Brain trust.

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marlinman93
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Brain trust.

#1 Post by marlinman93 » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:36 pm

So we woke up Sunday to ash falling all over the neighborhood. Then Monday even more ash! Seems some family camping in the scenic Columbia River Gorge allowed their dumb teenager to set off fireworks! First off, fireworks are illegal in Oregon, and 2nd his parents should know it's been months since we had any rain here!
Last night I took this picture of my wife's car:

Image

This morning they said the fire had moved 12 miles closer West to us. Several small towns to our East have been told to evacuate, and the winds blew the fire across the Columbia into Washington last night also! That's over a mile across the river at this point, but Wash. is also burning now. Both states have closed their highways going up the gorge until they get the fire fought back from the freeways.

I'm just amazed that people can be this stupid, and create children too!

http://www.columbian.com/news/2014/aug/ ... of-rowena/

edit-They just announced the fire is moving quicker, and is now about 9 miles East of us. More towns told to evacuate!
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Chuck 100 yd
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Re: Brain trust.

#2 Post by Chuck 100 yd » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:10 pm

This morning the smoke has the area smelling like a campfire. I am just across the Columbia river from MM. visibility is about 1/4 mile without a cloud in the sky. Hundreds of people evacuated to the Washington side of the river and now the fire jumped over to our side !!!

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Re: Brain trust.

#3 Post by 2ndovc » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:17 pm

Good luck Guys! Sure hope the situation improves for everyone.


jb 8)
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Re: Brain trust.

#4 Post by GunnyMack » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:40 pm

My uncle worked for Alpine County Road Department which also included fire fighting. If memory serves almost all the fires are started by STUPID PEOPLE!

But it's also our fault by not allowing fires to consume the dead trees, brush etc.

We know that fire is very beneficial to the land, it's a crying shame that people loose everything including their lives.
I wish you luck and pray for rain!

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Re: Brain trust.

#5 Post by BlaineG » Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:49 pm

All the rain is going where it's not needed.... :(
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Re: Brain trust.

#6 Post by gamekeeper » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:47 pm

2ndovc wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:17 pm
Good luck Guys! Sure hope the situation improves for everyone.


jb 8)
+1
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Re: Brain trust.

#7 Post by piller » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:50 pm

Good luck. Hope it doesn't head directly at you gentlemen.
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Re: Brain trust.

#8 Post by jeepnik » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:51 am

Good luck guys.

Idiots are going to continue to start fires until there are sufficiently severe penalties for doing it. I'm talking decades of working on the fire line of every fire that comes along. If the authorities had the stones to properly punish the fools, and then broadcast it to the world people would think twice.

Seriously, even though the kid "might" do a day or two in jail, and it "might" cost the parents a couple of bucks (no one who has ever been ordered to pay restitution for the cost of a fire has even come close to paying up) no lesson will be learned.
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Re: Brain trust.

#9 Post by Gobblerforge » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:23 am

I've been smelling smoke here in Ohio for two days now.
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Re: Brain trust.

#10 Post by marlinman93 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:34 am

The 15 yr. old who started the fire was setting off fireworks. Forest Service was notified as soon as he did it by witnesses, and they caught him and his friends before they got to the freeway. One witness said she asked him why he'd do that, and that he had just started a forest fire. His replay was, "So what, nothing I can do about that now."
The kids were from Vancouver, Wa. and were filming him tossing the fireworks over the edge of a draw.
It burned another 10,000 acres overnight, but the winds died down. The fire is over 40,000 acres total, and they said with the wind shift today it should force the fire back on itself, and make it easier to contain. The ash and smoke here should also subside. I took this picture of Mt Tabor about 1/2 mile from my house. Can't even see the outline of Mt tabor with all the smoke, but it's usually seen about where the top crossarm of this power pole is:

Image

Rains forecast for Thu., so might help fighting fires. But with the rain comes lightning strikes also!
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Re: Brain trust.

#11 Post by stretch » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:47 am

I once had a neighbor that burned a brush pile on a windy, RED FLAG fire warning day.

He was LIVID that someone called the fire department on him! And yes, he's
already sired children... :cry:

Best of luck to you!

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Re: Brain trust.

#12 Post by mikld » Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:41 am

Been dealing with the Chetco Bar fire for over 3 weeks now. I'm in a level 2 evacuation area. City of Brookings, much within level 2 and 3, within 2.5 miles of fire and down wind. Several of my friends have been evacuated from their homes. Many of the folks up river have been told to leave. Air rated from poor to very unhealthy. Wonder why this fire isn't getting the press the smaller fires are getting?
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Re: Brain trust.

