Modifing spire tipped bullet for use in a lever gun?

[L_Kilkenny]

A buddy of mine was given a box of reloading stuff from a ol'timer in his home town. The box included 400 Hornady spire tipped 110gr bullets. The only .308 either of us has is my 30/30 so I was hoping to modify them into FP's for plinkin, small game on up to coyotes.

What is the best diameter of the FP that I should try to get?

Any ideas for a simple way to modify them? I'm thinkin that I could take a piece of wood the proper thinkness, drill holes in it to hold the bullets and install some sheet metal to the top so a file doesn't dig into the wood. Any better ideas?

While I'm at it I'm gonna toss a couple more questions in here:

I have about 1500-2000 large pistol primers left over from the days when I reloaded .45 ACP. Safe to use in my 30/30? Advantages/disadvantages?

Also in the box of reloading stuff my buddy received was an un-used, possibly opened 1lb can of H4895. We're talking old here, packed in a cardboard can. What are the odds it's still good if stored in a non-climate controled garage for a few years? Same with a bunch of primers that were included in his newly aquired stash?

BTW, with the primers I looked and 500 of the primers Win. magnum LP's and the other 1000 are standard CCI LP's. I'm looking at reduced loads too. Possibly with Unique, SR4759 and H4895.

[Hobie]

You can do a lot with the wrong tools if you NEED to BUT you should trade those LP primers to somebody who needs them. The pistol primers are NEEDED by pistol shooters due to the relative lack of depth in pistol primer cups.

As to the bullets, save yourself some work and single load the cartridges. You can just clip the point with a pair of dikes (aka side cutting pliers). Save the lead, somebody will want it.

What does the powder smell like? It can well be it is fine but you do need to check it out.

[TedH]

Yeah, I'd say make some kind of jig to hold the bullets the same way for each one and just file them down. Only need to have the flat point close to the same size as the primer. Do these bullets have a cannalure to crimp in? Could be an issue in a levergun if they don't. Nothing that a Lee FCD wouldn't solve though.

Not sure about the pistol primers in the 30/30. Rifle primers are a bit taller, so your pistol primers will sit deeper in the primer pocket. Could run into some misfire problems even if they were hot enough for your rifle power charges. Might do fine with your Unique charges. I personally wouldn't do it.

If the powder passes the sniff test, it could be ok to use. But there again, it's not been stored properly, and are you certain what's in the can is actually what it says? Not worth the risk in my book.

[pokey]

someone [paco maybe] in one of the articles on this home page wrote about
clipping the points on projectiles. some kind of jig where the point sticks out
so you get them kind of uniform.

if you seat a primer in an empty case , snap it in chamber , point gun in safe
direction and pull trigger . if it goes bang you are good to go, slowly.

old powder , burn a little , check results/residue/flash etc.
basic rule WHEN IN DOUBT THROW IT OUT.

good luck, pokey

[handirifle]

I kept some powder for 30 years and it still works like new. Powder, if kept dry and clean, will not deterioriate.

[Doc Hudson]

Don't bother tring to flat point the bullets! Too much trouble, takes too much time and screws up accuracy.

I have an alternate suggestion.

Use the bullets as they now are and only load two cartridges in your rifles. One in the chamber and one in the magazine. After all, how often do you fire more than two shots at a deer anyway?

I'd also suggest you check out Accurate Arms reloading manual for some load ideas.

I used to load 125 gr. Ballistic Tips over a healthy dose of AA-2520 for use in my Marlin M-30 AS. I don't remember the velocity but I think it was ne the neighborhood of 2400-2500 fps and I could make a1" to 1 1/2" two shot group out to a bit over 100 yards.

[jd45]

I understand if you sniff the powder & it gives off a pungent ammonia-like odor, it's gone bad. With something that old, I'd toss it. jd45

[Modoc ED]

Turn the bullets around and load them pointy end in the case. Don't laugh it works.

