Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Welcome to the Leverguns.Com Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here ... politely.

Moderators: Hobie, AmBraCol

Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.

Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Post Reply
User avatar
Dirty Bob
Levergunner
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:26 am
Location: The Great State of Texas!

Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Dirty Bob »

Hi, all!

I recently acquired an R92, .45LC, in the "trapper" length. I can't believe how light and short this carbine is! It's super-quick, and I plan to keep it as a home defense/self-defense long gun. I may also take it along as a vehicle gun on trips.

If I'm going to practice SD work with a long gun, I also have to practice transitions from carbine to handgun. I need a sling. I have an idea that involves modding the stock a bit. I don't plan to sell this little gun, and I know they're not collectible, so I'm OK with minor mods. I just want to make sure I'm not crazy!

I want to use a single, two-point sling, and I want the carbine to lay flat on my back when I "throw" it there. I'm thinking that the side of the buttstock is where I want to sling attached, but I don't want a sling swivel sticking out there. Here's what I propose:

For the front swivel I think the barrel band is the strongest point, so I plan to attach the swivel to the bottom of the band. I'll either drill/tap or drill and epoxy a nut on the inside of the band. I just don't know how thick it is until I take it off.

I'm planning to use a square metal loop on the other end of the sling. It needs to be just big enough for the other end of the sling (with swivel) to pass through. I plan to make it myself and rivet and solder the ends together. To loop the sling, I propose cutting a small rectangular hole through the stock near the buttplate -- maybe 1.5" from the butt. I'll pass the metal loop through it, go around the buttplate, and pass the other end of the sling through the metal loop. Kinda' like an M1 Carbine sling, but simpler, and with no big or pointy pieces of hardware to hit my back when I toss the trapper there.

Any suggestions? You guys know more about carrying and shooting leverguns than I'll ever be able to learn. I hope my idea doesn't sound too crazy.

Thanks,
Dirty Bob
superchicken
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:32 pm

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by superchicken »

I thought 7.62 posted something about doing this on this board, but I couldn't find it. Try this:

http://www.shootersforum.com/model-92s- ... 2-a-2.html

It's a slick idea, and I've been meaning to try it.
superchicken
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:32 pm

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by superchicken »

User avatar
vancelw
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 3699
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:56 pm
Location: 90% NE Texas and 10% SE Montana

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by vancelw »

superchicken wrote:Alternate ideas:

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... i+92+sling
I don't think many of those will work for what he wants, as it appears they would shift if you were flinging the carbine to your back and snatching it back to the front under duress. A tight laced-leather cuff might work, but the looser nylon straps probably wouldn't.

He might also be able to mount an Uncle Mikes style front swivel (the kind that clamp on the mag tube) at a 90 degree angle, but there's probably not enough room between the barrel and mag tube.
"Make yourself an honest man, and then you may be sure that there is one less scoundrel in the world." - Thomas Carlyle
DPris
Levergunner 3.0
Posts: 983
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:56 am

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by DPris »

For typical HD use, I doubt you'd be doing much transitioning. :)

If you find yourself carrying two guns around the house, you start out with the carbine & empty it, then switch to the handgun, you might consider just dropping the carbine. :)
Denis
92&94
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1266
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:59 pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by 92&94 »

Sounds a bit like some of the WWI and WWII military sling mounts:
Swiss_K31_Sling_Rear3.jpg
You could also use a quick detach socket and swivel, though that would not be flush on the side.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
User avatar
vancelw
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 3699
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 1:56 pm
Location: 90% NE Texas and 10% SE Montana

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by vancelw »

DPris wrote:For typical HD use, I doubt you'd be doing much transitioning. :)

If you find yourself carrying two guns around the house, you start out with the carbine & empty it, then switch to the handgun, you might consider just dropping the carbine. :)
Denis
Maybe so, but the OP asked for technical advice, not tactical advice. This thread will probably devolve into "he's doing everything wrong". Smh.

