Wife laughs at new levergun, gets no rebuttal

[deafrn]

I'm used to the uneven quality of Rossi 92 clones, having owned variants sold by three different importers. I have even sworn them off at one time, only to get another one on a whim and have my faith restored. My LGS ordered me a new carbine (and from a fourth importer, no less) months ago, and it finally arrived this week. Before filling out the "fight crime and evil" forms and paying for it, I gave it a cursory glance and sort of shrugged off the weird wood-to-metal fit along the top tang... hey, it's a Rossi after all, right?

I got around to disassembling it this afternoon, and with each screw or pin removed, I found something that wasn't quite what I had expected. Anyway, when I took the forearm off, I dang near had a cat- the unidentifiable but very lightweight wood was (to be charitable) not of first quality, the fitting was less than precise, and the thing was split clean down the length of what little there was of the "web" of wood between the barrel and the mag tube. I made my way to the kitchen, handed Mrs. Deafrn the forearm, backed up a step and asked her what she thought of it.

Oh, lordy! She laughed, she marveled, she pondered, she... well, ultimately she suggested that it should go back to Rossi to be placed in a most uncomfortable spot. Now, my wife and I have been married for 30 years, and those three decades have seen a lot of firearms come and go; they have also seen a lot of hardware scattered on the kitchen table when the bench is already full. But tonight marks a first: I have never had her laugh out loud at a new gun's build quality.

And - another first - I laughed about it too! I'm mellowing in my old age after all. Anyone else here experienced something similar?

[AJMD429]

Anyway, when I took the forearm off, I dang near had a cat- the unidentifiable but very lightweight wood was (to be charitable) not of first quality, the fitting was less than precise, and the thing was split clean down the length of what little there was of the "web" of wood between the barrel and the mag tube.

I had a nice 'pre-Remington' Marlin XLR that was like that...

Here's just a couple pictures of the crummy fit (I can't find my picture of it, but the area under the magazine tube is STILL full of splits; I just used a bunch of furniture-wax to seal it after sanding it by wrapping the magazine tube in sandpaper and sliding the forend over it for ten minutes or so):



The GOOD news is that I got an affordable gun, $500 less than the cost of some high-end safe-queen, and with a minimal amount of elbow-grease, got it to shoot THIS five-shot, 100-yard group (without any 'cool-down' in between shots):



Remember, this was a "pre-Remington" Marlin.

Still, if someone had offered me the $500 difference in cost vs. a 'perfect' gun, I'd have taken the less-expensive one and done the half-hour's worth of work to get it where I wanted it.

Back "in the day" (1970's) I remember spending a couple hundred bucks on a pretty nice rifle was expected, and twice that much for a beautifully-fit one. The worth of a dollar is now about 1/6th as much, so - why is it that gun purchasers are 'offended' that a 'pretty nice' rifle will cost about $600, and a 'beautifully-fit' one about $1,200...?

If I want a 'beautifully-fit' gun, I'll buy a Turnbull for $1,200 or so, and if I want a 'shooter', I won't be offended if it costs $600. It's called "inflation", and comes to us courtesy of Uncle Sam...

[deafrn]

Here's just one picture of the crummy fit:

That one is definitely cringe-worthy. I'd post pics of the forend my better half cracked up over, but I'm post-Photobucket as of this week. It is kind of fun to get a "project" gun to mess with if you can get it for a reasonable price.

A couple of years ago a situation like this would have had me cussing until the shop was a blue haze and swearing off ever ordering another gun, but apparently I'm entering that part of life where I'm able to "stick around just to see what I get stung on next." Busting out laughing at the mess was hands down the best reaction a person could have.

[AJMD429]

A couple of years ago a situation like this would have had me cussing until the shop was a blue haze and swearing off ever ordering another gun, but apparently I'm entering that part of life where I'm able to "stick around just to see what I get stung on next." Busting out laughing at the mess was hands down the best reaction a person could have.

There are far worse things going on in the world than having a less-than-perfect firearm...

[SteveR]

[quote="AJMD429"]
The GOOD news is that I got an affordable gun, $500 less than the cost of some high-end safe-queen, and with a minimal amount of elbow-grease, got it to shoot THIS five-shot, 100-yard group (without any 'cool-down' in between shots):

quote]

There are only 4 holes.................

Steve

[Old Savage]

Clearly 5 shots though. What is the caliber and model. Great gun with the crush fit forend - could become all the rage.

[.45colt]

I can just see Wally the new assembler........this durn cap won't fit on the thingy. hey says His co-worker that started yesterday, just get a Bigger Hammer... .

[Panzercat]

Oh, you are simply not inspiring me with confidence. I (probably) pick up my Rossi 92 .454 tomorrow. We'll see, huh?