#13 Post by Griff » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:14 am

gamekeeper wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:47 pm
2ndovc wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:17 pm
Good luck Guys! Sure hope the situation improves for everyone.
jb 8)
+1
+2.
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Re: Brain trust.

#14 Post by 2ndovc » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:31 am

mikld wrote:
Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:41 am
Been dealing with the Chetco Bar fire for over 3 weeks now. I'm in a level 2 evacuation area. City of Brookings, much within level 2 and 3, within 2.5 miles of fire and down wind. Several of my friends have been evacuated from their homes. Many of the folks up river have been told to leave. Air rated from poor to very unhealthy. Wonder why this fire isn't getting the press the smaller fires are getting?
The media seems to get more enjoyment out of the hurricane and flood coverage.

jb 8)
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Re: Brain trust.

#15 Post by Nate Kiowa Jones » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:35 am

Good luck guys. Wish I could send ya some extra Texas rain.
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Re: Brain trust.

#16 Post by marlinman93 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:08 pm

The East wind died down last night, so the fire progressed another 10,000 acres (33,000 now) but is holding. The 15 yr. old who witnesses saw set the fireworks off told a woman when she asked why he did it, "Nothing I can do now."
He jumped in a van with his buddies and tried to get away, but Forest Service and State police caught them before they hit the freeway. He is from Vancouver, Wa. and is still not charged at this point.
Rains predicted for Thursday, but lightning too, so it may help, or add issues to other areas.
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Re: Brain trust.

#17 Post by Old Ironsights » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:32 am

GunnyMack wrote:
Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:40 pm
...
But it's also our fault by not allowing fires to consume the dead trees, brush etc. ...
Don't forget essential bans on logging.

Roast spotted owl anyone?
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Re: Brain trust.

#18 Post by GunnyMack » Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:34 pm

What the bunny huggers didn't know was that logging BENEFITED the spotted owl more then old growth timber did! Then the population crashed in memory serves...!

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Re: Brain trust.

#19 Post by BlaineG » Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:47 pm

GunnyMack wrote:
Sun Sep 10, 2017 3:34 pm
What the bunny huggers didn't know was that logging BENEFITED the spotted owl more then old growth timber did! Then the population crashed in memory serves...!
The Barred Owl ran out the Spotted Owl. Lumber industry had nothing to do with it, but the greeners and bunny huggers didn't want you to know that....
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Re: Brain trust.

#20 Post by pdentrem » Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:10 pm

Maybe should of called the topic "Brain Busted"?

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Re: Brain trust.

#21 Post by AJMD429 » Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:28 pm

I agree the fire-starters should be punished, but lots of fires are started by lightning and so-on.....what I don't understand is why people build wooden houses with flammable roofs, surrounded by 100 ft pines....!

Then they act surprised they lose their homes if the forest burns. :roll:

If that is a risk they are willing to take, fine, but don't ask me to pay for it with 'relief funds', and more importantly - don't ask people to risk their lives stopping the fire from burning your home....!
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Re: Brain trust.

#22 Post by marlinman93 » Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:56 am

AJMD429 wrote:
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:28 pm
I agree the fire-starters should be punished, but lots of fires are started by lightning and so-on.....what I don't understand is why people build wooden houses with flammable roofs, surrounded by 100 ft pines....!

Then they act surprised they lose their homes if the forest burns. :roll:

If that is a risk they are willing to take, fine, but don't ask me to pay for it with 'relief funds', and more importantly - don't ask people to risk their lives stopping the fire from burning your home....!
based on that theory, don't expect me to pay for people who build in flood zones, tornado zones, earthquake zones, or hurricane zones. All build their homes knowing the chances are great of eventually losing their homes, so why should they get disaster relief?
It's really not as simple as your reply makes it sound. There's only so much land to build on, and people have only so much money to build with. Should we jam everyone into certain areas, and highly regulate the materials and building methods, so nobody can afford to build except the rich?
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Re: Brain trust.

#23 Post by Old Ironsights » Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:30 pm

marlinman93 wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:56 am
AJMD429 wrote:
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:28 pm
I agree the fire-starters should be punished, but lots of fires are started by lightning and so-on.....what I don't understand is why people build wooden houses with flammable roofs, surrounded by 100 ft pines....!

