OT-Scale problems
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- J Miller
- Member Emeritus
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OT-Scale problems
I have all my 30-06 cases preped. 100 of them primed. Bullets and powder sitting ready, and I can't zero my stinkin scale.
I have an RCBS 5-0-5 scale, it was rebuilt a couple of years ago by RCBS and so far has worked OK. The last time I used it, just last week to test weigh some bullets it zeroed fine. Tonight it's reading one (1) grain off.
Nothing in the pan, or on the bar or anywhere else, the weights are in their appropriate places and yet it reads one grain with the pan empty.
I wanna scream!!!!! This scale is so simple yet it has me stumped.
I'm about ready to dig out my ancient oil dampened Redding scale.
Any body got any ideas?
Joe
I have an RCBS 5-0-5 scale, it was rebuilt a couple of years ago by RCBS and so far has worked OK. The last time I used it, just last week to test weigh some bullets it zeroed fine. Tonight it's reading one (1) grain off.
Nothing in the pan, or on the bar or anywhere else, the weights are in their appropriate places and yet it reads one grain with the pan empty.
I wanna scream!!!!! This scale is so simple yet it has me stumped.
I'm about ready to dig out my ancient oil dampened Redding scale.
Any body got any ideas?
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
Adjust the foot?
Kind regards,
Tycer
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- J Miller
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Tycer,
To adjust the foot to level it would require raising over an inch . I tried that all ready.
Pepe Ray,
I have a bullseye bubble level on the scale platform. It hasn't moved.
That is why I'm frustrated. This thing has just gone off. For no obvious reason.
Is it possible that static electricity can throw them off like that? Just curious, the basement isn't dry really.
Joe
To adjust the foot to level it would require raising over an inch . I tried that all ready.
Pepe Ray,
I have a bullseye bubble level on the scale platform. It hasn't moved.
That is why I'm frustrated. This thing has just gone off. For no obvious reason.
Is it possible that static electricity can throw them off like that? Just curious, the basement isn't dry really.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
- Griff
- Posting leader...
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Joe,
Take a toothbrush and thoroughly clean the thing. Especially the "V" groove @ the balance point. You get some dust or... heaven forbid, some type of granule in there and it'll drive ya nuts. Did that to me!
Take a toothbrush and thoroughly clean the thing. Especially the "V" groove @ the balance point. You get some dust or... heaven forbid, some type of granule in there and it'll drive ya nuts. Did that to me!
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
The weights inside the pan are just pieces of lead shot. Take one out. Then use a check weight.
The dryer sheet might work. I've read not to leave them set-up due to the magnetic damper screwing up.
The dryer sheet might work. I've read not to leave them set-up due to the magnetic damper screwing up.
Kind regards,
Tycer
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- J Miller
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- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:46 pm
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Just cleaned it like Griff suggested. Helped a bit. Need some canned air like the stuff you use for computers. It would help.
The factory has this thing zeroed so I'm not going to mess with the lead in the pan tray. Since it was zeroed last time, it's gotta be something simple. Nothing physical has changed.
Joe
The factory has this thing zeroed so I'm not going to mess with the lead in the pan tray. Since it was zeroed last time, it's gotta be something simple. Nothing physical has changed.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
I have the next model up from your's. I started having the same probs. Made a trip to RCBS (their 54 miles away). Caught he77 from" charlie"
because I have been leaving it uncovered and and dirt gets into everything. He gve me a new one and said he dint want to see me back with the same problem. Gotta run out to the loading shed to make sure I covered it.
Gun Runner
because I have been leaving it uncovered and and dirt gets into everything. He gve me a new one and said he dint want to see me back with the same problem. Gotta run out to the loading shed to make sure I covered it.
Gun Runner
- Griff
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Joe,
It's a month or more between my reloading sessions. My old RCBS balance beam scale needs re-zeroing every time I move it from the storage place on the back of the bench, to the area I'm working at. I have to consciously think each time to check that the slide part is actually @ the ZERO location, and that I haven't left the 1/10 grain adjustment on some fraction setting when I start weighing powder. I usually, (read: ALWAYS), take several readings before I begin with actually weighing. Interestingly, although I think y bench is pretty flat, I can move the scale an inch in most any direction and it affects it's zero. I go thru the zero process again.
