357 Mag Levergun

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TraderVic
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357 Mag Levergun

#1 Post by TraderVic » Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:53 am

I have several 357 Mag revolvers and am considering a 357 Mag levergun to shoot along with the revolvers.
Been looking at the Henry offerings, always on the lookout for a "JM" Marlin 357, which are not very common around these parts.
In a recent post here, one forum member mentioned he had purchased a more recent Marlin (Remlin) that appear to finally be well made again.
One question regarding any of the Marlin options ; I've read about the "Marlin Jam" many times over the years with these rifles.
(1) What exactly is the Marlin Jam ?, and (2) what does one usually need to replace or fix to correct it ?

Best Regards, Vic

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#2 Post by Pete44ru » Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:04 am

.

Here's the skinny on the Marlin jam: http://www.ktgunsmith.com/marlinjam.htm

That said, I loved my .357 Rossi w/16" bbl.

If I wanted a scope, I would have gotten my mitts on a Marlin 1894, but since I didn't want a scoped .357, so I peeped it.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#3 Post by Nath » Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:21 am

You can't spread the Marlin jam on toast :|
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#4 Post by Bronco » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:02 am

Nath wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:21 am
You can't spread the Marlin jam on toast :|
LOL great mind working there :mrgreen:
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#5 Post by TraderVic » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:26 am

Nath wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:21 am
You can't spread the Marlin jam on toast :|
A bit of dry, but enjoyable British humor I'd say :D

I read the link regarding the Marlin Jam (thanks for that Pete44). One would certainly think Marlin would correct these flaws, but then what would the tinkerers and gunsmiths do :wink:

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#6 Post by piller » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:48 am

Does it happen with all cartridges in Marlin leverguns?
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#7 Post by earlmck » Wed Oct 02, 2019 12:20 pm

piller wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:48 am
Does it happen with all cartridges in Marlin leverguns?
Yep. Can happen with either the 336 and its rifle style cartridges or the 1894 with the pistol calibers. I've never done the "fix" on the 1894 -- I'd have to look that one up because the fix is different. I once did a write-up about fixing "Jam #1" on here. I'm guessing it is a thing of the past, of the true "JM" branded Marlins but I don't know that for sure. I've fixed a 1950 model 336A in 30/30 and a mid-80's 336 in 35 Rem. Both caused by the same thing -- the factory took a little too much metal out of the lifter.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#8 Post by Chuck 100 yd » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:53 pm

Of the several dozen + Marlins running fast at our CAS matches , I have never heard or seen the dreaded Marlin jam ,nor have I even heard of it happening. I think it’s blown way out of proportion. Not saying it never happens but I’d be more worried about being bitten by a snow snake in Florida. Just saying.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#9 Post by gundownunder » Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:07 pm

If you're going to look at a remlin, make sure you look at it before you buy it. A bloke at our local club turned up with one and with just one quick look you could see the lack of QC. The front of the forearm still had the sawtooth marks in it.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#10 Post by Grizz » Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:48 pm

Bob, that was the mountainman model . . .

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#11 Post by hfcable » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:47 pm

I have two of the rossi's .. a stainless SRC 16" and a 24 " case hardened octagon, which is a real shooter.... but my absolute favorite is a uberti 1873 deluxe rifle, beautiful and shoots everything really well....especially the 180 gr loads which I puts into right little groups at 100 yds..
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#12 Post by AJMD429 » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:19 pm

Out of 18 or so Marlins that have passed through my hands over the years, about a sixth were 'pre-safety', a half 'JM with safety', and a third 'Remlin'. The only one to EVER jam was one of the 'pre-safety' ones, and it only jammed once because I slow-cycled it at a really strange angle, and then tried to force it to close like a moron. The only one to have any real 'quality' issues was one of the 'JM with safety' ones, and it just had some poorly-finished interior parts that didn't affect safety or function but annoyed me. I've heard about some really bad ones from around four years ago to a couple years ago, but must have lucked out and never came across one.

Most any place you buy a gun you can decline the final purchase if you find it not made right, and that isn't usually subtle - just simple stuff like are the sights at 12-o'clock position, does the gun mechanically function properly, and is the fit and finish something you can live with.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#13 Post by Lastmohecken » Thu Oct 03, 2019 1:12 am

I have always heard the .357's were less likely to develop troubles, regarding the Marlin Jam then the .44mag
I know when I was much younger, I often frequented a gun dealer who would not hardly trade for a used Marlin 44 mag, because he had experienced so many jammers, but the .357's had not given him any troubles.

I bought a nice slick 70's or possible early 80's vintage Marlin 44 mag, thinking that it would be alright, but it soon developed the dreaded Marlin Jam. I have never had the problem with 30/30's, or much issue with the 45/70's or 444's but the bigger rifle rounds probably got shot less.

