Election Year

[JimT]

http://theanswerorg.wordpress.com/

[J Miller]

Yep, that about sums it up. Donkeys and Elephants, the two sides of the same coin.

Joe

[crawdaddyjim]

Jimmy, Nice article.

Sounds to me like you need to get out and support
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/

[cutter]

Excellent! Get the message out, I don't like competition at the polls.

[Ysabel Kid]

Excellent! Get the message out, I don't like competition at the polls.

I agree - only if it goes out to Junior's distribution list! Let's keep them all home this November!

As you note, not that the parties are much different. Even a lot of the candidates currently running are pretty much equally horrible. Still, the thought of Hillary or Edwards being elected makes me violently ill!

[Paul105]

Jim,

Thanks for the link!

I came to this conclusion quite a while back. I get accused of just being cynical. The really discouraging thing is that most people just don't see it -- they continue to believe the BS that the politicians put out.

"You can continue to fuss, argue and fight over who should be in power. Quite frankly, it won’t be you, even if “yourâ€

[JimT]

"the purchasing power of your dollar will continue to erode".
Paul

You are correct. The dollar has been continually made worth less and less.

$1.00 when I was born had about the same buying power as $11.00 today.

[cutter]

"the purchasing power of your dollar will continue to erode".
Paul

You are correct. The dollar has been continually made worth less and less.

$1.00 when I was born had about the same buying power as $11.00 today.

That's a biased statement.
Provide the average wage of an American during that time period.

[JimT]

That's a biased statement.
Provide the average wage of an American during that time period.

It's not biased since we are talking abut the PURCHASING POWER of the dollar instead of wages.

The worth of the dollar has eroded consistantly. You can check it out yourself. Just Google up "purchasing power of the dollar" and "buying power of the dollar". This is one:

http://www.measuringworth.com/ppowerus/

The dollar is worth about 1/10th what it was when I was a kid. It's all chalked up to "inflation" which, if you read the newspapers, seems to come from toilet seats or out of thin air.

In reality it's simply the government printing more money. It makes the money in circulation worth less.

Now.. it is true folks made less money, but since their money went farther they did more with the less they had than they can do today. When a new car cost around $2000 and you could buy a week's worth of groceries for $10 a person's money just did more.

When I was a kid a household with one person working could support a household. It was common for the average working man to be able to buy a house, a car and support his wife and kids in a comfortable manner. A new sixgun from Ruger could be had for around $70. You could get a good used levergun for $30 to $50.

I spent 3 years overseas for Uncle Sam in the 1960's. The dollar was high against all other currencies then. Not like it is now.

So no .. that is not a biased statement.

[cutter]

I agree with much of what you say, but ALL the facts are not being presented. To properly show the value of a dollar, one cannot use 2008 prices with 1955 wages. It is biased, and wrong.

In 1970, a friend of mine purchased a '69 camaro for 1,400 dollars ( IF I remember corectly ) at the time he was making 2.20 an hour. That is about 16 weeks pay.

Today he is making roughly 23.00 an hour, if he were to purchase, say a new Mustang at 19,250, that would be about 21 weeks pay.

This is how you honestly represent inflation, in a specific market, and a worker within a specific industry. Which still isn't a total representation of market inflation, considering GOVERNMENT MANDATED manufacturing requirements to the auto industry, and rediculous taxes. Your assesment of the dollar value is nearly correct, but not WHY you think. This is why one must vote.

Now, are we going to get back on subject?

[JimT]

Now, are we going to get back on subject?

oh .. I thought we were ...

[maddog]

While I honor your opinion, Jim, and I AM getting tired of voting for the lesser of two evils, as opposed to voting for the best man/woman, NOT VOTING, to me is definately NOT the answer. It's a right, and a DUTY to cast your vote. By not voting, you are simply saying, "I don't care". I always subscribe to the theory that if "you don't vote, don't BI**H!".

I really hope, that what I am seeing is the american populus, is getting fed up, on both sides. If I were an encumbent[on either side], I'd be looking over my shoulder, and have a bag packed for a quick escape. ! I'm not just refering to national elections, but am seeing it in our local elections, and what is setting up for our state elections, this fall. I don't mean to start any flames, just an honest difference of opinion.

maddog

[Idahoser]

[JimT]

While I honor your opinion, Jim, ...

