Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

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Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by jmiller »

BUYER BEWARE:
Just a heads up on buying from one of the members on here. I've been buying and selling guns and other items on line for many years and up to now I've never been burned. Recently I got burned by a member of this forum when purchasing a gun from them. They had a SxS 20 ga. shotgun advertised on here which caught my eye. I'd been looking for one for a while but couldn't find one in 20 ga. The price was a bit high, but the seller advertised the gun to be in 90% condition with no rust or pitting and in mechanically perfect condition. The photo's were blurry and when I asked for additional photo's I was told they were unable to take any. I called the seller and he assured me the gun was everything the ad said it was. Although the price was at the top of the book value, based on my belief that it was a 90% gun I sent the seller a money order and waited for the gun. It arrived yesterday and I went to the FFL/LGS to pick it up. The gun I thought I was buying wasn't even closely similar to the one I received. The gun I received was pitted from front to back, top to bottom. Both barrels were heavily pitted inside and there were multiple scratches on the barrel finish and scratches in the wood. The wood could be repaired if the rest of the gun were in better condition. The safety works intermittently. I can understand a slight difference in determining the "percentage" of condition between two parties, but the 90% in the ad turned out to be about 10% in reality. I paid the seller $430 for the gun with shipping and the LGS appraised the gun at $125-150 tops. They have several on the shelf (in 12 ga) and at the three hundred dollar mark you get a gun that is truly 90%. The appraiser told me they wouldn't even take this gun on trade at any price and said they were sorry I got ripped off buying on line. The gun I received looks like something that someone had hanging in a barn for several years or had in the trunk of their car for a couple of years. They didn't even bother to clean it before shipping it to me. I could take a cleaning pick and run it along the solder joint between both barrels and the rib and pull out gobs of rust and dirt. It was filthy. As you can see in the ad, the seller promised one thing and in my photos of the actual gun you can see what I got. I contacted the seller and his remark was "one man's junk is another man's treasure". I guess he thinks it's funny he ripped someone off. Sadly, he's a member who's been on here a long time and has a lot of posts. I guess that doesn't translate to honesty or integrity. Here's the gun I got. What condition do you think the gun is in? I find it hard to believe I've got it wrong. If I have I'll delete this post. He's not going to do anything for me, but don't let him take advantage of you......buyer beware.

Pete44ru's ad:

"20ga Savage/Stevens Model 311 made for Sears Roebuck in 1958 in excellent overall condition.

No scratches, cracks, gouges or rust, in 90% original condition & 100% operating condition (see opening lever pic), 26" bbls, choked IC/MOD, with excellent bores.

$399.00 + shipping - via USPS M.O. or Certified Check"
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Tycer »

That’s horrible. Hopefully the moderator will post his real name. What a piece of Pelosi.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by piller »

While percentages such as 90% condition are not quite an exact science, they are pretty well established. If I am told 90%, I expect no rust anywhere. That gun has been abused and neglected.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Ray »

I am not picking sides or trying to defend but I have bought scores of used guns, sight unseen from individuals, cherry's fine guns, clay smith guns, kittery trading post, the log cabin shop, and track of the wolf to name a few.

In this case, "excellent and no rust" is obviously false but 90% grading is consistent with my unseen purchasing experience......
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by marlinman93 »

Hopefully he'll make things right and send you your money back, including shipping. But as a side note. It's easy to click on the barrel picture and see immediately that isn't a 90% gun on the barrels. Not sure how anyone could open that image and not see all that pitting, regardless of the description being wrong.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Old No7 »

Always

* ALWAYS *

Ask for -- especially if it's not listed -- a "3 Business Day Non-firing Inspection Period with Return Option"

Sorry to hear of this.............

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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Grizz »

MAIL FRAUD

what the fbi is really for
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by vancelw »

And never buy a gun or anything from a seller who insists on USPS money orders or Cashiers Checks.
There is a reason they don't want the money to be reversible.