Good luck with your project Dirty Bob, and post pictures when you figure it out.
"Make yourself an honest man, and then you may be sure that there is one less scoundrel in the world." - Thomas Carlyle
User avatar
AJMD429
Posting leader...
Posts: 27667
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:03 am
Location: Hoosierland
Contact:

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by AJMD429 »

Why not just remove the buttplate, file about 1/8" deep in the buttstock, the width of the sling, then replace the metal buttplate. The sling can easily slip 'under' the buttplate then, and wrap around it, secured with one of those screw-rivet things they commonly use for slings. The thickness of a sling under the buttplate won't be uncomfortable for shooting, and if anything, might make the butt slip less on some surfaces.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.


Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
User avatar
Dirty Bob
Levergunner
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:26 am
Location: The Great State of Texas!

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Dirty Bob »

DPris wrote:For typical HD use, I doubt you'd be doing much transitioning. :)

If you find yourself carrying two guns around the house, you start out with the carbine & empty it, then switch to the handgun, you might consider just dropping the carbine. :)
Denis
Agreed! I would likely be using a long gun OR a handgun for home defense. I would prefer a long gun without a sling: less chance of catching on stuff. Besides, the sleek profile is one of the bonuses with leverguns.

OTOH, I like to have the ability to sling any given long gun. I won't need it for HD, but I will use it at the range. If I'm there alone, I don't like to leave a gun at the firing line when I go down to check/post targets. It's either locked in my trunk, or I make sure it's reloaded with an empty chamber and sling it. Platt and Matix -- the two bank robbers killed in the 11 April 1986 Miami Gunfight (http://www.thegunzone.com/11april86.html) with the FBI -- got their guns by robbing and killing recreational shooters.

The chance I'll ever need to do a transition is low, but I like practicing it as a basic skill.

-------------------------------

I really like the ideas! I knew you were a smart group of people! I'm weighing my options, but I really like a side-mounted sling. Thank you very much! Any more comments or ideas would be greatly appreciated!

In gratitude,
Dirty Bob
User avatar
Malamute
Member Emeritus
Posts: 3647
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:56 am
Location: Rocky Mts

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Malamute »

The first link to shootersforum with the side mount sling mounts is nice. Its very similar to the Belgian Congo Cavalry model 94 Winchesters, and should be very study with the front mount tied into and under the band.

You could get a rear mount from the old Packmayr flush mount studs with the hammerhead type sling loop.

The barrel bands on Winchester 94's only gives about 2 threads or less once a small flat is filed onto the band for the stud to set squarely on. I used to mount studs in them by drilling and tapping, but went to inletting the knurled nuts intended for inside bolt action fore ends into the wood under the band. Makes a very strong mount, and it can be removed and indexed so the stud torques up tightly in whatver orientation you want it.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-

Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
DPris
Levergunner 3.0
Posts: 983
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:56 am

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by DPris »

Vance,
It wasn't "tactical" advice, it was gently saying that if the ONLY purpose in going to all that trouble with a sling was transitions for home defense, it probably isn't worth it.

If a sling is a practical need or use across the board, by all means have at it.
Denis
superchicken
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:32 pm

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by superchicken »

Malamute wrote:The first link to shootersforum with the side mount sling mounts is nice. Its very similar to the Belgian Congo Cavalry model 94 Winchesters, and should be very study with the front mount tied into and under the band.

You could get a rear mount from the old Packmayr flush mount studs with the hammerhead type sling loop.
I like the Pachmayr flush mounts, but I don't think you could get it to hold on a levergun forearm, especially with the side mount. With a little ingenuity and elbow grease, you could create a front mount like the one on the Shooters Forum post that replaces the stud with a slotted hole that would work with a Pachmayr flush mount swivel. I don't have a milling machine, but I've done more complex things with a hacksaw, drill, press and files. Just a thought.

I really like side mounted slings on leverguns, but I like them to come off. I won't comment on the tactical side of things. I think the sling idea has merit on it's own, and doing it without having studs sticking off it to get caught on things seems to be a good idea. All that said, the leather cuff on 7.62's 454 Casull seems like it would probably work well without too much gunsmithing effort.