I've finally come to understand that when I start a sentence that way, it's time to stop talking.

No problem. I don't want anyone to QUIT unless that is the voice of their conscience.

I do want to provoke people to THINK.

To keep doing the same thing over and over and over, hoping for different results the next time .... there is a term for that ...

[cutter]

Maddog, I can't think of a single US president who hasn't raised taxes, or increased government regulations. Even the great Reagan raised taxes quiet a bit.

I think the problem is with the voters. So few vote in local elections, or even know who their senator is, and that is where the real power is. When the state will blindly follow the feds, out of fear from loosing federal funding, who has the power then?

Jim, the president couldn't raise taxes, or send us off to war, if we were trully represented in government. Untill these professional congressmen, and sinators are voted out of office, nothing will change.

I understand the frustrations, it's hard being free ( well, at least somewhat free ).

[Hobie]

I vote in every election, I write and/or talk to my representatives from Commonwealth's Attorney to Congressman (our Senators won't bother to make themselves available), and I contribute money, post yard signs, etc. When you're not part of the process you will be ignored. Not that I necessarily influence anyone, I can't know that but I do try.

While I agree that the parties have broadly become very similar, the individual candidates not not necessarily left one without a choice. Of those from whom I have to choose, there is indeed a difference. To me, it is just as if I was hiring somebody or selecting the best person for a promotion, there's always a difference and even a slight difference can have a big effect.

[JimT]

Thanks a lot Hobie!

"Part 2" was gonna be based on Claire Wolfe's other suggestion: "Vote or you will be ignored" ... or words to that effect

[Caco]

The only way not voting will help is if everyone participated. Other wise it's less people deciding for the whole. Not voting for one is like voting for the other, It still makes the oponent one vote better.
Dave

[Old Ironsights]

On Purchasing power:

THe thing that continues to irk me is that so few people realize, or willingly ignore the fact that the government doesn't just take 50% of their income - they take 80% or more.

There is only one kind of taxpayer in the US, and that is the Individual.

Corporations & Businesses do not pay taxes, no matter how much you tax them. To them, taxes are simply a business expense that gets worked into what the individual pays.

YOU pay the taxes for Exxon or Motorola or Dell or Microsoft, not them.

The more taxes are levied, the more things cost all the way up and down the chain of production. THAT is the basis of inflation.

[Hobie]

Thanks a lot Hobie!

"Part 2" was gonna be based on Claire Wolfe's other suggestion: "Vote or you will be ignored" ... or words to that effect

You can still write it up better than I can!

[Paul105]

In 1968, I bought a used 1966 Mustang for $2,100. This was a basic model, 6 cyl, 3 on the floor, radio. No air conditioning.

In 1970, my wife bought a used 1968 Camaro fro $2,500. This was also a basic model. It did have auto trans, but no AC. She couldn’t affort a 1969 fully loaded mustang that they wanted $3,000 for.

Cutter’s example of a $1,400 Camaro isn’t how I remembered it.

In 1970, my wife and I attended San Diego State Univ. Tuition was Less than $100/Semester for the 2 years we attended – the first year it was $50/semester for a full load..

In that same time frame, we could buy a weeks worth of groceries (including steak, pork chops, lamb chops, etc.) for less $20 and we weren’t looking for bargains.

Gas was 19 cents a gallon.

We were both attending college – I got $200/mo on the GI Bill, my parents gave us $150/Mo, and my wife worked three different part time jobs and brought home an additional $200/Mo. We lived very well, and even saved some money.

We bought our own health insurance policy, and had regular medical and dental checkups and never felt this to be a burden.

I worked a s security guard for a home builder -- Smaller (1,300 sq ft) houses were going for less than $20K. Those same houses recently sold in the mid to upper $400K range.

When my dad passed away (in 2000), I was sorting thru some of his papers. I came across some medical bills for my mother (she died of cancer in the early 50s). There was a bill for one nights stay in intensive care at a hospital in Pasdena, CA – it was $14.00.

