Introduction and a question...UPDATE 06/27/2010

[JohnB]

Hello! I have been viewing the boards as a guest for a while now and I decided to join the party. I am a huge fan of all firearms, with a special place in my heart for 1911's, SAA's and Lever Actions. The are simple, effective, visually appealing and well designed.

It seems there is a wealth of knowledge here so I would like to ask a question, please.

I need to correct to minor issues with my 1873 Winchester in .32-20, third model, circa 1890 and I would really appreciate your input.

The front sight is incorrect and the dust cover does not function correctly. The operating rod hook does not engage the dust cover effectively and consequently jams the cover on the brass "elevator" piece that lifts the cartridge.

Where can I procure the period correct (original, if possible) pieces to rectify this situation?

Thanks for the forum and your input!!

[pokey]

welcome to the camp,

someone with the answers you seek will be along, shortly.

[O.S.O.K.]

WELCOME to the board!

There are several places to get parts but I'm going to wait for one of our winny experts to tell you the best bet for your original 73.

Post a pic of this rifle when you get a chance!

[Griff]

Edit: Ooops, yep, WELCOME to THE Forum!

My '73 is stittin' in my safe and I'm several states removed; but, ISTR there's simply a hook on top of the extractor that pulls the dust cover back as the bolt is drawn to the rear.

Check with Jack First. His info and other sources can be found @ Winchester Parts Sources

[JohnB]

Pics of the old girl...

[JohnB]

Edit: Ooops, yep, WELCOME to THE Forum!

My '73 is stittin' in my safe and I'm several states removed; but, ISTR there's simply a hook on top of the extractor that pulls the dust cover back as the bolt is drawn to the rear.

Check with Jack First. His info and other sources can be found @ Winchester Parts Sources

Thanks for the information. Yes, there is a hook but it does not engage the piece under the dust cover consistently, thus creating the jam. The dust cover is loose and has a decent amount of side to side play...could that be the problem?

[Gun Smith]

The dust cover stop is the name of the part you are refering to. It is held in place on the lower side of the dust cover by a 6/48 screw. The dust cover stop has a piece that extends below the level of the dust cover and that extended part is where the extractor hook on the top of the bolt catches and pushes back the cover. Over time as the dust cover loosens up the extractor hook will slip below the stop and jams the dust cover and bolt. The only solution is to purchase a new dust cover stop. They have a longer stub and have to be fitted to each gun. I have seen M. 73's with the extractor hook bent up to catch the stop. This will not cure the problem. Used dust cover stops come up for sale once in a while, but if they have had the stub filed down any great amount, they won't work any better than the old part.

[Griff]

Edit: Ooops, yep, WELCOME to THE Forum!
My '73 is stittin' in my safe and I'm several states removed; but, ISTR there's simply a hook on top of the extractor that pulls the dust cover back as the bolt is drawn to the rear.
Check with Jack First. His info and other sources can be found @ Winchester Parts Sources

Thanks for the information. Yes, there is a hook but it does not engage the piece under the dust cover consistently, thus creating the jam. The dust cover is loose and has a decent amount of side to side play...could that be the problem?

In short... yes, but not as likely as if it were up/down slop. 3rd models as I recall had the dovetail in the receiver, not a separate piece screwed on as were the 2nd models as I recall; so... how to fix the side to side play, I'd let others answer as I'm no gunsmith. Does the side to side play cause the cover to bind, thereby stopping it's rearward slide and the jam, or is the hook just sliding under the cover?

I see Gun Smith chimed in with excellent info. Also, you can run them without the cover in place.

Also, if those links above don't get you fixed, I'd suggest you get in touch with Lisa at VTI, as she'll know which Uberti parts will interchange with originals. (Some do, and some don't, I ain't guessin' and tellin' ya wrong, she's the gal with the most knowledge about that sorta thing.)

Nice lookin' rifle.

Here's the listing of the parts GunSmith referred to:
224 UB:240224 Uberti Cover Slide Guide (1873 LA, 1876) US$9.00
233 UB:240233 Uberti Powder Cover Screw (1873 LA, 1876) US$2.95
233 UB:240233/Hard Uberti HARDENED Powder Cover Screw (1873 LA) US$5.50
If these will fit an original, I'd go with the hardened screw. Since the screw just goes into the guide, it shouldn't be an issue about threads.

[JohnB]

Excellent information and advice, sir. Thank you! I could see what is supposed to be happening and I could also determine the hook wasn't engaging the stop. So, a new stop should eliminate this issue, yes? If so, I have found several places that offer the part. You also stated it needs to be fitted to the rifle, so this is a gunsmith fix, not a home fix, correct?

Also, as I had mentioned earlier, the front sight is not factory (I think it is an Ebay special). The pictures I have found of the original sights included a set screw on the right side of the dovetail block. Any ideas where to find one of those?

Thanks again for all your help!

[TedH]

Welcome aboard! That's a fine looking piece of history you have there.

[Griff]

Also, as I had mentioned earlier, the front sight is not factory (I think it is an Ebay special). The pictures I have found of the original sights included a set screw on the right side of the dovetail block. Any ideas where to find one of those?
Thanks again for all your help!