Then they act surprised they lose their homes if the forest burns. :roll:

If that is a risk they are willing to take, fine, but don't ask me to pay for it with 'relief funds', and more importantly - don't ask people to risk their lives stopping the fire from burning your home....!
based on that theory, don't expect me to pay for people who build in flood zones, tornado zones, earthquake zones, or hurricane zones. All build their homes knowing the chances are great of eventually losing their homes, so why should they get disaster relief? ...
And? What is wrong with that sentiment? Why should you, I or anyone be forced at gunpoint to pay for what was not planned for?

You voluntarily buy Insurance to cover unforeseen, or at least statistically unlikely losses.

If you live in a historical flood zone, your flood insurance will cost more... just like it costs more to insure a 16y/o male with a Camaro than a 35y/o accountant with a Corolla.

There is a story relating the actions of one Congressman David Crockett which is apropos:
...Crockett was then the lion of Washington. I was a great admirer of his character, and, having several friends who were intimate with him, I found no difficulty in making his acquaintance. I was fascinated with him, and he seemed to take a fancy to me. I was one day in the lobby of the House of Representatives when a bill was taken up appropriating money for the benefit of a widow of a distinguished naval officer. It seemed to be that everybody favored it. The Speaker was just about to put the question when Crockett arose. Everybody expected, of course, that he was going to make a speech in support of the bill. He commenced:

"Mr. Speaker -- I have as much respect for the memory of the deceased, and as much sympathy for the sufferings of the living, if suffering there be, as any man in this House; but we must not permit our respect for the dead or our sympathy for a part of the living to lead us into an act of injustice to the balance of the living. I will not go into argument to prove that Congress has no power under the Constitution to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. We have the right, as individuals, to give away as much of our own money as we please in charity; but as members of Congress we have no right so to appropriate a dollar of the public money. "Mr. Speaker, I am the poorest man on this floor. I cannot vote for this bill, but I will give one week's pay to the object, and if every member of Congress will do the same, it will amount to more than the bill asks." He took his seat. Nobody replied. The bill was put upon its passage, and instead of passing unanimously, as was generally supposed, and as no doubt it would, but for that speech, it received but a few votes and was lost. Like many others, I desired the passage of the bill, and felt outraged at its defeat. I determined that I would persuade my friend Crockett to move for a reconsideration the next day.

Previous engagements preventing me from seeing Crockett that night, I went early to his room the next morning and found him franking letters, a large pile of which lay upon his table.

I broke in upon him rather abruptly, by asking him what the devil had possessed him to make that speech and defeat that bill yesterday. Without turning his head or looking up from his work, he replied: "I will answer your question. But thereby hangs a tale, and one of considerable length, to which you will have to listen."

I listened, and this is the tale which I heard:

"Several years ago I was one evening standing on the steps of the Capitol with some other members of Congress, when our attention was attracted by a great light over in Georgetown. It was evidently a large fire. We jumped into the hack and drove over as fast as we could. When we got there, I went to work, and I never worked as hard in my life as I did there for several hours. But, in spite of all that could be done, many houses were burned and many families made houseless, and, besides, some of them had lost all but the clothes they had on. The weather was very cold, and when I saw so many women and children suffering, I felt that something ought to be done for them, and everybody else seemed to feel the same way. "The next morning a bill was introduced appropriating $20,000 for their relief. We put aside all other business and rushed it through as soon as it could be done. I said everybody felt as I did. That was not quite so; for, though they perhaps sympathized as deeply with the sufferers as I did, there were a few of the members who did not think we had the right to indulge our sympathy or excite our charity at the expense of anybody but ourselves. They opposed the bill, and upon its passage demanded the yeas and nays. The yeas and nays were recorded, and my name appeared on the journals in favor of the bill.