I take personal checks when I sell. Nowadays they clear fast.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Tycer »

marlinman93 wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:12 am
Hopefully he'll make things right and send you your money back, including shipping. But as a side note. It's easy to click on the barrel picture and see immediately that isn't a 90% gun on the barrels. Not sure how anyone could open that image and not see all that pitting, regardless of the description being wrong.
Pete removed his pictures from the post. Those are Jmiller’s pics.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by jmiller »

Tycer wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:41 am
marlinman93 wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:12 am
Hopefully he'll make things right and send you your money back, including shipping. But as a side note. It's easy to click on the barrel picture and see immediately that isn't a 90% gun on the barrels. Not sure how anyone could open that image and not see all that pitting, regardless of the description being wrong.
Pete removed his pictures from the post. Those are Jmiller’s pics.
And I stated that. The seller's pics were very blurry and when I asked for better pic's I was told the seller couldn't provide them....lack of capability. Those are the pics I took last night after I picked up the gun. This gun is really rough, and I mean rough. It's nothing like the seller described it in his ad, or described to me on the phone after I called him to inquire about getting some better pics. He sounded like a good guy so I took a chance and sent the money. First time this ever happened to me. His snide remarks at my dissatisfaction only increased my disappointment. He obviously has no shame.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Tycer »

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/ ... ent=safari

He pulled the images from imagur.

Jmiller if you could search your cached pages, you might find a set of cached images. I don't know how to do this, just that it can be done.

Anybody here on RimfireCentral? He posted there too:
https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/v ... &id=244361
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Jay Bird »

It doesn't matter if the gun was described as 90% and then the gun came through as new in the box with all hang tags. There is ALWAYS a three day inspection with a return FOR ANY REASON..........anybody sellling should always state that returns will be happily refunded for any reason.

Yes, sometimes people will buy stuff and then return it with changed parts...that's when you say, "no go bro".

I take it a step father....if you think and can reasonably say that the gun was not as described I'll give your money back plus a hundred dollars for your aggravation. Of course, this is only here and it's never happened. I don't sell anything anywhere else except at local gun shops.

Sellers here who sell to fellow forum members should be held to a higher standard of honesty and good will as I've found people in the general public can be liars and pride themselves on deception.

My feelings towards Pete has always been positive and my guess is that he will make good for ya. ---6
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Blaine »

Regardless, he's a long-time forumite and deserves a chance to respond before being thrown under the bus. :idea:
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by .45colt »

Sixgun Sr wrote:' There is ALWAYS a three day inspection with a return FOR ANY REASON..........anybody sellling should always state that returns will be happily refunded for any reason.". Yep Six, that is how it should be......
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by jmiller »

Blaine wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:23 pm
Regardless, he's a long-time forumite and deserves a chance to respond before being thrown under the bus. :idea:
Other than his PM response to me of "one man's junk is another man's treasure", I'm also waiting to hear from him. It's pretty easy to make those remarks to me in a PM. It might not sound as good stating that publicly though.

Here's a thought:
Pete, if you're reading this how about sending me my money back and I'll send you the gun back. I'll end up being out about a hundred bucks when it's all said and done. I paid to have it shipped to me, I paid for my FFL to receive it and transfer it to me in NY, and I''ll end up paying to ship it back to your FFL. All of that will end up costing me about a hundred bucks out of pocket. At that point I'll have at least gotten something back. I'd rather be out a hundred bucks instead of four-hundred-sixty bucks like I am now. Maybe you can find someone else to sell it to who won't complain about being swindled like I'm complaining.

Reason for edit: I just realized I paid for all shipping and the seller has paid nothing. If he took it back he wouldn't be out a penny.
Last edited by jmiller on Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Blaine »

jmiller wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:33 pm
Blaine wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:23 pm
Regardless, he's a long-time forumite and deserves a chance to respond before being thrown under the bus. :idea:
Other than his PM response to me of "one man's junk is another man's treasure", I'm also waiting to hear from him. It's pretty easy to make those remarks to me in a PM. It might not sound as good stating that publicly though.