I currently own a 45/70 new production post JM and when I got it the action was pretty rough but wore in after a lot of cycles. Workmanship is pretty good, and it's the most accurate Marlin I have ever owned, literally capable of 1" groups with an Aimpoint MIcro red dot sight at 100yds with factory 300 gr loads. I really expected to get more like 3" maybe even 4" groups out or it, and still can't hardly believe it. If some one had told me to expect accuracy like that out of it, I would have normally laughed out loud.
So, anyway, the new Marlins are not all bad, but of course individual specimens will vary.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#14 Post by Bronco » Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:37 am

I guess it depends on the individual rifle!
I have had a JM Marlin in 44 mag. I've got a Redhawk and wanted one cartridge for two firearms in my wanderings. When I first got it I followed the procedure outlined above and in many 1000's of rounds have never had a jam problem. Keeping my fingers crossed!
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#15 Post by earlmck » Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:56 am

Being semi-senile I can't remember where I read it but on one of the forums I read a post from someone who had been a long-time Marlin employee. He said that the Marlin jam (I think he may have been addressing "Marlin jam #1" in the 336 but it probably applies generally) was the result of manufacturing inconsistencies caused because Marlin was still using ancient and rather worn-out milling machines built in the early 1900's. Use of outdated manufacturing technology is precisely what Remington addressed, though it took them an awful long time to get it right. So hopefully we have seen the last of the Marlin jams.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#16 Post by Old Savage » Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:12 pm

So Earl, would replacement with new parts solve that.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#17 Post by 2ndovc » Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:48 pm

I had a '70s vintage 94 in .357 that I picked up at a show. Every time I'd take it out, the thing would lock up on me. I'd have to take the lever out and push a round back into the magazine tube to free it back up. This was long before the internet ad didn't know what to do with it. Sold it to guy that said he could fix it. I didn't buy another Marlin for a long time. Came across a steal of a deal on a 94P and have had quite a few since then. Haven't had that problem again.

The current production rifles are pretty darned nice. Took a couple years for Remington to figure out how to make a lever action. My new .357 CST will feed anything, right down to very narrow profile SWCs. Fit and finish is excellent.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#18 Post by AJMD429 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 7:54 pm

By the way, I think a 357 Mag levergun could well be THE best single rifle to own for many people, from the "only one gun" family looking for a basic home defense, sporting, survival firearm, to the seasoned hunter who wants to stalk his game and have a compact yet capable carbine, to the casual 'sport' shooter looking for a firearm the whole family can likely shoot, from their 6-year-old grandkid to 96 year-old grandma. You can load cases forever if you stick with mild to moderate loads, but load them up to 'big-game' levels able to deal with most North American game. Of course the compatibility of a revolver in the same chambering (....or a Desert Eagle.... :twisted:) is an added plus.... 8)
Last edited by AJMD429 on Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#19 Post by mickbr » Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:52 am

I tend to agree Doc, my only centrefire rifle is 357. I was tempted to upgrade to 44 to get more punch with subsonic loads at one point, but I started loading wider meplats in the 357 and they worked fine on small game. Ticks quite a few boxes on the bugout checklist too. Depending on bullet, 357 ammo will carry almost as light as 223 in the field, about 3lbs to the 100, and it stacks tighter than 223 in ammo cans.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#20 Post by TraderVic » Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:25 am

A lot of experience with comments to reflect on here. Still pondering which rifle to pursue ; Marlin (older "JM" or REM), Henry, Winchester Miroku, etc.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#21 Post by AJMD429 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:17 am

earlmck wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:56 am
...I read it but on one of the forums I read a post from someone who had been a long-time Marlin employee. He said that the Marlin jam (I think he may have been addressing "Marlin jam #1" in the 336 but it probably applies generally) was the result of manufacturing inconsistencies caused because Marlin was still using ancient and rather worn-out milling machines built in the early 1900's. Use of outdated manufacturing technology is precisely what Remington addressed, though it took them an awful long time to get it right. So hopefully we have seen the last of the Marlin jams.
I think I read the same thing.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#22 Post by TraderVic » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:31 am

AJMD429 wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:17 am
earlmck wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:56 am
...I read it but on one of the forums I read a post from someone who had been a long-time Marlin employee. He said that the Marlin jam (I think he may have been addressing "Marlin jam #1" in the 336 but it probably applies generally) was the result of manufacturing inconsistencies caused because Marlin was still using ancient and rather worn-out milling machines built in the early 1900's. Use of outdated manufacturing technology is precisely what Remington addressed, though it took them an awful long time to get it right. So hopefully we have seen the last of the Marlin jams.
I think I read the same thing.
Interesting. I have not read this and good to know. It has taken Remington a long time to turn out a decent levergun.
I've learned from posts in various forums to inspect any new gun (rifle and/or revolver) closely and carefully before accepting it while still at the gun shop.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#23 Post by AJMD429 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:32 am

TraderVic wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:25 am
A lot of experience with comments to reflect on here. Still pondering which rifle to pursue ; Marlin (older "JM" or REM), Henry, Winchester Miroku, etc.
I recently "traded up for*" a Marlin 1894 CST, and it is awesome. Not an inexpensive firearm, but it checks all the boxes for me for a grab-and-go little carbine for woods-walking, grabbing if headed out to feed livestock or investigate a bump-in-the-dark, or just plink at some cans with a friend. I can use it as a 'first gun to shoot' for a new shooter, using 38 Specials, all the way up to deer hunting with some 180 grain wide-meplat thumpers.