"The next summer, when it began to be time to think about election, I concluded I would take a scout around among the boys of my district. I had no opposition there, but, as the election was some time off, I did not know what might turn up, and I thought it was best to let the boys know that I had not forgot them, and that going to Congress had not made me too proud to go to see them. "So I put a couple of shirts and a few twists of tobacco into my saddlebags, and put out. I had been out about a week and had found things going very smoothly, when, riding one day in a part of my district in which I was more of a stranger than any other, I saw a man in a field plowing and coming toward the road. I gauged my gait so that we should meet as he came to the fence. As he came up I spoke to the man. He replied politely, but, as I thought, rather coldly, and was about turning his horse for another furrow when I said to him: 'Don't be in such a hurry my friend; I want to have a little talk with you, and get better acquainted.' He replied: "'I am very busy, and have but little time to talk, but if it does not take too long, I will listen to what you have to say.' "I began: 'Well, friend, I am one of those fortunate beings called candidates, and . . . .' "' Yes, I know you; you are Colonel Crockett. I have seen you once before, and voted for you the last time you were elected. I suppose you are out electioneering now, but you had better not waste your time or mine. I shall not vote for you again.' "This was a sockdolager .... I begged him to tell me what was the matter. "'Well, Colonel, it is hardly worthwhile to waste time or words upon it. I do not see how it can be mended, but you gave a vote last winter which shows that either you have not capacity to understand the Constitution, or that you are wanting the honesty and firmness to be guided by it. In either case you are not the man to represent me. But I beg your pardon for expressing it that way. I did not intend to avail myself of the privilege of the constituent to speak plainly to a candidate for the purpose of insulting or wounding you. I intend by it only to say that your understanding of the Constitution is very different from mine; and I will say to you what, but for my rudeness, I should not have said, that I believe you to be honest. ... But an understanding of the Constitution different from mine I cannot overlook, because the Constitution, to be worth anything, must be held sacred, and rigidly observed in all its provisions. The man who wields power and misinterprets it is the more dangerous the more honest he is.' "'I admit the truth of all you say, but there must be some mistake about it, for I do not remember that I gave any vote last winter upon any constitutional question.' "'No, Colonel, there's no mistake. Though I live here in the backwoods and seldom go from home, I take the papers from Washington and read very carefully all the proceedings of Congress. My papers say that last winter you voted for a bill to appropriate $20,000 to some sufferers by a fire in Georgetown. Is that true?' "'Certainly it is, and I thought that was the last vote which anybody in the world would have found fault with.' "'Well, Colonel, where do you find in the Constitution any authority to give away the public money in charity?'

"Here was another sockdolager; for, when I began to think about it, I could not remember a thing in the Constitution that authorized it. I found I must take another tack, so I said: "'Well, my friend; I may as well own up. You have got me there. But certainly nobody will complain that a great and rich country like ours should give the insignificant sum of $20,000 to relieve women and children, particularly with a full and overflowing Treasury; and, I am sure, if you had been there, you would have done just as I did.' "'It is not the amount, Colonel, that I complain of; it is the principle. In the first place, the government ought to have in the Treasury no more than enough for its legitimate purposes. But that has nothing to do with the question. The power of collecting and disbursing money at pleasure is the most dangerous power that can be intrusted to man, particularly under our system of collecting revenue by a tariff, which reaches every man in the country, no matter how poor he may be, and the poorer he is the more he pays in proportion to his means. What is worse, it presses upon him without his knowledge where the weight centers, for there is not a man in the United States who can ever guess how much he pays to the government. So you see, that while you are contributing to relieve one, you are drawing it from thousands who are even worse off than he. "'If you had the right to give anything, the amount was simply a matter of discretion with you, and you had as much right to give $20,000,000 as $20,000. If you have the right to give to one, you have the right to give to all; and as the Constitution neither defines charity nor stipulates the amount, you are at liberty to give to any and everything which you believe, or profess to believe, is a charity, and to any amount you may think proper. You will very easily perceive what a wide door this would open for fraud and corruption and favoritism, on the one hand, and for robbing the people on the other. "'No, Colonel, Congress has no right to give charity. Individual members may give as much of their own money as they please, but they have no right to touch a dollar of the public money for that purpose. There are about two hundred and forty members of Congress. If they had shown their sympathy for the sufferers by contributing each one week's pay, it would have made over $13,000. There are plenty of wealthy men in Washington, who could have given $20,000 without depriving themselves of even a luxury of life. The congressmen chose to keep their own money, which, if reports be true, some of them spend not very creditably; and the people about Washington, no doubt, applauded you for relieving them from the necessity of giving what was not yours to give. The people have delegated to Congress, by the Constitution, the power to do certain things. To do these, it is authorized to collect and pay moneys, and for nothing else. Everything beyond this is usurpation, and a violation of the Constitution.'