It's a month or more between my reloading sessions. My old RCBS balance beam scale needs re-zeroing every time I move it from the storage place on the back of the bench, to the area I'm working at. I have to consciously think each time to check that the slide part is actually @ the ZERO location, and that I haven't left the 1/10 grain adjustment on some fraction setting when I start weighing powder. I usually, (read: ALWAYS), take several readings before I begin with actually weighing. Interestingly, although I think y bench is pretty flat, I can move the scale an inch in most any direction and it affects it's zero. I go thru the zero process again.
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
- Sixgun
- Posting leader...
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- Location: S.E. Pa. Where The Finest Winchesters & Colts Reside
I really liked Pete's answer. I agree with Griff. Every now and then, I take the scale to the sink and spray it down with Simple Green, Windex, or some other cleaner. Then I wash it down real good with hot water. Don't get the panholder wet because like Tycer says, thats the part that holds the lead shot and water will just make a mess.
After she's all clean and dry, carefully inspect the V groove in the scale AND the matching V on the beam. This is the most critical part of the scale. On the left side of the scale (underneath) there is a magnetic balancer. Make sure nothing is interupting it's operation---wipe it down, check the screw that holds it on, etc. You say your basement is damp and the magnetic plate could have accumulated some rust.
Set all the marks on "0" and adjust the leg to the point where the balance beam is on the proper line. Like Tycer says, sometimes you might have to add or subract a tiny piece of lead shot from the pan. I use #11 shot. You say that it (lead shot) is factory set but something as simple as a paint chip from the beam can cause a drastic difference.
If you get that far without your BP going over 200/150, check it with scale weights or quality .224 match bullets. If it still don't work, do what I do and send a 250 gr. Keith towards its way. Sometimes things just wear
out. I keep three scales--two balance and one electronic and like loading manuals, I'm always comparing them.---------Sixgun
After she's all clean and dry, carefully inspect the V groove in the scale AND the matching V on the beam. This is the most critical part of the scale. On the left side of the scale (underneath) there is a magnetic balancer. Make sure nothing is interupting it's operation---wipe it down, check the screw that holds it on, etc. You say your basement is damp and the magnetic plate could have accumulated some rust.
Set all the marks on "0" and adjust the leg to the point where the balance beam is on the proper line. Like Tycer says, sometimes you might have to add or subract a tiny piece of lead shot from the pan. I use #11 shot. You say that it (lead shot) is factory set but something as simple as a paint chip from the beam can cause a drastic difference.
If you get that far without your BP going over 200/150, check it with scale weights or quality .224 match bullets. If it still don't work, do what I do and send a 250 gr. Keith towards its way. Sometimes things just wear
out. I keep three scales--two balance and one electronic and like loading manuals, I'm always comparing them.---------Sixgun
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- Advanced Levergunner
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Joe, Make sure there is no electrical device near the scale that could cause a magnetic field like a motor or electric dribbler or lube heater or such. I find that simple is best with scales and your old Redding oil dampened scale is a good scale. My dad and I used the same one for many years without problem. We never did put oil in it. They are not as fast as the magnetic ones but accurate. I still use mine to cross check my new Redding scale from time to time.
PS. Dad bought that old scale in 1954 for $14 ( a lot of money back then)
!
PS. Dad bought that old scale in 1954 for $14 ( a lot of money back then)
!
- J Miller
- Member Emeritus
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- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:46 pm
- Location: Not in IL no more ... :)
I'm well aware of the set up, adjust, zero, and verify settings mantra. I do it each and every time I go to load. My scale remains where it sets. I don't store it elsewhere then put it up to load. Maybe I should though.
I have to admit it's not covered, never has been, I don't have a cover for it.
And my loading bench doubles as my work bench so it's not all sanitary clean.
Three neon curly bulb lights are over the bench, basements are dark, a power bar with circuit breaker, powers all the lights and it's only two feet from the scale. Can't really move it any were either.
So everything I've been told to check for is present and accounted for.
I'm screwed. I think I'd be happier casting my bullets over a camp fire and using an old Lyman nut cracker loading tool. Prep the cases, scoop up a bunch of black powder, suff in a big fat bullet and go kill something.
Ahhhhh, the good old days. Technology should be banned.
Will wash the scale, probably needs it. And will try again.
If that don't work will break out the old Redding scale.
Joe
I have to admit it's not covered, never has been, I don't have a cover for it.
And my loading bench doubles as my work bench so it's not all sanitary clean.
Three neon curly bulb lights are over the bench, basements are dark, a power bar with circuit breaker, powers all the lights and it's only two feet from the scale. Can't really move it any were either.