Here's a thought:
Pete, if you're reading this how about sending me my money back and I'll send you the gun back. I'll end up being out about a hundred bucks when it's all said and done. I paid to have it shipped to me, I paid for my FFL to receive it and transfer it to me in NY, and I''ll end up paying to ship it back to your FFL. All of that will end up costing me about a hundred bucks out of pocket. At that point I'll have at least gotten something back. I'd rather be out a hundred bucks instead of four-hundred-sixty bucks like I am now. You'll only be out the twenty-some bucks you paid to ship it to me. Maybe you can find someone else to sell it to who won't complain about being swindled like I'm complaining.
So....what did my statement have to do with your feelings? If he "stays in the dark" on this, then you were correct. If he publically admits his errors, and makes full restitution then that would be a very good thing, right?
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by harry »

There is a drop down menu at the bottom of the page to change % :
https://www.bluebookofgunvalues.com/#/G ... 90%25/None
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by wm »

I'm not choosing sides or second guessing anyone.

I just want to say that in this day and age with the cameras they are putting in our phones these days and the lumens they can pack into lights now it takes some effort to produce bad pictures. If the pictures are vague it is a good bet someone is trying to obscure something.

This community has an atypical closeness to it in my experience. We want to believe in each other. It hurts all of us to think that someone would take advantage of that.

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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by .45colt »

Blaine wrote:"Regardless, he's a long-time forumite and deserves a chance to respond before being thrown under the bus. :idea:" Yep. :shock: :shock: :shock: .
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Woodtroll »

I was interested in that gun, too, but even the blurry pictures he posted led me to believe that the condition was not as he had described. I'm glad I passed, and I'm sorry JMiller didn't. The lack of better photos upon request would have sealed the deal for me, but we tend to trust each other here.

I have no dealings with Pete44ru, but it's a shame that someone who has been on this forum as long as he has would respond the way he did to another forum member.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by stretch »

I've had dealings with a couple of forum members here.

No problems, even at over $500.

One of the things that has always impressed me on this forum is the implied honesty of the
members. Most of them are a cut above the average in terms of integrity. There's always
the exception, though.

Lets see if Pete44ru has the integrity and gonads to own up to the error of his ways, take the gun
back, refund the money, and offer to pay for the return shipping and fees.

I think in buying or selling something as described as 90% or better, a lot of subjectivity is apparent
in that last 10% of grading. This one isn't close to 90%. With better pictures, I'm sure the rating would
drop even further.

It's a shame.

Kudos to jmiller for calling the seller out, and high marks to the moderator(s) for allowing that.

Good luck, Mr. Miller.

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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by AJMD429 »

Sixgun Sr wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 12:56 pm
My feelings towards Pete has always been positive and my guess is that he will make good for ya. ---6
Blaine wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:23 pm
Regardless, he's a long-time forumite and deserves a chance to respond before being thrown under the bus. :idea:
I bought a revolver from him in 2010 and there was no problem whatsoever; if there had been, I'd have tried to work it out individually before 'calling him out' publicly. Anyway, I had no problems.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by barbarossa »

I ve bought and sold a lot online and for the most part have had very few problems.One time though I sold a gun to a fellow on another forum I m on and recieved an email about 2 days later that he wanted his money back because he wasn t happy with it.I figured ok no problem kinda of a bummer though because I was selling to purchase something else but not the end of the world.Well later that night I while on a different forum I came across a post and it was my gun I had sold and the poster showed a pic of the gun and about 2000 empty rimfire rounds stating it was a fun gun but now he was bored with it time to send it back to get something else.I sent him a pic of his post and told him he should think twice when posting things on the net if he plans to screw some one over.From my experience there are more good people online than bad but one has to be careful
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by 6pt-sika »

I have sold a lot online and continue to do so . We always give as good a description as we can and give CLEAR pictures of any problems an item may have . Granted from time to time you’re going to overlook something if you do it enough but not by 60-80% of finish quality . I also say you can return if you don’t fire it or take it apart and if you did the paperwork and it left the shop our deal is DONE :!:
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Rusty »

And so far nothing from Pete?
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Jay Bird »

Rusty wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 2:51 am
And so far nothing from Pete?