[Bob A]

I have use this bullet in my 30-30.
You can just barely seat the bullet with COL under 2.56". This will allow the cartridge to cycle. Any longer and you can't unload an unfired cart.
Then just load 2 at a time. One in the tube, one in the chamber.
Or, you can clip off the tips. I got pretty good using finger nail clippers. It snips off clean.

I got very good accuracy with 32.5 gr of Reloader 7. I still use this load for coyotes at home but have changed to the Sierra 110 HP Varminter

Bob

[Old Savage]

Powder certainly can deteriorate. It changes color, mine was rust colored and began to have large variations in pressure. H322 I believe. It was not mistreated in the time between when it was good and when it turned. It was good in 96 although not new and by 2000 it gave 1557 - 2054 fps variation in a 45-70 load using 54 gr and a 300 gr bullet. Previous loads were 47 gr loads in a 444 with a 300 gr bullet and sub inch accuracy.

[jnyork]

I have a .33 WCF for which bullets are no longer available except for very pricey custom jobs. I use the .338 .200 grain Hornady spire points, just load singly. I did make some flat points that worked very well, I took a 30-30 trim die and put it in my press, then run the spire point up in it using a dowel between the ram and the base of the bullet. Left just enough sticking out to nick off with a file. Weighed a few and came out +/- about a half a grain, which is plenty good enough. Best solution is to shoot gas checked cast, of which I have a couple thou, should see me through.

[41bear]

I'm with Hoby on the pistol primers, trade'em. As for the powder, if you know the person who gave you the stuff (and trust him) then try some at the lowest level you can over a chrono. If not, please throw it out. A pound of powder versus a $500 + dollar gun, sorry but its not worth it in my eyes, and doesn't even take into account some bystander getting hurt, killed, because of it. Just my 2 cents.

[Kansas Ed]

I have modified spire point bullets for years. I've used them with great success in the 25-35, 25-20, and 33 Winchester. These are calibers which unfortunately have little in the way of bullet selection out there, and it requires some creativity to make good shooters. While the 25-20 gets a little more involved, the 25-35 was easy with Nosler Ballistic tips. Basically I load the cartridge, and take the plastic tips to the bench grinder and grind them down to just above the jacket surface. Being it's plastic I'm grinding, there is no pressure on the bullet to speak of. Now I wouldn't do that to the average lead pointed bullet due to airborne lead, and also you need to keep the cannelure requirement in mind. But there is no real issue with converting good bullets to a point style which fits your needs. For 33 Winchester bullets I used Speer Grand Slam's cut back in a lathe. Although the ogive length presented some OAL problems. But they worked nicely just the same.

BTW: The 25-35 with 115gr Altered Ballistic Tips shoots well under an inch at 50 yds, which is pretty good shootin for me and irons. I think my 85gr 25-20 load is pretty similar.

Ed

[JustaJeepGuy]

If you do discard the powder, just spread it around on your lawn. It's good fertilizer.

[Old Savage]

Ed - great tip there. I think I will try that.

[L_Kilkenny]

Some great advice here guys, thanks much.

Still undecided about the powder. It looks and smells fine but a good point about not risking a $500 gun and possible injury to find out.

I'm gonna try to find someone to do a trade on the pistol primers. I don't know any handgun reloaders (besides me and i only need SP's) and I'm not sure too many dealers/suppliers are gonna hip on the idea of a trade. We'll see.

About the bullets.....Thinkin a trade may be in order there too. Maybe I can find someone to trade me the 400 spire pointed bullets on 300 round nose or HP bullets (or maybe 500-600 cast bullets). Good for me, good for them. If I can't trade em I'll tinker with em, price was right on em. Interesting idea on turning them around. Bet thats puts a thumping on game. And no, they don't have a crimp grove but I was thinkin about getting a Lee crimp die anyway.

[otteray]

Someone has the same question with a similar powder over here: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=5444880

[WCF3030]

FWIW I've shot now several thousand rounds from my 30-30 both with Unique and h-335 with LP primers. When I first started I compared accuracy between LR and LP primers and found the LP to be more consistent with my loads.