More bullet tests, and some surprises.
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More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Put the wet phone books to work again tonight. I was testing my home made 185 gr. 357 cal. cast bullets, and the 240 gr. Hornady XTP in 44 cal.
First up was the 357's. I shot the identical load of 15 gr. of Lil'Gun with a mag primer in my Rossi 92 with a 20" barrel and my Ruger Blackhawk with a 4 5/8" barrel. The load clocks 1750 fps from the Rossi, and 1240 from the Ruger. The bullets are cast from straight wheelweight alloy.
The bullet fired from the Rossi penetrated 18" and upset perfectly with very good expansion. The same load fired from the Ruger penetrated all 25" of books and just lodged itself in the tree that was backing the books, and didn't expand at all. Both bullets retained 100% of their weight.
Next up was the Hornady 240 gr. XTP. Same load again for rifle and revolver, 24 gr. of H110. I have not crono'd this load from the Marlin, but it's 1340 fps out of my 6" barrel S&W 629. I was very surprised that the bullets fired from each gun are almost indistinguishable from each other. The bullet fired from the Marlin still weighs 223 gr. and the revolver bullet 226 gr. The bullet from the rifle did peel back more, but just ever so slightly. Both ended up in the same phone book, some 18-19 inches deep.
After this exercise I won't have any problem stuffing the Marlin full of this bullet for deer hunting this fall. I had some concern about the Hornady hollow point at rifle velocities, but apparently it's not something that bullet can't handle, and do so very well.
I won't be using that 357 bullet in the Blackhawk for deer hunting. But it has proven itself a very effective bullet on deer from the Rossi already. Looks like a softer alloy is needed to get some expansion at handgun velocities. Another project for another day.
First up was the 357's. I shot the identical load of 15 gr. of Lil'Gun with a mag primer in my Rossi 92 with a 20" barrel and my Ruger Blackhawk with a 4 5/8" barrel. The load clocks 1750 fps from the Rossi, and 1240 from the Ruger. The bullets are cast from straight wheelweight alloy.
The bullet fired from the Rossi penetrated 18" and upset perfectly with very good expansion. The same load fired from the Ruger penetrated all 25" of books and just lodged itself in the tree that was backing the books, and didn't expand at all. Both bullets retained 100% of their weight.
Next up was the Hornady 240 gr. XTP. Same load again for rifle and revolver, 24 gr. of H110. I have not crono'd this load from the Marlin, but it's 1340 fps out of my 6" barrel S&W 629. I was very surprised that the bullets fired from each gun are almost indistinguishable from each other. The bullet fired from the Marlin still weighs 223 gr. and the revolver bullet 226 gr. The bullet from the rifle did peel back more, but just ever so slightly. Both ended up in the same phone book, some 18-19 inches deep.
After this exercise I won't have any problem stuffing the Marlin full of this bullet for deer hunting this fall. I had some concern about the Hornady hollow point at rifle velocities, but apparently it's not something that bullet can't handle, and do so very well.
I won't be using that 357 bullet in the Blackhawk for deer hunting. But it has proven itself a very effective bullet on deer from the Rossi already. Looks like a softer alloy is needed to get some expansion at handgun velocities. Another project for another day.
Last edited by TedH on Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Same load, and the round shot from the rifle penetrated less than the one from the revolver?
Bizzare...
Bizzare...
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Interesting.
I wouldn't have any trouble hunting with any of these bullets from any of the guns tested.
The .357 Mag revolver bullet did exactly what it is supposed to do as a cast bullet. They typically do not expand from handguns yet kill very decisively when placed in the HL area.
Really, when you look at most of our testing, we are really just looking at the differences between bullets that will all do the job!
The only bullets that I will not hunt with are the ones that are so frangible that they blow-up and don't penetrate enough to reach the vitals and cause enough damage to put the game down quickly.
Thanks for sharing the pics and results though!
I still enjoy and like seeing the different results.
I wouldn't have any trouble hunting with any of these bullets from any of the guns tested.
The .357 Mag revolver bullet did exactly what it is supposed to do as a cast bullet. They typically do not expand from handguns yet kill very decisively when placed in the HL area.