Well said Rusty.....shows either guilt or disgust.....with Pete it's more likely the latter.....you know, if I'm gonna make a "hit and roll" I'm sure not gonna do it on a 10 cent gun...it's gonna be a Uberti disguised as a Colt and then it's off to Mexico. :D ---6
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by WinM71 »

When dealing between long-time members here, you should be able to expect an honest and detailed description. The 3-day inspection period should go without saying.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by wvfarrier »

Dang, hate to see this. Ive made several great deals on here
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by jmiller »

I bought a revolver from him in 2010 and there was no problem whatsoever; if there had been, I'd have tried to work it out individually before 'calling him out' publicly. Anyway, I had no problems.
I PM'd him before posting about it. His response (I said this before earlier) was "one man's junk is another man's treasure". Again, it's no treasure. I guess his good name has a price....four hundred bucks. I would have much rather had him offer to take it back. I've posted that I'd pay to ship it back to him. At that point all the shipping costs would have been paid for by me going both ways. It's pretty obvious he doesn't want the gun back, and it's obvious why. He'd still have the gun and not be out a penny. I'd be out over a hundred bucks in shipping both ways....and he still doesn't seem to care.The pictures and his ad don't lie. What you see is what happened. If you got a fair deal from him in 2010 good for you. I'll get over it. I just think it's only fair that others who may buy from him know what could happen based on my experience. Many web sites and forums have seller ratings. I wish they had that on here.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by JB »

One man's 90% may be 95% or 85% to another, but that gun is a LONG way from 90% based on those photos. And defiantly not a $400 gun.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Lastmohecken »

Well, I am thinking Pete44ru must be hard up for money, or something.

Maybe he already spent your money and don't have it. Still, he ought to at the very least give back some of your money, so that maybe you could pass the gun off to someone else at a reduced price. That could maybe come closer to win win for all involved. Pete gets a little bit of credibility back, and maybe you could come out somewhat by selling the gun to someone else at a price closer to the true value of the gun. Not the prefect plan, but sometimes everyone just needs to cut their loses, and live with it.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by wvfarrier »

1- if he isnt willing to defend himself he needs booted from the forum.
2- its worth legal action just to teach him a lesson
3- nothing worse than a liar and a theif
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Bill in Oregon »

Very disappointed in your seller and his response. Those aren't tomato soup stains. A man who'd sell his integrity for $399 might as well be a politician.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by rossim92 »

Anyway you can ring his doorbell and ask him face to face for your money back? Or like they said, file a complaint with the fbi for mail fraud?
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Jay Bird »

Bill in Oregon wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 8:24 am
Very disappointed in your seller and his response. Those aren't tomato soup stains. A man who'd sell his integrity for $399 might as well be a politician.
That does make sense Bill and then it don't make sense.....your right, a paltry $400 for his integrity. On the other hand Pete must think it was worth $400 and this is where I will go to bat for him.

It's a 20 ga....much harder to find.
That's not rust inside the barrel...it's line streaking from plastic wads or carbon/leading of some sort
The bluing under the receiver is deep with freckled areas as is the barrel.

In a half hour I'd be able to make that gun a true 90% er without altering its originality.

There's very little you can buy for $2-400 anymore. That 20 ga. Is priced high...at retail it's worth $250-300.

A lesson.......down at Targetmaster people will look and handle a used gun......Let's pretend the gun is a gun that costs $1,000 NEW......then lets also pretend the gun in question is a true 90% er which brings the price down to an honest $650.. The potential buyer will complain about a "mark here or there" .....to which my buddy will say, "Oh! I see! You want a brand new one."