"I have given you," continued Crockett, "an imperfect account of what he said. Long before he was through, I was convinced that I had done wrong. He wound up by saying: "'So you see, Colonel, you have violated the Constitution in what I consider a vital point. It is precedent fraught with danger to the country, for when Congress once begins to stretch its power beyond the limits of the Constitution, there is no limit to it, and no security for the people. I have no doubt you acted honestly, but that does not make it any better, except as far as you are personally concerned, and you see that I cannot vote for you.' "I tell you I felt streaked. I saw if I should have opposition, and this man should go to talking, he would set others to talking, and in this district I was a gone fawn-skin. I could not answer him, and the fact is, I was so fully convinced that he was right, I did not want to. But I must satisfy him, and I said to him: "'Well, my friend, you hit the nail upon the head when you said I had not sense enough to understand the Constitution. I intended to be guided by it, and thought I had studied it fully. I have heard many speeches in Congress, but what you have said here at your plow has got more hard, sound sense in it than all the fine speeches I have ever heard. If I had ever taken the view of it that you have, I would have put my head into the fire before I would have given that vote; and if you will forgive me and vote for me again, if I ever vote for another unconstitutional law I wish I may be shot.'

"The farmer laughingly replied: 'Yes, Colonel, you have sworn to that once before, but I will trust you again upon one condition. You say that you are convinced that your vote was wrong. Your acknowledgment of it will do more good than defeating you for it. If, as you go around the district, you will tell people about this vote, and that you are satisfied it was wrong, I will not only vote for you, but will do what I can to keep down opposition, and, perhaps, I may exert some little influence in that way.' "'If I don't,' said I, 'I wish I may be shot; and to convince you that I am in earnest in what I say I will come back this way in a week or ten days, and if you will get a gathering of the people, I will make a speech to them. Get up a barbecue, and I will pay for it.' "'No, Colonel, we are not rich people in this section, but we have plenty of provisions to contribute for a barbecue, and some to spare for those who have none. The push of crops will be over in a few days, and we can then afford a day for a barbecue. This is Thursday; I will see to getting it up on Saturday seek. Come to my house on Friday, and we will go together, and I promise you a very respectable crowd to see and hear you.' "'Well, I will be here. But one thing more before I say good-bye. I must know your name.' "'My name is Bunce.' "'Not Horatio Bunce?' "'Yes.' "'Well, Mr. Bunce, I never saw you before, though you say you have seen me, but I know you very well. I am glad I have met you, and very proud that I may hope to have you for my friend. You must let me shake your hand before I go.' "We shook hands and parted that day in gentlemanly friendship and amity.

"It was one of the luckiest hits of my life that I met that man. He mingled but little with the public, but was widely known for his remarkable intelligence, incorruptible integrity, and, for a heart brimful and running over with kindness and benevolence, which showed themselves not only in words but in acts. He was the oracle of the whole country around him, and his fame extended far beyond the circle of his immediate acquaintance. Though I had never met him before, I had heard much of him, and but for this meeting it is very likely I should have had opposition, and had been beaten. One thing is very certain, no man could now stand up in that district under such a vote. "At the appointed time I was at his house, having told our conversation to every crowd I had met, and to every man I stayed all night with. In fact I found that it gave the people an interest and a confidence in me stronger than I had ever seen manifest before. "Though I was considerably fatigued when I reached the home of Mr. Bunce, and under ordinary circumstances should have gone early to bed, I kept him up until midnight, talking about the principles and affairs of government, and got more real, true knowledge of them than I had got all my life before. "I have told you Mr. Bunce converted me politically. He came nearer converting me religiously than I had ever been before. He did not make a very good Christian of me, as you know; but he has wrought upon my feelings a reverence for its purifying and elevating power such as I had never felt before. "I have known and seen much of him since, for I respect him -- no, that is not the word -- I reverence and love him more than any living man, and I go to see him two or three times every year; and I will you sir, if every one who professes to be a Christian lived and acted and enjoyed it as he does, the religion of Christ would take the world by storm.

