OT CCW Recommendation?

[TedH]

Since I traded my G19 for the Single Six, I'm needing to fill the empty slot for my main CCW. I've got some large revolvers, full size 1911 on the big end, Baby Browning and a PPK on the small end. I need something in the middle. I had thought I would just get a G36 because I like size of them (nearly the same as the G19 I'd been carrying) and the fact that it's a 45 cal. But I thought I would open it up to other opinions.

Must be a compact.
Must be lightweight. (alloy or polymer frame)
Either 9mm or 45 acp.
Under $600.

So what do you like?

[Tycer]

I absolutely LOVE my XDm in 9mm. I added the XS Sights 24/7 and a Serpa holster.

[Tycer]

OOops!!!

missed the COMPACT part. Sorry.

Maybe a Glock 19?

A J-frame conceals well with plenty of umph.

I do carry my XDm concealed often.

[O.S.O.K.]

I urge you to consider a nice single stack 9mm. My choice is the Kahr9:



This an older, all steel model with electorless nickel finish - works great for me.

What I like about it:
1) very slim and hides very well tucked into my belt with just a thin "cover" holster
2) holds 8 rounds of a very good defensive round
3) no extraneous controls - just point and click
4) very accurate and easy to place shots with

I would recommend a pistol that has those attributes. If you carried a G19 (which is a great pistol) then you will have no trouble with a slim single stack pistol and I think will really like the way it conceals.

Kahr now makes polymer models in up to 45 ACP - and the only dis on them that I've read is that they require a couple hundred rounds fired before they become completely reliable.

Kel-tec maks an even more svelt 9mm that is also lower cost and is a good pistol from what I've read about it - I have handled them and they are not nearly as nice in the hand as the Kahrs but your milage may vary.

You may also want to consider a good used (and collectible) piece like this Smith & Wesson 3914:



It is a double - then single action single-stack. It does have the safety if you want that but you can carry it ready to go with the pull of a double action trigger. Apparently, these are hard to find and run about $450 - I got it for $300 and didn't even realize that I got a good deal. I wanted it for my youngest's 16th birthday.

[madman4570]

There are 4 that I use (Taurus SS Millenium pro 9mm,Colt SS mag carry .357,Kel-Tec P40 .40S&W,and a Kel-Tec P32 .32Auto)
I have a lot other handguns but are too big for CCW
I like the Taurus because it also has a manual safe.But If I was to get ONE(1) gun for CCW it would be a Kel-Tec P-3AT 7Oz .380
That gun is what I call a true "ALL THE TIME CCW GUN"You dont see it/feel it/and its always hidden in pants pocket(shirt pocket etc.)
Now they do carry a 9mm(12Oz)PF-9 that is unreal small for that caliber.

I have a lot more expensive brand guns but have been very impressed how accurate/well they handle/reliable they are.
They run $250-$350 worth every penny.

Me again it would be that P-3AT with Corbon or Buffalo bore hot .380 loads.(I am talking CCW defense against Bad People, with the intent to kill you not Big Bad Bears)
Gun thinness/Size/Weight is everything for all time carry.Heck if size dont matter then get the Glock G36 or 19(which are HUGE compared to the Kel-Tecs) So if it had to be 9mm or .45acp only it would be that Kel-Tec PF-9 about $275 Your call.

[Grizz]

xd45c and xd9sc have capacity but are bulky. turns out they conceal better on skinny straight sided guys than they do on me.

I alternate them, and even though the 9 is only slightly smaller in the grip department it is a little easier to hide without printing.

I feel bad when I leave the .45 behind, like I've dialed my chances down. I know savvy guys who carry .380, but it just seems like a dumbed down 9, and already 9mm seems wimpy alongside the .45s.

Then too, when you go to the little .380s you not only give up oooomph, but you have fewer of them to give, so it seems regressive.

Just going to a single stack isn't a guaranty of concealment because it seems to me that it's the length of the handle bar that prints.

the xd40sc is on my short list, exactly the same size as the xd9sc with much better value per squeeze...

it's tough to hide the bigger ones... hope someone has the solution to this one...

Grizz

[TedH]

I should have mentioned before, no KelTecs. I've had one before and it was the biggest thing I ever wasted money on. I sure as heck wouldn't trust my life on it. I've thought about the Kahrs, but the steel frame models are too heavy for their size, and the ones I've shot left me sour on the triggers.