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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Pisgah »

wvfarrier wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 7:25 am

2- its worth legal action just to teach him a lesson
I seriously doubt it. It's essentially a small claim. If he lived in the same state, it MIGHT be worth the hassle, but only then if he lives no farther away than the next county. Once you've prepared the required paperwork, paid for filing the claim, serving the summons and complaint, then showing up in court you've spent time and money. If he's in another state, then you have to either hire an attorney there or travel to file and prosecute your case in his jurisdiction. And even if your case is a dead-bang winner, all you're going to get is a judgement, which is just a piece of paper saying you're owed money. If the US Mail was involved, a complaint to the USPS might get you some satisfaction, but based on my previous experiences with such things -- nope. Even their insurance is worthless!
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Nath »

FBI!
Na, just needs judge Judy on this one.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by barbarossa »

In reality the loss of ones standing in a forum such as this is probably hurts more than anything
else.Once your integrity is gone it s a long hard road getting it back.There must be a back story here as one normally doesn t sell their integrity so cheap.I can think of all kinds of addictions etc that would give reason for this ,my sister who recently passed away was addicted to gambling and from this addiction she swindled my mother ,her son and various institutions for thousands of dollars.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by FWiedner »

I've hesitated to ring in on this one. Wanted to think about it for a minute.

I don't know Peter44ru or jmiller and I don't have a dog in the fight, but I've got to check the box that this is a misunderstanding that needs to be worked out between buyer and seller.

We all appreciate a heads-up on an unscrupulous vendor, but Pete44ru has been logging in here for a long time and IMO deserves something amounting to a benefit of the doubt.

The fact that he hasn't logged in to defend himself means absolutely nothing, the only person he owes any sort of explanation to is to jmiller. Perhaps he simply has not has the opportunity to check in, for whatever reason.

In any case, and again IMO, coming into the forum and smearing a member's reputation is the wrong approach. It's just bad form.

:|
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by vancelw »

FWiedner wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:05 pm
.....

We all appreciate a heads-up on an unscrupulous vendor, but Pete44ru has been logging in here for a long time and IMO deserves something amounting to a benefit of the doubt.

The fact that he hasn't logged in to defend himself means absolutely nothing, the only person he owes any sort of explanation to is to jmiller. Perhaps he simply has not has the opportunity to check in, for whatever reason.

In any case, and again IMO, coming into the forum and smearing a member's reputation is the wrong approach. It's just bad form.

:|
Agreed .

Side note...I have a Springfield 511 in 20 gauge (essentially the same gun with different furniture) in much better condition that I'd sell for $399 in a heartbeat. :D
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Nath »

FWiedner wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:05 pm
I've hesitated to ring in on this one. Wanted to think about it for a minute.

I don't know Peter44ru or jmiller and I don't have a dog in the fight, but I've got to check the box that this is a misunderstanding that needs to be worked out between buyer and seller.

We all appreciate a heads-up on an unscrupulous vendor, but Pete44ru has been logging in here for a long time and IMO deserves something amounting to a benefit of the doubt.

The fact that he hasn't logged in to defend himself means absolutely nothing, the only person he owes any sort of explanation to is to jmiller. Perhaps he simply has not has the opportunity to check in, for whatever reason.

In any case, and again IMO, coming into the forum and smearing a member's reputation is the wrong approach. It's just bad form.

:|
+1
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Pitchy »

Both these guys have been friends to me on this board so i won`t act like a Dem and judge before i know the facts.
People here like to run they`er mouth before they know the facts, same chit different day, call ya friend one day and turn on ya the next... sick.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Nath »

Pitchy wrote:
Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:39 pm
Both these guys have been friends to me on this board so i won`t act like a Dem and judge before i know the facts.
People here like to run they`er mouth before they know the facts, same chit different day, call ya friend one day and turn on ya the next... sick.
+1
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by rossim92 »

I don't think the price of the shotgun is the problem, just that it was stated the finish is rated at 90%. From what I can tell of the pictures shown here, it should not be rated that high. Just my two cents worth. Hopefully this can be settled like gentleman, and no hard feelings come by this.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by gundownunder »