So everything I've been told to check for is present and accounted for.
I'm screwed. I think I'd be happier casting my bullets over a camp fire and using an old Lyman nut cracker loading tool. Prep the cases, scoop up a bunch of black powder, suff in a big fat bullet and go kill something.
Ahhhhh, the good old days. Technology should be banned.
Will wash the scale, probably needs it. And will try again.
If that don't work will break out the old Redding scale.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
- Griff
- Posting leader...
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- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 4:56 pm
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Joe, I think you've got it! All else is smoke & mirrors!J Miller wrote:...I think I'd be happier casting my bullets over a camp fire and using an old Lyman nut cracker loading tool. Prep the cases, scoop up a bunch of black powder, suff in a big fat bullet and go kill something...
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
- Modoc ED
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 3332
- Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:17 am
- Location: Northeast CA (Alturas, CA)
Yeah, quit breathing around it Joe.
To me the cover for it is critical. Lots of dust around my place and it plays havoc with the V notches and pan.
Call RCBS and get their input and maybe send it back to them again.
Your're old enough to know that "old" doesn't mean broke or won't work but new/newer can be messed up.
Go with the old Redding scale for now until you get the RCBS scale's problem worked out.
To me the cover for it is critical. Lots of dust around my place and it plays havoc with the V notches and pan.
Call RCBS and get their input and maybe send it back to them again.
Your're old enough to know that "old" doesn't mean broke or won't work but new/newer can be messed up.
Go with the old Redding scale for now until you get the RCBS scale's problem worked out.
- J Miller
- Member Emeritus
- Posts: 14881
- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:46 pm
- Location: Not in IL no more ... :)
I brushed it off like Griff said last night. Checked it today and it's settled down close enough to zero.
But I've got to make some changes. You are all right about the cold, dirty, basement, and the need for a cover. Will under take the task asap.
I'm pretty sure the scale is not gone bad. It's just the victim of a lack of proper care. I've found a lens cleaning brush that will clean the V-blocks better and am going to brush it off again then see if it will zero. If so then all will be well again.
Joe
But I've got to make some changes. You are all right about the cold, dirty, basement, and the need for a cover. Will under take the task asap.
I'm pretty sure the scale is not gone bad. It's just the victim of a lack of proper care. I've found a lens cleaning brush that will clean the V-blocks better and am going to brush it off again then see if it will zero. If so then all will be well again.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
- J Miller
- Member Emeritus
- Posts: 14881
- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:46 pm
- Location: Not in IL no more ... :)
oldgerboy,
Thats an idea to ponder on. On this scale you have the base which is either aluminum or pot metal, can't tell.
At the left end is a steel tab with indicator marks on it that the beam pointer passes through. Right near that is a slot. On the inside of the base there is a magnet at the slot.
The balance beam is aluminum. On the left end of the beam just past the pointer there is a flag ( for lack of better words ) that fits into the slot in the base and reacts with the magnet. All the other steel parts are at the far end of the aluminum beam near the pan. I have no idea how or if they could become magnetized. Or if it would make any difference since they don't interact with other steel parts.
The pivot shaft rides in polymer V-blocks, so there's no metal to metal interaction there.
I'm 99.5% sure it was just a case of foreign material where it should not have been. Nuther words it was dirty.
Joe
Thats an idea to ponder on. On this scale you have the base which is either aluminum or pot metal, can't tell.
At the left end is a steel tab with indicator marks on it that the beam pointer passes through. Right near that is a slot. On the inside of the base there is a magnet at the slot.
The balance beam is aluminum. On the left end of the beam just past the pointer there is a flag ( for lack of better words ) that fits into the slot in the base and reacts with the magnet. All the other steel parts are at the far end of the aluminum beam near the pan. I have no idea how or if they could become magnetized. Or if it would make any difference since they don't interact with other steel parts.
The pivot shaft rides in polymer V-blocks, so there's no metal to metal interaction there.
I'm 99.5% sure it was just a case of foreign material where it should not have been. Nuther words it was dirty.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
One other thing Joe ... I do wipe out the V's on the base and carefully wipe off and lube the V on the beam. My V-blocks are steel.
The "lube" is something I read about somewhere 40-some years ago ... take your finger and wipe it along your nose (NO, NOT INSIDE) at the side where it contacts your face ... it's always greasy there. Yep, my lube is NOSE GREASE.
I then wipe it on the V on the beam. Wipe it across not along the V ... it is sharp (don't ask).