Aye, those Uberti copies use the same front sight.
15 UB:202015 Uberti Front Sight (1866 Rifle, 1873 Rifle, Rolling Block Carbine, 1885 HW, Rev Carb) US$20.00
119 UB:400692 Uberti Set Screw (1873 Rifle, 1866 Rifle, Rolling Block Carbine, 1885 HW, Rev Carb) US$2.95

[JohnB]

Thanks to both of you!

Yes, she is a very fine piece of history. Just the idea that she was built BEFORE the turn of the 20th century is mind boggling, given her condition.

I am ready to take her out and shoot, but I am hesitant as I had read somewhere that the older rifles do not like smokeless powder, too much pressure. Any credence to this?

[TedH]

I wouldn't be afraid to take her out for some range time. The peak pressure of proper smokeless loads will likely be lower than the original black loads. I'd just stay with low to mid range loads, and you'll be fine, assuming the condition of the rifle itself is good.

[Griff]

Thanks to both of you!
Yes, she is a very fine piece of history. Just the idea that she was built BEFORE the turn of the 20th century is mind boggling, given her condition.
I am ready to take her out and shoot, but I am hesitant as I had read somewhere that the older rifles do not like smokeless powder, too much pressure. Any credence to this?

.32WCF is a black powder pressure cartridge. There are high velocity rounds in .32-20 that are not for the '73 Winchester or the Colt SAA, but standard velocity ammo would be fine. If you reload, keep your reloads at or below peak pressure for the old BP rounds (approx 12K CUP), if you buy redi-mades... make sure there's no "HV" or "Hi-Velocity" markings on the box. If you don't reload... you might consider it... especially as that opens up the possibility of reloading your own BP ammo! MORE SMOKE!!!!

[JohnB]

Thanks again for the tips! I have a few boxes of Winchester White Box so it sounds like I should be OK. Now if it would just stop raining!!!

[kimwcook]

Welcome to the forum. Nice '73. I need to clean out some stuff and get one some day. I'd like an original in 38 WCF, but an Uberti would do.

[Gun Smith]

Hi John B,
Dixie gunworks has that piece as a reproduction part. It is listed in their online catalog for $7.50.
Fitting the new part is simple. It may clear the top of the bolt now without fitting, and if not, a small amount of metal can be removed from the little boss. Only enough is removed to clear the bolt top.

[perry owens]

You can get the sights from Buffalo Arms - http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,6921.html
They are available in different heights.
Perry Owens

[JohnB]

You can get the sights from Buffalo Arms - http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,6921.html
They are available in different heights.
Perry Owens

Those are perfect! Exactly what I am looking for! My attempts to find an original '73 sight have been in vain. I figure since the front sight is not factory anyway, I cannot hurt the value by getting rid of the e-bay special and at least replacing with a repro period correct item...

Thanks for the link!

[KirkD]

I am ready to take her out and shoot, but I am hesitant as I had read somewhere that the older rifles do not like smokeless powder, too much pressure. Any credence to this?

Welcome to the fire! 1911's, SAA's and leverguns?. ...... you are right at home here. With regard to smokeless in your 32-20, there are fast powders, slow burning powders, and medium speed powders; stick to the medium speed ones like IMR 4227, SR4759 or even IMR 4198. There are plenty of smokeless loads that are perfectly safe in your '73. My favorite load is 9.5 grains of IMR 4227 under a 115 grain cast bullet for 1,217 fps. That is a very safe load for your '73. There have been a couple threads on using smokeless powders in BP cartridges. If you do a search on this forum you should be able to find one or two real good ones.

[JohnB]

I am ready to take her out and shoot, but I am hesitant as I had read somewhere that the older rifles do not like smokeless powder, too much pressure. Any credence to this?

Welcome to the fire! 1911's, SAA's and leverguns?. ...... you are right at home here. With regard to smokeless in your 32-20, there are fast powders, slow burning powders, and medium speed powders; stick to the medium speed ones like IMR 4227, SR4759 or even IMR 4198. There are plenty of smokeless loads that are perfectly safe in your '73. My favorite load is 9.5 grains of IMR 4227 under a 115 grain cast bullet for 1,217 fps. That is a very safe load for your '73. There have been a couple threads on using smokeless powders in BP cartridges. If you do a search on this forum you should be able to find one or two real good ones.

Once again, thanks for the wealth of information! I knew I was going to like it here!

[the telegraphist]

johnB, welcome to the fire sir. Congratulations on a fine 73, shes a beauty. Enjoy the experience, let us know how she shoots when you are ready.

[JohnB]

You can get the sights from Buffalo Arms - http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,6921.html
They are available in different heights.
Perry Owens

FYI...I ordered the Lyman 21A today. I will post up again as soon as it is installed....it looks like it will be perfect!

Thanks again!

[JohnB]

Received the sight yesterday and it looks to be a perfect repro of the original sight.

Now I just need to decide if I can install it or if I should l find a good, local professional...

[JohnB]

So, I decided to try it myself...and it went just fine.

I needed to file the sight just a hair and it tapped right in!

The bluing does not match the wonderful patina, but it looks period correct, which works for me!

[Griff]

Excellent. That's identical to the one on my Uberti '73. Lookin' good.

[Hobie]

[firefuzz]

Very nice rifle and welcome to the fire.

Rob

[Ysabel Kid]

Good job and welcome to the fire!