Really, when you look at most of our testing, we are really just looking at the differences between bullets that will all do the job!
The only bullets that I will not hunt with are the ones that are so frangible that they blow-up and don't penetrate enough to reach the vitals and cause enough damage to put the game down quickly.
Thanks for sharing the pics and results though!
I still enjoy and like seeing the different results.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Very interesting - great test - very informative.
Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Ysabel Kid wrote:Same load, and the round shot from the rifle penetrated less than the one from the revolver?
Bizzare...
The bullet fired from the rifle expanded a good bit, thus reducing penetration. The bullet fired from the handgun didn't have the spank needed to expand, therefore it acted more like a solid.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Hadn't thought of that - and it explains it perfectly!TedH wrote:Ysabel Kid wrote:Same load, and the round shot from the rifle penetrated less than the one from the revolver?
Bizzare...
The bullet fired from the rifle expanded a good bit, thus reducing penetration. The bullet fired from the handgun didn't have the spank needed to expand, therefore it acted more like a solid.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Thanks for your post...
This jacket is what is left of an .44 XTP 240 out of a 44-40 @ about 1200fps into hard earth at 10ft ..
Note how friction left solder marks where the lands bit in... Fired these about 6 years ago
This jacket is what is left of an .44 XTP 240 out of a 44-40 @ about 1200fps into hard earth at 10ft ..
Note how friction left solder marks where the lands bit in... Fired these about 6 years ago
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WIL TERRY
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
+1O.S.O.K. wrote:Interesting.
I wouldn't have any trouble hunting with any of these bullets from any of the guns tested.
The .357 Mag revolver bullet did exactly what it is supposed to do as a cast bullet. They typically do not expand from handguns yet kill very decisively when placed in the HL area.
Really, when you look at most of our testing, we are really just looking at the differences between bullets that will all do the job!
The only bullets that I will not hunt with are the ones that are so frangible that they blow-up and don't penetrate enough to reach the vitals and cause enough damage to put the game down quickly.
Thanks for sharing the pics and results though!
I still enjoy and like seeing the different results.
I do not want expansion in a deer bullet in 357. A hardcast leaves a clean wound channel you can eat right up to. A clean 3/4" hole from side to side or front to back bleeds out very quickly.
Kind regards,
Tycer
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
O.S.O.K. wrote: Really, when you look at most of our testing, we are really just looking at the differences between bullets that will all do the job!
Very true.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Ted, Is the 357 mold an off the shelf item or custom. I am looking for such a bullet.
TomF
TomF
Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
I guess you would call it a semi custom. It's from the Lee C358-180-RF that has run a group buy a few times over at the Cast Boolits forum. There are a few of us here that have the mold. I believe Cast Performance sells a very similar bullet as well.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Phonebooks are tougher than IN whitetails... My ACWW 180s don't expand at 20" velocities in deer.
Try 3/1 WW/pb or do Paco's nose annealing trick...
Try 3/1 WW/pb or do Paco's nose annealing trick...
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Nicely done, thanks for taking the time to do the testing. Things like this are always a good source of information.
Ed
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Interesting post, thanks
Pete
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Yeah, I kind of figured the same, but I've yet to recover one from a deer. They've always made two holes.OI phones in... wrote:Phonebooks are tougher than IN whitetails... My ACWW 180s don't expand at 20" velocities in deer.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
That cast .358 bullet looks very similar to their 310 .430 design:
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
It is very similar. As many times as that mold has run a group buy, I'm surprised LEE hasn't put it in as a catalog item.
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
I'm always pleasantly surprised how good a cast bullet from wheel weights is!
Nice report!
-Tutt
Nice report!
-Tutt
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Re: More bullet tests, and some surprises.
Agree with you.Tycer wrote:O.S.O.K. wrote: I do not want expansion in a deer bullet in 357. A hardcast leaves a clean wound channel you can eat right up to. A clean 3/4" hole from side to side or front to back bleeds out very quickly.
So what .75 cal caliber non expanding bullet are you shooting?
Hermann