The old article claimed that it gave a measure of lubrication so the beam moved freely but not so much that a glob of crud would develope.
The "lube" is something I read about somewhere 40-some years ago ... take your finger and wipe it along your nose (NO, NOT INSIDE) at the side where it contacts your face ... it's always greasy there. Yep, my lube is NOSE GREASE.
I then wipe it on the V on the beam. Wipe it across not along the V ... it is sharp (don't ask).
The old article claimed that it gave a measure of lubrication so the beam moved freely but not so much that a glob of crud would develope.
That "lube" is what I taught my sons to use on their fishing rods. Prior to putting the sections together, "lube" them. Makes taking them apart a breeze.
My reloading room is out in our unheated shop. In the summer it is too hot; in the winter too cold. Usually when I'm reloading, there is a fan of some sort working. When it comes time to set the scale and to weigh charges, all fans get turned off--they do affect my scale.
I also built an aluminum base for my scale. The added stability gives me peace of mind, though I doubt it improves anything else in my setup.
(The heater is on out there at this writing. I'm warming the room--readying to reload. YAY!)
My reloading room is out in our unheated shop. In the summer it is too hot; in the winter too cold. Usually when I'm reloading, there is a fan of some sort working. When it comes time to set the scale and to weigh charges, all fans get turned off--they do affect my scale.
I also built an aluminum base for my scale. The added stability gives me peace of mind, though I doubt it improves anything else in my setup.
(The heater is on out there at this writing. I'm warming the room--readying to reload. YAY!)
-
- Levergunner 3.0
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- Location: New Kent County, VA
I've got an Ohaus 5-0-5 that's more than 30 years old. It has always been covered, never cleaned, and has never skipped a beat. When I'm ready to use it, I set all the poises on zero, and adjust beam zero with the foot. It has never been more a tenth or two out either way. I've checked it repeatedly with quality bullets, and never found any reason to doubt its accuracy. It has also survived a move from Massachusetts to Virginia.
Perhaps I just got a good one
Perhaps I just got a good one
Riamh Nar Dhruid O Spairn Lann
- motto on the Irish Regiments' flags
- motto on the Irish Regiments' flags
- J Miller
- Member Emeritus
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- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 7:46 pm
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There is nothing wrong with my scale. Once I carefully and thoroughly cleaned all the dust and debris off of it it works fine. The pointer dropped within a couple tenths of the zero indicator mark.
It was all my fault. As I said earlier I use this bench as a work bench too.
A couple days ago I used my Dremel tool to cut out two plastic spacers for our trucks. Of course a Dremel with a cutting disc turned wide open spews debris and junk every where. Well, some of it got on the scale, all over the scale.
All my fault. I need to move the scale when I'm not using it and cover it too.
Thanks for all the suggestions. And yes I know the pivot shaft V's are sharp and I know how you know.
Joe
It was all my fault. As I said earlier I use this bench as a work bench too.
A couple days ago I used my Dremel tool to cut out two plastic spacers for our trucks. Of course a Dremel with a cutting disc turned wide open spews debris and junk every where. Well, some of it got on the scale, all over the scale.
All my fault. I need to move the scale when I'm not using it and cover it too.
Thanks for all the suggestions. And yes I know the pivot shaft V's are sharp and I know how you know.
Joe
***Be sneaky, get closer, bust the cap on him when you can put the ball where it counts .***
Glad you figured it out Joe.
I also take the beam off my scale when not using it, and either cover it with a clean rag, paper towel, or an overturned plastic ammo bin. I then look at and blow off the pivot and beam before setting the beam.
Another heads up. A couple times I've had the scale change setting (making it look like the powder measure changed setting suddenly)for no apparent reason. After some head scratching, discovered that a couple granuals of powder had come out of the trickler and fallen into the pan holder and into the phillips screw slot, making them about invisible, and throwing off the scale setting. With the pan back in the holder, of course the errant powder was covered and completely invisible.
I also take the beam off my scale when not using it, and either cover it with a clean rag, paper towel, or an overturned plastic ammo bin. I then look at and blow off the pivot and beam before setting the beam.
Another heads up. A couple times I've had the scale change setting (making it look like the powder measure changed setting suddenly)for no apparent reason. After some head scratching, discovered that a couple granuals of powder had come out of the trickler and fallen into the pan holder and into the phillips screw slot, making them about invisible, and throwing off the scale setting. With the pan back in the holder, of course the errant powder was covered and completely invisible.