[deafrn]

Oh, you are simply not inspiring me with confidence. I (probably) pick up my Rossi 92 .454 tomorrow. We'll see, huh?

If you get a good one, my bet is that you will love it.

The issue I have with them is that they are so doggone variable; it seems as if each one is another roll of the dice. The Navy Arms short rifles I traded away were quite nice examples of Rossi 92s, and I thought the late LSI-imported ones were better than earlier ones. As for the current crop from Braztech... I don't know, but the difference between this new one of mine and a (supposedly) identical 2007 example - which had a glitch here and there that I dealt with myself - is like night and day.

The newer carbines appear to have a better front sight (with a flat-faced round brass bead), a one-piece rear sight (better than the riveted two-piece) and come with some tapped holes for a scout scope mount; these are all positive changes and are commendable. (Personally, I'd just as soon have had them D&T the receiver side for a Lyman or Williams aperture sight, but I am something of a dinosaur. It'd probably raise hob with the bolt safety anyway...)

Changes I don't like so much are that the carbine buttplates appear to be stamped from thinner sheet stock, the new - and to me "redundantly redundant" - keyed "lock" on the hammer. The extractor on mine is blued (the gun itself is stainless), and maybe they all come with blued ones now, but if so, it looks sort of odd compared to the older guns.

Hopefully yours will not have been made early Monday morning or late Friday afternoon!

[FatJackDurham]

I am discovering some probs with my Rossi .357.

Magazine tube doesn't seat all the way against the machined rim in the receiver, so there is a gap in which .357 Mag soft points catch on the rim of the tube, both coming an going.

As well, when they drilled between the mag tube and the barrel, I believe they caused a deformation in the bore. I am ordering a bore slug kit to be sure, but while pushing a tight fitting patch through on a jag, I feel a subtle bump. I used a bore caliper thing set to the diameter of the groves, oiled it and slid it down the barrel. It jams right at the point where the barrel band goes around.

Assuming its true, I wonder how to get it fixed.

[ollogger]

my rossi is used for home deffence now, the stock warped so bad i
now can shoot around corners
no its not quite that bad but it did walk bout 3/4s of a inch
a tang site helped that a lot, short of a new rear stock anybody
have a fix for that?

ollogger

[deafrn]

Hmm... I had a Marlin 1894C once that had a gap at the tube/receiver junction; occasionally a rim would sort of slip down in there and tie things up. I ended up sending it back to Marlin... I'm not sure how that'd work out nowadays. Hopefully the most it would take would be a different mag tube.

I've actually had a variety of levergun makes with slight bumps or ripples in the bore where a dovetail was cut or a transverse slot was milled. The absolute worst of the bunch was a USRAC-made .44 Mag trapper that the front sight dovetailing operation had displaced metal downward into the bore. Oddly, it shot just fine, and I probably wouldn't have noticed it were I not a compulsive cleaner. I'd still be shooting it if someone hadn't wanted it more than I did at the same time I was starting to get rid of everything in 44 Mag.

Not one of mine, but a .45-70 Marlin Cowboy I looked over at a "famous sporting goods chain" a couple years ago had a seriously deep front sight dovetail that had to have been microscopically thin between the bottom of the dovetail and the lands on the other side- I almost thought I could see some of the semicircular marks left by the dovetail cutting tool (t'was wavy, at any rate). It would have looked right at home in an experiment to see just how thin a barrel could get at the muzzle before letting go.

[AJMD429]

Not one of mine, but a .45-70 Marlin Cowboy I looked over at a "famous sporting goods chain" a couple years ago had a seriously deep front sight dovetail that had to have been microscopically thin between the bottom of the dovetail and the lands on the other side- I almost thought I could see some of the semicircular marks left by the dovetail cutting tool (t'was wavy, at any rate). It would have looked right at home in an experiment to see just how thin a barrel could get at the muzzle before letting go.

Maybe that's how "Mag-na-porting" got started...

[Carlsen Highway]

I'm wondering how much is involved with the importers you guys have. Maybe they have screwed Rossi right down on the price.
Over here, I have had three Rossi's, two carbines and a 24 inch barrelled rifle, all in .44/40, and all have been well made, slicked up well with use, and quite accurate; the rifle particuarly so. I have seen others and they were just as fine.
We don't get the safety models here luckily, I think they only make them for the US market.

[pricedo]

Like I keep saying it's a Rossi...........what else is new???
Just like a previous poster on the thread said every gun is a brand new roll of the dice.
If you ever apply for a job at the Rossi factory don't put Quality Control Inspector on the "position applied for" line.........they don't have any there.
The guns go into the box just as they come off the line without so much as a second look.
The only Quality Control Inspector that will handle the rifle before you lay the cash down on the barrel head is you the buyer.
Check the gun over, work the action, look down the barrel with a flashlight, tap the fore-end and stock, check the W/M fit, even test fire it if they have a range at the shop like mine does BEFORE you lay your money/plastic down.
And NEVER buy a Rossi by mail order.
I have bought and sold alotta Rossis..........I know.