I notice everybody saying the seller has been on this forum such a long time, but nobody is saying that the buyer has been on this forum such a long time. There isn't a huge difference between them, 10 years vs 12 years.
Ripping somebody off has repercussions, but so does publicly roasting somebody. I don't think either decision should be taken lightly
At this stage we are only seeing one side of the story, but If the buyer has approached the seller to clear up a misunderstanding, and been flipped off with "one mans trash is another mans treasure" I'd say he has a legitimate gripe.
If that cannot be settled privately, maybe putting it on here is the best option. Both sides get to state their case, and potential future buyers can be the judge.
Sixgun says he could restore the gun to 90% in a half hour. I'm not a gunsmith or a skilled firearms handyman, so I couldn't. Besides, it was advertised as a 90% gun, not as "a bit rough but could be easily restored to 90%".
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by Bill in Oregon »

Waiting to hear Pete's side of this deal. If he lets it stand as is, the case seems closed. He said "NO RUST." He also replied to his buyer, "one man's junk is another man's treasure" according to Mr. Miller. That's no honest reply to a buyer with a serious disagreement about condition. And I am not running my mouth.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by vancelw »

90% means 90% of original finish.
If it's not already 90%, it can't be made to be.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by cas »

Depends on what the definition of the word is, is. ;)

Playing devils advocate, "..in 90% original condition" just means 90% of it hasn't been altered.
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Re: Heads up on unscrupulous seller on here - Pete44ru

Post by jmiller »

Well, it doesn't look like I'm going to get any satisfaction from the seller on this issue. For those who seem to think that the gun can be made to be in 90% condition with some ease.....you simply have no idea what you're talking about. I've been shooting for over sixty years now and I've owned hundreds of guns over the years. Literally hundreds. I've had guns restored, custom built, customized, reblued, restocked, and every other option you can think of. This gun would need a complete polishing and rebluing, the stock would need some refinishing, and the safety might need repaired (it just might be gunk, the seller did't even clean it before shipping it...and it was filthy). The seller told me on the phone that it was in excellent condition. He also stated that in his ad. There simply isn't any defense on this issue. I bought the gun based on his statements to me on the phone that it was in very good condition....90+ percent. It's simply not even close. I WAS NOT looking for a "fixer-upper". I'm in my 70's and I bought this gun with the intentions of giving it to a young shooter who will be old enough to hunt in a few years. Being retired myself, I don't have enough money to waste buying guns from people who rip me off. At this point there isn't enough money left in my account to go out and buy another gun for the kid. I don't want this gun in this condition, I WOULD NOT sell it to anyone else in this condition, and I've posted that I will pay to ship it back to the seller at my expense. Here's where I'm at with that: I paid the seller $400 for the gun plus $30 shipping. I paid my FFL/LGS $32.40 to receive it for me. So far I have $462.40 into this piece of junk. I offered to pay to ship it back to the seller at my expense. MY FFL/LGS charges $70 to box, ship, and insure sending a long gun to another FFL. That would bring me to $532.40 at the point of shipping it back. If I get my $400 back that I paid for the gun, I'm $132.40 IN THE HOLE. The seller wouldn't be out a penny. NOT ONE CENT. And he still hasn't responded. Unbelievable, he'd get his gun back and not be out a penny. NOT ONE CENT.
IF I KEEP THE GUN: I'll get in line with all the other good citizens at the next buy-back and take my fifty dollar gift card in exchange for this gun. I won't sell this gun to anyone as is, and I have no use for it. I'm not paying anything to ship it to someone else, I don't sell guns in this condition. It's not worth fixing up. I wouldn't give this gun to a kid getting into the shooting/hunting sports. I value my name, my word, and my reputation. No one's ever gotten anything like this from me. I'm sure being stuck with this is the final outcome. I have no more to say about this and won't be adding any more comments on this post. I won't communicate any further with the seller on this...he's had his chance. At this point he needn't bother doing anything.

TO THE MODS ON THIS BOARD: you might want to think about how the seller used your board to dispose of this gun. You might consider his lack of response. You may consider the more than fair offer I've made on how to return it to him. You might want to consider whether or not he should be posting on here in the future. If you can lock this thread at this time, go ahead and do so. I don't think there's anymore to be said that's of any value, and I'm sure the seller would like it to go away. I just want to put it in the rear-view mirror myself. Thank you for your fairness in letting this proceed to this point.
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