[Old Ironsights]

The problem is the "Under $600" part.

Given what you want, an Officer's Model 1911 or a "XO/CCO" would be the ticket... but they are all pricy unless you get lucky.

I'd say you are spot on with the Glock 36

[JimT]

The problem is the "Under $600" part. Given what you want, an Officer's Model 1911 or a "XO/CCO" would be the ticket... but they are all pricy unless you get lucky. I'd say you are spot on with the Glock 36

or stop fooling around with those newfangled fad guns and get a good revolver

[Old Ironsights]

The problem is the "Under $600" part. Given what you want, an Officer's Model 1911 or a "XO/CCO" would be the ticket... but they are all pricy unless you get lucky. I'd say you are spot on with the Glock 36

or stop fooling around with those newfangled fad guns and get a good revolver

Well, *I* carry a .357 snubby... but Ted DID say 9mm or .45ACP, which, while not impossible, makes revolvers a bit more problematic...

[O.S.O.K.]

http://v4.beta.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vi ... =131469916

There's a nice one. You should like the trigger on that. Don't know what the "reserve" (I hate reserves) price is, but might check it out...

I love the trigger on my Kahr - it is totally different than any other trigger that I've squeezed but once you get used to it, to me anyway, its excellent.

[mescalero1]

I have a Llama Minimax9
shoots well
reliable
single stack
might not make your weight requirement.

[JimT]

Well, *I* carry a .357 snubby... but Ted DID say 9mm or .45ACP, which, while not impossible, makes revolvers a bit more problematic...

http://www.leverguns.com/acp/bigbore_bellyguns.htm

I carried the 45 ACP revolver quite a bit ... as a CCW gun ... but I don't recommend it to those who won't take the necessary steps to learn to use it properly.

[Old Ironsights]

Well, *I* carry a .357 snubby... but Ted DID say 9mm or .45ACP, which, while not impossible, makes revolvers a bit more problematic...

http://www.leverguns.com/acp/bigbore_bellyguns.htm

I carried the 45 ACP revolver quite a bit ... as a CCW gun ... but I don't recommend it to those who won't take the necessary steps to learn to use it properly.

Yep, not impossible, just more problematic... and likely not under $600 either.

[David]

From my absolutely bias as h... view point, the P239 is a very nice carry piece.

We don't need no stinking safety's!

[Blaine]

I have a G36, a very utile piece. Accurate enough that I shot grouse with it a few times. Almost light enough for it to ride in a jacket pocket, but don't leave one in the chamber if it ain't holstered.

[madman4570]

TedH,

Got to respect your opinuion there.You must have gotten a bad one?
But on that same token the two biggest thing guns that I have ever had were Glocks.
My first Glock I bought new in 1992(Glock 19) litterly had the actual frame just crumble/break apart)like a little toy cap gun, and I was easy on that gun!

Next was a M26 glock that was sent back to the factory 3 times with issues the first two times for defective Guide rods.(twice ?)and then issue with a defective slide stop.(Factory agreed) 2 months later.

No way would I trust my life with either of them things.
I shoot my Kel-Tec P32 more than all my other handguns combined(over 5,000 rds in the last 3 years not one single problem and at 10 to 15yds it throws all seven very fast into a group the size of a mans fist!
I guess all makes could have their problems,I just dont trust the Glocks.Maybe I just got two bad ones???????/

[TedH]

madman, we've all had our own experiences and formed our own opinions. Nothing wrong with that. I guess I'm partial to Glocks because I carried one for years as a LEO and fired many thousands of rounds without a single failure of any kind. After I got out of the cop business I felt naked without my Glock, so I bought one of my own and have had one in some form ever since.

Still favoring the G36 as my next one.

[Blaine]

TedH,

Got to respect your opinuion there.You must have gotten a bad one?
But on that same token the two biggest thing guns that I have ever had were Glocks.
My first Glock I bought new in 1992(Glock 19) litterly had the actual frame just crumble/break apart)like a little toy cap gun, and I was easy on that gun!

Next was a M26 glock that was sent back to the factory 3 times with issues the first two times for defective Guide rods.(twice ?)and then issue with a defective slide stop.(Factory agreed) 2 months later.