[Panzercat]

And NEVER buy a Rossi by mail order.

Yeah, sadly don't have that luxury with the caliber I bought... But I did order from Bud's and they have a decent rep so I'm hoping that hedges odds somewhat in my favor in terms of suppliers and returns.

/crossedfinger

[olyinaz]

I've seen half a dozen Rossis with the thin wood/split between the barrel and mag tube. It seems to be a continuing problem for them, and on the .454 and .480 guns I bet it runs right at 90% of them have it.

The other issue I've seen right out of the box is rust. I got one a few years back that had a few small rust spots on the barrel band so I took it down. Lordy!! It turned out to be full of huge rust flowers inside. Large red crystals that looked like you could brew a mean cuppa Joe with if you snapped 'em off and gave 'em to the mess sergeant.

I will only buy Rossis from Davidson's (no hassle return guarantee) or one of my local shops where the proprietor is a skilled gunsmith and will make it right no matter what. Buyer beware!!

Cheers,
Oly

[pricedo]

I've seen half a dozen Rossis with the thin wood/split between the barrel and mag tube. It seems to be a continuing problem for them, and on the .454 and .480 guns I bet it runs right at 90% of them have it.

The other issue I've seen right out of the box is rust. I got one a few years back that had a few small rust spots on the barrel band so I took it down. Lordy!! It turned out to be full of huge rust flowers inside. Large red crystals that looked like you could brew a mean cuppa Joe with if you snapped 'em off and gave 'em to the mess sergeant.

I will only buy Rossis from Davidson's (no hassle return guarantee) or one of my local shops where the proprietor is a skilled gunsmith and will make it right no matter what. Buyer beware!!

Cheers,
Oly

I have 4 great Rossis.....a .357 Mag......a .44 Mag........a .454 Casull.......a .30-30 Rio Grande.
The .454 has pumped out at least 1000 full power shots and is still as solid as the Rock of Gibraltar.
And believe me they weren't the first guns I looked at in the purchasing process.
One of the clerks in the shop thought I was a fed gov't inspector after I'd done looking, checking, tapping each gun with flashlight, cleaning rod and magnifying glass in hand.
Gotta admit that Rossi has got the problem of secure warehousing licked in a unique sorta way.
The bull gators in that Florida swamp they store their guns in must keep the thieves at bay.
Don't sweat the brown GUNK.......it's normal and usually superficial but always check to see if there is any permanent pitting.......if there is move on to the next rifle.
It might take a while but you will eventually find a good one.
It's sad cause judging by the Navy Arms 92s I have looked at and shot these people know how to build a good 92 rifle but just don't seem to give a darn and are throwing their own reputation down the toilette bowl with some of the outrageous junk showing up on store racks with their brand name on them.

[Panzercat]

Well, got to inspect my Rossi 454 and am happy to report it appears to be in fine fit and finish. Action runs smooth- better than I was expecting though that cheesy plastic safety at the top is a bit bewildering. Wood also exceeds expectations. Didn't see any splits or anything. I don't foresee any problems when I take possession of it tomorrow.

[pricedo]

though that cheesy plastic safety at the top is a bit bewildering.

Funny thing...........Braztech has got money to waste on installing that useless abortion of a safety but nothing for some good ole fashion Quality Control.........go figure.

[deafrn]

"Or: Wife No Longer Amused!"

The carbine that started it all went back to Miami in February to have some things looked at, and it returned to me after two months. I would have been ahead of the game had I just left it sitting in a corner.

In a nutshell, the bolt was replaced... but the extractor was bent in the middle so that it protruded above the bolt like the back of the Loch Ness monster, the firing pin wouldn't move freely in its channel despite having been ground down freehand on the pointy end (removing about .021" all around) then hit with a buffing wheel, and the locking surfaces of the locking bolts appear to have also been "freelanced" on a sanding belt and buffer. To be fair, the front sight can no longer be pushed in and out with mere light finger pressure... they did take care of that.

The other stuff that was a bit cheesy on a new gun (cracked buttstock, split and otherwise "iffy" forend, badly beat-up firing pin stop pin, etc) was apparently not considered out of line or covered by the lifetime warranty and therefore not addressed, which is serendipitous because this particular firearm's lifetime - with me - is over as of right now. I won't re-sell a firearm that I wouldn't stick my own noggin behind, and this carbine makes me nervous... so it is going to be scrapped on site. Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me; fool me a third time and I am a jackass who deserves to be out of pocket the purchase price/tax.

Look any Rossi over real closely before you fill out the 4473. Caveat emptor.