Paired .44 Mag Weapons

[Iron_Marshal]

OK...So I don't NEED 300gr bullet in the .44 mag. Perhaps I was overly wowed by commercial wording promising terminal performance from the heavier round. I am glad you all have pointed out that the 240 gr is all I need. I should have seen this for myself. I use Federal Match Grade 168 gr BTHP in the Rem 700 as a police sniper/counter sniper and I know what it will do.

(OT- Doc, I have aquainted myself with your DSGL sight and I am NOT one of those police officers who is in favor of big govenrment/gun control. I wholly support the Second Amendment and abhor the human rights violations condoned and conducted by other nations. I pray this country does not follow suit. Just thought I'd throw that out there.) When can we debate the whole black clad ninja SWAT guys? Just kidding.

Sooooo... First, I will study all of the loading data I can get my hands on.

Second, I will BUY some cast bullets and LATER think about casting my own.

Third, I need to buy a scale to test the dipper for consistencey. Also, since the Lee Loader "may" throw 17.5 gr, and most of you seem to like 18-20 gr of powder, I "may" need to buy a different method for charging the cases. In your opinions, would the 17.5 gr be a nice mild plinking load under a 240 gr bullet for both pistol and rifle? I may just use the enclosed dipper for that purpose.

Fourth, any suggestions on primers?

Side Note - Any suggestions on a mallet? The kit does not come with one.

[fordwannabe]

Iron Marshall if you are planing to use cast boolits one of the first things you can do is to slug your barrels(if you don't know how to do this there is a pretty good video of it on uTube). It will tell you if you have two compatable barrels, ie can use the same diameter boolit(remember cast boolits are usually sized at least 1 thousand over bore size ie. barrel slugs .429 will probably use .430 or .431 boolits). Cast boolits are a great way to save money in this area but it does have a learning curve of it's own. My suggestion is to get the handloading process down pat ,and then when you have a baseline on the guns start casting your own(doesn't mean don't try commercial cast or some you can get from others,I'll send you a hundred keith style 240's if you tell me your bore size). I think the earlier responses were just trying to tell you to be careful and please remember each gun is different what works in my redhawk might blow yours up or it might not, but each gun(bore, strength of material, prior usage, what somebody who didn't have people telling him to be careful, did to it before you got it WILL have an effect on your gun.)is it's own intity. Keep asking questions and folowing the manuals and you'll be as fine as can be expected when using contolled explosions. Good luck Tom

[Iron_Marshal]

fordwannabe, Thanks for the offer to send some bullets! I am familiar with slugging a barrel but I never thought about the compatibility problems between rifle and pistol. I will slub the barrels soon, before I start loading. Would you reccomend buying jacketed bullets to start?

[Lefty Dude]

If you are lucky both the Ruger & Rossi will slug .429". The Ruger will be most likely .429" And hopefully the cylinder throats .4295"-.430". The Rossi, well that can be a toss-up. My Rossi/44 slugs .429". They can be .429"-.432".

Jacketed bullets are available, .429", .430", & .431".

Yes, start with jacketed bullets for your first reloading experience.

[fordwannabe]

I (note I said I) would start with the jacketed to get a good understanding of the rifle and the revolvers potential, I think it is easier to get loads that work well for both with jacketed bullets. Please don't take that to mean I don't like cast boolits, I very much do, but if you can get a load that works as a baseline then you can spend the next 60 years or so fiddlin with different cast loads to get exactly what you want and have something to compare it to. Note I said it is easier, but not nearly as much fun. Good luck. Tom

[JohndeFresno]

...Third, I need to buy a scale to test the dipper for consistency. Also, since the Lee Loader "may" throw 17.5 gr, and most of you seem to like 18-20 gr of powder, I "may" need to buy a different method for charging the cases.

...Fourth, any suggestions on primers?...

IM,

The best article I remember ever seeing on making your own custom dippers at minimal expense and effort is this one; you should download it or at least print it out while it is still on the net:
http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_no ... tes.htm/41

As for primers, that poses a problem that seems to be abating a little. It's always best to use the exact primers shown in the individual recipe for each bullet and powder; not the primers shown in the spreadsheets I listed. Speer, for instance, always lists CCI primers in their book because it is their product; but then again the powder is matched to the primer for a safe load.

Aside from that, there has been lively and informative discussion here (and elsewhere) on primers that are not specific to a known formula that you may need to research if you don't have a certain primer available. One regular poster here, as an illustration, swears by Remington primers for all or most of his loads. But the key is that he works the loads up from a safe beginning point, watching for pressure problems.

As an example of mating primers, if you buy a certain powder (such as Winchester products), then use the recipes available at the Winchester site if you have no other sources, so the primers are matched. Winchester primers are mentioned here specifically because certain of their primers burn much hotter and raise pressures than others - the large rifle primer burns hotter than the CCI large rifle primer, for one.

On this forum, I asked the same question and received excellent answers:
Big 3 Primers - MV Differences? (Edited - link added)
http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... erences%3F

Excellent photos of the primers firing:
http://www.6mmbr.com/PrimerPix.html

CalNet Primer test:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/show ... hp?t=95308

I have dozens more in my archive, but these should work - there definitely is a difference.

[Lefty Dude]

I have a lead load W/ a 240 gr. SWC that shoots very well in my Ruger SBH/44 & the Rossi/44. I use Unique powder. For the Rossi it cronographs 1000 FPS and the standard diviation is 6. This load also, when shot from the RSBH prints a SD of 6.