No way would I trust my life with either of them things.
I shoot my Kel-Tec P32 more than all my other handguns combined(over 5,000 rds in the last 3 years not one single problem and at 10 to 15yds it throws all seven very fast into a group the size of a mans fist!
I guess all makes could have their problems,I just dont trust the Glocks.Maybe I just got two bad ones???????/

I am NOT implying a limp wrist, but Glocks will sometimes not cycle properly without the IronGrip hold. Beats me as to why.

[madman4570]

Ya, I have heard that to.I definetly dont limp wrist it@ six four/240lbs and still bench 380lbs(was 420lbs but I am getting old )

TedH,
No,I know a lot of people that love the Glocks.Really the way I work it is with the exception of the Taurus w/manual safety I carry the other CCW autos with the chamber empty.
Back about 10 years ago,a friend of mine which was a Tioga ,Ny Deputy Sheriff he accidently shot his right knee cap apart with his Glock and I still dont like to carry them racked.It left him permanently very badly crippled.???
I have two relatives that work for the FBI and they both now carry HKs ??

[Ysabel Kid]

A Para P12.45 (.45 ACP) or a Glock Model 27 (.40 S&W). Both have a lot of firepower in small packages (but are not pocket pistols).

[madman4570]

Holy cow!
I just saw this 5 mins ago on gunsholstersandgear.com
How about a 12Oz 9mm "Revolver" rated for +P and lifetime warranty.
Can also be had in a .45 auto.


Charter Arms Rimless Revolvers in 9mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP
By Richard
Charter Arms has been showing the willingness to be different and offer consumers revolvers that they can’t find elsewhere. Earlier this year, Charter Arms introduced the Patriot line of revolvers chambered in .327 Federal Magnum. The Ruger SP101 was the only revolver chambered for the .327, until the Patriot revolvers which gives buyers a choice in this caliber. Now Charter has announced a new line of revolvers designed for rimless self-defense cartridges.

Chambering revolver for a rimless cartridge, such as the 9mm or .45 ACP, is not a new idea. Smith and Wesson, Taurus, and others have done it before. The problem has always been with the moon clips. To get a rimless cartridge to sit properly in the cylinder, you would have to snap individual rounds into a full or half-moon clip. While in theory this isn’t too bad, a lot of shooters will tell you it will quickly become a pain.

Charter Arms claims to have solved this problem by offering a system that allows you to insert rimless cartridges directly into the cylinder without the need for clips. Assuming the system functions flawlessly, this could be a serious leap forward for Charter. A lot of citizens would like to have a revolver chambered for the same cartridge they carry in their Glock or Sig. Also, add to the equation all of the police officers wanting to carry a back-up gun chambered for the same cartridge they carry in their duty gun.

The revolvers will be offered in 9mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP. The guns will feature a 2″ barrel on the 9mm, with a 2.2″ on the .40 and .45. The 9mm will be offered on Charter’s lightweight aluminum frame (12 oz), while the .40 and .45 will be offered on the slightly larger “Bulldog” frame. All guns will handle +P cartridges and will have a lifetime warranty.

An interesting note: Charter states the 9mm will chamber .380 ACP ammunition. So, if you need revolver dependability but need very light recoil due to arthritis or other issues, this might be well worth looking at.

MSRP will range from $399 to $449, so the guns will be affordable. Charter anticipates shipping these guns in the first quarter of 2009, starting with the .40 S&W then .45 ACP, and 9mm. All should be available by the end of 2009.
This new 9mm is the Parabellum(not the 9mm federal like the pit bull used)Thank God. I bet those 9mm 115gr HP @1400fps from Buffalo Bore would be a man stopper!

[Old Ironsights]

"An interesting note: Charter states the 9mm will chamber .380 ACP ammunition. So, if you need revolver dependability but need very light recoil due to arthritis or other issues, this might be well worth looking at."

Call me a Missourian, but I'd like to see the engineering on that...

Otherwise... COOL!... but it may be vaporware too... http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/2009 ... vaporware/

[madman4570]

Exactly!
I would love to see that gun.Gosh you can shoot those light .380s then move right up to the real hot 9mm stuff (12 Oz revolver)???Alloy framed.????????
I will buy one for sure if it really exists???(nice carry gun for the wife)

[4t5]

Don't forget ..KAHR..I'M think'in my next purchase is a pm 45, maybe you should too!