I have, or have had, lots of 357 Mag leverguns:

Rossi 92 16" stainless
Marlin 1894 cst 16" stainless
Marlin 1894 cs 18" blued
Marlin 1894 css 18" stainless
Rossi 20" blued
Rossi 24" octagonal stainless

If I could only keep two, I'd keep the 24" Rossi because it is just fun to shoot, and seems 'vintage' even though it is modern matte stainless. It is superbly accurate, as well. The OTHER one I'd keep would be the shorty Marlin 16" since it is so short and handy. Before I got it I shot the Rossi 16" the most, but the sight options on the Marlin will be much better. If only 'allowed' one 357 Mag levergun, it would be the Marlin, because it is really more practical, and so far seems quite accurate as well. I also like the finish in that it is nice-looking, but durable and going to be hard to ding/damage enough to bother me. The slightly-larger lever is perfect (I think the huge ones look silly, but the regular-sized ones on other Marlins, Henrys, and Rossis all are a bit too small for comfort, especially in winter if I might have a glove on).

I'll probably swap over my 'Night Scout' sight system onto it because then it can be easily used at night if something messes with the livestock, plus those sights will work well when I slip on the Mystic Suppressor. You can actually mount the Burris Fastfire-2 and LaserMax laser on a regular 'scope base' using just the ready-made holes on the Marlin receiver, but I had a 'scout mount' I was experimenting with in this photo that shows the sights on a Marlin 1894 I converted from 44 Mag to 45 Colt.

Image

More on the 'Night Scout' project I have been playing with - viewtopic.php?f=1&t=46640#p583183

*(code for "bought, but haven't got around to selling anything else yet..." :lol: )

P.S. here's the Rossi 16", CST, CSS, an 1894 SS (44 Mag), and the 24" Rossi for comparison:
20191005_203804-1.jpg
Sights:

Marbles Bullseye (Williams FireSight front),
Skinner (Skinner front)
'Night Scout' (Burris Fastfirez2 & Lasermax combo) Williams FP (factory bead front)
Taurus Tang (with Lyman Globe front)....
20191005_203932-1.jpg
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#24 Post by piller » Sat Oct 05, 2019 1:39 pm

Grizz wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:48 pm
Bob, that was the mountainman model . . .
My Stainless Guide Gun is the Facebook version. Lots of unneccessary chatter marks inside.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#25 Post by Grizz » Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:36 pm

piller wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 1:39 pm
Grizz wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 7:48 pm
Bob, that was the mountainman model . . .
My Stainless Guide Gun is the Facebook version. Lots of unneccessary chatter marks inside.
sri, it was supposed to be a joke about a wood comment... my guide gun is 15 years or more old and it has lousy machining inside. but it's one of my straightest shooting guns so I put up with it. and i don't let him hear me call him Ugly....

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#26 Post by piller » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:28 pm

I thought you were standing in for Blaine and making a joke about the Sawtooth Mountains.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#27 Post by earlmck » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:43 pm

Old Savage wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 1:12 pm
So Earl, would replacement with new parts solve that.
I would be afraid that the old JM Marlins had got to where parts weren't interchangeable without a fair amount of hand fitting, so who knows how that would translate to interchangeability with Remington manufactured parts. I think you'd be better off fixing the original part: here's a link to my post from a few years ago which also has directions from NKJ on his alternative technique for fixing Jam #1. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=32740
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#28 Post by Old Savage » Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:35 am

I have three 79 originals that work fine: 35 Rem, 375, and 357. But then I don't try to run them fast.
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#29 Post by Grizz » Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:48 am

piller wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:28 pm
I thought you were standing in for Blaine and making a joke about the Sawtooth Mountains.
wish I could, but I often have to explain my jokes . . . B has a gift

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#30 Post by AJMD429 » Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:33 am

Grizz wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:48 am
. . . wish I could, but I often have to explain my jokes . . .
This is me and my wife (before the sex change)....
https://youtu.be/fMinUMCdc0g
.....I have to TELL her I'm about to make a joke; if I do, she will politely laugh. I've told her precisely TWO jokes in 40 years that actually triggered a genuine laugh.... :?
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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#31 Post by piller » Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:53 am

He was better in that role than as Jeff in Coupling.

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Re: 357 Mag Levergun

#32 Post by AJMD429 » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:47 pm

357 Magnum leverguns:
20191006_183948-1.jpg
Marlin CST and Rossi 92 (clone of Winchester 92)... very similar size and balance, given the lightweight titanium Mystic suppressor, and so far the accuracy seems similar.

Once you get over about 12 inches in 367 Magnum, things seem to equalize, so I don't see much difference in the 16 inch versus 24 inch barrels. The suppressor makes things very quiet with loads under 1,050 fps or so, on the order of a 22 short or very long barreled 22 long rifle as far as noise. With the 16 inch Marlin, taking off the suppressor results in an even more compact firearm for everyday use.

Here's an interesting video on the 357 Mag from a 'tactical' standpoint (advert for an M-lock forend) - https://youtu.be/8GX2CaiWaSk
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