357 180XTP in 1:30 twist barrel

[mickbr]

Fellas any idea whether a Rossi 1892 will stabilze this bullet at decent speeds, say 1450-1600fps? If anyone has run them in a marlins 1:38 twist would be interested to hear as well.

[Tycer]

They should stabilize. They have in mine. The 180 cast lbt does too at that speed. Starts to wobble at 100 at 1200 and below. Never had a real keyhole and accuracy didn’t really suffer horribly.

[AJMD429]

I didn't chono them but some 180 grain factory loads worked fine at 75 yards from my Marlin 1894 CSS (the 16" stainless one made in early 2,000's). Probably Remington as I think the box was green, but maybe had a blue line on it. Dunno.

[Rockrat]

I have shot 180 xtp and 180 Rem SJHP thru my Remlin 357mag with good groups @100yds and they work well in my Rossi too. I drive them pretty fast with 300-MP powder

[Scott Tschirhart]

The 180 gr XTP driven hard seems to work just fine in my Marlin and my Rossi rifles. I don't see any reason to even use this bullet unless I am pushing it hard.

[earlmck]

I have been one of those who whimpered about the poor accuracy of 180 grain bullets in a Rossi levergun. I have a very nice 180 grain LBT mould which throws 2 gas-check and 2 plain-base bullets that has produced thousands of bullets for my Ruger GP100 (mostly using the plain based ones) and I was looking forward to really getting wonderful results with the gas checked bullet from this mould in the Rossi. Considerable disappointment, which I have expressed a couple times here on this forum. But in my case I am wanting accuracy at 200 yards for our levergun buffalo shoot we hold at the local gun range. 100 yard groups have been acceptable with the bullet.

I am now shooting a 135 grain gas-checked bullet out on an NOE mould (Ranch-Dog style) that holds up nicely to 300 yards and beyond that I will use in our little buffalo shooting game when I use the Rossi 357.

If you are only needing minute-of-deer accuracy at 75 to 100 yards I suspect any of the 180's will work for you.

[jmiller]

I had an MGM .357max bbl with a 1:20 twist and it wouldn’t shoot any 180g bullet with accuracy that was acceptable to me. I ended up selling it and buying a 1:16 twist and it shot just fine. I did try a lot of different bullets and powders out of the 1:20 and a couple of bullets shot “OK” groups, but not even close to the 1:16 bbl groups. I’ve had a couple of guns custom built for me in .357mag by some truly excellent gunsmiths (Bill Davis was one) and they all advised for best accuracy to with 1:16 or even 1:14 for heavy bullets. I guess a lot of it depends on your expectations also. I always look for the tightest groups I can get and that’s not always necessary for the task at hand.

[Grizz]

I had an MGM .357max bbl with a 1:20 twist and it wouldn’t shoot any 180g bullet with accuracy that was acceptable to me. I ended up selling it and buying a 1:16 twist and it shot just fine. I did try a lot of different bullets and powders out of the 1:20 and a couple of bullets shot “OK” groups, but not even close to the 1:16 bbl groups. I’ve had a couple of guns custom built for me in .357mag by some truly excellent gunsmiths (Bill Davis was one) and they all advised for best accuracy to with 1:16 or even 1:14 for heavy bullets. I guess a lot of it depends on your expectations also. I always look for the tightest groups I can get and that’s not always necessary for the task at hand.

very interesting about the twist rate. have you experience with 44mag in this regard?

does type of rifling affect bullet performance? microgroove used to be common and sometimes controversial, and Ballard was offered in the later Marlins. I think.



thanks in advance,
grizz

[Rusty]

If you look on the graybreard's outdoor forums Veral Smith, maker of the LBT molds has talked several times about his cast 180 grain bullets in a Rossi '92. It's his wife's elk rifle.

[mickbr]

thanks all. I have a chance to pick up a few boxes so will grab them.

[mickbr]

btw anyone have any loads with 2400 powder they might want to share.

[jmiller]

I had an MGM .357max bbl with a 1:20 twist and it wouldn’t shoot any 180g bullet with accuracy that was acceptable to me. I ended up selling it and buying a 1:16 twist and it shot just fine. I did try a lot of different bullets and powders out of the 1:20 and a couple of bullets shot “OK” groups, but not even close to the 1:16 bbl groups. I’ve had a couple of guns custom built for me in .357mag by some truly excellent gunsmiths (Bill Davis was one) and they all advised for best accuracy to with 1:16 or even 1:14 for heavy bullets. I guess a lot of it depends on your expectations also. I always look for the tightest groups I can get and that’s not always necessary for the task at hand.

very interesting about the twist rate. have you experience with 44mag in this regard?

does type of rifling affect bullet performance? microgroove used to be common and sometimes controversial, and Ballard was offered in the later Marlins. I think.

Grizz, no experience in the 44mag other than owning several model 629’s and a couple of SBH’s. They all shot 240g XTP’s just fine with the standard rifling in the factory guns. For some reason or another, I just got caught up in .357’s over the years and owned a LOT of them in handguns and rifles, both mag and max.

thanks in advance,
grizz

[Scott Tschirhart]

btw anyone have any loads with 2400 powder they might want to share.

I use 13.5 gr 2400 and a small rifle primer, but only in my guns and with my loads. 12.6 is max in the Hornady manual.

[AJMD429]

.
One thing on unstable bullets....to the extent they exhibit 'minute of deer' accuracy, if they are keyholing and hit sideways....who cares...? A sideways bullet presents a heck of a 'meplat' to the target and if it is hard enough to stay in one piece, probably is even more effective as a hunting or defense round. Maybe not a target shooting round.

[Tycer]

image.jpg

.
One thing on unstable bullets....to the extent they exhibit 'minute of deer' accuracy, if they are keyholing and hit sideways....who cares...? A sideways bullet presents a heck of a 'meplat' to the target and if it is hard enough to stay in one piece, probably is even more effective as a hunting or defense round. Maybe not a target shooting round.

[CowboyTutt]

Good article, thanks Tycer! -Tutt

[wvfarrier]

I have been one of those who whimpered about the poor accuracy of 180 grain bullets in a Rossi levergun. I have a very nice 180 grain LBT mould which throws 2 gas-check and 2 plain-base bullets that has produced thousands of bullets for my Ruger GP100 (mostly using the plain based ones) and I was looking forward to really getting wonderful results with the gas checked bullet from this mould in the Rossi. Considerable disappointment, which I have expressed a couple times here on this forum. But in my case I am wanting accuracy at 200 yards for our levergun buffalo shoot we hold at the local gun range. 100 yard groups have been acceptable with the bullet.

I am now shooting a 135 grain gas-checked bullet out on an NOE mould (Ranch-Dog style) that holds up nicely to 300 yards and beyond that I will use in our little buffalo shooting game when I use the Rossi 357.

If you are only needing minute-of-deer accuracy at 75 to 100 yards I suspect any of the 180's will work for you.

Ive had excellent 200 yard accuracy using the Montana Bullet Works 160 grain HCGC .358

It also vaporizes groundhogs

[CowboyTutt]

While it is mostly bullet length and not weight in bullets that determines stability vs rifling (mass does count and most calculators allow you to change the mass of the material), that does sound like a very good bullet to use for accuracy in the 357. -Tutt