Image
User avatar
Malamute
Member Emeritus
Posts: 3647
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:56 am
Location: Rocky Mts

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Malamute »

I agree, I dont think theres enough meat in a fore end to support any sling attachment alone. That was why the suggestion to use the flush mount on the rear, and the "under the band" like the link showed for the front, or some way of attaching it to the band. The mag tube mounts may work if turned sideways. Some use split bands, some use complete bands. The complete band type may work.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-

Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
User avatar
fordwannabe
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 3113
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2009 8:52 am
Location: Womelsdorf PA

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by fordwannabe »

Ok I realize this is not what the OP wanted but does it have a saddle ring? You know a tacticle one point sling for one of those AR thingies hooks right into a saddle ring. ..kinda like that little ring was designed for it. Who knew?
a Pennsylvanian who has been accused of clinging to my religion and my guns......Good assessment skills.
User avatar
7.62 Precision
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1836
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:34 am
Location: Alaska
Contact:

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by 7.62 Precision »

1. Sling mounting: Your best points to mount the sling for your purposes are on the side of the rifle, front and back, or on the side of the rifle at the rear of the receiver (saddle ring). You can do it nicely like in the photo posted above, or you can do it with Mauser sling swivels like the Belgian Congo Carbine, or with a bar and inlet like the K31, or with a slot in the stock like an M1 Carbine. Whatever you like. They will all work.
Image

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... 28#p685467

2. Tactics and use: You may never need to do a transition in a home defense situation. That does not mean that you should not be prepared to. Crime changes all the time, and one of the current trends is toward home invasions with violence and a number of invaders. It is easier to find valuables if you can intimidate the homeowner into giving their locations, and violent physical harm, torture, and rape are often used. We can't count on facing only one assailant.
Don't mess with putting the rifle to your back in a transition - it should just be dropped down and to your off-side. You can do this with either a two point or single-point sling no problem. The side-sling setup you are looking at is fine for this, but keep it on the side front and back - don't put it on the bottom up front.
Carrying the rifle on your back with a side sling, muzzle down, and the off-hand on the barrel or forend of the rifle (African style) is a great way to carry. It is comfortable, out of the way, and simply bringing the off-hand forward with a twist aligns the rifle to the shoulder ready for action. The long comes off the body, though. Carrying the rifle on a single-pont sling by the saddle ring in front of the body also keeps the rifle ready for instant action.
In any case, keep the rifle in front of the body when transitioning to a pistol.
Last edited by 7.62 Precision on Mon May 18, 2015 3:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
FWiedner
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 8767
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 9:50 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by FWiedner »

I have two Trapper type Model 94s.

They've both got hardware (studs) installed but I've yet to use a sling in the field on either of them.

I almost never carry at sling arms even when I need both of my hands. I'll set it down or tie it to something before I'll sling it for any period of time, and I rarely use one for marksmanship purposes, unless it's competition. I carry one hand for travel and cradle or port arms while hunting.

I usually carry a sling in my day-pack but, for the most part, I find them without frequent utility.

I install the hardware, but I almost never use a sling.

:|
Government office attracts the power-mad, yet it's people who just want to be left alone to live life on their own terms who are considered dangerous.

History teaches that it's a small window in which people can fight back before it is too dangerous to fight back.
MrMurphy
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1947
Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 12:32 pm

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by MrMurphy »

7.62 beat me to it, as I was at work.


I normally sling carbines to my front (along with shotguns), head and left arm through the loop muzzle down. This keeps it handy and it drops in place for pistol transitions.

For a pure house gun, not absolutely necessary, especially if you don't train with it.

I'm currently levergun-less, but when I had a Marlin 1894 in .44, I slung it the same way with side swivels as 7.62 shows to keep things simple, or the barrel down offside "African" carry.

With the exception of the occasional M16 and a Mauser or two which won't allow carrying it other ways, I've almost never carried rifles muzzle up-strong side.

The method the OP was talking about sounds like it would work.
User avatar
OldWin
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4798
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2009 2:38 pm
Location: Maine

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by OldWin »

A clip in single point on the saddle ring works well as its quickly removed when not needed. I've used this method hunting for getting in and out of a stand. I can keep the sling rolled up and in my pocket otherwise.

