Old rifle - 5744

[Old Savage]

Say - didn't someone here experience something similar?

http://www.quigleymatch.com/accident-update.html

[vancelw]

I think you are remembering that Don McDowell posted some information about this right after it happened as Don was at the Quigley that year.

[Old Savage]

Vance, there was another one involving an old 1886. No this catastrophic. The shooter was not injured.

[harry]

Vance, there was another one involving an old 1886. No this catastrophic. The shooter was not injured.

Thats the one from 2012 that was reported on here last summer

[Don McDowell]

There's just no reason to shoot any smokeless powder in a rifle that was built during the blackpowder era.. Matter of fact even with blackpowder I'm not so sure those ol buggers need be run very hard..

[vancelw]

Vance, there was another one involving an old 1886. No this catastrophic. The shooter was not injured.

I either missed that one or my part-timers is acting up.

Seems like that old Ballard was getting a pretty good workout with three shooters using it for the same match

[FatJackDurham]

Were her fingers blown off and reattached, or just badly shredded?

it certainly is a cautionary tale.

[Chuck 100 yd]

Those old Ballard rifles were not very strong to begin with ,with the early ones being made on cast receivers of unknown quality. I don`t think I would even want to push a newly made one very hard.

[Sixgun]

That was me and an old 1886 in 45-90. Cost me $4,000 to take that shot. (well, I did save the innards)

That load was too heavy for the lady and her original Ballard. Ballards are iron and for the most part, are not even safe with black as they are all well over a hundred years old.

My 1886 was made in '03 (destroyed in '03 ) but was not nickel steel.

In my 1886's in 40-65 I use 24 grains of 5744 BUT with a 270 grain bullet. Her load was a grain less but with a bullet 23% heavier. Even in my 1881 Marlin in 40-60 caliber (same as a 40-65) I drop the load to 22 grains and a 270 grain bullet.

Don't know the reason for mine blowing up. I was told it was metal fatigue. After all I did have 1800 rds. out of it with many of them fired in my youth when the brain was, well, uneducated.

My arm is still scarred up a bit, but the scars fit right in from old car, snowmobile, motorcycle wrecks and other things like chainsaws, knives, hatchets, whatever.---------------------------6

[FatJackDurham]

sixgun, Looks like yours ruptured right in front of the receiver. DId the bullet get jammed in the barrel?

[Old Savage]

Six - scars you say - pics? but .... can you magnetize a golf club.

[Old Savage]

Looks like the bullet may have stalled in the barrel then the powder charge went off fully there. Similar to this one

[FatJackDurham]

Brrrrrrr. I had some delayed fire issues with my marlin last year. I am glad that didnt happen to me.

[AJMD429]

There's just no reason to shoot any smokeless powder in a rifle that was built during the blackpowder era.. Matter of fact even with blackpowder I'm not so sure those ol buggers need be run very hard..

I was under the impression that 5744 and SR 4759 actually had slightly LESS of a pressure-spike than blackpowder, and were therefore potentially gentler on the older guns. Of course, I suppose a fatigued one will blow regardless of what powder is used.

[FatJackDurham]

I saw a pressure graph for 4759 that implied that.

[vancelw]

There's just no reason to shoot any smokeless powder in a rifle that was built during the blackpowder era.. Matter of fact even with blackpowder I'm not so sure those ol buggers need be run very hard..

I was under the impression that 5744 and SR 4759 actually had slightly LESS of a pressure-spike than blackpowder, and were therefore potentially gentler on the older guns. Of course, I suppose a fatigued one will blow regardless of what powder is used.

I just know 23 gr of 5744 doesn't fill the case like 65 gr of BP would

[Sixgun]

I have also witnessed TWO other rifles that went BOOM with 5744. One was a Browning 1886 that blew off the loading gate and the other was ANOTHER 1886 in 45-90 that bulged the chamber.............mine also.

I have no idea how the cat with the Browning caused it, but I was there helping him look for the loading gate.

I had the chamber of my other 86 relined by Taylors machining. He left the barrel alone, just the chamber and the darn gun shoots better than it did before.

Yes, I continue to use 5744 as I'm not convinced that it is the powder but a mistake by me. 5744 is a very highly volatile powder and its easy to get 2 charges in the same case. Back when I had these "issues" I used an RCBS 2000 progressive (still do) and one time when I was loading 35 Winchesters, I noticed powder flowing out the top of the case before I inserted the bullet!!! The 35 Winchester case is a long one like the 45-90 and I traced it to the mechanics of the machine when using long cases......so................that's what I get for having confidence without education/experience.

Like I said, I still load all of my rifle ammo on a Pro-2000 but...........all long cases get weighed after loading and have yet to discover an overload but...........I am much more familiar . I go through at least 10-12 pounds of 5744 a year.

Well, I should not say "all" of my ammo on a Pro-2000. I still load .257 Roberts, 300 mag, and .270's one at a time. .308's and .223's get the progressive treatment and those babies will bust clay birds out to 500 meters.

Jack.........the bullet did not get stuck in the barrel. I think its still in outer space.------------------6

[Leverluver]

A while ago both Don and I mentioned how easily 5744 bridges and shorts one load and "lengthens" the next load, when using a powder measure. I still use 5744 but I weigh charges. I would even rather dip the charges than use a powder measure. That one bad day (high static???) when I looked down inside 50 cases and found a quarter with no powder and a quarter with double charges, I got religion. Weigh or dip, that's it for me.

[AJMD429]

That one bad day (high static???) when I looked down inside 50 cases and found a quarter with no powder and a quarter with double charges, I got religion. Weigh or dip, that's it for me.

What kind of powder measure were you using...??? That's downright scary, no matter what powder you're using...!

[Leverluver]

standard run of the mill RCBS powder measure. I admit I don't know what is going on as it never even did that with Lincoln Log powders (IMR 3031, 4350, etc.). Just something odd about 5744.

[Old Savage]

Six, bullet did not stick the barrel of that silver Marlin either looked like it got pushed part way down then the main charge went off in the barrel. Bullet left the scene.

Wow, hadn't heard of a Browning letting go before.