]

NFG

This is a 416 Ruger Wid West in Anchorage, AK, built. I talked with Brian, one of their gunsmiths, and he said they made a special tool for removing the barrels. Give them a cal. The last I talked with them they only charge $600 to rebarrel the blr. Not bad by todays standards! They also chambered them in a 375 Ruger.

Thanks, Coloradoyaler!!