The side sling works well also because the sling can be tightened and not be in the way of the functioning of the rifle.

If the carbine in question is used for more than just home defense............options are good. :D
Listen.......you can hear George Orwell laughing.
User avatar
Dirty Bob
Levergunner
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:26 am
Location: The Great State of Texas!

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Dirty Bob »

AN UPDATE:

I've taken some steps with the Rossi R92 Trapper project, and I'm delighted!

I received a stainless mag spring and follower from Steve's Gunz and installed them. It's reassuring to have those parts in place.

The huge change came with the bolt-mounted peep sight, also from Steve. Wow, what a difference!

My sight suffered from the "looseness" I've heard about, so I followed the instructions in Steve's FAQ and made a smaller notch in the side of the bushing, rotating it so the pin went through my notch rather than the larger, original one. I took my time with this, doing a little work with the needle file, then trying it, then filing a bit more, until the pin went in. The sight is now rock-solid.

I was at the range trying it out for the first time yesterday. I was there with a police officer (who is a gun enthusiast and a heckuva good shot) and his wife, a retired Army officer, and a professional firearms trainer and his (very cool) father. Everyone who tried the '92 commented positively on the sights.

I found that at 15-25 yards, it was easy to keep all shots in a small group in the center of a paper plate, shooting offhand in fairly rapid fire. When we backed off to about 80 yards to shoot at a gong, I was hitting it consistently, using a center hold. The bolt-mounted peep is a perfect upgrade for my '92.

I was using factory cowboy ammo (Magtech and Winchester), and my own Colt SAA-compatible handloads, with a Keith 255-grain SWC over a charge of Blue Dot (Lee manual, 2nd ed), in Starline brass. Recoil was light, though you could readily tell the difference when shooting the handloads. I've chosen to go with cowboy loads for home defense. Out of the 16-inch barrel, they are nothing to sneeze at.

Even the jaded bunch of shooters all wanted to shoot the '92. The police officer's spouse is getting into shooting, and she took to the '92 with cowboy loads without any trouble. I think the proliferation of AR-type rifles has made peep sights familiar to many shooters.

I really liked the '92 with a buckhorn sight, but I'm much more effective with the peep sight. My eyes aren't what they used to be, but a peep close to my eye was a big help.

Regarding slings:
I've been looking at a barrel band for the front sling attachment. I'm sure it's a much stronger anchor point than the relatively thin mag tube. I mic'd the barrel and saw that it will probably work with the band for Remington 7600 and similar rifles. For the rear, I'm trying to decide on a flush-mount sling mount, but I'm leaning toward the Pachmayr.

Love the '92! It just keeps getting better.

I'll keep you posted!

Dirty Bob

BTW: When browsing Wikipedia, I found a pic of an 1860 Henry rifle with sling mounts on the left side: Henry rifle photo
Last edited by Dirty Bob on Sat Jul 04, 2015 8:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
superchicken
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:32 pm

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by superchicken »

Sounds like things are going swimmingly with your Rossi. I'm glad it's working out.
User avatar
Dirty Bob
Levergunner
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:26 am
Location: The Great State of Texas!

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Dirty Bob »

Another Update - Parts Ordered:

For the front anchor point:
Uncle Mike's Remington 760 and 7600 (1969 and Newer) Swivels (Blued, 1-Inch Loop)

For the buttstock:
GrovTec GTSW295 Heavy Duty Push Button Swivel Set

Both were ordered from Amazon. I'm supposed to receive them next week. I didn't find a sling I liked when shopping, so I'll start with a basic nylon web two-point sling. At least it will serve my purpose of keeping the trapper handy when going down to the targets.

By the way, in order to have free shipping, I added a movie that some of you will probably like: Exit Humanity. It's a zombie film that takes place in the closing days of the Civil War and in its aftermath. I definitely would want an 1860 Henry!

In the trailer -- though it's hard to be certain -- it looks like one of the characters may have managed to find a Winchester 1892 or 1894. I'm used to that kind of anachronism, and I can forgive one or two goofs in an otherwise good movie.