[tman]

glock 27-40s&w. keltec pf-9 9mm. nothing else compares!

[RIHMFIRE]

S&W 460 8 3/8"

[AJMD429]

Para Ordnance P-12's are nice and maybe a used one would be $500 or less? Their single-stack ones are even more compact, and I suppose cost less than the double-stack ones.

[Les Staley]

Find yourself a Sig P6 German Police trade in.. 9mm, single stack, alloy frame, SS slide double action.. the one I have was never shot, I have put about four boxes of blazer through it, and it now shows a little bit of brass track on the breech face.. I keep it stoked with Hornady critical defence ammo, functions fine, and hope I never use it ... Les

[TedH]

Alright folks, I appreciate all the input. After investigating many of your suggestions there were a couple that interested me, but my heart was still set on a G36. Local shop has one for $625 and wouldn't budge on the price. With sales tax it was going to be $670. Tonight I surfed the web a little and found one on Gunbroker NIB for $499 + 20 shipping. It's on it's way. There's just something about a 45 in that small 20 oz package.

[Tycer]

Looking forward to range reports!

[Ysabel Kid]

Congrats Ted! Be sure to post some pictures when it arrives - and after you install the obligatory lever on it!

[TedH]

Congrats Ted! Be sure to post some pictures when it arrives - and after you install the obligatory lever on it!

Hmmm, I may need some help with that lever installation.......

[piller]

My daughter has a Kahr CW9. It is great. She had a problem with some overpressure ammunition made by Houston Cartridge Company which popped out the piece on the handgrip which diverts and slows down the gasses from a cartridge rupture. The ejector was also popped out. Kahr fixed this in about 5 days total turn-around time. Stick with good, reliable ammunition and the Kahr lineup will be all you could ask for. I have a Kel-Tec P3AT, and it has never failed me. I shoot it about 4 times per year. Every company can make a bad firearm on occasion. Remember the batch of Glocks that the New Jersey State Police had to return because they could not be made to work. An entire production run. It happens. More importantly than the brand is the fit to your hand. If it doesn't fit you, you won't like it.

[Streetstar]

So far, my Officers size Rock Island has not had a FTF or FTE -- about 250 rounds through it so far --50 HP's to check for function. Its small enough for me and still has an "old school" appearance, which i like -- price is around 400 bucks. It holds 7, same as the full size models ---- i would rather have this than any Kel Tec or Kahr. However, a surplus Sig single stack or something would be very tempting too




edit: whoops - just read about you getting the Glock --- good luck with it. I had a G-21 before i decided to jump into the 1911 fire. Excellent pistols, i actually wouldnt mind having another one (a 21 or a 10mm 20, not one of the compact ones) . Just put in plenty of practice -- the light weight of the darn things can make them want to jump out of your hands with full power and +P loads. Great choice

[Travis Morgan]

I have, carry, and recommend, the Taurus Milleniums. The Millenium pro is double action only, but I shoot it pretty well. Once I got over hating it and just practiced with it, I got to doing pretty well, pretty fast.

[tman]

So far, my Officers size Rock Island has not had a FTF or FTE -- about 250 rounds through it so far --50 HP's to check for function. Its small enough for me and still has an "old school" appearance, which i like -- price is around 400 bucks. It holds 7, same as the full size models ---- i would rather have this than any Kel Tec or Kahr. However, a surplus Sig single stack or something would be very tempting too



OKAY, I FORGOT THIS ONE. ADD IT TO THE 27 AND THE PF-9
edit: whoops - just read about you getting the Glock --- good luck with it. I had a G-21 before i decided to jump into the 1911 fire. Excellent pistols, i actually wouldnt mind having another one (a 21 or a 10mm 20, not one of the compact ones) . Just put in plenty of practice -- the light weight of the darn things can make them want to jump out of your hands with full power and +P loads. Great choice

[madman4570]

TedH,
Good luck with that new Glock.Thats a "very good price".
I am sure it will serve you well(I think mine were flukes)
You, having always carrying glocks and them being second nature to you, you probably made the wisest choice. Again good luck, and post a picture of her when she comes in! see ya,