The boolet is a Laser-Cast 240 gr. SWC and sized .431" I use 44 Remington mag cases.
This is a mild target & long range load, easy to shoot and very accurate.

For full 44 mag loads I use a Nosler 240 gr JHP .429", and WW 296. this load also shoots very well in my 44 pair.

[AJMD429]

Also, since the Lee Loader "may" throw 17.5 gr, and most of you seem to like 18-20 gr of powder, I "may" need to buy a different method for charging the cases.

I used an old hatchet handle for a mallet, and a scrap of smooth oak cabinet lumber for a 'tabletop'.

For just a few dollars, you can get a whole SET of the Lee dippers, and combined with a scale, measure out and CONFIRM just about any charge you need. Some folks even file down the top of the next larger dipper if they want an 'in between' load that badly.

Eventually you'll likely want a 'real' measure, but don't feel too handicapped with the dippers - just use them consistently (which is even important with a powder measure), and always confirm your charge once in awhile (hint - don't keep ANY dipper on your bench but the one you're using... ).

MidwayUSA has "Lee Dippers" - http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?p ... ber=943305 - for $8.29

[Buck Elliott]

Well, I do not feel I came on here posting as a "wise-@$$"
“WHY LOADING EQUIPMENT MANUFACTURERS GO GRAY...”
and…
“DONT HANDLOAD...!!!”

If you reread my post, I didn't say you were one, just don't want to have you become one out of ignorance. No offense meant -- just good advice. And yes, it's questions like this that drive the maunufacturers crazy --BUT -- it's better (far better) to ask than to jump in head-first, with both feet, and to proceed without asking.

Good luck in your continuing handloading education. And yes, I mean it sincerely.

[Blaine]

When I start loading again later this year, I'm going to treat myself to a HSLD Electronic Scale that throws the charge, and a set of check weights.

[alnitak]

Third, I need to buy a scale to test the dipper for consistencey. Also, since the Lee Loader "may" throw 17.5 gr, and most of you seem to like 18-20 gr of powder, I "may" need to buy a different method for charging the cases. In your opinions, would the 17.5 gr be a nice mild plinking load under a 240 gr bullet for both pistol and rifle? I may just use the enclosed dipper for that purpose.

I use 17-17.5g of 2400 for a .44 mag plinking load with a 240g LSWC. I find it to be an easy shooting, accurate load.

FWIW, I use Lee dippers (some shaved down per AJ's post; I bought a second set just for that purpose). I find that I can drop a load within 0.1g consistently with good techinque. Even for a klutz like me, I find you can get a feel for the right dipping technique and get some very reliable results. BTW, I agree about the one dipper. That's part of the reason I went with a second set, rather than in some cases, trying to use two different sized dippers to get the right volume.

On the hand-made dippers, I've seen that article. But wasn't there another one about an adjustable dipper, using a screw and nut/bolt setup, where you could adjust the capacity of the brass case, virtually infinitely, by tightening or loosening the nut?

BTW, I also find that AA#5 at about 10-10.5 grains makes a nice "cowboy" load in the .44 mag cases, and that AA#9 is very similar to 2400, but burns a bit cleaner and downloads nicely.

Here are some links for you:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=28774
http://www.gun-tests.com/performance/nov96biteout.html
http://www.gun-tests.com/pdfs/1-2-magliteload.pdf
http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/sho ... hp?t=10814
http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?p=2181727

[Travis Morgan]

I strongly suggest a digital scale to anyone that's gonna load more than a hundred rounds.

[JohndeFresno]

IM -

Here is another thought. You can have access to many safe, proven loads for your .44 at a very low price.

For $29.95, you get a year's membership, and a really cool three ring binder, from LoadData:
http://www.loaddata.com/

I prefer using the various manuals for their depth of material, tables, bullet commentaries, and so on (Speer, Barnes, Hornady, Lee, Hodgdon, Sierra, Cast Bullet Handbook and others). But that collection grew slowly and cost hundreds of bucks. For now, you can benefit from the recipes shown in all of those books by subscribing to LoadData for a year, and then printing out the recipes and popping them into your fat three ring binder.

There are several resources there; but the greatest thing is their safe loads. I say that because you can enter something like "44 Mag" in the caliber window and LoadData will show you hundreds of loads from identified sources. You can enter "240" in bullet weight and select your powder to limit the search further. I'll explain "safe" below. The "start at 10% below max and slowly work up" rule always applies, as does the "make sure you are using a modern handgun in safe working order" proviso.

I thought of this because I am working up some Barnes (California legal, all copper) hunting loads using 2400 powder for my .44. The Nr. 4 manual shows powders that I don't use, and the Nr. 3 Barnes book is unobtainable anywhere - I've searched for a month online, and even the Barnes folks don't have any more issues. The earlier manual shows loads for the .44 Mag bullet using 2400. I found the loads at LoadData.

There are other sites, and many good ones, but I know that LoadData info is safe because you can choose only loads that come from the actual manufacturers' handbooks, or sources that you trust. Mike Venturino, as an example, is a noted writer and his loads are identified and scattered throughout LoadData tables. The same proviso exists for LoadData loads, nevertheless: Double check the veracity of any gunwriters who submit loads; some like to load the hottest loads and I don't subscribe to their recipes because some of them push the envelope when they exceed the factory specs.

Also - the loads are identified as to whether they are for rifle, or pistol, and many times as to which firearm and barrel length they were loaded for.