It bugs me, but it's a much lesser sin than the many gun errors in Abraham Lincoln vs. Zombies, which had one character repeatedly firing a flintlock rifle without reloading. He was definitely better with a flintlock than I am, because he never even cocked the hammer to fire it.

More later,
Dirty Bob
User avatar
jeepnik
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 5952
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:39 pm
Location: On the Beach

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by jeepnik »

7.62 nailed it. But I want to address the transitioning thing.

About the only reason to transition is if the long gun malfunctioned or ran empty and you didn't have time to reload. In which cases, since it's home defense/self defense, just open your hands and let it drop. Then go to handgun while it's falling.

In a situation like this, who cares if the darned thing gets a ding or scratch. I've seen guys with autos stick magazines back in a pocket or pouch during reloading so they didn't hit the ground and get dinged up. Guess what they will do when it counts.
Jeepnik AKA "Old Eyes"
"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
"Freedom is never more that a generation from extinction" Ronald Reagan
"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
Pete44ru
Posting leader...
Posts: 11242
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 7:26 am

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Pete44ru »

.

Former board member Junior Doughty came up with a single point sling for rifles.

Image

Image



My .45 Rossi M-92 was issued with a saddle ring, but if your rifle doesn't have one, it's easy enough to add.


.
User avatar
7.62 Precision
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1836
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:34 am
Location: Alaska
Contact:

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by 7.62 Precision »

Dirty Bob wrote:Another Update - Parts Ordered:

For the front anchor point:
Uncle Mike's Remington 760 and 7600 (1969 and Newer) Swivels (Blued, 1-Inch Loop)

For the buttstock:
GrovTec GTSW295 Heavy Duty Push Button Swivel Set
The QD swivel for the rear, you might want to install with just a bit of epoxy. It might have a hole in the bottom of the socket for a screw, but epoxy is probably the way to go in the wood.

On the front band, you might have to thin it a bit to fit between the barrel and the mag tube. While you have it apart, you may find it makes sense to thin the forend wood a bit to prevent it from spreading the barrel and mag tube as is the case on many Rossis from the factory.
User avatar
Dirty Bob
Levergunner
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:26 am
Location: The Great State of Texas!

Re: Rossi 92 "Trapper" Sling Idea: Am I Nuts?

Post by Dirty Bob »

jeepnik wrote:7.62 nailed it. But I want to address the transitioning thing.

About the only reason to transition is if the long gun malfunctioned or ran empty and you didn't have time to reload. In which cases, since it's home defense/self defense, just open your hands and let it drop. Then go to handgun while it's falling.

In a situation like this, who cares if the darned thing gets a ding or scratch. I've seen guys with autos stick magazines back in a pocket or pouch during reloading so they didn't hit the ground and get dinged up. Guess what they will do when it counts.
You guys have convinced me. I won't even keep the sling attached to the trapper when at home. It's really more of a range thing, so I don't leave a valuable/dangerous gun back at the line while down changing targets. I'd much rather have it on a sling. Even w/o the sling, I carry it with me, but a sling is a lot more convenient.
7.62 Precision wrote:The QD swivel for the rear, you might want to install with just a bit of epoxy. It might have a hole in the bottom of the socket for a screw, but epoxy is probably the way to go in the wood.

On the front band, you might have to thin it a bit to fit between the barrel and the mag tube. While you have it apart, you may find it makes sense to thin the forend wood a bit to prevent it from spreading the barrel and mag tube as is the case on many Rossis from the factory.
That's very good advice, thank you! I was thinking of wiping the "threads" of the rear sling mount with a little epoxy, but I wasn't sure. I think you're right, and I'll try it that way.

I had been planning on filing a clearance in the band, so it doesn't press on the mag tube, mainly because I've seen the clearance "scallops" on other barrel or mag bands. The forend idea is new to me. When I think about it, though, it makes perfect sense and is a very good idea. I'll take a look and see if perhaps there's pressure in there that needs to be relieved.

If these parts work as advertised, I should have a fairly trouble-free install of sling mounts, or at least I hope that's how it goes!

Waiting for parts,
Dirty Bob

Thank you again for such good advice.
Post Reply