"But to return to my story. The next morning we went to the barbecue, and, to my surprise, found about a thousand me there. I met a good many whom I had not known before, and they and my friend introduced me around until I had got pretty well acquainted -- at least, they all knew me. "In due time notice was given that I would speak to them. They gathered up around a stand that had been erected. I opened my speech by saying: "'Fellow-citizens -- I present myself before you today feeling like a new man. My eyes have lately been opened to truths which ignorance or prejudice, or both, had heretofore hidden from my view. I feel that I can today offer you the ability to render you more valuable service than I have ever been able to render before. I am here today more for the purpose of acknowledging my error than to seek your votes. That I should make this acknowledgment is due to myself as well as to you. Whether you will vote for me is a matter for your consideration only.' "I went on to tell them about the fire and my vote for the appropriation as I have told it to you, and then told them why I was satisfied it was wrong. I closed by saying: "'And now, fellow-citizens, it remains only for me to tell you that most of the speech you have listened to with so much interest was simply a repetition of the arguments by which your neighbor, Mr. Bunce, convinced me of my error. "'It is the best speech I ever made in my life, but my friend Horatio Bunce is entitled to the credit of it. And now I hope he is satisfied with his convert and that he will get up here and tell you so.' "He came upon the stand and said: "'Fellow-citizens -- It affords me great pleasure to comply with the request of Colonel Crockett. I have always considered him a thoroughly honest man, and I am satisfied that he will faithfully perform all that he has promised you today.' "He went down, and there went up from the crowd such a shout for Davy Crockett as his name never called forth before. "I am not much given to tears, but I was taken with a choking then and felt some big drops rolling down my cheeks. And I tell you now that the remembrance of those few words spoken by such a man, and the honest, hearty shout they produced, is worth more to me than all the honors I have received and all the reputation I have ever made, or ever shall make, as a member of Congress.

"Now, sir,' concluded Crockett, "you know why I made that speech yesterday. I have had several thousand copies of it printed, and was directing them to my constituents when you came in. "There is one thing now to which I will call your attention. You remember that I proposed to give a weeks pay. There are in that House many very wealthy men -- men who think nothing of spending a week's pay, or a dozen of them, for a dinner or a wine party when they have something to accomplish by it. Some of those same men made beautiful speeches upon the debt of gratitude which the country owed the deceased -- a debt which could not be paid by money -- and the insignificance and worthlessness of money, particularly so insignificant a sum as $10,000, when weighed against the honor of the nation. "Yet not one of those Congressmen responded to my proposition. Money with them is nothing but trash when it is to come out of the people. But it is the one great thing for which most of them are striving, and many of them sacrifice honor, integrity, and justice to obtain it." http://hushmoney.org/Davy_Crockett_Farmer_Bunce.htm
I give MY money willingly AS A GIFT to help those in need. I do NOT believe it is appropriate, ethical or even LEGAL for the .gov to take it from me, by force, through taxes, to "help those in need" (after siphoning off a % here and a % there to those NOT in need).

My church, a relatively "small" denomination in the scheme of things, put it this way: 100 people in each of our 6000 congregations giving ONLY $10 a Sunday gives SIX MILLION DOLLARS A WEEK to the areas of need. No Government needed or wanted.

If I want to build a house in a forest, it will be fireproof. If I want a house near the Sea, it will be Storm Proof. (either by design or mass, a properly situated home will survive - see Hemmingway's place...) If I build a house in Chicago, it will be Bullet Proof.

A Manufactured Double-Wide in those places is just dumb - even if insured to 3x value.

Disaster Relief is NOT the job of the Government. Show me where "Disaster Releif" is an enumerated power.

Disaster Relief is CHARITY to be given by the godly from a LOVING SPIRIT, not by Government Mandate.

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Gobblerforge
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Re: Brain trust.

#24 Post by Gobblerforge » Tue Sep 12, 2017 5:48 am

Yep.
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marlinman93
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Re: Brain trust.

#25 Post by marlinman93 » Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:19 pm

Old Ironsights wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:30 pm


My church, a relatively "small" denomination in the scheme of things, put it this way: 100 people in each of our 6000 congregations giving ONLY $10 a Sunday gives SIX MILLION DOLLARS A WEEK to the areas of need. No Government needed or wanted.

If I want to build a house in a forest, it will be fireproof. If I want a house near the Sea, it will be Storm Proof. (either by design or mass, a properly situated home will survive - see Hemmingway's place...) If I build a house in Chicago, it will be Bullet Proof.

A Manufactured Double-Wide in those places is just dumb - even if insured to 3x value.

Disaster Relief is NOT the job of the Government. Show me where "Disaster Releif" is an enumerated power.

Disaster Relief is CHARITY to be given by the godly from a LOVING SPIRIT, not by Government Mandate.

https://lwr.org/?gclid=CjwKEAjw6NjNBRDK ... oCVePw_wcB
So what you're saying is we need to pick and choose who gets help. We need to only help those we all agree to help, and not just help everyone in need? Guess if we don't know the people in need, then we shouldn't help any of them either?
I feel comfortable helping my church, and those I know, but I can't look at every disaster and go there to determine who needs my hhelp, or deserves it. That's why I accept and understand that FEMA was set up to help in these cases.
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