The entire medical expense – Doctors, surgeries, hospital bills, etc. came to $4,000. It took dad some time to pay that off (no health ins in those days).

As a kid (late 50s), I remember going to the Saturday matinee – double feature, popcorn and a coke. 25 Cents to get in and .10 for the popcorn and a coke.

My dad was a school teacher. Neither of his two wives (remarried after my mother died) ever worked. He managed to buy a house, 2 cars, and put two children thru college, and left this world with no obligations – all on one, not to substantial, income.

If anyone thinks that wages have keep up with “inflationâ€

[tman]

do the reasearch. NO WAY, does your dollar have the buying power as it did 30yrs. ago. not even close! yea, i know you can buy cheap shoes and furniture from china, but with costs of energy, food, healthcare. it doesn't balance out like the talk show hosts' try to brainwash us into believing.

[Hobie]

When I was a kid poor people didn't eat too well and were thin as a rail, they didn't have cars, tvs or even AM radios, they might not have a phone in their house and many I knew might not have bedroom furniture. NOW, even "poor" people have all these things. Heck I know "poor" folks with two TVs, two cars and a cell phone for everyone in the family. The dollar isn't worth what it was, but folks sure do live better than they used to.

[Old Ironsights]

That's 'cause they are doing it with your (my) money....

[tman]

all i know is that i'm working more overtime than ever before, and it's getting harder to make ends meet. fortunately, my child is finnished with school, i made the final payment 2 yrs. ago on her tuition. i have LESS money left over now than back then. same mortage, car, toys and working more hours. if the economy's so great, where did i go wrong. IT"S NOT ALL TAXES.

[Old Ironsights]

all i know is that i'm working more overtime than ever before, and it's getting harder to make ends meet. fortunately, my child is finnished with school, i made the final payment 2 yrs. ago on her tuition. i have LESS money left over now than back then. same mortage, car, toys and working more hours. if the economy's so great, where did i go wrong. IT"S NOT ALL TAXES.

As a matter of fact, it is.

Think about it. The price of everything you buy every day is directly affected by taxes.

When you buy the proverbial "Loaf of Bread" you are paying the taxes of:

The Grocery that sold that bread
The Wholesaler who sold the bread to the store
The Baker who sold it to the wholesaler
The Wholesaler who sold ingrediants to the Baker
The Mill that sold Flour to the Wholesaler
The Agribusiness that sold Yeast and Grain to the Mill & Wholesaler
The CoOp that sold Wheat to the Agribusiness
The Farmer who sold the Wheat to the CoOp
The Implement Dealer who sold the COmbine to the Farmer
The Fuel Company who sold Fuel to the Farmer
The Grocery who sold Bread to the farmer.....

Add a tax anywhere in that chain and ALL the prices go up... almost exponentially

It is a vicious, self feeding/perpetuating cycle that totally borks the law of supply and demand.

[Old Savage]

Well, I am going to vote against the democrats - they seem to be the most interested in taking the guns and making it harder to keep and use them.

[Old Savage]

Comparing to 1965 - people insist on having more now. Otherwise multiply anything then including wages 8 to 10 fold and here we are now. Only the numbers have changed. Buy only what we had then.

[tman]

maybe i'm wrong ,but i'm only talking about how the prices have risin' ouer the last ten years. bush did cut the the tax rates, so i should be better off now as then. i'm not trying to make a poliltical or philisofical statement. it ain't a rep vs. dem. thing with me. it's just the way it is.

[Old Ironsights]

maybe i'm wrong ,but i'm only talking about how the prices have risin' ouer the last ten years. bush did cut the the tax rates, so i should be better off now as then. i'm not trying to make a poliltical or philisofical statement. it ain't a rep vs. dem. thing with me. it's just the way it is.

Who did he cut them for? Unless you cut them across the board - and actually cut them, not just decrease the rate of increase - it won't help.

[gon2shoot]

In the late 60s it took me 6 mo. to save enough for a new pick-up working and going to school part time. Now I have a much better job, make much more money, work many more hours, and my truck last 1/3 as long, and still takes a full 6mo wages to pay for.
I'm doing OK finanically but the quality has gone to stuff so I have to buy 3 times as much to get the same use.